zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:48 am

When I was watching the BNA Press conference announcing BNA-CUN. They mentioned some routes that business people were asking them to add.

IND-BNA was mentioned by WN as one of the hot suggested routes out of BNA.

I can possibly see them wanting to announce that as a summer 2018 start up possibly which would fit in the Aug. 28th extension.

So, with that information I say give them time, and it will come eventually.
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 11:18 am

zackary747 wrote:
When I was watching the BNA Press conference announcing BNA-CUN. They mentioned some routes that business people were asking them to add.

IND-BNA was mentioned by WN as one of the hot suggested routes out of BNA.

I can possibly see them wanting to announce that as a summer 2018 start up possibly which would fit in the Aug. 28th extension.

So, with that information I say give them time, and it will come eventually.


Welcome to a.net! Thanks for sharing your insight. I think WN might want to add a few other routes out of BNA for feed of the IND-BNA flight... Because right now BNA doesn't add that many destinations that can't be flown nonstop from IND.

Do you recall any of the other highly suggested routes out of BNA?
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:29 pm

Thanks for the welcome!

At the press conference they mentioned three routes that were requested by high demand by leisure and business travellers.

They mentioned:

BNA-ATL
BNA-IND
BNA-Costa Rica

The press conference was on their Facebook page.
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:22 pm

T-100 data has been updated into May

Here is how the new routes are doing

May IND-SEA AS seat utilization-86%(21 departures)
May IND-AUS G4 seat utilization-86% (4 departures)
May IND-VPS G4 seat utilization-92% (2 departures)
March-May MSY-IND WN seat utilization-85% (11 departures)

WN IND-DCA improved YOY Jan-May 2017 seat utilization-72%, Jan-May 2016 seat utilization-58%
Seat Utilization per month JAN-60%, Feb-58%, Mar-80%, Apr-85%, May-76%
Maybe this comes back seasonally?

Increase in seat utilization at BWI as well...
WN IND-BWI Jan-May 2016-61%, IND-BWI Jan-May 2017-73%

*WN LGA-IND Jan seat utilization- 40.5%! I can see why that was dropped...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
ADrum23
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:34 pm

zackary747 wrote:
Thanks for the welcome!

At the press conference they mentioned three routes that were requested by high demand by leisure and business travellers.

They mentioned:

BNA-ATL
BNA-IND
BNA-Costa Rica

The press conference was on their Facebook page.


I just found that. I am surprised businesses are in demand for BNA-ATL on WN and BNA-IND, they seem awfully close. Would it not be faster to drive? DL already does BNA-ATL, so not sure if WN wants to get in on that.

I would be very surprised if Costa Rica ever was served directly from BNA.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:47 pm

ADrum23 wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
Thanks for the welcome!

At the press conference they mentioned three routes that were requested by high demand by leisure and business travellers.

They mentioned:

BNA-ATL
BNA-IND
BNA-Costa Rica

The press conference was on their Facebook page.


I just found that. I am surprised businesses are in demand for BNA-ATL on WN and BNA-IND, they seem awfully close. Would it not be faster to drive? DL already does BNA-ATL, so not sure if WN wants to get in on that.

I would be very surprised if Costa Rica ever was served directly from BNA.


I didn't find it, could you post the link.

As a business person myself I hate driving, so much so that this week I flew IND-ORD-STL just to avoid the 4-hour drive. And I am sure I am not the only one...

BNA-ATL is a different animal from BNA-IND though...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:48 pm

ADrum23 wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
Thanks for the welcome!

At the press conference they mentioned three routes that were requested by high demand by leisure and business travellers.

They mentioned:

BNA-ATL
BNA-IND
BNA-Costa Rica

The press conference was on their Facebook page.


I just found that. I am surprised businesses are in demand for BNA-ATL on WN and BNA-IND, they seem awfully close. Would it not be faster to drive? DL already does BNA-ATL, so not sure if WN wants to get in on that.

I would be very surprised if Costa Rica ever was served directly from BNA.


Well, knowing how WN wants to compete and steal passengers from DL, I can see why they would want to add ATL. Yes, IND and ATL are "close" but from a business side of view a 1 hour flight is quicker for business than a 5-6 hour drive. Not to mention some leisure travellers would take a 1 hour non-stop (including me) than drive.
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ADrum23
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sat Aug 26, 2017 10:55 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
Thanks for the welcome!

