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Iemand91
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Re: Jet Airways Announces Partnership With Delta/KLM

Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:55 pm

Jet Airways adds another route to Amsterdam, this time from/to Bangalore.

9W236 - dep. BLR 02:25 - arr. AMS 08:35 A333
9W235 - dep AMS 10:50 - arr. BLR 00:40 A333

First flight to Amsterdam will take place on October 29.

One interesting thing is that all 4 planes will be at the Amsterdam gates at roughly the same time.
The first flight (9W233 from Toronto) lands at 07:55 and the last (9W236 from Bangalore) at 08:35.
The first to depart (9W235 to Bangalore) departs at 10:50 and the last (9W233 to Delhi) at 11:40.

I've often tracked them on FR24 taking of right after each other at Amsterdam.
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FSDan
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Re: Jet Airways Announces Partnership With Delta/KLM

Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:42 pm

Iemand91 wrote:
Jet Airways adds another route to Amsterdam, this time from/to Bangalore.

9W236 - dep. BLR 02:25 - arr. AMS 08:35 A333
9W235 - dep AMS 10:50 - arr. BLR 00:40 A333

First flight to Amsterdam will take place on October 29.

One interesting thing is that all 4 planes will be at the Amsterdam gates at roughly the same time.
The first flight (9W233 from Toronto) lands at 07:55 and the last (9W236 from Bangalore) at 08:35.
The first to depart (9W235 to Bangalore) departs at 10:50 and the last (9W233 to Delhi) at 11:40.

I've often tracked them on FR24 taking of right after each other at Amsterdam.


BLR is an important market to serve, and this will provide a nice alternative to flying AF through CDG. Regarding all 9W aircraft being on the ground at the same time, that's not surprising given it's a scissor hub.
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CaliguyNYC
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Re: Jet Airways Announces Partnership With Delta/KLM

Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:11 pm

9W also announced CDG-MAA per another site. Its 5 days a week x23 usual Europe-India timings

And so it begins. Comes at the right time as well with the laptop ban. Big question is if AF will retain their metal into BLR. I think they are 6/5 days a week winter/summer. Maybe stabilize at 5 days year round to maintain the presence. I really hope AF/KL/DL/9W stay serious on this partnership and ensure the pax transit experience is good. Have some Indian staff (don't care who employs them) at AMS and CDG to help out. Ensure no offensive treatment if IRROPS (really common sense customer service that airlines give to Japanese and Chinese travelers). Also 9W needs to improve around the edges. Why not offer an amenity kit in J on day flights (if you read reviews they get reamed for this). For god sakes, things are so cheap in India, offer eye mask, mouth wash and ear plugs in coach too. Finally improve English movie selection to include more new movies. Why Indian carriers have this issue is beyond me.

Finally for all those that say the ME3 brought cheap fares to India which makes them worth it, the AF/KL/DL/9W/VS partnership also is bringing cheap fares. Basically it seems AF/KL/DL and VS are offering a good chunk of their transatlantic cheapo seat inventory for India pax. This way they push up fares US-Europe O&D and allow the effective fare Europe-India to go up (for a US-India fare). Its really a brilliant way to combat the ME3. Also peak to India is off peak US-Europe. Of course it means one-stop to other regions suffer but what markets really are there that need US one stop via Europe? It seems like the fight for US-ME pax is ceded to ME3 plus TK.
 
CDG777FAN
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Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 4:52 pm

Hello everybody,

Don't know if it has been discussed previously but Jet Airways (9W) is starting to new non-routes from Europe to India effective from 29OCT2017:

CDG/MAA/CDG with 330-300 Mon, Thu, Fri, Sat, Sun
AMS/BLR/AMS with 330-300 daily

AF/KL will be code-sharing on flights.

