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admanager
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Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Thu Feb 16, 2017 8:20 pm

Nice story. AC flight diverts to Fredericton due to weather at the destination and there were no food options open at that hour. A Westjet pilot sees situation and does something about it. While Westjet declined to comment on the event, I hope the pilot got a nice thank you from his company for helping stranded passengers.
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/westjet-pi ... -1.3286897
The pizza didn't look all that good - but when you're hungry it's all good.
 
11725Flyer
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:35 pm

Great PR. Nice to see this kind of story.
 
IPFreely
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:46 pm

admanager wrote:
I hope the pilot got a nice thank you from his company for helping stranded passengers.


I agree. I also hope the useless AC employee who stood there watching after saying it was impossible to do anything gets some remedial training in common sense.

Will AC issue a press release? Per jimbo's theory they might....on Friday.
 
Osiris
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:56 pm

In this day and age there are almost always food options available, no matter how basic. The AC employee saying they couldn't do anything just couldn't be bothered to try. Hats off to the Westjet pilot.
 
CrisAA
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:24 pm

All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:52 am

CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


At a minimum, they probably didn't have the bank to cover it like a pilot might. I'm curious if any airline employees on this board have pulled out their credit card and bought food for a planeload of people or put them up in a hotel?
-Dave
 
wjcandee
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:18 am

PlanesNTrains wrote:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


At a minimum, they probably didn't have the bank to cover it like a pilot might. I'm curious if any airline employees on this board have pulled out their credit card and bought food for a planeload of people or put them up in a hotel?


It's an "authority thing", in that the agent probably knew only that he could hand out vouchers that would be useless as the concessions were closed. He didn't have authority to go into whatever cash there was to buy meals for the customers.

OTOH, it's a failure of imagination and procedure. The diversion wasn't an air-return, it was a diversion from somewhere else. OPS certainly had the time to notify someone to be available to greet the flight and to arrange a crew or service to fuel the aircraft. No part of their procedure was to check whether food and bev options would be available for the self-loading freight and to take steps if it wasn't. It's an easy enough thing to make a part of the procedure, but apparently it is not.

That it is not part of AC's diversion procedure is a "culture thing". Westjet touts the fact that most employees are owners (through their stock incentive plan), and it's a mindset and a culture that I'm sure the disgruntled employees (and there always are some) mock, but my understanding is that it's prevalent among most employees there. To make people feel like owners, you also have to empower them, and it takes a lot of work and a bit of money to constantly push the culture throughout a far-flung operation, and it takes managers who understand that when an employee makes a good-faith decision to do something for passengers, you back them, period. Buying hotel rooms? Maybe not. But pizza? No brainer. The Westjet pilot knew that the best way to make customers for life is to show them kindness when they are facing bad times. It's why the GM of the Hilton ATL was walking among and handing out bottled waters to the maybe 100 stranded passengers in his lobby lined up for 2, then 3, then 4 front-desk stations (also wisely pulling staff onto the desk to move things faster) one night that I became one of them. (He also enlisted a porter who was vacuuming the closed restaurant to come help him with water duty, then found a second person to do so as he jumped behind the desk to open the final station -- exactly the kind of exercise of discretion a hospitality-business manager is supposed to do.) It's why I pledged my allegiance to Alamo Rent-a-Car one horrible night when their station manager waited for me and my 4-hour-delayed last-flight to a medium-city airport, long after everyone else had closed up, and was almost-annoyingly-cheery and fun and nice -- great personality. He turned my scowl and sadness and concern (as I had a big thing the next day and was exhausted) into a least a couple of smiles, and really put me in the right frame of mind to keep moving forward. I have never forgotten that, both for his kindness and for what his effect on me told me about how any business I was involved in should seek out and shine in those moments if we wanted a surefire way to build loyalty -- even if that cost us money. This Westjet pilot's actions, particularly because he prefaced it by saying "I'm with Westjet and we do things differently," reflects a stellar corporate culture that took a lot of work to build and maintain. He wasn't just being a good guy (which he certainly was), he was affirmatively-trying to help his company and knew that his company would back him for doing so. And, with that one act of kindness, he generated the kind of genuine goodwill that a million dollars of advertising never could.

Bravo to him. And bravo to WestJet for having the kind of people and culture that led to his actions.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:27 am

wjcandee wrote:
PlanesNTrains wrote:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


At a minimum, they probably didn't have the bank to cover it like a pilot might. I'm curious if any airline employees on this board have pulled out their credit card and bought food for a planeload of people or put them up in a hotel?


It's an "authority thing", in that the agent probably knew only that he could hand out vouchers that would be useless as the concessions were closed. He didn't have authority to go into whatever cash there was to buy meals for the customers.

OTOH, it's a failure of imagination and procedure. The diversion wasn't an air-return, it was a diversion from somewhere else. OPS certainly had the time to notify someone to be available to greet the flight and to arrange a crew or service to fuel the aircraft. No part of their procedure was to check whether food and bev options would be available for the self-loading freight and to take steps if it wasn't. It's an easy enough thing to make a part of the procedure, but apparently it is not.

