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New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun Apr 30, 2017 12:34 pm

Welcome to the May edition of the New Zealand Thread. Please continue to add your comments below. Link to April edition viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1359289

Please note: Moderators have decided to let all country/regional aviation threads like this thread be a month long thread instead of the usual 200-250 post limit as per before
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sunrisevalley
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun Apr 30, 2017 8:32 pm

Way back when it was reported that NZ updated 4 of the 77E fleet to EDTO-300min. the maximum time needed for AKL-EZE. My understanding is that the upgrade was primarily of the cargo hold fire suppression system. I note that at one time or another all 8 of the 77E fleet have been used on AKL-IAH an EDTO-240min route. I wonder what needed to be done to bring the 4 that did not get the 300 min upgrade, upto 240-min. Does anyone have any ideas?
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:02 pm

sunrisevalley wrote:
Way back when it was reported that NZ updated 4 of the 77E fleet to EDTO-300min. the maximum time needed for AKL-EZE. My understanding is that the upgrade was primarily of the cargo hold fire suppression system. I note that at one time or another all 8 of the 77E fleet have been used on AKL-IAH an EDTO-240min route. I wonder what needed to be done to bring the 4 that did not get the 300 min upgrade, upto 240-min. Does anyone have any ideas?

The real way to test it is to take note of the ones which operated to EZE, then observe their flight plans on flightaware ex IAH vs the other ones. I think you'll find they might take a different track.
If they don't then all 8 had modification up to either 240 or 307min. I have a hunch if you check the ownership it will match the ones with the ones that are owned by NZ
according to what I can find on plane spotting websites.

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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:30 pm

aerorobnz wrote:
The real way to test it is to take note of the ones which operated to EZE, then observe their flight plans on flightaware ex IAH vs the other ones. I think you'll find they might take a different track.

A good thought....thanks!
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 4:59 am

Has been announced that John Key (ex Prime Minister of New Zealand) will join the NZ board of directors.
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Wed May 03, 2017 5:39 am

Interesting track that NZ28 took out of AKL today
https://www.flightradar24.com/ANZ28/d432234
NZ444 also had a very short final (4km), by AKL standards. We get them more often in Dunedin.
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 3:24 am

Interesting article urging Indian airlines to consider direct NZ flights.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news ... d=11849955
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 5:42 am

NPL8800 wrote:
Interesting article urging Indian airlines to consider direct NZ flights.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news ... d=11849955

Yes well AI is the only airline that would really do it.
Only way NZ would consider it is to link up with it's EZE flight and even then probably moreso if they had more than 1 Sth America destination.
It's just a long flight, mostly low yielding and expensive to operate (aircraft interiors get trashed too).
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 5:44 am

LamboAston wrote:
Interesting track that NZ28 took out of AKL today
https://www.flightradar24.com/ANZ28/d432234
NZ444 also had a very short final (4km), by AKL standards. We get them more often in Dunedin.

Have been on a very similar track (just the left turn made over Hunua rather than over the Firth of Thames. Basically a parallel course about 2nm further North.
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 5:47 am

Zkpilot wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
Interesting track that NZ28 took out of AKL today
https://www.flightradar24.com/ANZ28/d432234
NZ444 also had a very short final (4km), by AKL standards. We get them more often in Dunedin.

Have been on a very similar track (just the left turn made over Hunua rather than over the Firth of Thames. Basically a parallel course about 2nm further North.

Do you know why they do that track?
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 10:05 pm

LamboAston wrote:
Zkpilot wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
Interesting track that NZ28 took out of AKL today
https://www.flightradar24.com/ANZ28/d432234
NZ444 also had a very short final (4km), by AKL standards. We get them more often in Dunedin.

Have been on a very similar track (just the left turn made over Hunua rather than over the Firth of Thames. Basically a parallel course about 2nm further North.

Do you know why they do that track?

I'm guessing it is for traffic avoidance and allows them to have an unrestricted climb to cruise since there aren't any other flights out there normally. Might work in with the optimal route too.
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 4:04 am

Zkpilot wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
Zkpilot wrote:
Have been on a very similar track (just the left turn made over Hunua rather than over the Firth of Thames. Basically a parallel course about 2nm further North.

Do you know why they do that track?

I'm guessing it is for traffic avoidance and allows them to have an unrestricted climb to cruise since there aren't any other flights out there normally. Might work in with the optimal route too.