So 9W operations in Europe in the near future will be:

14X LHR/BOM/LHR
7X LHR/DEL/LHR
7X AMS/BOM/AMS
7X AMS/DEL/AMS
7X AMS/BLR/AMS
7X AMS/YYZ/AMS
7X CDG/BOM/CDG
5X CDG/MAA/CDG

With agreements signed with AF, KL, DL and VS 9W is willing to fight for North American customers offering one-stop connections through AMS, LHR and CDG on their way to India.
 
klm617
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Re: RE: Jet Airways Announces Partnership With Delta/KLM

Thu Apr 20, 2017 4:55 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
747megatop wrote:
Quoting global1 (Reply 14):non-stop service to India from ATL or JFK is not out of the question.
Given the wide range of 1 stop options for NYC - India and 2 non stops NYC - DEL/BOM i don't see how DL would re-attempt JFK-BOM non stop or for that matter JFK-DEL. I don't see DL being bold enough to resurrect the ATL either because i very much doubt if the premium market exists. I think we have just about seen the end of new US - India non stops being launched with the last one being the DEL-SFO nonstop by AI. At the most, we may see DEL-IAD by AI and that's about it. Only significantly improved economics by a more fuel efficient aircraft may lead to other non-stops being tried; I think DL will probably concentrate on making more inroads into the Chinese market as far as Asia is concerned.


I actually think DL or 9W should restart JFK-BOM nonstop (once they have their JV in place). Fact remains the ME3 fill their F and J cabins ex BOM and a good chunk of those pax are going to the US. US-India non stops need connections on both sides (which is what the last DL JFK-BOM flight lacked). AI's nonstops all land in India well in time to make connections all over India. DL/9W can do something similar (say 4pm departure from JFK and 4pm arrival at BOM). Not to mention many people, but not all, much prefer the one long flight so you can sleep. Connecting in Europe after 7 hours at what is 2am EST to then get on another 8 hour flight is HELL. Plus most of these flights from Europe arrive too late into BOM to connect to smaller towns. You cannot compete against the ME3 without options. With DL being strong with corporates in NYC and 9W strong in BOM, that's the nonstop they should have in their portfolio. Btw JFK-BOM-SIN would probably be one of the fastest connections for Skyteam team fans out of JFK if all the flights are timed right. I'd also like to see 9W start EWR-AMS (it's the too important of a US destination from India) and start San Jose, CA to CDG to BOM. I think SJC-CDG is a better year round destination than SJC-FRA and the Indian community in SF Bay Area will fill the flight during winter and be good back fill during summer. This way 9W would fly to the three most important NA destinations - YYZ, EWR and SF Bay Area.



I think they are better off DTW-India this is the largest international market out of Detroit not served by a direct flight over 100 PAX a day. JFJ is already over served in the India market with so much competition driving down yields why not go some where like DTW or ATL where they can have the whole market to themselves. Detroit more so because ATL has QR
 
jkrugman22
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 4:55 pm

Any chance for HYD to make the list in the near future?
 
CDG777FAN
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 5:01 pm

HYD is served by KL if I'm not mistaken
 
LJ
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 5:10 pm

CDG777FAN wrote:
HYD is served by KL if I'm not mistaken


You mean was served (discontinued as of February 2009
 
Irehdna
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 5:32 pm

Any chance for seeing BOM-JFK, BOM-PVG, BOM-JNB, or MAA/BLR-SYD sometime?
 
TheGeordielad
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 5:57 pm

Irehdna wrote:
Any chance for seeing BOM-JFK, BOM-PVG, BOM-JNB, or MAA/BLR-SYD sometime?

They did BOM-JFK but withdrew in 2012
They were going to start PVG but didn't in 2011.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:45 pm

TheGeordielad wrote:
Irehdna wrote:
Any chance for seeing BOM-JFK, BOM-PVG, BOM-JNB, or MAA/BLR-SYD sometime?

They did BOM-JFK but withdrew in 2012
They were going to start PVG but didn't in 2011.


BOM-EWR via BRU lasted until 2015 or 2016 when the Delta partnership began.
 
Luisvalero
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:54 pm

I would like to see BOM-BCN. Lot of indians visit BCN every year, and there's Also a sizeable indian population of gujarati origin
 
Irehdna
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:01 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
TheGeordielad wrote:
Irehdna wrote:
Any chance for seeing BOM-JFK, BOM-PVG, BOM-JNB, or MAA/BLR-SYD sometime?

