peterj324
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Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 3:00 pm

Both United airlines and American Airlines have announced the drawdown of their Dash-8 100/200/300 fleets

Currently Commutair operates a total of 16 -200's and 5 -300s out of IAD and EWR. Commutair is currently replacing its Dash-8 fleet with used E145s (from expressjet?) Down below is the current map of the remaining UA Dash-8 routes. The longest being IAD-ALB at 325 miles and the shortest is IAD-CHO at 77 miles. The Dash 8 200s and 300s are used interchangeably on all the routes.

The current routes are:

IAD-EWR/CHO/FAY/GSO/ALB/SCE/RIC/CRW/MDT/ROC/ROA/ORF

EWR-AVP/BDL/PVD/ITH/SYR/RIC/ALB/ROC/BWI

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=IAD-EWR%0D ... =wls&DU=mi

American airlines currently operates 25 -100s and 11 -300s according to wikipedia and like United they operate interchangeably, soon to be replaced by E-145s. They operate out of CLT and PHL plus they operate CRW-DCA. Currently the longest route is CLT-SBY at 371 miles while the shortest is CLT-GSO at 83 miles.

PHL-AVP/CRW/ITH/ERI/ART/SCE/CHO/ORF/HVN/SBY/ISP/ALB/MDT/IPT

CRW-DCA

CLT-CRW/HHH/LYH/GSO/ROA/TRI/AGS/FLO/HTS/SBY

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=PHL-AVP%2F ... =wls&DU=mi

Once the AA and UA Dash-8s are gone it will be the end of prop operations for the 3 US legacy carriers. One can still catch Dash 8 flights in the US through Alaskan Airlines who operate them exclusively on the West Coast or through Air Canada who operates several transborder routes on Dash-8 100/300/400s to several Northern US cities and WestJet Encore and Porter Airlines who uses Dash-8-400s to several US cities. Also there are limited Dash-8 ops in Hawaii via Islandair and Alaska through multiple small carriers.

Although some people may despise these planes, I have fond memories of taking these small prop planes and I will certainly miss them.
 
Flighty
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 3:26 pm

The Dash is a great airliner, a proven workhorse. It got unfortunately handicapped by FAA passenger weight regulations that messed up its performance as originally designed. Of course it's totally safe, this was just a political matter. This meant some passengers either had bags left behind, or were denied boarding, which makes it harder to say it is a great passenger pleaser anymore. Anyway, it's served well beyond its expected lifetime, did so safely, and financially earned its keep. That is a feat very few old airplanes can claim.
 
FSDan
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 3:29 pm

peterj324 wrote:
American airlines currently operates 25 -100s and 11 -300s according to wikipedia and like United they operate interchangeably, soon to be replaced by E-145s.


Looking at the summer schedule for 2017, they are no longer going to operate interchangeably. All the -100s are out of PHL and all the -300s are out of CLT. Also, DCA-CRW moves to CR2s, so the whole Dash 8 fleet will be contained to PHL and CLT.

Have actual timelines for the retirements been announced?
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
MesserJ
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 3:34 pm

I know Piedmont/AA have retired several of their -100 series in the past several months, and the fleet size will be down to the single digits by the end of the year. No changes expected for the -300 fleet this year, but I wonder how much longer they will be around.
 
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cosyr
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 4:01 pm

I know UA is only getting rid of the 300's right now, but the 200's won't last forever. I think cities like AVP and ITH will hurt when they eventually go. I could be wrong, but there has to be some city on the edge of profitability that still works with a prop, but wouldn't with a jet. Just like in the past cities like UCA made sense in the past with a 19 seat plane and EAS, and now, not only did the service go away, but the airport was closed.
 
sagechan
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 4:06 pm

FSDan wrote:
peterj324 wrote:
American airlines currently operates 25 -100s and 11 -300s according to wikipedia and like United they operate interchangeably, soon to be replaced by E-145s.


Looking at the summer schedule for 2017, they are no longer going to operate interchangeably. All the -100s are out of PHL and all the -300s are out of CLT. Also, DCA-CRW moves to CR2s, so the whole Dash 8 fleet will be contained to PHL and CLT.

Have actual timelines for the retirements been announced?


Actually that's backwards, the last 100 flight in CLT (scheduled) is in June, at CLT become 300 only. PHL retains the 100s (not sure about 300s.) Here at CRW we've been the bridge for the lone 100 flight in CLT since February which is HHH. Until June 3rd, CLT had 3x HHH and 1x CRW on the 100, using 2 frames. After June, HHH goes to 300, and CRW is all CRJ-200 to CLT/DCA/PHL
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FSDan
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 4:10 pm

sagechan wrote:
FSDan wrote:
peterj324 wrote:
American airlines currently operates 25 -100s and 11 -300s according to wikipedia and like United they operate interchangeably, soon to be replaced by E-145s.