There wasn't any traffic anywhere near conflicting. Still, there was an arrival which could have been delayed and caused conflicting traffic. They wouldn't have known whether it would be on time or not in the planning stages of the flight.
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 5:54 am

Which inbound EK A380 operates the outbound EK449?
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 6:05 am

LamboAston wrote:
Which inbound EK A380 operates the outbound EK449?


It appears to generally be the same A380 that operated EK448, though in the last week the acft that operated EK418 also flew it.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 10:48 am

NPL8800 wrote:
Interesting article urging Indian airlines to consider direct NZ flights.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news ... d=11849955


I don't see any hope for any Indian Airline to start NZ flights in near future.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 5:04 pm

Zkpilot wrote:
Yes well AI is the only airline that would really do it.
Only way NZ would consider it is to link up with it's EZE flight and even then probably moreso if they had more than 1 Sth America destination.
It's just a long flight, mostly low yielding and expensive to operate (aircraft interiors get trashed too).


which city in India would be the likely choice? There is no non-stop PER- India , is that a possible city pair say AKL-PER-India or would something like AKL-MEL/SYD/BNE-BOM work better because of no present direct service from Aus-BOM.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 6:47 pm

sunrisevalley wrote:
Zkpilot wrote:
Yes well AI is the only airline that would really do it.
Only way NZ would consider it is to link up with it's EZE flight and even then probably moreso if they had more than 1 Sth America destination.
It's just a long flight, mostly low yielding and expensive to operate (aircraft interiors get trashed too).


which city in India would be the likely choice? There is no non-stop PER- India , is that a possible city pair say AKL-PER-India or would something like AKL-MEL/SYD/BNE-BOM work better because of no present direct service from Aus-BOM.


This has been discussed previously, but one factor that goes against a NZ-India route is that demand is spread across the sub-continent (Delhi, Mumbai, Chennai, Bangalore) and not focussed on one particular market. Two airlines which apparently do very well in channeling Australia/NZ traffic to India are SQ and MH. And indeed, transferring in SIN and KUL is much easier than it is in DEL and BOM (although, admittedly, I'm yet to experience BOM's new terminal).

Additionally, of course, Indian routes would still be of low-yield.

Speaking of which, NZ's PVG route was traditionally described as a low-yield route, dominated by tourism, students and VFR. Any thoughts as to whether that would still be the case, ten or so years on from when the route was started?
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 7:43 pm

QF46 wrote:
sunrisevalley wrote:
Zkpilot wrote:
Yes well AI is the only airline that would really do it.
Only way NZ would consider it is to link up with it's EZE flight and even then probably moreso if they had more than 1 Sth America destination.
It's just a long flight, mostly low yielding and expensive to operate (aircraft interiors get trashed too).


which city in India would be the likely choice? There is no non-stop PER- India , is that a possible city pair say AKL-PER-India or would something like AKL-MEL/SYD/BNE-BOM work better because of no present direct service from Aus-BOM.


This has been discussed previously, but one factor that goes against a NZ-India route is that demand is spread across the sub-continent (Delhi, Mumbai, Chennai, Bangalore) and not focussed on one particular market. Two airlines which apparently do very well in channeling Australia/NZ traffic to India are SQ and MH. And indeed, transferring in SIN and KUL is much easier than it is in DEL and BOM (although, admittedly, I'm yet to experience BOM's new terminal).


It is highly unlikely there will ever be an Indian service via Australia while Indians are required to get a transit visa by the Australian govt for the ones that just want to pass through. Why would they when there are perfectly good one stop options with their favourite airline sq via the best airport in the world where they don't need a transit visa.

I don't know who in the background is pushing this idea with the media but they are pretty ilinformed.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 8:02 pm

Really where in India would be best? From a connecting point of view? It's long haul pretty low yield and visa's via Australia required, I don't think you will see it either way. Not when SQ can get you there easily to a number of destinations 1 stop. AI well who knows. NZ can't see it.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 8:49 pm

[quote="ZK-NBT/]. AI well who knows. NZ can't see it.[/quote]

Thus far NZ appear to see it! It is many years since it was reported that India was on NZ's consideration list.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 9:45 pm

[*]
sunrisevalley wrote:
[quote="ZK-NBT/]. AI well who knows. NZ can't see it.[/quote]

Thus far NZ appear to see it! It is many years since it was reported that India was on NZ's consideration list.[/quote]


Where have you read that or where have they seen it? The SQ deal works pretty well it would seem. 14/15 hrs for a relative VFR market. Maybe seasonal?
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 12:41 am

Can the RR powered EK A380s do EK448/9? The current deliveries are only 2 class so won't be flying it yet.
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 1:19 am

LamboAston wrote:
Can the RR powered EK A380s do EK448/9? The current deliveries are only 2 class so won't be flying it yet.