They did BOM-JFK but withdrew in 2012
They were going to start PVG but didn't in 2011.


BOM-EWR via BRU lasted until 2015 or 2016 when the Delta partnership began.


I meant non-stop BOM-JFK/SYD and possibly MAA-JFK/SYD non-stop.

I actually think that MAA is better positioned for a USA/AUS non-stop than BOM. Both USA and Australia have high Tamil diasporas, but neither have high Marathi communities.
 
CDG777FAN
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:07 pm

LJ wrote:
CDG777FAN wrote:
HYD is served by KL if I'm not mistaken


You mean was served (discontinued as of February 2009


Thanks for the information
 
vadodara
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:07 pm

Jet Airways has lots of 777's and A330's that need to be monetized.

They tried to emulate the likes of Pan Am, TWA etc and start a European hub with predictable results.

A partnership with EU/N American airline where they exchange passengers but not overextend themselves is an optimum solution. They can add more Indian cities to AMS/CDG/LHR and pick the incremental revenue. For cases that justifies non-stops, they could add them independently. At some point, the market will mature for them to start non-stop DEL/BOM to US. However, under current scenario, it would mean a DL hub. So other than JFK, really no alternative. Neither of ATL/CVG/SLC/DTW/MSP would fit the bill except perhaps for ATL.
 
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AI126
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:19 pm

Still hoping that they start HYD-CDG/AMS eventually. Then they would have all five premium heavy Indian metros connected to Europe. I do wonder how long the flights will last, though. They withdrew MAA-BRU-JFK after two years of operation if I remember correctly.
 
Cunard
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:50 pm

Manchester to either Delhi or Mumbai is long overdue especially if anyone has read the recent CAPA report stating that upto 300,000 searches were made on Skyscanner in the last twelve months for flights from Manchester to Mumbai.
 
User001
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:52 pm

MAN-BOM must now be one of the largest Europe-India routes without a direct link.

Jet Airways has a hub at BOM, has a growing relationship with Virgin, who in term base aircraft at Manchester. That tied with the large indirect pax numbers, all the ingredients are there!
 
airDFW
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:35 pm

So KLM does not fly to DFW anymore?

Pity the flight timings are good. Not crazy like those of BA or Qatar or Etihad into and out of BLR.
 
Nimish
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:10 pm

CDG777FAN wrote:
CDG/MAA/CDG with 330-300 Mon, Thu, Fri, Sat, Sun
AMS/BLR/AMS with 330-300 daily
...
With agreements signed with AF, KL, DL and VS 9W is willing to fight for North American customers offering one-stop connections through AMS, LHR and CDG on their way to India.


This is great news, and something we've been eagerly waiting for. AF/KL/DL/VS need a strong Indian partner and a good set of one-stop India - Americas routes and 9W adding these flights will greatly help meet that need.

For the FFP members, hopefully these flights get to a "status miles" earning soon (probably needs 9W to enter a JV or join Skyteam), so the flights on non-9W metal from CDG/ AMS/ LHR continue to earn the 9W status miles.
Incredible India!
 
alfa164
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:14 pm

airDFW wrote:
So KLM does not fly to DFW anymore?
Pity the flight timings are good. Not crazy like those of BA or Qatar or Etihad into and out of BLR.


It was cancelled this year in favor of SLC-AMS
 
behramjee
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:18 pm

Cdg Maa is a big p2p market segment with 110,000 pax round trip passenger demand in 2016 however very low yielding. I don't see 9W lasting on this route beyond 2021.

BLR AMS should do fine for them especially in J class cabin year round. KL will support this new service very nicely.
 
AMS18C36C
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:26 pm

Several months ago, it was stated that KL/9W were looking at a new AMS-India route, so this announcement isn't very surprising. :)
 
NichCage
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:49 pm

Something I want to add that some people may have forgotten. When Jet Airways had there scissor hub in BRU, they flew to MAA for a little while along with YYZ, JFK, EWR, along with BOM and DEL. They might have served some other Indian cities out of BRU that I don't know of.
 