Looking at the summer schedule for 2017, they are no longer going to operate interchangeably. All the -100s are out of PHL and all the -300s are out of CLT. Also, DCA-CRW moves to CR2s, so the whole Dash 8 fleet will be contained to PHL and CLT.

Have actual timelines for the retirements been announced?


Actually that's backwards, the last 100 flight in CLT (scheduled) is in June, at CLT become 300 only. PHL retains the 100s (not sure about 300s.) Here at CRW we've been the bridge for the lone 100 flight in CLT since February which is HHH. Until June 3rd, CLT had 3x HHH and 1x CRW on the 100, using 2 frames. After June, HHH goes to 300, and CRW is all CRJ-200 to CLT/DCA/PHL


I left out the important word "based". I meant the -100s will be based/operated out of PHL and -300s out of CLT, but I can see why you read it the way you did :).
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Boeing778X
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 4:11 pm

Piedmont is accepting 2x E145s a month from Envoy through 2018. The -100s will definitely be gone by early next year.
Been On: 722 733 73G 738, 752, 763, 77W, 788, A319, A320, A321, E140, E145, E45X, E175, C150, C172, C208, Q400, CRJ7, CRJ9, MD82, MD83, PA28
 
DiamondFlyer
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 4:16 pm

peterj324 wrote:
Both United airlines and American Airlines have announced the drawdown of their Dash-8 100/200/300 fleets

Currently Commutair operates a total of 16 -200's and 5 -300s out of IAD and EWR. Commutair is currently replacing its Dash-8 fleet with used E145s (from expressjet?) Down below is the current map of the remaining UA Dash-8 routes. The longest being IAD-ALB at 325 miles and the shortest is IAD-CHO at 77 miles. The Dash 8 200s and 300s are used interchangeably on all the routes.

The current routes are:

IAD-EWR/CHO/FAY/GSO/ALB/SCE/RIC/CRW/MDT/ROC/ROA/ORF

EWR-AVP/BDL/PVD/ITH/SYR/RIC/ALB/ROC/BWI

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=IAD-EWR%0D ... =wls&DU=mi

American airlines currently operates 25 -100s and 11 -300s according to wikipedia and like United they operate interchangeably, soon to be replaced by E-145s. They operate out of CLT and PHL plus they operate CRW-DCA. Currently the longest route is CLT-SBY at 371 miles while the shortest is CLT-GSO at 83 miles.

PHL-AVP/CRW/ITH/ERI/ART/SCE/CHO/ORF/HVN/SBY/ISP/ALB/MDT/IPT

CRW-DCA

CLT-CRW/HHH/LYH/GSO/ROA/TRI/AGS/FLO/HTS/SBY

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=PHL-AVP%2F ... =wls&DU=mi

Once the AA and UA Dash-8s are gone it will be the end of prop operations for the 3 US legacy carriers. One can still catch Dash 8 flights in the US through Alaskan Airlines who operate them exclusively on the West Coast or through Air Canada who operates several transborder routes on Dash-8 100/300/400s to several Northern US cities and WestJet Encore and Porter Airlines who uses Dash-8-400s to several US cities. Also there are limited Dash-8 ops in Hawaii via Islandair and Alaska through multiple small carriers.

Although some people may despise these planes, I have fond memories of taking these small prop planes and I will certainly miss them.


Actually, United will still have branded ATRs in the operation
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peterj324
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 4:19 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
peterj324 wrote:
Both United airlines and American Airlines have announced the drawdown of their Dash-8 100/200/300 fleets

Currently Commutair operates a total of 16 -200's and 5 -300s out of IAD and EWR. Commutair is currently replacing its Dash-8 fleet with used E145s (from expressjet?) Down below is the current map of the remaining UA Dash-8 routes. The longest being IAD-ALB at 325 miles and the shortest is IAD-CHO at 77 miles. The Dash 8 200s and 300s are used interchangeably on all the routes.

The current routes are:

IAD-EWR/CHO/FAY/GSO/ALB/SCE/RIC/CRW/MDT/ROC/ROA/ORF

EWR-AVP/BDL/PVD/ITH/SYR/RIC/ALB/ROC/BWI

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=IAD-EWR%0D ... =wls&DU=mi

American airlines currently operates 25 -100s and 11 -300s according to wikipedia and like United they operate interchangeably, soon to be replaced by E-145s. They operate out of CLT and PHL plus they operate CRW-DCA. Currently the longest route is CLT-SBY at 371 miles while the shortest is CLT-GSO at 83 miles.