I assume the RR engine will not have any difficulty with the current new build 575t TOW. Otherwise why would have EK purchased it?
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 7:26 am

VH-YIV has been and is currently completing circuits of Queenstown with several approaches, I assume this is because they must be doing night time flying practice as this has been happening at night? Please correct me if I am mistaken.

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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 8:25 am

ZKOXA wrote:
VH-YIV has been and is currently completing circuits of Queenstown with several approaches, I assume this is because they must be doing night time flying practice as this has been happening at night? Please correct me if I am mistaken.

ZKOXA

More of a question is why was it sitting in CHC for nearly a week before these flights, after positioning from MEL with the same flight number (VA9948)
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 10:05 am

I would think that Hyderabad would be the most central non-backtrack top 5 city in India.
Otherwise Mumbai since it's the largest and not too far north. New Delhi is too far north.
But yes the multiple cities does make it tricky to service which is why NZ won't do it as they have a good deal in place with SQ.
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 10:59 am

ZKOXA wrote:
VH-YIV has been and is currently completing circuits of Queenstown with several approaches, I assume this is because they must be doing night time flying practice as this has been happening at night? Please correct me if I am mistaken.

ZKOXA


You are correct. Expensive operation...
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 7:49 pm

Zkpilot wrote:
I would think that Hyderabad would be the most central non-backtrack top 5 city in India.
Otherwise Mumbai since it's the largest and not too far north. New Delhi is too far north.
But yes the multiple cities does make it tricky to service which is why NZ won't do it as they have a good deal in place with SQ.


Then NZ would also need a local carrier to codeshare with, I can't see this happening really for some time if ever.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 9:24 pm

ZK-NBT wrote:
Zkpilot wrote:
I would think that Hyderabad would be the most central non-backtrack top 5 city in India.
Otherwise Mumbai since it's the largest and not too far north. New Delhi is too far north.
But yes the multiple cities does make it tricky to service which is why NZ won't do it as they have a good deal in place with SQ.


Then NZ would also need a local carrier to codeshare with, I can't see this happening really for some time if ever.


Since they cooperate heavily with SQ already then I'm sure they'd be able to make an arrangement with Vistara for domestic services if they wanted to
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 9:44 pm

Any updates on North America expansion?
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 9:49 pm

LamboAston wrote:
ZKOXA wrote:
VH-YIV has been and is currently completing circuits of Queenstown with several approaches, I assume this is because they must be doing night time flying practice as this has been happening at night? Please correct me if I am mistaken.

ZKOXA

More of a question is why was it sitting in CHC for nearly a week before these flights, after positioning from MEL with the same flight number (VA9948)


My Guess would be that they were outfitting it with HUD, and they wanted to test them in Queenstown much like NZ did with their A320s with HUD.
Now, I have four questions related to night flights into Queenstown:
1. Is VA planning on doing night operations into Queenstown along with NZ and Jetstar?
2. Is it necessary to fit HUD into aircraft for night flying ops into Queenstown or just helpful?
3. How long until we see Qantas begin night flights, or would they have to install HUD too?
4. Has Jetstar installed HUD into their A320 fleet, if so which aircraft?

ZKOXA
Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind. - Dr. Seuss
 
NPL8800
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 10:01 pm

ZKOXA wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
ZKOXA wrote:
VH-YIV has been and is currently completing circuits of Queenstown with several approaches, I assume this is because they must be doing night time flying practice as this has been happening at night? Please correct me if I am mistaken.

ZKOXA

More of a question is why was it sitting in CHC for nearly a week before these flights, after positioning from MEL with the same flight number (VA9948)


My Guess would be that they were outfitting it with HUD, and they wanted to test them in Queenstown much like NZ did with their A320s with HUD.
Now, I have four questions related to night flights into Queenstown:
1. Is VA planning on doing night operations into Queenstown along with NZ and Jetstar?
2. Is it necessary to fit HUD into aircraft for night flying ops into Queenstown or just helpful?
3. How long until we see Qantas begin night flights, or would they have to install HUD too?
4. Has Jetstar installed HUD into their A320 fleet, if so which aircraft?