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TheLion
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:12 am

With AI improving and taking the fight to the ME3, it's good to see Jet joining them with some smart expansion.
 
Irehdna
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:06 am

To be fair, I like how Jet Airways sees India as more than one city.

Nearly all of AI's long-haul flights (and all that were started recently) are from DEL, and they have neglected other airports all together in terms of long-haul expansion. 9W cares more about connecting more Indian cities to popular international destinations, and I do think this approach will serve them well in the near future.

Effectively, Air India has become "Air Delhi," and Jet Airways is the new "Air India."
 
Taco2sDay
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:12 am

I know this about Europe. But any chance of North America again?
 
anshabhi
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:16 am

It will be interesting to see how this hurts​ 9W-EY partnership
 
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KLMatSJC
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:33 am

TheGeordielad wrote:
Irehdna wrote:
Any chance for seeing BOM-JFK, BOM-PVG, BOM-JNB, or MAA/BLR-SYD sometime?

They did BOM-JFK but withdrew in 2012
They were going to start PVG but didn't in 2011.


I know they had SFO-PVG-BOM back in the late 2000s, so they have definitely operated it.
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Spiderguy252
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:45 am

NichCage wrote:
Something I want to add that some people may have forgotten. When Jet Airways had there scissor hub in BRU, they flew to MAA for a little while along with YYZ, JFK, EWR, along with BOM and DEL. They might have served some other Indian cities out of BRU that I don't know of.


They also had a BLR-BRU terminator service with an A330-200.

Irehdna wrote:
To be fair, I like how Jet Airways sees India as more than one city.

Nearly all of AI's long-haul flights (and all that were started recently) are from DEL, and they have neglected other airports all together in terms of long-haul expansion. 9W cares more about connecting more Indian cities to popular international destinations, and I do think this approach will serve them well in the near future.

Effectively, Air India has become "Air Delhi," and Jet Airways is the new "Air India."


Air India's strategy is fair enough. Have you seen their international connector services from DEL to other cities in the country?

In addition, they do serve their fair share of long/medium haul routes out of BOM/BLR/MAA/CCU - the likes of SIN/DXB/LHR among them.

KLMatSJC wrote:
TheGeordielad wrote:
Irehdna wrote:
Any chance for seeing BOM-JFK, BOM-PVG, BOM-JNB, or MAA/BLR-SYD sometime?

They did BOM-JFK but withdrew in 2012
They were going to start PVG but didn't in 2011.


I know they had SFO-PVG-BOM back in the late 2000s, so they have definitely operated it.


Indeed, though by all accounts the Chinese weren't liberal with slots at PVG which heavily impacted traffic to and from that destination. It was more or less a glorified fuel stop.
Vahroone
 
Luisvalero
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:24 am

One question, with the launch of the MAA-CDG, Jet Airways can sell, for example, MAA-CDG-LAX which is operated by Air France? It's like DL?
 
panamair
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:30 am

Luisvalero wrote:
One question, with the launch of the MAA-CDG, Jet Airways can sell, for example, MAA-CDG-LAX which is operated by Air France? It's like DL?


Correct. From the press release

http://news.delta.com/delta-partner-jet ... ica-europe

"......Through its European gateways of Amsterdam and Paris, Jet Airways will offer guests in Chennai and Bengaluru seamless one-stop connectivity to 35 destinations across Europe and 24 destinations in the United States, Canada and Mexico with our codeshare partners Air France, KLM and Delta.

Currently, Jet Airways connects to major European cities via Amsterdam and Paris including key destinations such as Berlin, Brussels, Copenhagen, Dusseldorf, Edinburgh, Geneva, Gothenburg, Hamburg, Helsinki, Madrid, Manchester, Oslo, Prague, Stockholm, Stuttgart, Vienna, Munich, Venice, London, Dublin and Zurich.

