There are many Aviation threads on this forum, but what about Texas?

We are the home to AA and WN, along with a large UA hub at IAH.

This forum is not a Dallas vs. Houston thread (will ask moderators to delete any DvH topic), but all about Aviation in the Lone Star State!

Well the most important item of late is that Del Rio will once again be on the airline map lol.
With Texas Sky's one flight/day DFW-DRT, I hope to see a nice usage of the Del Rio Airport again.
Texas Sky (CFM) will have now (from 4/17) a Victoria-DFW-DRT-DFW-Victoria rotation for the Jetstream they use on this service.
Secondly, on a personal note, I will be relocating from SAT to MAF (Midland,TX), next week so will be seeing a big loss in types and numbers of airline flights lol. Oh well.

On Thursday, the Austin Airport will be reopening the South Terminal. Allegiant will initially use it as well as Sun Country when they begin flights in August. Frontier may also move to the terminal, though it has not yet been confirmed.

Some observations from AMA:

We keep hearing rumors that AA is going to start PHX with an MQ ERJ-145.

While AA is now E-175s, CRJ-900s and one Super 80 per day, UA is still all ERJ-145 (and occasionally 135) to IAH and DEN.

My wet dream is to see UA restart some intra-Texas flying with their new domestic build up.

I also believe AUS will get an NRT flight before the end of the deacde.

TWA772LR wrote:

My wet dream is to see UA restart some intra-Texas flying with their new domestic build up.

I also believe AUS will get an NRT flight before the end of the deacde.

I can see UA restarting air service to Beaumont, and upgrading Amarillo, El Paso, Corpus Christi to Mainline. It also sucks to see IAH lose the 787, but it gets backfilled with 777s and 767s. But I would like to see IAH get a 77W or two!!

AVENSAB727 wrote:

TWA772LR wrote:

My wet dream is to see UA restart some intra-Texas flying with their new domestic build up.

I also believe AUS will get an NRT flight before the end of the deacde.

I can see UA restarting air service to Beaumont, and upgrading Amarillo, El Paso, Corpus Christi to Mainline. It also sucks to see IAH lose the 787, but it gets backfilled with 777s and 767s. But I would like to see IAH get a 77W or two!!

IAH-NRT/GRU would most likely be the first ones. But not for a while since they haven't even thought about bringing it down here yet.

Well, I know it is "just" general aviation, but it matters...

...Austin (KAUS) has a fourth FBO (MillionAir) in the construction phase, and it could certainly use the competition, because the service and cost of the existing ones have both worsened of late. As it stands, I rarely use KAUS any longer, preferring the exceptional service at KEDC (Austin Executive). The airside works fine, and air ops in and out are easy, but the FBOs are difficult, and the location of the GA facilities automatically throws an extra 20 minutes into your drive time arriving and departing the field on the ground.

It is still a sin that Austin has only one airport (KEDC is in Pflugerville), and had the City of Austin exercised a modicum of common sense, they would have kept Mueller open as a single-runway GA reliever.

Meanwhile, Addison (KADS), which has never reliably supported three FBOs and has a serious shortage of hangar space for based aircraft, is demolishing several rows of T-hangars on the southeast corner so they can build... a fourth FBO.

More direct destinations from ELP.

AVENSAB727 wrote:

TWA772LR wrote:

My wet dream is to see UA restart some intra-Texas flying with their new domestic build up.

I also believe AUS will get an NRT flight before the end of the deacde.

I can see UA restarting air service to Beaumont, and upgrading Amarillo, El Paso, Corpus Christi to Mainline. It also sucks to see IAH lose the 787, but it gets backfilled with 777s and 767s. But I would like to see IAH get a 77W or two!!

CRP and AMA will not see mainline IMO. ELP might.

IAH will definitely not get the 77W anytime soon.

For intra-Texas flying, the only way we are going to see it expand is IF UA signs on with a prop plane operator that can fly to places like TYR, ACT, and DRT. BPT is so close Im not sure restarting it is in the cards.

LAXdude1023 wrote:

AVENSAB727 wrote:

TWA772LR wrote:

My wet dream is to see UA restart some intra-Texas flying with their new domestic build up.

I also believe AUS will get an NRT flight before the end of the deacde.

I can see UA restarting air service to Beaumont, and upgrading Amarillo, El Paso, Corpus Christi to Mainline. It also sucks to see IAH lose the 787, but it gets backfilled with 777s and 767s. But I would like to see IAH get a 77W or two!!