At the press conference they mentioned three routes that were requested by high demand by leisure and business travellers.

They mentioned:

BNA-ATL
BNA-IND
BNA-Costa Rica

The press conference was on their Facebook page.


I just found that. I am surprised businesses are in demand for BNA-ATL on WN and BNA-IND, they seem awfully close. Would it not be faster to drive? DL already does BNA-ATL, so not sure if WN wants to get in on that.

I would be very surprised if Costa Rica ever was served directly from BNA.


I didn't find it, could you post the link.

As a business person myself I hate driving, so much so that this week I flew IND-ORD-STL just to avoid the 4-hour drive. And I am sure I am not the only one...

BNA-ATL is a different animal from BNA-IND though...


I can't post a direct link, since it was a livestream on Facebook. If you go to the Nashville International Airport page and scroll back to May 18th, the announcement was there. It is a little over 13 minutes long and the statement was about 3/4ths of the way through.

If there is enough demand, my guess is BNA-IND, BNA-ATL and even IND-STL will eventually be launched
 
Cubsrule
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:20 am

ADrum23 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:

I just found that. I am surprised businesses are in demand for BNA-ATL on WN and BNA-IND, they seem awfully close. Would it not be faster to drive? DL already does BNA-ATL, so not sure if WN wants to get in on that.

I would be very surprised if Costa Rica ever was served directly from BNA.


I didn't find it, could you post the link.

As a business person myself I hate driving, so much so that this week I flew IND-ORD-STL just to avoid the 4-hour drive. And I am sure I am not the only one...

BNA-ATL is a different animal from BNA-IND though...


I can't post a direct link, since it was a livestream on Facebook. If you go to the Nashville International Airport page and scroll back to May 18th, the announcement was there. It is a little over 13 minutes long and the statement was about 3/4ths of the way through.

If there is enough demand, my guess is BNA-IND, BNA-ATL and even IND-STL will eventually be launched


Nashville business traveler here, and I spend a lot of time in both Atlanta and Indy. I fly to Atlanta about half the time and have done BNA-JAX-ATL on WN. I've never considered flying BNA-IND. The difference isn't distance but rather that IND is a much less stressful drive and that having a car in Indianapolis is much easier.
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ADrum23
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:35 am

Cubsrule wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

I didn't find it, could you post the link.

As a business person myself I hate driving, so much so that this week I flew IND-ORD-STL just to avoid the 4-hour drive. And I am sure I am not the only one...

BNA-ATL is a different animal from BNA-IND though...


I can't post a direct link, since it was a livestream on Facebook. If you go to the Nashville International Airport page and scroll back to May 18th, the announcement was there. It is a little over 13 minutes long and the statement was about 3/4ths of the way through.

If there is enough demand, my guess is BNA-IND, BNA-ATL and even IND-STL will eventually be launched


Nashville business traveler here, and I spend a lot of time in both Atlanta and Indy. I fly to Atlanta about half the time and have done BNA-JAX-ATL on WN. I've never considered flying BNA-IND. The difference isn't distance but rather that IND is a much less stressful drive and that having a car in Indianapolis is much easier.


Interesting. I also live in Nashville and couldn't even imagine flying to either IND or ATL (unless, in the case of ATL, I am connecting), they just seem too close. But to each his own I guess. Now to Chicago? That is a different story.
 
zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:55 am

Well, I will say this. WN didn't say IND and ATL was requested highly for no reason.

On the bigger spectrum here, I think it could work. It just depends on the person (as it does for any route.)
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 1:27 am

zackary747 wrote:
Well, I will say this. WN didn't say IND and ATL was requested highly for no reason.

On the bigger spectrum here, I think it could work. It just depends on the person (as it does for any route.)


Good points...

I'll also say that it could be announced in the next schedule extension because this one only updates up until June 1.

Also, I wouldn't mind if WN trimmed IND-ATL to make room for IND-BNA...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
Indy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 2:44 am

Has anyone here used IND international arrivals? I'm looking at a pic of passport control and the baggage claim area and the baggage claim looks extremely small. The design looks pretty bad and appears that it would quickly clog up with people. The design of having the baggage claim run along the walls like that would greatly limit the number of people who could access it at any given time. Is this going to be practical if IND hopes to regularly process a 767 or 787?