ZKOXA


Yes, VA will be operating night services on BNE-ZQN flights from June 23rd at 2/weekly
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 10:16 pm

I realise they installed runway edge lighting but what other night aids have they installed? Are there approach lights? Would be cool to have curved approach lights up the valley sort of like JFK Canarsie approach. Or are night ops restricted to landing over the lake (safer approach)
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 10:26 pm

77west wrote:
I realise they installed runway edge lighting but what other night aids have they installed? Are there approach lights? Would be cool to have curved approach lights up the valley sort of like JFK Canarsie approach. Or are night ops restricted to landing over the lake (safer approach)


That would be really cool, but probably never happen as people would complain it ruins the landscape or something, but yes night approaches do come down the Valley and not just over the lake.

ZKOXA
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 6:39 am

Are there any plans to refurbish the older A320 domestic aircraft? The seats are getting in pretty bad condition now in the old OJs
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77west
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 8:22 am

LamboAston wrote:
Are there any plans to refurbish the older A320 domestic aircraft? The seats are getting in pretty bad condition now in the old OJs


I would say they are being replaced by the new NEO's but they are going on international/regional service I believe.

Can somone give a breakdown of which regs are configured for which services? I know all the OX series are domestic, and fairly new, the majority of the OJ series are regional with some OJ series domestic..
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 8:34 am

OJQ,OJR, OJS and OAB are domestic the rest of the OJ's are regional.
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 8:54 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
OJQ,OJR, OJS and OAB are domestic the rest of the OJ's are regional.


Which are all 2011/2012 builds from memory?
 
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 9:05 am

zkncj wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
OJQ,OJR, OJS and OAB are domestic the rest of the OJ's are regional.


Which are all 2011/2012 builds from memory?


Yep, maybe time for a cabin refresh soon? I wonder how many are owned leased of the domestic fleet?
 
zkncj
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 9:11 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
Yep, maybe time for a cabin refresh soon? I wonder how many are owned leased of the domestic fleet?


From some quick research tonight:

OJQ,OJR, OJS and OAB - Leased
OXA-OXM - Owned

I do wonder if they are planning to replace the OJ* domestic fleet with A321's, on top of the 13 A321/320NEO purchase they did agree to lease 5x 321NEO which the rights to on sell the some of the 13 purchased if required later on. So in theory they do have slots for 18 NEO's unless they choose to onsell the 5.
 
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aerorobnz
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 11:31 am

zkncj wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Yep, maybe time for a cabin refresh soon? I wonder how many are owned leased of the domestic fleet?


From some quick research tonight:

OJQ,OJR, OJS and OAB - Leased
OXA-OXM - Owned

I do wonder if they are planning to replace the OJ* domestic fleet with A321's, on top of the 13 A321/320NEO purchase they did agree to lease 5x 321NEO which the rights to on sell the some of the 13 purchased if required later on. So in theory they do have slots for 18 NEO's unless they choose to onsell the 5.

A couple of points to make on this,

- I don't believe that the domestic A320s will change to A321s any time soon. The A321s will likely be utilised as regional primarily, with a few subs and for the business travel peak periods of the day and seasonal peaks domestically only. I think it is a reasonable assumption to expect that anything replacing the Regionals will likely be an A321.

- If they do go A321s to WLG.CHC/DUD/ZQN then there is a gap between 70Y and 220Y which is not an inconsequential gap to bridge especially when the ports want frequency rather than capacity.

- The domestic airports might be able to handle them, but the current AKL domestic terminal can't easily without flow restriction and overall operational penalty to domestic. Gate holds, misconnections etc. I don/t think A321s will be mainstream domestically until the new terminal is built. 40 extra seats in and out will have a impact on turn times and gate availability.

- The "old" domestics are 6.5 years compared to 13.5 years for the regionals. It seems the target window for fleet replacement for 777/A320/787s now the old 767/744s are gone is in the vicinity of 15 years. That means that even the most elderly of the A320Ds are only approaching their "half-life".
Flown to 128 Airports in 48 Countries on 81 Operators. Visited 56 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
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qf789
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 11:41 am

NPL8800 wrote:
ZKOXA wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
More of a question is why was it sitting in CHC for nearly a week before these flights, after positioning from MEL with the same flight number (VA9948)


My Guess would be that they were outfitting it with HUD, and they wanted to test them in Queenstown much like NZ did with their A320s with HUD.
Now, I have four questions related to night flights into Queenstown:
1. Is VA planning on doing night operations into Queenstown along with NZ and Jetstar?
2. Is it necessary to fit HUD into aircraft for night flying ops into Queenstown or just helpful?
3. How long until we see Qantas begin night flights, or would they have to install HUD too?
4. Has Jetstar installed HUD into their A320 fleet, if so which aircraft?

