MIflyer12 wrote:

par13del wrote:

Hmmm, US carriers are the last ones to operate narrow body a/c across the pond, and we know based on A.Net experts that no self respecting European would fly on those a/c, so are we talking transfer pax on the EU side, or is the fact that the A321 is wider than the 757 going
to make the flights more comfortable?

Something like that!

If they want to fly from U.S. secondary (and even less prominent) cities they're going to need to go non-stop to destinations Americans want to visit: London, Paris and (seasonally) Rome. Something like PIT-Cork isn't going to cut it. With the hub model the Big 3 U.S. carriers cover all the important/volume USA-hub-Europe routings 1-stop already.

10% of all US tourists to Europe come to Ireland. Europe isn't just London, Paris and Rome. Dublin handled more traffic across the Atlantic than Rome, Madrid or Milan. It's number 5 in Europe for US traffic after LHR, CDG, FRA and AMS and offers a vast network to destinations across the EU.

Maybe WW is thinking more outside the box on what the LR can do going east as well. Specifically, the kind of routes the ex-BMI aircraft were operating into the various countries east of the Balkans. Lufthansa has been doing some valuable business there as well, so it's there for consideration. Places like Turkmenistan and Kazakhstan need something with a little extra oomph than a bog-standard A321, and also need an uprated onboard product with more front end seating.

These routes run on transfer traffic and oil-related passengers. Tickets can also be expensive, which is good for the airline.

Put into a pool of aircraft that also operate other destinations and it makes a subfleet at BA worth considering. The BMI planes also will eventually be coming off lease so BA and IAG do need to consider what happens next. I can see BA looking to grow those marginal eastern routes, particularly the ex-BMI route(s) into Iran.

seabosdca wrote:

How interesting that the European carriers never really looked at this sort of service when the aircraft that could fly it was the 757, but now that it's the A321neo they are all interested.

Why would any of us want to visit somewhere that is full of people like you?*

par13del wrote:

Hmmm, US carriers are the last ones to operate narrow body a/c across the pond, and we know based on A.Net experts that no self respecting European would fly on those a/c, so are we talking transfer pax on the EU side, or is the fact that the A321 is wider than the 757 going
to make the flights more comfortable?

Unfortunately in Europe, we can't afford to run 6 mpg F-150s - petrol/diesel prices are too high.
[and our roads are too small for the width of it.]



*This may not be serious.

Amiga500 wrote:

seabosdca wrote:

How interesting that the European carriers never really looked at this sort of service when the aircraft that could fly it was the 757, but now that it's the A321neo they are all interested.

Why would any of us want to visit somewhere that is full of people like you?*

par13del wrote:

Hmmm, US carriers are the last ones to operate narrow body a/c across the pond, and we know based on A.Net experts that no self respecting European would fly on those a/c, so are we talking transfer pax on the EU side, or is the fact that the A321 is wider than the 757 going
to make the flights more comfortable?

Unfortunately in Europe, we can't afford to run 6 mpg F-150s - petrol/diesel prices are too high.
[and our roads are too small for the width of it.]



*This may not be serious.

Or DUB is building a 2nd runway and the home airline has managed costs to justify the growth....

Lightsaber

par13del wrote:

Hmmm, US carriers are the last ones to operate narrow body a/c across the pond, and we know based on A.Net experts that no self respecting European would fly on those a/c, so are we talking transfer pax on the EU side, or is the fact that the A321 is wider than the 757 going
to make the flights more comfortable?

Aer Lingus? Openskies? Icelandair?

My recollection is that in the 1990s BA operated 757s on the following routes:

GLA-JFK-BOS
BHX-JFK-YYZ

JFK-BOS would not, of course, have been revenue flights as they were cabotage.

They used JFK for the GLA/BHX passengers to feed onto the other service, effectively offering BOS, YYZ and JFK from both airports on a daily basis but using only 2 aircraft.

SelseyBill wrote:

Armodeen wrote:

It isn't just TATL that they could be used on of course (secondary middle east destinations stand out for me). I too see a fleet of around 10 at BA.

One of the attractions for BA/IAG with the A321LR is also its fleet flexibility.
Its easy to imagine a A321LR doing a TATL round trip, and then a Euro/UK round trip in a 24 hour block, potentially transforming fleet economics.

seabosdca wrote:

How interesting that the European carriers never really looked at this sort of service when the aircraft that could fly it was the 757, but now that it's the A321neo they are all interested.

That has to be one of the most uninformed comments I've ever witnessed on these pages; and believe me; that is a fairly big list.

Would they be that keen to have a A321neo fitted with lie flats and potentially Y+ seats flying up and down to Newcastle for part of they day? Although saying that the mid haul's go to Europe at the momment.

As for the comments about DY at Edinburgh and UK regionals. All BA have to do is fare dump on flights orginiating in those airports to the US via LHR. They'd possibly go into save Manchester from DY but they're really only interested in saving the home turf of LGW from them at this current point in time.

seabosdca wrote:

How interesting that the European carriers never really looked at this sort of service when the aircraft that could fly it was the 757, but now that it's the A321neo they are all interested.

If the 757 didn't work against 767s and early A330s, the A321neo will also have a hard time against 787s and A330neos.

The A231 is cheaper to run than a 757.

Would they be that keen to have a A321neo fitted with lie flats and potentially Y+ seats flying up and down to Newcastle for part of they day? Although saying that the mid haul's go to Europe at the momment.

The G-MED* aircraft have lie flats and are regularly sent to Manchester, just 30 mins flight time, so, I'm guessing BA would be OK with it.

IMO Bulk of these IAG A321NEO orders may be for EI. Atleast the LR model.

Does any other airline in the group need the LR?

BA flies some Club equipped A321's on longer flights. Old frames.

keesje wrote:

BA flies some Club equipped A321's on longer flights. Old frames.

Ex-BMI routes? Will those last in the current form when the frames are retired?

Almost certainly IAG will already have converted some existing A320 series option to be options for the LR,which does not need shareholder prior approval. It is IAG's style to have rolling options with Airbus for years ahead, to be converted to orders on a one by one basis. Thus very flexible, makes good sense to the accountants. They also have options for 787 series, A330 series, A350 series,and A380.

hispanola wrote:

garpd wrote:

UK Charter airlines we sending 757s to Orlando in the 90s, long before CO or AA ever cottoned on to the idea of sending theirs to the UK.

I'm certain that American was sending 757s to MAN in the 90s as well. It may be that the English were the first to do it, but AA wasn't so late.

Air 2000 were sending 757's across the pond from Scotland circa 1989-90 and were in fact the test case for the breaking of Prestwick Airport's transatlantic monopoly status, allowing any other Scottish airport to offer US direct flights. Back then the Air 2000 757 would depart GLA, briefly touch down at PIK to satisfy regulations before taking off again over the Atlantic. British Airways, Northwest, American, United, Air Canada etc all followed suit pretty quickly, making GLA one of the best served UK regional airports in the 90's in terms of US destinations.

Fantastic news for the 321LR and a no-brainer for IAG.

JannEejit wrote:

Air 2000 were sending 757's across the pond from Scotland circa 1989-90...

Ah yes.... good old Air 2000! Thanks for the info/reminder

Small update.

Aer Lingus will ease one additional A321neoLR aircraft, bringing the fleet to 8.

Today Air Lease Corporation (NYSE:AL) announced a long term lease agreement with Aer Lingus for one additional new Airbus A321neo LR aircraft. The aircraft, delivering in June 2019, will be the eighth A321neo LR leased to the airline and is from ALC’s order book with Airbus.

http://newsroom.aviator.aero/air-lease- ... er-lingus/