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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:05 am

Indy wrote:
Has anyone here used IND international arrivals? I'm looking at a pic of passport control and the baggage claim area and the baggage claim looks extremely small. The design looks pretty bad and appears that it would quickly clog up with people. The design of having the baggage claim run along the walls like that would greatly limit the number of people who could access it at any given time. Is this going to be practical if IND hopes to regularly process a 767 or 787?


Never used it, but have been inside the facility before and I think the picture makes it look smaller than it actually is. The facility is 24,250-square feet and was built to accommodate 400 international travelers per hour, but I believe it can easily be expanded if need be.
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
Indy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:18 am

Midwestindy wrote:
Never used it, but have been inside the facility before and I think the picture makes it look smaller than it actually is. The facility is 24,250-square feet and was built to accommodate 400 international travelers per hour, but I believe it can easily be expanded if need be.


The pic makes it look like maybe 50 or 60 people at most could access the baggage claim at one time. Everyone else would be crammed in the middle looking for a shot at getting their bags. I think 400 passengers in an hour is pretty poor as well. A full 787 would take about 40-45 minutes to process. I understand you don't want to commit the square footage to a flight that doesn't exist but if/when IND does secure a long term deal for a TATL flight, they really need to invest in an upgrade. What happens if they land BA and later on a carrier like WOW comes in and starts a 2nd one. There comes the risk of having two flights arriving at nearly the same time. What about Saturday? Imagine two TATL flights plus the CUN flights. Those passport control lanes and that baggage claim won't be able to handle the load. If they land a BA 788 or an AA 767 then making more room should be a priority.

FYI you can check average customs wait times here. IND isn't listed unfortunately.

https://awt.cbp.gov/
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cvgComair
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:23 am

Indy wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Never used it, but have been inside the facility before and I think the picture makes it look smaller than it actually is. The facility is 24,250-square feet and was built to accommodate 400 international travelers per hour, but I believe it can easily be expanded if need be.


The pic makes it look like maybe 50 or 60 people at most could access the baggage claim at one time. Everyone else would be crammed in the middle looking for a shot at getting their bags. I think 400 passengers in an hour is pretty poor as well. A full 787 would take about 40-45 minutes to process. I understand you don't want to commit the square footage to a flight that doesn't exist but if/when IND does secure a long term deal for a TATL flight, they really need to invest in an upgrade. What happens if they land BA and later on a carrier like WOW comes in and starts a 2nd one. There comes the risk of having two flights arriving at nearly the same time. What about Saturday? Imagine two TATL flights plus the CUN flights. Those passport control lanes and that baggage claim won't be able to handle the load. If they land a BA 788 or an AA 767 then making more room should be a priority.

FYI you can check average customs wait times here. IND isn't listed unfortunately.

https://awt.cbp.gov/

Though, usually staffing is the limiting factor, not the size of the facility. For instance, look at CVG's wait times for the CDG flight, they can reach 30-40 min, and that facility was built to handle 1000's of passengers an hour. The likelihood that IND can get staff for more than the current 6 booths is very unlikely.
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:31 am

cvgComair wrote:
Though, usually staffing is the limiting factor, not the size of the facility. For instance, look at CVG's wait times for the CDG flight, they can reach 30-40 min, and that facility was built to handle 1000's of passengers an hour. The likelihood that IND can get staff for more than the current 6 booths is very unlikely.


It would be really sad if they could not staff people to work a TATL flight. I would imagine that it would be a high priority flight. At least for a while until they got bored keeping up the staffing or decided to start cutting corners. This is where the IAA needs to step up and work hard to get a few more flights (could be Caribbean) to give CBP a reason to keep the place properly staffed. I wonder how staffing works. Do you bring in a full crew just to work for one hour? What do they do with the rest of their day? Does the IAA need to pay them for a minimum number of hours? I wonder if anyone here knows the answer to that.
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:32 am

cvgComair wrote:
Indy wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Never used it, but have been inside the facility before and I think the picture makes it look smaller than it actually is. The facility is 24,250-square feet and was built to accommodate 400 international travelers per hour, but I believe it can easily be expanded if need be.