CRP and AMA will not see mainline IMO. ELP might.

IAH will definitely not get the 77W anytime soon.

For intra-Texas flying, the only way we are going to see it expand is IF UA signs on with a prop plane operator that can fly to places like TYR, ACT, and DRT. BPT is so close Im not sure restarting it is in the cards.

They have a bus service from Beaumont to IAH, 3 times a day IIRC, so no point of flying that route. I really hope to see IAH getting a 77W! LHR,NRT and FRA could be benefited from it.

nadavatar64 wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

AVENSAB727 wrote:

I can see UA restarting air service to Beaumont, and upgrading Amarillo, El Paso, Corpus Christi to Mainline. It also sucks to see IAH lose the 787, but it gets backfilled with 777s and 767s. But I would like to see IAH get a 77W or two!!

CRP and AMA will not see mainline IMO. ELP might.

IAH will definitely not get the 77W anytime soon.

For intra-Texas flying, the only way we are going to see it expand is IF UA signs on with a prop plane operator that can fly to places like TYR, ACT, and DRT. BPT is so close Im not sure restarting it is in the cards.

They have a bus service from Beaumont to IAH, 3 times a day IIRC, so no point of flying that route. I really hope to see IAH getting a 77W! LHR,NRT and FRA could be benefited from it.

They are not going to open a single route from IAH with the 77W. Given that NH and UA share among IAH-NRT, debatably, there is already enough if not too much capacity on it.

A 77W only works for IAH-LHR if its going to go to a daily flight and that isn't happening. The market demands some sort of frequency from UA.

IAH-FRA does fine with the 777. Its already getting a seat count upgrade.

nadavatar64 wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

AVENSAB727 wrote:

They have a bus service from Beaumont to IAH, 3 times a day IIRC, so no point of flying that route.

Well, I had a brief chat with a gate agent last time through IAH a couple weeks ago and there was some amount of rumor that maybe the planes return to BPT, we shall see - pretty quick flight that marginally might beat the bus depending on Houston traffic. Isn't parking free at BPT? Also we continue to see E-135/145 reductions from the United Express fleet...

stxbohn wrote:

nadavatar64 wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

Well, I had a brief chat with a gate agent last time through IAH a couple weeks ago and there was some amount of rumor that maybe the planes return to BPT, we shall see - pretty quick flight that marginally might beat the bus depending on Houston traffic. Isn't parking free at BPT? Also we continue to see E-135/145 reductions from the United Express fleet...

Pilots, FAs, and gate agents are among the worst people to get rumors like that from.

50 seaters are being reduced, yes. But there will still be demand for some kind of 50 seat service. The shortest route from IAH is LCH. Not only is that on 50 seaters but its served multiple times per day. LCH has the advantage of being an oil destination (it's like Galveston, a hub where the workers leave from on helicopters to go to the rig), as well as having 2 massive resorts there (Golden Nugget and Lauberge). It warrants both frequency and seats. UA would probably lose money sending one daily 737 there instead of 3 daily ERJs. BPT is similar to LCH in that it is an oil destination, but since I can get in my car from my house in Humble (town across the highway from IAH) and reach any point in Beaumont within an hour of stepping outside my house to get in my car, that alone means BPT is just too close for air service, at least on any present equipment.

I wonder if Cape Air has ever looked into doing any intra-Texas flights. It seems up their alley. A hub in SAT or AUS, and somewhere in Houston and Dallas would be a good network for them.

TWA772LR wrote:

stxbohn wrote:

nadavatar64 wrote:

Well, I had a brief chat with a gate agent last time through IAH a couple weeks ago and there was some amount of rumor that maybe the planes return to BPT, we shall see - pretty quick flight that marginally might beat the bus depending on Houston traffic. Isn't parking free at BPT? Also we continue to see E-135/145 reductions from the United Express fleet...

Pilots, FAs, and gate agents are among the worst people to get rumors like that from.

50 seaters are being reduced, yes. But there will still be demand for some kind of 50 seat service. The shortest route from IAH is LCH. Not only is that on 50 seaters but its served multiple times per day. LCH has the advantage of being an oil destination (it's like Galveston, a hub where the workers leave from on helicopters to go to the rig), as well as having 2 massive resorts there (Golden Nugget and Lauberge). It warrants both frequency and seats. UA would probably lose money sending one daily 737 there instead of 3 daily ERJs. BPT is similar to LCH in that it is an oil destination, but since I can get in my car from my house in Humble (town across the highway from IAH) and reach any point in Beaumont within an hour of stepping outside my house to get in my car, that alone means BPT is just too close for air service, at least on any present equipment.