PHL-AVP/CRW/ITH/ERI/ART/SCE/CHO/ORF/HVN/SBY/ISP/ALB/MDT/IPT

CRW-DCA

CLT-CRW/HHH/LYH/GSO/ROA/TRI/AGS/FLO/HTS/SBY

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=PHL-AVP%2F ... =wls&DU=mi

Once the AA and UA Dash-8s are gone it will be the end of prop operations for the 3 US legacy carriers. One can still catch Dash 8 flights in the US through Alaskan Airlines who operate them exclusively on the West Coast or through Air Canada who operates several transborder routes on Dash-8 100/300/400s to several Northern US cities and WestJet Encore and Porter Airlines who uses Dash-8-400s to several US cities. Also there are limited Dash-8 ops in Hawaii via Islandair and Alaska through multiple small carriers.

Although some people may despise these planes, I have fond memories of taking these small prop planes and I will certainly miss them.


Actually, United will still have branded ATRs in the operation



Yes technically true. Although there will only be 2 ATR-42's operating in Guam, so the retirement of the dash-8 will mean the end of US3 prop operations in the 50 states.
 
sagechan
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 4:21 pm

FSDan wrote:
sagechan wrote:
FSDan wrote:

Looking at the summer schedule for 2017, they are no longer going to operate interchangeably. All the -100s are out of PHL and all the -300s are out of CLT. Also, DCA-CRW moves to CR2s, so the whole Dash 8 fleet will be contained to PHL and CLT.

Have actual timelines for the retirements been announced?


Actually that's backwards, the last 100 flight in CLT (scheduled) is in June, at CLT become 300 only. PHL retains the 100s (not sure about 300s.) Here at CRW we've been the bridge for the lone 100 flight in CLT since February which is HHH. Until June 3rd, CLT had 3x HHH and 1x CRW on the 100, using 2 frames. After June, HHH goes to 300, and CRW is all CRJ-200 to CLT/DCA/PHL


I left out the important word "based". I meant the -100s will be based/operated out of PHL and -300s out of CLT, but I can see why you read it the way you did :).


Hah, yes that's a different meaning! And there you are correct.
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ahj2000
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 5:07 pm

Saw a pair of US-colored Dashes at CLT this weekend. A great little plane! It'll be a shame when the JungleJets replace them all...
-Andrés Juánez
 
airzona11
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 5:07 pm

Had some fun rides on those birds. The PHL-EWR hops were always fun. Some winter connection EWR-BUF in snowstorms, that feels like real flying.

It is somewhat crazy to think that as technology has advanced, there is less and less service to small airfields/markets. Alas the market forces are pushing bigger planes are larger airports.
 
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AVLAirlineFreq
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 5:33 pm

peterj324 wrote:

CLT-CRW/HHH/LYH/GSO/ROA/TRI/AGS/FLO/HTS/SBY

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=PHL-AVP%2F ... =wls&DU=mi



AA is also flying the -300s on CLT-AVL and CLT-EWN, usually 1x/day.
 
toltommy
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 5:39 pm

I thought AA was retiring the individual Dash-8's as they came due for a heavy check. Has it actually been confirmed that they are parking the remaining fleet, even if it has life left? Between parking the remaining Dashes (if true) and ZW taking their CRJs to UA, that's a lot of smaller market capacity leaving in 2018.
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Fri May 19, 2017 6:17 pm

I'm not really sure the DH1 / DH3 fleet is interchanged on the US/AA side. They have hard lines except for 2 DH3 airframes, as far as friends who work there tell me. But while they *can* be interchanged due to loads, AA doesn't necessarily schedule them as generic DH8 then throw whatever plane goes on what route. Typically that schedule gets firmed up 90 days out.
xx
 
GoHokies
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sat May 20, 2017 1:57 pm

According to this wikipedia link Piedmont is down to 10 DH1s which is pretty close to the revised fleet plan which shows 12 DH1s at the end of the second quarter. There will only be 4 DH1s by the end of the year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piedmont_Airlines#Fleet

AA revised their 2017 fleet plan after Air Wisconsin announced that it will fly for UA rather than AA. The 4th page of the "IR Update - April 27, 2017" link has the 2017 fleet plan which shows 4 DH1s and 11 DH3s at the end of 2017.

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zht ... sentations

toltommy wrote:
I thought AA was retiring the individual Dash-8's as they came due for a heavy check. Has it actually been confirmed that they are parking the remaining fleet, even if it has life left? Between parking the remaining Dashes (if true) and ZW taking their CRJs to UA, that's a lot of smaller market capacity leaving in 2018.