The pic makes it look like maybe 50 or 60 people at most could access the baggage claim at one time. Everyone else would be crammed in the middle looking for a shot at getting their bags. I think 400 passengers in an hour is pretty poor as well. A full 787 would take about 40-45 minutes to process. I understand you don't want to commit the square footage to a flight that doesn't exist but if/when IND does secure a long term deal for a TATL flight, they really need to invest in an upgrade. What happens if they land BA and later on a carrier like WOW comes in and starts a 2nd one. There comes the risk of having two flights arriving at nearly the same time. What about Saturday? Imagine two TATL flights plus the CUN flights. Those passport control lanes and that baggage claim won't be able to handle the load. If they land a BA 788 or an AA 767 then making more room should be a priority.

FYI you can check average customs wait times here. IND isn't listed unfortunately.

https://awt.cbp.gov/

Though, usually staffing is the limiting factor, not the size of the facility. For instance, look at CVG's wait times for the CDG flight, they can reach 30-40 min, and that facility was built to handle 1000's of passengers an hour.


In terms of baggage claim, I read that the northern most carousel could be isolated from the rest of the Baggage Claim Hall by movable glass partition walls. Although I'm not quite sure how that would work....

Ultimately though the Customs and Passport control area is bigger than the photo makes it out to be, and the 400 pax number could be an underestimate...

For now, at least the facility is fine even if we get a 787 TATL...

The good thing that IND has going for it though, is that it isn't limited by type/size of aircraft...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
Indy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:38 am

Midwestindy wrote:
In terms of baggage claim, I read that the northern most carousel could be isolated from the rest of the Baggage Claim Hall by movable glass partition walls. Although I'm not quite sure how that would work....

Ultimately though the Customs and Passport control area is bigger than the photo makes it out to be, and the 400 pax number could be an underestimate...

For now, at least the facility is fine even if we get a 787 TATL...

The good thing that IND has going for it though, is that it isn't limited by type/size of aircraft...


IND didn't go with the isolated baggage claim setup like was diagrammed in the midfield terminal PDF. Perhaps it could be easily converted for that reason. I am not sure. I think RDU uses that concept. I was there when their TATL flight was arriving and I cold have sworn I saw a baggage claim closed off by a glass partition. Memory is a little fuzzy on it.
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Cubsrule
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 4:11 am

Indy wrote:
cvgComair wrote:
Though, usually staffing is the limiting factor, not the size of the facility. For instance, look at CVG's wait times for the CDG flight, they can reach 30-40 min, and that facility was built to handle 1000's of passengers an hour. The likelihood that IND can get staff for more than the current 6 booths is very unlikely.


It would be really sad if they could not staff people to work a TATL flight. I would imagine that it would be a high priority flight. At least for a while until they got bored keeping up the staffing or decided to start cutting corners. This is where the IAA needs to step up and work hard to get a few more flights (could be Caribbean) to give CBP a reason to keep the place properly staffed. I wonder how staffing works. Do you bring in a full crew just to work for one hour? What do they do with the rest of their day? Does the IAA need to pay them for a minimum number of hours? I wonder if anyone here knows the answer to that.


In your view, how many staffed passport control lanes are appropriate for a single TATL widebody?
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Indy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 4:33 am

Cubsrule wrote:
[In your view, how many staffed passport control lanes are appropriate for a single TATL widebody?


However many it takes to get the people through the line in 30 minutes or less. Lets pretend BA launched IND-LHR and used the 788. A full flight coming in from London would have 214 people on it. If you only had 4 agents working they'd have to process 53 to 54 people each. What is the average processing time per passenger for an agent? If it takes a minute per passenger the wait would be unacceptable. Let's assume it was only 30 seconds per person. That means there could be a wait as long as 26 minutes just to get your passport checked. Then of course you have to pick up your bag at baggage claim. By that time your bag is probably already out but it still may take a couple minutes to collect your stuff. Then of course there is another line where you get your bags inspected. That is yet another wait. Depending on whether or not you have something to declare and whether or not agents decide to search your bags, that could be another 10 to 20 minute wait. If you want ungodly long waits they why not just use that horrible experience that is ORD?

So crunch the numbers. Figure out how long it takes per passenger at a desk and then go from there.
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:48 am

Indy wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
[In your view, how many staffed passport control lanes are appropriate for a single TATL widebody?