Similarly, guests can travel to major destinations across North America over Amsterdam and Paris, such as: Atlanta, Boston, Chicago, Cincinnati, Detroit, Houston, Los Angeles, Miami, Minneapolis, New York-JFK, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Newark, Portland, Raleigh-Durham, Salt Lake City, San Francisco, Seattle, Washington, Calgary, Edmonton, Montreal, Vancouver and Mexico City......"
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:31 am

SkyTeam non-stops to North America - Total 34 (I think 24 in the press release is a typo)

AMS - 21 Destinations- Atlanta, Austin, Boston, Charlotte, Columbus, Detroit, Denver,Las Vegas, Miami,Minneapolis, Orlando,Phoenix,Portland,Salt Lake City,San Diego,Seattle,St. Louis,Tampa,Calgary,Edmonton,Mexico City

CDG - 20 Destinations - Atlanta, Chicago, Cincinnati, Detroit, Houston,Los Angeles, Miami,Minneapolis, Newark, New York,Pittsburgh, Philadelphia, Raleigh-Durham,Salt Lake City ,San Francisco,Seattle,Washington DC,Vancouver,Montreal,Mexico City

LHR - 9 Destinations - Atlanta, Boston, Detroit, Minneapolis, New York,Philadelphia, Portland,Salt Lake City,Seattle
 
blrsea
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:59 am

How does DL/KL/AF baggage policy work with 9W to US? From India, 9W allows 2 bags free for Y passengers to US. On the return from US where they will first be taking the partner carrier, will they allow free bags as per 9W policy? Earlier if I remember right, AA wouldn't allow EY's allowance of 2 bags when connecting to EY, but EY would allow 2 bags to US. For people taking taking 2 bags to US, they would have to pay baggage fee for one bag to AA on the way back! I hope its not something similar with DL/KL/AF codeshare with 9W
 
panamair
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:22 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
SkyTeam non-stops to North America - Total 34 (I think 24 in the press release is a typo)

AMS - 21 Destinations- Atlanta, Austin, Boston, Charlotte, Columbus, Detroit, Denver,Las Vegas, Miami,Minneapolis, Orlando,Phoenix,Portland,Salt Lake City,San Diego,Seattle,St. Louis,Tampa,Calgary,Edmonton,Mexico City


There are no nonstops from AMS to AUS, CLT, CMH, DEN, LAS, MCO, PHX, SAN, STL, TPA
 
VTORD
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:22 pm

blrsea wrote:
How does DL/KL/AF baggage policy work with 9W to US? From India, 9W allows 2 bags free for Y passengers to US. On the return from US where they will first be taking the partner carrier, will they allow free bags as per 9W policy? Earlier if I remember right, AA wouldn't allow EY's allowance of 2 bags when connecting to EY, but EY would allow 2 bags to US. For people taking taking 2 bags to US, they would have to pay baggage fee for one bag to AA on the way back! I hope its not something similar with DL/KL/AF codeshare with 9W


Afraid, they might have to pay. My sister's family flew ATL-BOM-ATL via LHR on VS-9W last summer. She had to pay for 2 bags at ATL even though the ticket clearly mentioned a promotional offer with 2 free bags. Apparently VS's ground services are handled by DL and they refused to recognize that. She eventually got her money back as a refund after some haggling with VS but had to pay up front. I am not sure of the details but I know this happened for sure.
Twitter: @spottingfoodie
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:24 pm

panamair wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
SkyTeam non-stops to North America - Total 34 (I think 24 in the press release is a typo)

AMS - 21 Destinations- Atlanta, Austin, Boston, Charlotte, Columbus, Detroit, Denver,Las Vegas, Miami,Minneapolis, Orlando,Phoenix,Portland,Salt Lake City,San Diego,Seattle,St. Louis,Tampa,Calgary,Edmonton,Mexico City


There are no nonstops from AMS to AUS, CLT, CMH, DEN, LAS, MCO, PHX, SAN, STL, TPA


You are correct, not sure what I did.