Yes, Piedmont wants to be an all jet fleet.

http://salisburyindependent.net/wicomic ... jet-fleet/

"“He really wants the fleet completely turned over to jets by 2020. We therefore have to get ourselves in front of the FAA and essentially justify the need to extend the runway,” Strausburg said."

“The Dash has served us well for years but we know that passengers prefer the regional jets and we want to provide the best service we can for American and for our customers,” Hogg said.
 
toltommy
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sat May 20, 2017 4:14 pm

GoHokies, you actually made my point that there doesn't seem to be a firm retirement date for the AA Dashes. Saying that the airline "wants the fleet completely turned over to jets by 2020" says to me that AA hasn't decided when the last Dash will leave Piedmont. AA will tell Piedmont when the last Dash will leave. At the end of the day, it seems like Envoy will be all E175, PSA all CRJ, and Piedmont all E145. But it's not going to happen anytime soon for Piedmont.
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sagechan
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sat May 20, 2017 4:17 pm

toltommy wrote:
GoHokies, you actually made my point that there doesn't seem to be a firm retirement date for the AA Dashes. Saying that the airline "wants the fleet completely turned over to jets by 2020" says to me that AA hasn't decided when the last Dash will leave Piedmont. AA will tell Piedmont when the last Dash will leave. At the end of the day, it seems like Envoy will be all E175, PSA all CRJ, and Piedmont all E145. But it's not going to happen anytime soon for Piedmont.


The 300's are leased, most likely will stay until theu start coming off lease in, i believe, late 2019. The 100s will be done next year most likely.
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sat May 20, 2017 4:23 pm

GoHokies wrote:
“The Dash has served us well for years but we know that passengers prefer the regional jets and we want to provide the best service we can for American and for our customers,” Hogg said.

Not this passenger...ah well.
-Andrés Juánez
 
cheapgreek
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sat May 20, 2017 10:45 pm

I wonder if some 300's will be based in PHL? HVN is currently embroiled in a court battle with the state to pave the overruns as Piedmont has said HVN's 5600 foot runway will not work for the ERJ-145's to PHL. I expect HVN to win the case but will it be in time to maintain AA service to PHL and perhaps CLT later on? As stated earlier, the fleet at the end of 2017 will consist of 4 100's and 11 300's. Years back DL operated HVN-CVG service with CRJ-200's. The CRJ's are better off short runways and the stage length of the HVN-PHL is short so it might work.
As far as comfort, the Dash's are noisy,slow and shake the fillings out of one's mouth. On flights from PHL to ROA which I have flown many times on a Dash, then once I flew a CRJ on the route and what a difference, smoother, quieter, faster and no waiting for the ground crew to tether the prop so deplaning was quicker.
 
usairways85
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sat May 20, 2017 11:31 pm

Today, there were DH3 flights on UNV/ORF/ITH/HVN/SBY/ISP-PHL. So still a few in there.
 
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Adipasquale
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 12:32 am

cosyr wrote:
I know UA is only getting rid of the 300's right now, but the 200's won't last forever. I think cities like AVP and ITH will hurt when they eventually go. I could be wrong, but there has to be some city on the edge of profitability that still works with a prop, but wouldn't with a jet. Just like in the past cities like UCA made sense in the past with a 19 seat plane and EAS, and now, not only did the service go away, but the airport was closed.

ITH is a mix of DH2 and DH3, on UAX, I wouldn't be surprised if they can make it work with all ER4 service. DLC is all C2 to DTW and AA Eagle has moved it to almost exclusively DH3 and ER4. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty confident we'll see UAX ER4s in ITH.
DH8A DH8B CR1 CR2 CR7 CR9 E45 E70 E75 E90 D93 M88 319 320 321 333 343 732 733 734 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 77L 77W
 
UAinAUS
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 7:34 am

CommutAir's 300s will all be gone this year (lease returns). Although not announced yet by United, the entire Q200 fleet will leave in 2018. CommutAir is at that point supposed to be operating 40 ERJs for UAX out of EWR and IAD.
 
washingtonflyer
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 12:55 pm

How many AA/UA cities risk losing service owing to the technical advantages of the Dashes?
 
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AVLAirlineFreq
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 1:29 pm

washingtonflyer wrote:
How many AA/UA cities risk losing service owing to the technical advantages of the Dashes?


Hilton Head (HHH), oft-discussed on here, is one of the most likely candidates since it has never had jet service and because of its proximity to SAV.