However many it takes to get the people through the line in 30 minutes or less. Lets pretend BA launched IND-LHR and used the 788. A full flight coming in from London would have 214 people on it. If you only had 4 agents working they'd have to process 53 to 54 people each. What is the average processing time per passenger for an agent? If it takes a minute per passenger the wait would be unacceptable. Let's assume it was only 30 seconds per person. That means there could be a wait as long as 26 minutes just to get your passport checked. Then of course you have to pick up your bag at baggage claim. By that time your bag is probably already out but it still may take a couple minutes to collect your stuff. Then of course there is another line where you get your bags inspected. That is yet another wait. Depending on whether or not you have something to declare and whether or not agents decide to search your bags, that could be another 10 to 20 minute wait. If you want ungodly long waits they why not just use that horrible experience that is ORD?

So crunch the numbers. Figure out how long it takes per passenger at a desk and then go from there.


Between Global Entry and the kiosks, many passengers spend little or no time with an immigration agent.
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 4:28 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
Between Global Entry and the kiosks, many passengers spend little or no time with an immigration agent.


So the real problem in the pic I posted is going to be people piling up around what looks like a small baggage claim with a poor design. The baggage claim that could be isolated when an international flight arrives probably would have been a better decision. Guess we will find out if/when IND gets a 767/787. Big backup could occur at the declaration/inspection line but I have no idea how many stations they have. Could be big enough. Could be too small. No clue.
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floridaflyboy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 4:53 pm

Indy wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
Between Global Entry and the kiosks, many passengers spend little or no time with an immigration agent.


So the real problem in the pic I posted is going to be people piling up around what looks like a small baggage claim with a poor design. The baggage claim that could be isolated when an international flight arrives probably would have been a better decision. Guess we will find out if/when IND gets a 767/787. Big backup could occur at the declaration/inspection line but I have no idea how many stations they have. Could be big enough. Could be too small. No clue.


Doesn't look like IND has kiosks from the info I can find and definitely not Global Entry.
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Cubsrule
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:04 pm

floridaflyboy wrote:
Indy wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
Between Global Entry and the kiosks, many passengers spend little or no time with an immigration agent.


So the real problem in the pic I posted is going to be people piling up around what looks like a small baggage claim with a poor design. The baggage claim that could be isolated when an international flight arrives probably would have been a better decision. Guess we will find out if/when IND gets a 767/787. Big backup could occur at the declaration/inspection line but I have no idea how many stations they have. Could be big enough. Could be too small. No clue.


Doesn't look like IND has kiosks from the info I can find and definitely not Global Entry.


IND's current FIS load (essentially 100 percent leisure) does not justify either. A business-focused TATL flight is a very different matter. IINM every US airport with BA service has Global Entry.
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zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:37 am

WN to AUS from IND is on the schedule. I can see them adding this before anything else because they want to compete with Allegiant (G4)
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:38 am

IND-AUS on WN, that is what I have seen so far, hopefully more...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:41 am

Midwestindy wrote:
IND-AUS on WN, that is what I have seen so far, hopefully more...


I like this. It can generate a fun competition spark between WN and G4. We need that.
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zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:33 am

I suppose IND-SAN will come back in June.
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dronezone
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:24 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

I didn't find it, could you post the link.

As a business person myself I hate driving, so much so that this week I flew IND-ORD-STL just to avoid the 4-hour drive. And I am sure I am not the only one...

BNA-ATL is a different animal from BNA-IND though...


I can't post a direct link, since it was a livestream on Facebook. If you go to the Nashville International Airport page and scroll back to May 18th, the announcement was there. It is a little over 13 minutes long and the statement was about 3/4ths of the way through.

If there is enough demand, my guess is BNA-IND, BNA-ATL and even IND-STL will eventually be launched


Nashville business traveler here, and I spend a lot of time in both Atlanta and Indy. I fly to Atlanta about half the time and have done BNA-JAX-ATL on WN. I've never considered flying BNA-IND. The difference isn't distance but rather that IND is a much less stressful drive and that having a car in Indianapolis is much easier.