ZKOXA


Yes, VA will be operating night services on BNE-ZQN flights from June 23rd at 2/weekly


The flight is also seasonal

http://australianaviation.com.au/2016/1 ... ne-sydney/
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QF46
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 2:58 pm

aerorobnz wrote:
- The "old" domestics are 6.5 years compared to 13.5 years for the regionals. It seems the target window for fleet replacement for 777/A320/787s now the old 767/744s are gone is in the vicinity of 15 years. That means that even the most elderly of the A320Ds are only approaching their "half-life".


As a rule, don't short-haul aircraft have a somewhat shorter life than long-haul aircraft, due to a greater number of rotations? I think I've read somewhere that wear-and-tear is caused more by takeoff/landing cycles than by the sheer number of hours flown, such that longer haul aircraft stick around for longer (as with KLM's 747s, for instance).
 
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Zkpilot
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 2:17 am

QF46 wrote:
aerorobnz wrote:
- The "old" domestics are 6.5 years compared to 13.5 years for the regionals. It seems the target window for fleet replacement for 777/A320/787s now the old 767/744s are gone is in the vicinity of 15 years. That means that even the most elderly of the A320Ds are only approaching their "half-life".


As a rule, don't short-haul aircraft have a somewhat shorter life than long-haul aircraft, due to a greater number of rotations? I think I've read somewhere that wear-and-tear is caused more by takeoff/landing cycles than by the sheer number of hours flown, such that longer haul aircraft stick around for longer (as with KLM's 747s, for instance).

Correct the number of cycles generally dictates service life (especially when aircraft come up for costly heavy maintenance).
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 4:37 am

aerorobnz wrote:
zkncj wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Yep, maybe time for a cabin refresh soon? I wonder how many are owned leased of the domestic fleet?


From some quick research tonight:

OJQ,OJR, OJS and OAB - Leased
OXA-OXM - Owned

I do wonder if they are planning to replace the OJ* domestic fleet with A321's, on top of the 13 A321/320NEO purchase they did agree to lease 5x 321NEO which the rights to on sell the some of the 13 purchased if required later on. So in theory they do have slots for 18 NEO's unless they choose to onsell the 5.

A couple of points to make on this,

- I don't believe that the domestic A320s will change to A321s any time soon. The A321s will likely be utilised as regional primarily, with a few subs and for the business travel peak periods of the day and seasonal peaks domestically only. I think it is a reasonable assumption to expect that anything replacing the Regionals will likely be an A321.

- If they do go A321s to WLG.CHC/DUD/ZQN then there is a gap between 70Y and 220Y which is not an inconsequential gap to bridge especially when the ports want frequency rather than capacity.

- The domestic airports might be able to handle them, but the current AKL domestic terminal can't easily without flow restriction and overall operational penalty to domestic. Gate holds, misconnections etc. I don/t think A321s will be mainstream domestically until the new terminal is built. 40 extra seats in and out will have a impact on turn times and gate availability.

- The "old" domestics are 6.5 years compared to 13.5 years for the regionals. It seems the target window for fleet replacement for 777/A320/787s now the old 767/744s are gone is in the vicinity of 15 years. That means that even the most elderly of the A320Ds are only approaching their "half-life".

The A321s will not be 220Y, they will be 171Y if I remember correctly. They will also still have the OX series aircraft. The OJ domestic fleet is only 4 aircraft out of the total 17. This would allow for a small capacity boost on selected flights having 4 A321 and 13 A320D. The four OJ A320D could replace the oldest A320 regional aircraft, or be growth in either domestic or international. So before you go shouting "facts" Aerorobnz, check them. QF46 and ZKpilot above are also right, correcting you again.

Also, todays VA23 flew over AKL on a very southerly track.
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
Qantas16
Posts: 376
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 5:17 am

LamboAston wrote:
aerorobnz wrote:
zkncj wrote:

From some quick research tonight:

OJQ,OJR, OJS and OAB - Leased
OXA-OXM - Owned

I do wonder if they are planning to replace the OJ* domestic fleet with A321's, on top of the 13 A321/320NEO purchase they did agree to lease 5x 321NEO which the rights to on sell the some of the 13 purchased if required later on. So in theory they do have slots for 18 NEO's unless they choose to onsell the 5.

