ZeeZoo
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Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:52 pm

Obviously once being one, Boeing and United, does United have a sense of sentimental value towards Boeing and vice versa with United being given slightly preferential treatment by Boeing or is it strictly 100% business?
 
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adamblang
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:55 pm

Boeing and United, neither being a sentient beings, can't have sentimental value. And none of the people working for either company now were around when Boeing and United were one – no memory to draw back on.

Plus neither company's shareholders would stand for decisions made for reasons other than business value.
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DfwRevolution
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:58 pm

ZeeZoo wrote:
Obviously once being one, Boeing and United, does United have a sense of sentimental value towards Boeing and vice versa with United being given slightly preferential treatment by Boeing or is it strictly 100% business?


UA is an influential client, but that is because of their size and buying power; not their distant heritage. UA was spun-off from Boeing about the time that the grandparents of today's management was being born. There's no sentimental value there.
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727200
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 5:50 pm

UA seperated from Boeing in 1931. Would be very difficult to find any employees left from that era still around working.
 
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hOMSaR
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:35 pm

727200 wrote:
UA seperated from Boeing in 1931. Would be very difficult to find any employees left from that era still around working.


Are there even any employees from that era still alive (let alone working)?

If someone was hired in 1931 at age 18 (assuming they were at least that old) they'd be 104 years old.
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Freshside3
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:50 pm

If ANYONE would get preferential treatment from Boeing, it would probably be AS.
 
Bald1983
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:13 pm

ZeeZoo wrote:
Obviously once being one, Boeing and United, does United have a sense of sentimental value towards Boeing and vice versa with United being given slightly preferential treatment by Boeing or is it strictly 100% business?



Before the merger with Continental, United was a mix of Boeing and Airbus. United had not made a purchase order in almost two decades. When United did make a new order, shortly before the merger, it was a mix of Boeing 787's and Airbus A350's. While I understand that the A-350 deliveries may or may not happen, I do believe that fact indicates that United was not a Boeing only airline. Continental was before the merger.
 
SFOtoORD
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:32 pm

Freshside3 wrote:
If ANYONE would get preferential treatment from Boeing, it would probably be AS.


I would say that if anyone gets preferential treatment from Boeing it would be EK as the largest widebody purchaser or WN as the largest single manufacturer narrow body purchaser. AS is obviously local to Seattle, but it's more a marriage of convenience and a showcase of a key customer locally.
 
CX747
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:52 pm

Pre-merger Continental was a huge customer for Boeing. United was historically a Boeing company too, but jumped to the A320 family in the early 90s. That move alone pretty much had Boeing do the 737NG. It was that eye opening for them.

The 777 was a favorite of both companies and remains to this day (777-300ER). It seems like post merger UA continues to like what Boeing produces as we see the 737-Max order has grown and their 787 fleet is sizeable with more on the way. It looks set to continue with them being an early supporter for the 797 as a replacement for their 757/767 fleet.
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B777LRF
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:08 pm

Who's got 150 77Ws in the inventory, with another 150 77X on order and an ongoing contest involving 90-ish 78Js? If there's anybody holding Boeing by the short and curlies, it would be them. Luckily for Boeing, however, they've got an order book spread over a diverse and numerous set of clients.
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bananaboy
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:10 pm

CX747 wrote:
....United was historically a Boeing company too, but jumped to the A320 family in the early 90s....


They had the Caravelle, DC-6, 7, 8 and 10, L1011 TriStar, the Vickers Viscount (plus if you really want to go back, Ford Trimotor, DC-3 and so on.)

Yes, United have operated a shed-load of Boeing aircraft but to say that they were "historically Boeing" until the A320 came along is inaccurate.

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Newbiepilot
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Sun Mar 19, 2017 11:52 pm

Your biggest and best customers tend to get the best customer service. United has a huge Boeing fleet and many more planes on order just like Southwest for example. It is not a surprise that United and Southwest have also previously been launch customers. I would fully expect United to get better treatment at times or have more negotiating power compared to smaller airlines, mostly Airbus airlines or airlines with mostly used planes. For example if United and Allegiant are asking for the same offering on planes in their existing fleets, who do you think will be able to negotiate more favorable terms?
 