I am also a Nashville business traveler, and we have people from our company traveling up to Indy multiple times a month. A lot of these are short trips or even day trips, and driving 5 hours one way having meetings and then driving 5 hours back is not fun. When I go, I always try to fly, because even though I have to connect, I can at least get work done while I am en route. If there was a non-stop flight between BNA-IND, that would be amazing.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:41 pm

IND-BOS is back up to 2x daily, on the weekday
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:09 pm

Looks like next Spring WN will be at 40+ departures from IND, to 20 destinations, hopefully, that number will go up...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:58 pm

Jan-July pax numbers are updated

YTD Market share:
Southwest- 34.06%
AMERICAN AIRLINES-22.18%
DELTA AIR LINES-21.94%
UNITED AIRLINES-13.18%
ALLEGIANT AIR-4.44%
FRONTIER AIRLINE-2.56%
AIR GEORGIAN LIMITED-0.61%

July Concourse Pax numbers
Concourse B-520,625
Concourse A-287,023

5,116,953 total pax through July 2017, up a decent amount from 2016

Growth Current Month (July 2017) vs. Same Month Previous Year (July 2016)
ALASKA AIRLINES, INC +100.0%
AIR GEORGIAN LIMITED +33.7%
VACATION EXPRESS -6.3%
AMERICAN AIRLINES -1.9%
FRONTIER AIRLINE -1.1%
DELTA AIR LINES +9.6%
SOUTHWEST AIRLINES +4.1%
UNITED AIRLINES +1.7%
ONEJET, INC +25.4%

FedEx Cargo is down about -5%
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
stlgph
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 1:09 am

The FIS facilities at IND are fine. Even if it takes an hour, in worst case scenario, to get everyone through, then so be it. Consider the luxury of going nonstop and having a bit of a wait rather than going to another airport, going through their facilities, and then having to connect to another flight, let alone having to change terminals and re-enter through security at some of those airports.

On top of that, great o see OneJet growing by 25% Would like to see them scale back up in size.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
ADrum23
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 1:38 am

So any word on a TATL flight for IND?
 
Indy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 1:54 am

ADrum23 wrote:
So any word on a TATL flight for IND?


Nothing that I've seen or heard. But I've asked a journalist I know to send me any press release notices that come out related to IND.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:55 am

Midwestindy wrote:

My route addition, predictions for the next year:
G4 SJU-IND
G4 LAX-IND
G4 Central America/Carribean-IND
DL AMS-IND
DL SEA-IND
DL SLC-IND (Fully year round)
AS PDX-IND
AS SAN-IND (if WN doesn't go year round next year)
WN SAN-IND (year round)
WN STL or BNA-IND

Less likely announcements:
B6 BOS-IND
B6 JFK-IND
B6 FLL-IND
BA LHR-IND
WN AUS-IND
NK IND-DFW/DTW/FLL
WN DCA-IND (comes back from the dead)
WN PBI-IND



Lol! One for one so far...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
Indy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 3:06 am

Midwestindy wrote:
July Concourse Pax numbers
Concourse B-520,625
Concourse A-287,023

5,116,953 total pax through July 2017, up a decent amount from 2016


The July numbers are very impressive. 807,648 passengers served. I wonder if that is a single month record for IND or not. If we could do that every month IND would serve 9.7 million passengers.
But that won't happen anytime soon. Maybe in a few years if the growth rate continues. IND needs to do something to establish a balance between A & B. Those numbers are very lopsided.

IND is on pace to serve 8.77 million passengers this year which would shatter the old record. Also, if IND can manage a 3% growth rate starting in 2018, it will take 5 years to hit the 10 million passenger mark.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
zackary747
Posts: 110
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 3:11 am

Midwestindy wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

My route addition, predictions for the next year:
G4 SJU-IND
G4 LAX-IND
G4 Central America/Carribean-IND
DL AMS-IND
DL SEA-IND
DL SLC-IND (Fully year round)
AS PDX-IND
AS SAN-IND (if WN doesn't go year round next year)
WN SAN-IND (year round)
WN STL or BNA-IND

Less likely announcements:
B6 BOS-IND
B6 JFK-IND
B6 FLL-IND
BA LHR-IND
WN AUS-IND
NK IND-DFW/DTW/FLL
WN DCA-IND (comes back from the dead)
WN PBI-IND



Lol! One for one so far...


IND-SLC is year round also.

Mainline in Summer, Regional in winter. :)
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deltal1011man
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 3:47 am

Indy wrote:
cvgComair wrote:
Though, usually staffing is the limiting factor, not the size of the facility. For instance, look at CVG's wait times for the CDG flight, they can reach 30-40 min, and that facility was built to handle 1000's of passengers an hour. The likelihood that IND can get staff for more than the current 6 booths is very unlikely.