AMS-ATL,BOS,ORD,DTW,IAH,LAX,MIA,MSP,EWR,JFK,PDX,SLC,SFO,SEA,IAD,YYC,YEG,YYZ,YVR,MEX
CDG-ATL,BOS,ORD,CVG,DTW,IAH,LAX,MIA,MSP,EWR,JFK,PHL,PIT,RDU,SLC,SFO,SEA,IAD,YUL,YYZ,YVR,MEX
LHR-ATL,BOS,DTW,LAX,MIA,MSP,EWR,JFK,PHL,PDX,SLC,SFO,SEA,IAD
 
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Spiderguy252
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:01 pm

VTORD wrote:
blrsea wrote:
How does DL/KL/AF baggage policy work with 9W to US? From India, 9W allows 2 bags free for Y passengers to US. On the return from US where they will first be taking the partner carrier, will they allow free bags as per 9W policy? Earlier if I remember right, AA wouldn't allow EY's allowance of 2 bags when connecting to EY, but EY would allow 2 bags to US. For people taking taking 2 bags to US, they would have to pay baggage fee for one bag to AA on the way back! I hope its not something similar with DL/KL/AF codeshare with 9W


Afraid, they might have to pay. My sister's family flew ATL-BOM-ATL via LHR on VS-9W last summer. She had to pay for 2 bags at ATL even though the ticket clearly mentioned a promotional offer with 2 free bags. Apparently VS's ground services are handled by DL and they refused to recognize that. She eventually got her money back as a refund after some haggling with VS but had to pay up front. I am not sure of the details but I know this happened for sure.


These sound like teething problems and should hopefully be fixed lest disenchanted passengers ditch these options in favour of the Gulf carriers all over again.
Vahroone
 
CaliguyNYC
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:56 pm

I think they will fix all the small things like baggage quickly. 9W is clearly the way AF/KL/DL/VS are taking on the ME3. The dagger to the heart in a fight against the ME3 are India pax. This is the core part of the ME3's traffic. Move India pax away from the ME3 and their networks start to bleed. Also don't forget that even on routes where India pax dont fly, the profits from India help subsidize other ME3 growth. 9W finally is benefitting from powerful airlines wanting to cripple the ME3. I am sort of shocked that EY is allowing this. I guess 9W is more independent than I thought.
 
factsonly
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Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:53 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:

AMS-ATL,BOS,ORD,DTW,IAH,LAX,MIA,MSP,EWR,JFK,PDX,SLC,SFO,SEA,IAD,YYC,YEG,YYZ,YVR,MEX
CDG-ATL,BOS,ORD,CVG,DTW,IAH,LAX,MIA,MSP,EWR,JFK,PHL,PIT,RDU,SLC,SFO,SEA,IAD,YUL,YYZ,YVR,MEX
LHR-ATL,BOS,DTW,LAX,MIA,MSP,EWR,JFK,PHL,PDX,SLC,SFO,SEA,IAD


Add:

AMS - YUL
 
vadodara
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:45 pm

Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:57 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
I think they will fix all the small things like baggage quickly. 9W is clearly the way AF/KL/DL/VS are taking on the ME3. The dagger to the heart in a fight against the ME3 are India pax. This is the core part of the ME3's traffic. Move India pax away from the ME3 and their networks start to bleed. Also don't forget that even on routes where India pax dont fly, the profits from India help subsidize other ME3 growth. 9W finally is benefitting from powerful airlines wanting to cripple the ME3. I am sort of shocked that EY is allowing this. I guess 9W is more independent than I thought.


Well, EY handed 9W this on a platter. At one point, a lot of long hauls were wet-leased to EY effectively crippling 9W route network. Over-time, all of them have been returned. In the meantime, and in some part to EY's cash infusion, 9W has become a bit more rational in how it run's itself.

In addition, as a practical matter, ME3 had a rational so long as indian air carriers were absolutely incompetent. Even a reasonably good 9W can get decent load's out of India to Europe. Add to this transfers at AMS/CDG and now LHR to 20+ US cities and the game is on.

Do keep in mind that free-markets have done a little more here. Go back even 10 yrs and the Europeans/US airlines had too much of a colonial or even a racist mindset to serve. Competition is therefore a good thing, especially for an India flier!
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 3788
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:04 am

It appears not many Indians trust 9W's ability to sustain a route. But I think as long as 9W follows DL's lead they will do very well.