I think a number of other airports that are served exclusively by the Dashes, such as FLO, could sustain CRJ/ERJ service by dropping from 4x/day frequency to 3x.
 
washingtonflyer
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 1:36 pm

Tnx. I knew about HHH. I guess question #2 is, on a technical profile basis, are there routes that are available to a CR2 that are not available to a E145/140 owing to better takeoff performance? My recollection was that the Embraer required a longer runway than does the CR2.
 
qantas747
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 1:41 pm

How old are the birds from AA? Could they have a second life somewhere? Perhaps if they are relatively young they might be a target for qantaslink of JQ in NZ? I know QFlink seems to favour q400s but they are known to take on a couple of extras if the price is right.
 
SyracuseAvGeek
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 8:44 pm

ahj2000 wrote:
Saw a pair of US-colored Dashes at CLT this weekend. A great little plane! It'll be a shame when the JungleJets replace them all...


what are the aircraft tags on the Dashes still in the US livery?
"I haven't been everywhere yet, but it's on my list."
 
SyracuseAvGeek
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 8:47 pm

Know some of the routes operated by AA/US Dashes in the winter because there's not enough demand for the CR2, for example ART-PHL. What will end up happening to these routes? There is a Dash8~100 wearing the Piedmont livery (N837EX) anyone know the routes that plane will take?
"I haven't been everywhere yet, but it's on my list."
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Sun May 21, 2017 9:48 pm

qantas747 wrote:
How old are the birds from AA? Could they have a second life somewhere? Perhaps if they are relatively young they might be a target for qantaslink of JQ in NZ? I know QFlink seems to favour q400s but they are known to take on a couple of extras if the price is right.


The AA ones will be parked when they're done; they have been flown hard their entire life, all have high hours and high cycles, and are being retired as they come up against a HMV. I can't see anybody touching those planes, it would cost too much to get them into service.

As it is Qantas are retiring their own 200/300 fleet in the next couple of years so I can't se them buying more.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
xdlx
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 11:35 am

DHC builds a good airplane...... wonder how much is the HMV investment required for these birds? Does anyone knows if there are any LIFE LIMITS in the DH8 series? Can they go the way of the Viking Otter since NO ONE is making 35seaters any more?
 
cheapgreek
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 4:00 pm

xdlx wrote:
DHC builds a good airplane...... wonder how much is the HMV investment required for these birds? Does anyone knows if there are any LIFE LIMITS in the DH8 series? Can they go the way of the Viking Otter since NO ONE is making 35seaters any more?


Back some years ago, a Piedmont base manager said Bombardier wanted 2 million per Dash-8-100 to raise the cycle limit to 120k cycles I think, it might have been more. Too much for such an old frame.
 
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Boeing778X
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Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:55 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 4:47 pm

GoHokies wrote:
According to this wikipedia link Piedmont is down to 10 DH1s which is pretty close to the revised fleet plan which shows 12 DH1s at the end of the second quarter. There will only be 4 DH1s by the end of the year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piedmont_Airlines#Fleet

AA revised their 2017 fleet plan after Air Wisconsin announced that it will fly for UA rather than AA. The 4th page of the "IR Update - April 27, 2017" link has the 2017 fleet plan which shows 4 DH1s and 11 DH3s at the end of 2017.

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zht ... sentations

toltommy wrote:
I thought AA was retiring the individual Dash-8's as they came due for a heavy check. Has it actually been confirmed that they are parking the remaining fleet, even if it has life left? Between parking the remaining Dashes (if true) and ZW taking their CRJs to UA, that's a lot of smaller market capacity leaving in 2018.


Yes, Piedmont wants to be an all jet fleet.

http://salisburyindependent.net/wicomic ... jet-fleet/

"“He really wants the fleet completely turned over to jets by 2020. We therefore have to get ourselves in front of the FAA and essentially justify the need to extend the runway,” Strausburg said."

“The Dash has served us well for years but we know that passengers prefer the regional jets and we want to provide the best service we can for American and for our customers,” Hogg said.


Great info! I've heard rumors that the E140s would be returning for the time being to cover for ZW.

Piedmont receives 2x E145s a month for the foreseeable future. If Envoy reactivates 20x E140s and sends them to ORD and LGA, it would make a difference.
Been On: 722 733 73G 738, 752, 763, 77W, 788, A319, A320, A321, E140, E145, E45X, E175, C150, C172, C208, Q400, CRJ7, CRJ9, MD82, MD83, PA28
 
TWFlyGuy
Posts: 30
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:10 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 6:07 pm

AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
washingtonflyer wrote:
How many AA/UA cities risk losing service owing to the technical advantages of the Dashes?


Hilton Head (HHH), oft-discussed on here, is one of the most likely candidates since it has never had jet service and because of its proximity to SAV.