It would be really sad if they could not staff people to work a TATL flight. I would imagine that it would be a high priority flight. At least for a while until they got bored keeping up the staffing or decided to start cutting corners. This is where the IAA needs to step up and work hard to get a few more flights (could be Caribbean) to give CBP a reason to keep the place properly staffed. I wonder how staffing works. Do you bring in a full crew just to work for one hour? What do they do with the rest of their day? Does the IAA need to pay them for a minimum number of hours? I wonder if anyone here knows the answer to that.


TSA and CBP aren't up the airport or airlines. If they had their way airports would be staffed a lot better.

Sadly the US government is in control of all of this and that is why major airports like LAX, JFK, ORD, ATL, etc. etc. have had times where they were complete s**t shows. For Atlanta, space isn't remotely the problem, lack of staff and open lanes is the issue 99.9999999% of the time.
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zackary747
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:10 pm

Quick question to you guys in here. So I notice that WN is using the -800 on the EWR route quite often. Can someone find the load percentages on that route, and see if it is truly doing better than LGA was? I'm assuming it's doing a lot better if they're using the -800 on the route.
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:19 pm

zackary747 wrote:
Quick question to you guys in here. So I notice that WN is using the -800 on the EWR route quite often. Can someone find the load percentages on that route, and see if it is truly doing better than LGA was? I'm assuming it's doing a lot better if they're using the -800 on the route.


We will know in a month or two, the T100 data isn't updated through June/July yet, and data seems to be a little behind schedule this year considering the Q1 PDEW data has yet to be released...

Once I get that data I will share it, along with YOY growth...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
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exFWAOONW
Posts: 452
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:37 pm

Indy wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
[In your view, how many staffed passport control lanes are appropriate for a single TATL widebody?


However many it takes to get the people through the line in 30 minutes or less. Lets pretend BA launched IND-LHR and used the 788. A full flight coming in from London would have 214 people on it. If you only had 4 agents working they'd have to process 53 to 54 people each. What is the average processing time per passenger for an agent? If it takes a minute per passenger the wait would be unacceptable. Let's assume it was only 30 seconds per person. That means there could be a wait as long as 26 minutes just to get your passport checked. Then of course you have to pick up your bag at baggage claim. By that time your bag is probably already out but it still may take a couple minutes to collect your stuff. Then of course there is another line where you get your bags inspected. That is yet another wait. Depending on whether or not you have something to declare and whether or not agents decide to search your bags, that could be another 10 to 20 minute wait. If you want ungodly long waits they why not just use that horrible experience that is ORD?

So crunch the numbers. Figure out how long it takes per passenger at a desk and then go from there.
I think you've listed why there won't be more lines. Why would they pay for full-time agents to staff for only 1.5 hours of public-contact work. A thirty-minute wait every time is a bit unrealistic, especially when we're talking about government.

So hop WN IND-AUS and then BA AUS-LHR and you've got your TATL flight. :duck: side benefit, is you don't have to use the inadequate INDY facility to clear customs.
Is just me, or is flying not as much fun anymore?
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Tue Aug 29, 2017 10:44 pm

exFWAOONW wrote:
Indy wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
[In your view, how many staffed passport control lanes are appropriate for a single TATL widebody?


However many it takes to get the people through the line in 30 minutes or less. Lets pretend BA launched IND-LHR and used the 788. A full flight coming in from London would have 214 people on it. If you only had 4 agents working they'd have to process 53 to 54 people each. What is the average processing time per passenger for an agent? If it takes a minute per passenger the wait would be unacceptable. Let's assume it was only 30 seconds per person. That means there could be a wait as long as 26 minutes just to get your passport checked. Then of course you have to pick up your bag at baggage claim. By that time your bag is probably already out but it still may take a couple minutes to collect your stuff. Then of course there is another line where you get your bags inspected. That is yet another wait. Depending on whether or not you have something to declare and whether or not agents decide to search your bags, that could be another 10 to 20 minute wait. If you want ungodly long waits they why not just use that horrible experience that is ORD?

So crunch the numbers. Figure out how long it takes per passenger at a desk and then go from there.
I think you've listed why there won't be more lines. Why would they pay for full-time agents to staff for only 1.5 hours of public-contact work. A thirty-minute wait every time is a bit unrealistic, especially when we're talking about government.

So hop WN IND-AUS and then BA AUS-LHR and you've got your TATL flight. :duck: side benefit, is you don't have to use the inadequate INDY facility to clear customs.