A couple of points to make on this,

- I don't believe that the domestic A320s will change to A321s any time soon. The A321s will likely be utilised as regional primarily, with a few subs and for the business travel peak periods of the day and seasonal peaks domestically only. I think it is a reasonable assumption to expect that anything replacing the Regionals will likely be an A321.

- If they do go A321s to WLG.CHC/DUD/ZQN then there is a gap between 70Y and 220Y which is not an inconsequential gap to bridge especially when the ports want frequency rather than capacity.

- The domestic airports might be able to handle them, but the current AKL domestic terminal can't easily without flow restriction and overall operational penalty to domestic. Gate holds, misconnections etc. I don/t think A321s will be mainstream domestically until the new terminal is built. 40 extra seats in and out will have a impact on turn times and gate availability.

- The "old" domestics are 6.5 years compared to 13.5 years for the regionals. It seems the target window for fleet replacement for 777/A320/787s now the old 767/744s are gone is in the vicinity of 15 years. That means that even the most elderly of the A320Ds are only approaching their "half-life".

The A321s will not be 220Y, they will be 171Y if I remember correctly. They will also still have the OX series aircraft. The OJ domestic fleet is only 4 aircraft out of the total 17. This would allow for a small capacity boost on selected flights having 4 A321 and 13 A320D. The four OJ A320D could replace the oldest A320 regional aircraft, or be growth in either domestic or international. So before you go shouting "facts" Aerorobnz, check them. QF46 and ZKpilot above are also right, correcting you again.

Also, todays VA23 flew over AKL on a very southerly track.


171Y seems way to little for an A321... JQ have just announced they will be fitting 186Y in their A320s so 171Y in an A321 is very poor economics.
 
ZKOXA
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 5:30 am

Qantas16 wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
aerorobnz wrote:
A couple of points to make on this,

- I don't believe that the domestic A320s will change to A321s any time soon. The A321s will likely be utilised as regional primarily, with a few subs and for the business travel peak periods of the day and seasonal peaks domestically only. I think it is a reasonable assumption to expect that anything replacing the Regionals will likely be an A321.

- If they do go A321s to WLG.CHC/DUD/ZQN then there is a gap between 70Y and 220Y which is not an inconsequential gap to bridge especially when the ports want frequency rather than capacity.

- The domestic airports might be able to handle them, but the current AKL domestic terminal can't easily without flow restriction and overall operational penalty to domestic. Gate holds, misconnections etc. I don/t think A321s will be mainstream domestically until the new terminal is built. 40 extra seats in and out will have a impact on turn times and gate availability.

- The "old" domestics are 6.5 years compared to 13.5 years for the regionals. It seems the target window for fleet replacement for 777/A320/787s now the old 767/744s are gone is in the vicinity of 15 years. That means that even the most elderly of the A320Ds are only approaching their "half-life".

The A321s will not be 220Y, they will be 171Y if I remember correctly. They will also still have the OX series aircraft. The OJ domestic fleet is only 4 aircraft out of the total 17. This would allow for a small capacity boost on selected flights having 4 A321 and 13 A320D. The four OJ A320D could replace the oldest A320 regional aircraft, or be growth in either domestic or international. So before you go shouting "facts" Aerorobnz, check them. QF46 and ZKpilot above are also right, correcting you again.

Also, todays VA23 flew over AKL on a very southerly track.


171Y seems way to little for an A321... JQ have just announced they will be fitting 186Y in their A320s so 171Y in an A321 is very poor economics.


I too strongly doubt there will be 171Y as NZ have stated that there will be no J meaning that there will most likely be only Y. Also the A321NEO should have more economic seating as they did with the A320NEO. Thus the NZ A321 I would assume would have somewhere in the 220 seat region unless they have stated otherwise.

ZKOXA
Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind. - Dr. Seuss
 
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LamboAston
Posts: 555
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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 5:44 am

Sorry, I just quoted what zkncj said in the australian thread.
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
NPL8800
Posts: 89
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 5:00 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 5:48 am

CI has closed reservation for their TPE-SYD-CHC summer service, TPE-MEL-CHC will remain
 
NPL8800
Posts: 89
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 5:00 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 5:54 am

To avoid confusion it is the SYD-CHC sector of CI55/56 that is ending, the TPE-SYD sector remains unchanged

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