I wonder if Cape Air has ever looked into doing any intra-Texas flights. It seems up their alley. A hub in SAT or AUS, and somewhere in Houston and Dallas would be a good network for them.

Intra flying in Texas other than SWA has been a looser. As I type this I am looking at my old Texas Airways cup insulator (coozie?), yep another one that bit the dust.

It is shocking how many towns UA has pulled out of considering they hub in Houston, Texas. Waco, and San Angelo to name just a few. Its interesting that cities like Corpus Christie which had mainline in the 80s and 90s are now just spokes for regional partners other than SWA. I always wandered what changed to cause that? Demo shift? Vacation patterns?

TWA772LR wrote:

I wonder if Cape Air has ever looked into doing any intra-Texas flights. It seems up their alley. A hub in SAT or AUS, and somewhere in Houston and Dallas would be a good network for them.

Doubtful, for precisely this reason:

william wrote:

Intra flying in Texas other than SWA has been a looser.

In the deregulation era, Southwest has come to dominate virtually all air traffic within the state of Texas that doesn't touch DFW or IAH. It's hard to imagine Cape Air being able to make much of anything work within the state of Texas besides maybe - maybe - some level of minimal capacity in very small, specialized markets like ALE and/or feeding into a network hub in DFW or IAH (but even that seems like quite a stretch). At this point, though, among the markets in Texas that are big enough to support Southwest 737s, Cape Air doesn't seem plausible. And for those markets that aren't big enough for Southwest 737s, RJs to DFW and in some cases also IAH seem like perfectly sufficient connectivity to the two largest and most important markets in the state, plus global connectivity.

william wrote:

It is shocking how many towns UA has pulled out of considering they hub in Houston, Texas. Waco, and San Angelo to name just a few. Its interesting that cities like Corpus Christie which had mainline in the 80s and 90s are now just spokes for regional partners other than SWA. I always wandered what changed to cause that? Demo shift? Vacation patterns?

Part of it may have been the broader network evolution of IAH in the context of United's post-merger network. Continental obviously had a much smaller and more geographically limited network than the new United. As such, that naturally tended to concentrate more traffic in IAH whereas today, at least some of that traffic can also be optimized across ORD and DEN. As that capacity reshuffling filters down to smaller markets, it may translate into some reduce capacity into some regional feeder/connecting-heavy markets like those in question. Plus, more broadly, it may also be that with the cost - both direct and opportunity - of flying small aircraft in network-branded operations steadily rising, some smaller markets in Texas can no longer profitably support two network brands, and of the two, AA has historically been the stronger brand in all except the south/coastal Texas markets (CRP, MFE, HRL, etc.).

commavia wrote:

TWA772LR wrote:

I wonder if Cape Air has ever looked into doing any intra-Texas flights. It seems up their alley. A hub in SAT or AUS, and somewhere in Houston and Dallas would be a good network for them.

Doubtful, for precisely this reason:

william wrote:

Intra flying in Texas other than SWA has been a looser.

In the deregulation era, Southwest has come to dominate virtually all air traffic within the state of Texas that doesn't touch DFW or IAH. It's hard to imagine Cape Air being able to make much of anything work within the state of Texas besides maybe - maybe - some level of minimal capacity in very small, specialized markets like ALE and/or feeding into a network hub in DFW or IAH (but even that seems like quite a stretch). At this point, though, among the markets in Texas that are big enough to support Southwest 737s, Cape Air doesn't seem plausible. And for those markets that aren't big enough for Southwest 737s, RJs to DFW and in some cases also IAH seem like perfectly sufficient connectivity to the two largest and most important markets in the state, plus global connectivity.

The thing about DFW and IAH is that they are to far east to make true intra-Texas flights work. And of course if a market is too small for a WN 737 it won't work. But Cape Air lives off of Cessna 402s with a capacity of 9. It is a totally different business practice that favors Cape Air. Flights from AUS/SAT-CRP/HRL/MFE/Del Rio/Waco and other small cities are up Cape Airs alley.