Would if I could, LHR-AUS arrives at 4:20pm, AUS-IND leaves at 9:10 AM! :D
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Wed Aug 30, 2017 1:24 am

Sometime by the end of the week, I will be getting an update on the progress of the TATL flight. Once I do I will give an update on the thread...

Other Int'l notes, for next spring
The DL CUN flight will be upgraded to an A320 next year...
The Swift Air flight to PUJ will be a Monday IND-PUJ, and a Sunday PUJ-IND
The Volaris IND-CUN-IND will be a Sunday IND-CUN-IND
The Southwest IND-CUN, flight will be on a 737-700

In terms of Florida destinations, here are the # of departures from IND in peak Spring Break travel (Saturday, March 24th)
8x MCO-7x WN, 1x DL(RJ9)
7x RSW-5x WN, 1x F9(A319), 1x DL (RJ9)
5x TPA-5x WN
4x MIA- 3x AA (2xE75, 1xER4), 1x DL (E175)
3x FLL-2x WN, 1x G4
2x PIE-2x G4
2x SFB-2x G4
2x PGD-2x G4
*Note JAX, VPS, and some of the F9 routes don’t fly Saturdays

Pretty healthy amount of service to Florida, and surprised DL has hung on to some of these routes...
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
Indy
Posts: 4357
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Thu Aug 31, 2017 1:09 am

I asked on Flyertalk about the LHR route and here was the response.

"Yes, there will apparently be a new AA (not BA) route USA-LHR from a city that does not currently have LHR service."
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Thu Aug 31, 2017 1:25 am

Indy wrote:
I asked on Flyertalk about the LHR route and here was the response.

"Yes, there will apparently be a new AA (not BA) route USA-LHR from a city that does not currently have LHR service."


Hmm, I read that as him just reiterating what Jonnyc(the original poster) said, I assume he doesn't have any inside info that we don't have...

However, I'm kind of annoyed that he(Jonnyc)e dropped a rumor like that, and refused to say anything after.....
ATL BWI BOS CLT MDW ORD CVG DFW DAL DAB DEN DTW FLL RSW GNV BDL HNL IAH IND MCI LAS LAX SDF MEM MIA MKE MSP BNA EWR HVN MSY JFK LGA MCO SFB PHX PHL PVD RDU RAP RIC SLC STL CPS PIE SEA TPA DCA IAD
 
Indy
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Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Thu Aug 31, 2017 4:00 am

Midwestindy wrote:
Hmm, I read that as him just reiterating what Jonnyc(the original poster) said, I assume he doesn't have any inside info that we don't have...

However, I'm kind of annoyed that he(Jonnyc)e dropped a rumor like that, and refused to say anything after.....


Maybe his information is too inside and if he said more he'd risk getting in trouble.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
Briancw
Posts: 42
Joined: Thu Mar 02, 2017 12:55 pm

Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:08 am

Indy wrote:

Maybe his information is too inside and if he said more he'd risk getting in trouble.


Could also be complete BS. We all know rumors come and go, especially with the TATL situation...
 
floridaflyboy
Posts: 1527
Joined: Sat Jun 03, 2006 3:26 pm

Re: Indianapolis Aviation Thread

Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:12 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Sometime by the end of the week, I will be getting an update on the progress of the TATL flight. Once I do I will give an update on the thread...

Other Int'l notes, for next spring
The DL CUN flight will be upgraded to an A320 next year...
The Swift Air flight to PUJ will be a Monday IND-PUJ, and a Sunday PUJ-IND
The Volaris IND-CUN-IND will be a Sunday IND-CUN-IND
The Southwest IND-CUN, flight will be on a 737-700

In terms of Florida destinations, here are the # of departures from IND in peak Spring Break travel (Saturday, March 24th)
8x MCO-7x WN, 1x DL(RJ9)
7x RSW-5x WN, 1x F9(A319), 1x DL (RJ9)
5x TPA-5x WN
4x MIA- 3x AA (2xE75, 1xER4), 1x DL (E175)
3x FLL-2x WN, 1x G4
2x PIE-2x G4
2x SFB-2x G4
2x PGD-2x G4
*Note JAX, VPS, and some of the F9 routes don’t fly Saturdays

Pretty healthy amount of service to Florida, and surprised DL has hung on to some of these routes...


Missed F9 to MCO.
Good goes around!

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