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:23 am

This is kind of a dumb question, but does the fact their execs can go get a deep dish pizza together at anytime by walking down the street, do you think that benefits Boeing?
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TWA772LR
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:35 am

CX747 wrote:
Pre-merger Continental was a huge customer for Boeing. United was historically a Boeing company too, but jumped to the A320 family in the early 90s. That move alone pretty much had Boeing do the 737NG. It was that eye opening for them.

The 777 was a favorite of both companies and remains to this day (777-300ER). It seems like post merger UA continues to like what Boeing produces as we see the 737-Max order has grown and their 787 fleet is sizeable with more on the way. It looks set to continue with them being an early supporter for the 797 as a replacement for their 757/767 fleet.

CO being all Boeing was the result of Bethune being a former Boeing VP, I believe he also spearheaded the 737NG but I could be wrong. Going even further, GE became a stakeholder during the BK of the early 90s, hence GE engines on the 777, 787 and 767s, and possibly another factor (albeit small) in the 737NG order.
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BoeingGuy
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Tue Mar 21, 2017 4:20 am

bananaboy wrote:
CX747 wrote:
....United was historically a Boeing company too, but jumped to the A320 family in the early 90s....


They had the Caravelle, DC-6, 7, 8 and 10, L1011 TriStar, the Vickers Viscount (plus if you really want to go back, Ford Trimotor, DC-3 and so on.)

Yes, United have operated a shed-load of Boeing aircraft but to say that they were "historically Boeing" until the A320 came along is inaccurate.

Mark


UA bought DC-10s, not L-1011s. They inherited L-1011s from Pan Am.

As others noted, it's a business. Like any business, the largest customers may be treated well, but that's a business benefit not sentimental.
 
b6sea
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:42 am

One could ask the same question about whether Boeing gets preferential treatment from United Technologies (esp Pratt & Whitney), as a supplier to Boeing, and the other third of the formerly combined United Airlines/United Aircraft(now UTC)/Boeing Airplane Co. that was broken off when United Airlines and Boeing were split apart. My guess is that it's the same as any business relationship but these are all publicly traded companies and virtually everyone who was around to see the companies as anything other than customer/supplier to each other is dead or close to it.

My guess is that the amount of pressure on each of these companies and their boards to conduct business as usual, or as the markets would dictate, is far stronger than any nostalgia about the old days that might be kicking around. Although I think it would also be inaccurate to say there aren't people in each company who are aware of the history and mythologize it somewhat, or have some sort of sentimental historical bond to the other companies. If nothing else, it's something to talk about at press conferences.

Keep in mind at one time or another Boeing has owned: Pratt & Whitney, United Technologies (United Aircraft), Hamilton Sundstrand, Chance Vought, United Airlines, Rocketdyne, and deHavilland Canada among others. And those are just the companies that have been un-merged at some point.
 
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:49 am

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jakubz
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Fri Mar 24, 2017 2:32 am

And just to stir the pot a little more, I think that United tried to play Boeing and Douglas off of each other with the 707 and DC-8. I think United ordered 20 and 25, respectively at or near launch.

Again, this is based on my memory of what I have read. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong.
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United1
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Fri Mar 24, 2017 3:06 am

jakubz wrote:
And just to stir the pot a little more, I think that United tried to play Boeing and Douglas off of each other with the 707 and DC-8. I think United ordered 20 and 25, respectively at or near launch.

Again, this is based on my memory of what I have read. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong.


Think that was PA....

UA ordered the DC-8 (lots of them) and a number of 720s. UA never operated the 707 actually.
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jakubz
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Re: Does United get preferential treatment from Boeing? Or is it strictly business?

Tue Mar 28, 2017 2:07 am

United1 wrote:
jakubz wrote:
And just to stir the pot a little more, I think that United tried to play Boeing and Douglas off of each other with the 707 and DC-8. I think United ordered 20 and 25, respectively at or near launch.

Again, this is based on my memory of what I have read. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong.


Think that was PA....

UA ordered the DC-8 (lots of them) and a number of 720s. UA never operated the 707 actually.


Fair enough. Still that story illustrates the point that UA was (at least in that instance) not completely aligned with Boeing.
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