I can see AUS or SAT getting service from Norwegian eventually. AUS is very attractive to millennial from around the world and has a booming tech sector. SAT has a very rustic and modern fusion vibe to it and would be attractive to Europeans, it's also regarded as the gateway to SW Texas, i.e. hiking in Big Bend, tubing down one of the rivers, star gazing, etc... you know, stuff millennials love to do.

I can also see FI or WOW starting Texas flights.

TWA772LR wrote:

The thing about DFW and IAH is that they are to far east to make true intra-Texas flights work.

Again, what intra-Texas market exists that doesn't touch DFW or IAH is already pretty much covered by Southwest.

TWA772LR wrote:

And of course if a market is too small for a WN 737 it won't work. But Cape Air lives off of Cessna 402s with a capacity of 9. It is a totally different business practice that favors Cape Air. Flights from AUS/SAT-CRP/HRL/MFE/Del Rio/Waco and other small cities are up Cape Airs alley.

I remain highly skeptical that the economics of such an operation based on 402s could work.

LAXdude1023 wrote:

AVENSAB727 wrote:

TWA772LR wrote:

My wet dream is to see UA restart some intra-Texas flying with their new domestic build up.

I also believe AUS will get an NRT flight before the end of the deacde.

I can see UA restarting air service to Beaumont, and upgrading Amarillo, El Paso, Corpus Christi to Mainline. It also sucks to see IAH lose the 787, but it gets backfilled with 777s and 767s. But I would like to see IAH get a 77W or two!!

CRP and AMA will not see mainline IMO. ELP might.

IAH will definitely not get the 77W anytime soon.

For intra-Texas flying, the only way we are going to see it expand is IF UA signs on with a prop plane operator that can fly to places like TYR, ACT, and DRT. BPT is so close Im not sure restarting it is in the cards.

Seems like MAF could do a mainline flight from UA, depending on the state of the Oil industry though.

f18raider wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

AVENSAB727 wrote:

I can see UA restarting air service to Beaumont, and upgrading Amarillo, El Paso, Corpus Christi to Mainline. It also sucks to see IAH lose the 787, but it gets backfilled with 777s and 767s. But I would like to see IAH get a 77W or two!!

CRP and AMA will not see mainline IMO. ELP might.

IAH will definitely not get the 77W anytime soon.

For intra-Texas flying, the only way we are going to see it expand is IF UA signs on with a prop plane operator that can fly to places like TYR, ACT, and DRT. BPT is so close Im not sure restarting it is in the cards.

Seems like MAF could do a mainline flight from UA, depending on the state of the Oil industry though.

Currently, IAH-MAF fares are through the roof. Last minute fares are between $668-1000 RT. This one could easily do with a 319, however UA prefers being able to have 5-6 flights a day on smaller equipment.

commavia wrote:

TWA772LR wrote:

The thing about DFW and IAH is that they are to far east to make true intra-Texas flights work.

Again, what intra-Texas market exists that doesn't touch DFW or IAH is already pretty much covered by Southwest.

TWA772LR wrote:

And of course if a market is too small for a WN 737 it won't work. But Cape Air lives off of Cessna 402s with a capacity of 9. It is a totally different business practice that favors Cape Air. Flights from AUS/SAT-CRP/HRL/MFE/Del Rio/Waco and other small cities are up Cape Airs alley.

I remain highly skeptical that the economics of such an operation based on 402s could work.

There are a few markets not connected to IAH that, if they had a Colgan type Turboprop operator would probably work. ACT and TYR being the most obvious.

That said, those markets didn't work with RJ's.

TWA772LR wrote:

I can see AUS or SAT getting service from Norwegian eventually. AUS is very attractive to millennial from around the world and has a booming tech sector. SAT has a very rustic and modern fusion vibe to it and would be attractive to Europeans, it's also regarded as the gateway to SW Texas, i.e. hiking in Big Bend, tubing down one of the rivers, star gazing, etc... you know, stuff millennials love to do.

I can also see FI or WOW starting Texas flights.

I think AUS has a decent chance of getting a DY flight, but probably after DY adds some bigger markets in the US. I hope DFW could get the FI/WW flight, and I think eventually DFW/IAH will. Those markets could use some competition to Europe.

Years ago a los of intra-Texas flying was covered by Muse, Emerald, and Conquest.
These covered routes like, SAT or AUS to CRP, MFE, LRD, MAF and so on. Muse even
did HOU-BRO, MFE, and MAF? But none of these went on west of MAF or LBB.
COex had ERJ'S to DRT for a while.