I think a number of other airports that are served exclusively by the Dashes, such as FLO, could sustain CRJ/ERJ service by dropping from 4x/day frequency to 3x.


I know it has been talked about on here but I still wonder with the runway extension in HHH if it will retain service. Possibly even gain back ATL service.
 
boeing773er
Posts: 485
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 6:24 pm

Small oversight, I believe the shortest AA route with the Dash 8 is PHL-ABE.GcMap has it at 55 miles, I remember flying on it once when going down to NAS.
Work Hard, Fly Right.
 
BatonOps
Posts: 660
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 6:30 pm

Adipasquale wrote:
cosyr wrote:
I know UA is only getting rid of the 300's right now, but the 200's won't last forever. I think cities like AVP and ITH will hurt when they eventually go. I could be wrong, but there has to be some city on the edge of profitability that still works with a prop, but wouldn't with a jet. Just like in the past cities like UCA made sense in the past with a 19 seat plane and EAS, and now, not only did the service go away, but the airport was closed.

ITH is a mix of DH2 and DH3, on UAX, I wouldn't be surprised if they can make it work with all ER4 service. DLC is all C2 to DTW and AA Eagle has moved it to almost exclusively DH3 and ER4. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty confident we'll see UAX ER4s in ITH.


If I remember correctly, ITH reported that UA service would go all jet by the end of 2017. That was announced around the same time AA announced they would consolidate all ITH/BGM/ELM service at ITH.
 
Northwest1988
Posts: 94
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 6:39 pm

Quick question,
Why we're the Dash 8-200s retired from USAir express so long ago and the -100s stuck around? Why wouldn't they keep the newer version? Per Wikipedia they retired them in the early 2000s I believe.
 
sagechan
Posts: 121
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 6:14 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 6:51 pm

Northwest1988 wrote:
Quick question,
Why we're the Dash 8-200s retired from USAir express so long ago and the -100s stuck around? Why wouldn't they keep the newer version? Per Wikipedia they retired them in the early 2000s I believe.


Piedmont's 200s went to Mesa around 2007 i think, then Mesa dropped them in bankruptcy,
717, 733, 734, 738, 744, 752, 772, A319, A320, A321, A332, A333, MD88, CRJ, CR7, CR9, DH8, DH3, S340, ER4, E170, E175, E190/CO, NW, US, AC, NH, AA, UA, DL, WN, WS, SK, VY
 
cheapgreek
Posts: 194
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:57 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 6:53 pm

Northwest1988 wrote:
Quick question,
Why we're the Dash 8-200s retired from USAir express so long ago and the -100s stuck around? Why wouldn't they keep the newer version? Per Wikipedia they retired them in the early 2000s I believe.


Piedmont had 8 200's but was not willing to renew the leases. The 100's were cheaper to lease and some I believe were owned outright. Then Allegheny was merged into Piedmont and all they had were 100's. In 2002, Piedmont's fleet count was close to 70 frames and that was before the merger with Allegheny, 12 300's, 8 200's and the rest 100's.
 
Menzenski
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:19 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Mon May 22, 2017 10:53 pm

BatonOps wrote:
If I remember correctly, ITH reported that UA service would go all jet by the end of 2017. That was announced around the same time AA announced they would consolidate all ITH/BGM/ELM service at ITH.


I actually asked the airport ITH twitter account about that explicitly last year, and got a non-response:

FLYIthaca wrote:
We have had jet service with @united and are excited to have @AmericanAir flying jets into #ITH as well.


IMO, United at ITH seems like it could go either way (145s or dropping service).

Speaking more generally, this really feels like the end of an era. Gone will be the days when nearly every small airport in the Northeast US had prop flights to the nearest hub.
 
cheapgreek
Posts: 194
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Tue May 23, 2017 12:48 am

Menzenski wrote:
BatonOps wrote:
If I remember correctly, ITH reported that UA service would go all jet by the end of 2017. That was announced around the same time AA announced they would consolidate all ITH/BGM/ELM service at ITH.


I actually asked the airport ITH twitter account about that explicitly last year, and got a non-response:

FLYIthaca wrote:
We have had jet service with @united and are excited to have @AmericanAir flying jets into #ITH as well.


IMO, United at ITH seems like it could go either way (145s or dropping service).

Speaking more generally, this really feels like the end of an era. Gone will be the days when nearly every small airport in the Northeast US had prop flights to the nearest hub.


I think small airports will still have service, but frequency will be reduced as RJ's have more seats. Small cities help fill mainline hub flights and with less frequency with RJ's from small cities, airport delays might drop with less flights and not slowing up landings and takeoffs with slower prop planes.
 