There is no need for a scissor hub or fifth freedom flights. That is a total waste of resources (crew) and increased complexity. It might well connect another city to Europe. Hopefully SkyTeam+ will address the dietary needs of Indian passengers, which seems to be an issue even after decades of service.

Recently DL offered Palak Paneer at their lounges, you should read comments about its appearance.
 
audian
Posts: 155
Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2015 2:05 pm

Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:31 am

HYD for 9W and DFW for KLM would be great. AA and BA will be furious though.

Does anyone know if KLM is coming back to DFW this summer? They operated this route last summer.
 
blrsea
Posts: 1540
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 2:22 am

Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:35 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
It appears not many Indians trust 9W's ability to sustain a route. But I think as long as 9W follows DL's lead they will do very well.

There is no need for a scissor hub or fifth freedom flights. That is a total waste of resources (crew) and increased complexity. It might well connect another city to Europe. Hopefully SkyTeam+ will address the dietary needs of Indian passengers, which seems to be an issue even after decades of service.

Recently DL offered Palak Paneer at their lounges, you should read comments about its appearance.


Yup, one of the major issues. I remember on one of my AF flights, I was served plain rice and boiled spinach (with not even salt in it) for AVML meal. CDG was a mess to transfer earlier, and I don't know if people there really don't know english or act like it. FRA and AMS were much better in that regards.

Long time back, LHR and CDG didn't allow Indians to transit if they didn't have a valid US visa stamp in their passport. So if someone had a valid H1B extension(but stamp on passport had expired), or was on AP, they couldn't use CDG/LHR to transit. US is also unique in that the visa expiration date pertains to only entry to US, so you can enter US before your US visa expires, and the immigration officer will determine how long you stay there(have personal experience on this). So while coming back, the visa might have expired . For people like these, taking BA/AF was out of question at one time. So ME3/Asian carriers were better options. Not sure if policies has changed in these airports now. Plus there were instances earlier of Indian passengers not being given temporary visas when flights were delayed for more than 12-16 hours so they could not use the accommodation AF provided for stuck passengers. Not sure if things are better at CDG or not.

Given their visa limitations, EU airports are not the best ones to be stuck at for Indians. Asian carriers and ME3 are much better in that regard. HKG/KUL/SIN/DXB/AUH etc had no such issues.
 
anshabhi
Posts: 824
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2016 10:40 am

Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:03 am

vadodara wrote:
Do keep in mind that free-markets have done a little more here. Go back even 10 yrs and the Europeans/US airlines had too much of a colonial or even a racist mindset to serve. Competition is therefore a good thing, especially for an India flier!


That keeps happening even today.

Indian-origin mom told to prove lactation at Frankfurt airport (31st Jan 2017)

Indian woman asked to strip at Frankfurt airport security check, alleges racism (1st April 2017)

Asian and ME carriers are a ton better in this respect. ME carriers also keep care of Indian's dietary and social requirements.
Save your taste and innocent souls! http://www.chooseveg.in
 
unrave
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:06 am

This expansion is good news for 9W and Indian passengers, but a lot of work needs to be done to wean Indian travellers away from ME carriers. The three areas where ME carriers blow the competition away are (1) Food: EK for example out of SFO serves proper Indian vegetarian and meat, while God knows what gets served in the name of AVML in KL; EK even prints the menu the regional Indian language to and from India (2) IFE: European carriers (and even 9W) have no regional Indian content at all while ME carriers and SQ offer content in a variety of Indian languages and (3) IRROPS: I would rather get stranded in DXB/AUH/DOH than in CDG and get treated like shit.

ME carriers did not just capture Indian traffic by way of capacity dumping alone. They offer Indian food, Indian IFE content, Indian language speaking staff at their hubs. No wonder Indian passengers love to fly on them.
 
factsonly
Posts: 2208
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 3:08 pm

Re: Jet Airways to start two new routes from Europe to India later this year

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:15 am

audian wrote:
HYD for 9W and DFW for KLM would be great. AA and BA will be furious though.

Does anyone know if KLM is coming back to DFW this summer? They operated this route last summer.


With AA opening DFW-AMS daily (summer seasonal) on May 5th, 2017, there is little chance of KLM returning to DFW any time soon.

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