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vatveng
Posts: 1159
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Tue May 23, 2017 1:03 am

ahj2000 wrote:
GoHokies wrote:
“The Dash has served us well for years but we know that passengers prefer the regional jets and we want to provide the best service we can for American and for our customers,” Hogg said.

Not this passenger...ah well.


This passenger can't wait to be rid of the Dash-8.
 
Menzenski
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:19 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Tue May 23, 2017 1:36 am

cheapgreek wrote:
I think small airports will still have service, but frequency will be reduced as RJ's have more seats. Small cities help fill mainline hub flights and with less frequency with RJ's from small cities, airport delays might drop with less flights and not slowing up landings and takeoffs with slower prop planes.


In theory, yes, you're right. But once frequency drops enough, people in those small cities will just drive somewhere else with better options.
 
cheapgreek
Posts: 194
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Tue May 23, 2017 3:43 am

Menzenski wrote:
cheapgreek wrote:
I think small airports will still have service, but frequency will be reduced as RJ's have more seats. Small cities help fill mainline hub flights and with less frequency with RJ's from small cities, airport delays might drop with less flights and not slowing up landings and takeoffs with slower prop planes.


In theory, yes, you're right. But once frequency drops enough, people in those small cities will just drive somewhere else with better options.


It depends on fares and how far the drive would be. Most flyers from small airports accept a fewer number of flights but the trade off is less ground travel, and easy to navigate terminals. I tried to fly into HVN but the flights were full so on to BDL, very long and slow moving TSA lines, almost in Massachusetts and far away from my final destination. I am hoping AA will continue service to HVN with perhaps CRJ-200's or CRJ-700's as the move by Piedmont with the ERJ-145 will not work off HVN's 5600 foot runway.
 
ahj2000
Posts: 755
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Tue May 23, 2017 5:18 am

vatveng wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
GoHokies wrote:
“The Dash has served us well for years but we know that passengers prefer the regional jets and we want to provide the best service we can for American and for our customers,” Hogg said.

Not this passenger...ah well.


This passenger can't wait to be rid of the Dash-8.

Oh where's your nostalgia? :D
cheapgreek wrote:
Menzenski wrote:
cheapgreek wrote:
I think small airports will still have service, but frequency will be reduced as RJ's have more seats. Small cities help fill mainline hub flights and with less frequency with RJ's from small cities, airport delays might drop with less flights and not slowing up landings and takeoffs with slower prop planes.


In theory, yes, you're right. But once frequency drops enough, people in those small cities will just drive somewhere else with better options.


It depends on fares and how far the drive would be. Most flyers from small airports accept a fewer number of flights but the trade off is less ground travel, and easy to navigate terminals. I tried to fly into HVN but the flights were full so on to BDL, very long and slow moving TSA lines, almost in Massachusetts and far away from my final destination. I am hoping AA will continue service to HVN with perhaps CRJ-200's or CRJ-700's as the move by Piedmont with the ERJ-145 will not work off HVN's 5600 foot runway.

There are only two seats more on a JungleJet or CR2 than a DH3. 13 on a DH1. From what I understand from earlier posts AA hasn't made a distinction between the two ofte in their scheduling, right? Eo it would make sense that most of these markets could handle that increase in seats. If not, doesn't MQ have a bunch of 140s (44Y) in storage that Piedmont could borrow?
-Andrés Juánez
 
cheapgreek
Posts: 194
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Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Wed May 24, 2017 1:20 am

ahj2000 wrote:
vatveng wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
Not this passenger...ah well.


This passenger can't wait to be rid of the Dash-8.

Oh where's your nostalgia? :D
cheapgreek wrote:
Menzenski wrote:

In theory, yes, you're right. But once frequency drops enough, people in those small cities will just drive somewhere else with better options.


It depends on fares and how far the drive would be. Most flyers from small airports accept a fewer number of flights but the trade off is less ground travel, and easy to navigate terminals. I tried to fly into HVN but the flights were full so on to BDL, very long and slow moving TSA lines, almost in Massachusetts and far away from my final destination. I am hoping AA will continue service to HVN with perhaps CRJ-200's or CRJ-700's as the move by Piedmont with the ERJ-145 will not work off HVN's 5600 foot runway.

There are only two seats more on a JungleJet or CR2 than a DH3. 13 on a DH1. From what I understand from earlier posts AA hasn't made a distinction between the two ofte in their scheduling, right? Eo it would make sense that most of these markets could handle that increase in seats. If not, doesn't MQ have a bunch of 140s (44Y) in storage that Piedmont could borrow?


The 100's only offer 33-34 seats, not 37 seats. In the April investor report, 7 140's will be pulled from storage and added to the 13 in use. The 145's are runway hogs, SBY has 6400 foot runway and Piedmont says it needs another 600 feet added to accommodate the 145.
 
sagechan
Posts: 121
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 6:14 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Wed May 24, 2017 1:42 am

ahj2000 wrote:
vatveng wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
Not this passenger...ah well.


This passenger can't wait to be rid of the Dash-8.

Oh where's your nostalgia? :D
cheapgreek wrote:
Menzenski wrote:

In theory, yes, you're right. But once frequency drops enough, people in those small cities will just drive somewhere else with better options.


It depends on fares and how far the drive would be. Most flyers from small airports accept a fewer number of flights but the trade off is less ground travel, and easy to navigate terminals. I tried to fly into HVN but the flights were full so on to BDL, very long and slow moving TSA lines, almost in Massachusetts and far away from my final destination. I am hoping AA will continue service to HVN with perhaps CRJ-200's or CRJ-700's as the move by Piedmont with the ERJ-145 will not work off HVN's 5600 foot runway.

There are only two seats more on a JungleJet or CR2 than a DH3. 13 on a DH1. From what I understand from earlier posts AA hasn't made a distinction between the two ofte in their scheduling, right? Eo it would make sense that most of these markets could handle that increase in seats. If not, doesn't MQ have a bunch of 140s (44Y) in storage that Piedmont could borrow?


The 100s and 300s are NOT scheduled to be interchanged on a route, though subs between the two do happen. The 100s have 37 physical seats, but are usually only sold to betwern 33-35, when payload mix allows they will take 36 or 37 pax.
717, 733, 734, 738, 744, 752, 772, A319, A320, A321, A332, A333, MD88, CRJ, CR7, CR9, DH8, DH3, S340, ER4, E170, E175, E190/CO, NW, US, AC, NH, AA, UA, DL, WN, WS, SK, VY
 
Cubsrule
Posts: 12423
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 12:13 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Wed May 24, 2017 1:45 am

cheapgreek wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
vatveng wrote:

This passenger can't wait to be rid of the Dash-8.

Oh where's your nostalgia? :D
cheapgreek wrote:

It depends on fares and how far the drive would be. Most flyers from small airports accept a fewer number of flights but the trade off is less ground travel, and easy to navigate terminals. I tried to fly into HVN but the flights were full so on to BDL, very long and slow moving TSA lines, almost in Massachusetts and far away from my final destination. I am hoping AA will continue service to HVN with perhaps CRJ-200's or CRJ-700's as the move by Piedmont with the ERJ-145 will not work off HVN's 5600 foot runway.

There are only two seats more on a JungleJet or CR2 than a DH3. 13 on a DH1. From what I understand from earlier posts AA hasn't made a distinction between the two ofte in their scheduling, right? Eo it would make sense that most of these markets could handle that increase in seats. If not, doesn't MQ have a bunch of 140s (44Y) in storage that Piedmont could borrow?


The 100's only offer 33-34 seats, not 37 seats. In the April investor report, 7 140's will be pulled from storage and added to the 13 in use. The 145's are runway hogs, SBY has 6400 foot runway and Piedmont says it needs another 600 feet added to accommodate the 145.


Does SBY have terrain? MQ runs 145s off of 6,500 foot runways on a daily basis. COU and DBQ come to mind, but I'm sure there are others
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
cheapgreek
Posts: 194
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:57 pm

Re: Remaining AA and UA Dash-8 100/200/300

Wed May 24, 2017 12:33 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
cheapgreek wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
Oh where's your nostalgia? :D

There are only two seats more on a JungleJet or CR2 than a DH3. 13 on a DH1. From what I understand from earlier posts AA hasn't made a distinction between the two ofte in their scheduling, right? Eo it would make sense that most of these markets could handle that increase in seats. If not, doesn't MQ have a bunch of 140s (44Y) in storage that Piedmont could borrow?


The 100's only offer 33-34 seats, not 37 seats. In the April investor report, 7 140's will be pulled from storage and added to the 13 in use. The 145's are runway hogs, SBY has 6400 foot runway and Piedmont says it needs another 600 feet added to accommodate the 145.


Does SBY have terrain? MQ runs 145s off of 6,500 foot runways on a daily basis. COU and DBQ come to mind, but I'm sure there are others


AA operates ROA-LGA flights with 145's off a 6800 foot runway and only list 40 available seats. SBY terrain is relatively flat. Allegiant operated MD80 flights to Florida from SBY, its not the runway, its the plane.

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