That it is not part of AC's diversion procedure is a "culture thing". Westjet touts the fact that most employees are owners (through their stock incentive plan), and it's a mindset and a culture that I'm sure the disgruntled employees (and there always are some) mock, but my understanding is that it's prevalent among most employees there. To make people feel like owners, you also have to empower them, and it takes a lot of work and a bit of money to constantly push the culture throughout a far-flung operation, and it takes managers who understand that when an employee makes a good-faith decision to do something for passengers, you back them, period. Buying hotel rooms? Maybe not. But pizza? No brainer. The Westjet pilot knew that the best way to make customers for life is to show them kindness when they are facing bad times. It's why the GM of the Hilton ATL was walking among and handing out bottled waters to the maybe 100 stranded passengers in his lobby lined up for 2, then 3, then 4 front-desk stations (also wisely pulling staff onto the desk to move things faster) one night that I became one of them. (He also enlisted a porter who was vacuuming the closed restaurant to come help him with water duty, then found a second person to do so as he jumped behind the desk to open the final station -- exactly the kind of exercise of discretion a hospitality-business manager is supposed to do.) It's why I pledged my allegiance to Alamo Rent-a-Car one horrible night when their station manager waited for me and my 4-hour-delayed last-flight to a medium-city airport, long after everyone else had closed up, and was almost-annoyingly-cheery and fun and nice -- great personality. He turned my scowl and sadness and concern (as I had a big thing the next day and was exhausted) into a least a couple of smiles, and really put me in the right frame of mind to keep moving forward. I have never forgotten that, both for his kindness and for what his effect on me told me about how any business I was involved in should seek out and shine in those moments if we wanted a surefire way to build loyalty -- even if that cost us money. This Westjet pilot's actions, particularly because he prefaced it by saying "I'm with Westjet and we do things differently," reflects a stellar corporate culture that took a lot of work to build and maintain. He wasn't just being a good guy (which he certainly was), he was affirmatively-trying to help his company and knew that his company would back him for doing so. And, with that one act of kindness, he generated the kind of genuine goodwill that a million dollars of advertising never could.

Bravo to him. And bravo to WestJet for having the kind of people and culture that led to his actions.


I agree 100%. I am just picturing a gate agent or whomever is there to greet the flight having the wherewithal (or imagination) to pop for some pizzas. I agree - that's a big difference.
-Dave
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:04 am

Osiris wrote:
In this day and age there are almost always food options available, no matter how basic. The AC employee saying they couldn't do anything just couldn't be bothered to try. Hats off to the Westjet pilot.


More often that not the agents hands are tied by the company policies. This is an individual paying for pizza rather then a cooperation, big difference. Also big difference between a Capt salary versus a CSA salary!!! I wouldn't be to harsh on the AC employee, they do the best they can with what the have to work with!
 
MSJYOP28Apilot
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:06 am

I am not sure why AC used YFC as the alternate for YYT. Wouldnt YHZ, YQB or YUL have been better choices? Especially late at night it is always better to use a larger city with a busier airport as an alternate if the destination weather is forecast to be marginal or bad. Even if payload, i.e paying passengers and cargo/bags needs to be offloaded due to landing weight it is better customer service wise to have the majority of the passengers in a place where there are more resources. Diverting to a station with limited service late at night is recipe for a nightmare customer service wise. Late at night also means pilots are often close to timing out after working during the day so the risk for overnighting in the diverting point is pretty high.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:57 am

MSJYOP28Apilot wrote:
I am not sure why AC used YFC as the alternate for YYT. Wouldnt YHZ, YQB or YUL have been better choices? Especially late at night it is always better to use a larger city with a busier airport as an alternate if the destination weather is forecast to be marginal or bad. Even if payload, i.e paying passengers and cargo/bags needs to be offloaded due to landing weight it is better customer service wise to have the majority of the passengers in a place where there are more resources. Diverting to a station with limited service late at night is recipe for a nightmare customer service wise. Late at night also means pilots are often close to timing out after working during the day so the risk for overnighting in the diverting point is pretty high.


All true, and I don't purport to know Canada well, but here in the US, there's a Domino's Pizza in like every single town -- 5000 locations in the US. I don't know the Canadian equivalent -- TIm Horton's maybe? -- but there has to be some kind of reliable, universally-available food chain that delivers something that everyone can enjoy, even if it's a 6-foot submarine sandwich. I was at a party recently where the hostess had purchased a "Crave Crate" from White Castle, which is one hundred "sliders" neatly stacked in a box. Wow. People eyed it uncomfortably until one or two of us took one or two sliders each, then the thing evaporated in minutes, whereupon she produced another one from in back. Brilliant. They also have a 30-slider size. Point being, there's a chain (or at least a restaurant), and likely several, in any city big enough to have an airport that will happily deliver something people can share at night. That info ought to be available in the station office (and preferably on the city page in the OPS computer) for situations exactly like this, and it should be part of any diversion policy that the locals are empowered to make a call when the $5 vouchers are worthless. It's not that the airline doesn't feed passengers inconvenienced by a lengthy diversion -- they do! They just didn't bother to think it through like their careers depended upon it, and they didn't have a corporate culture that empowers employees to step up and use initiative when the company's plan can't accomplish the plan's goal. Plainly, OPS at AC focuses on moving machines, not taking care of people, at least past Step One of their plan. Imagine if the plane arrived and nobody had bothered to call the fuelers and tell them to have someone around, or if they didn't have the after-hours number for the fuelers. But if that happened, would they just say "Oh, well." and wait until morning? Similarly, if there was a mechanical issue, would they have no way to bring in mechanics or parts before the next day, or give up if the first layer of their plan wasn't possible? Of course not. But when it comes to the passengers... You get my point, and it's revealing.
 
oldannyboy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 9:27 am

:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..
 
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Faro
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:02 am

oldannyboy wrote:
:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..



Doing what they were told to do is not an excuse...letting children cry because they're hungry whilst righteously sticking to corporate feeding policy does not work as logic...

What one can understand is that a lower-level employee may not have the personal financial resources to buy a planeload of people lunch, yes...

Either way, bad day for AC...


Faro
The chalice not my son
 
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ojjunior
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:30 am

I don't see any problem with that. At least the pilot had the decency to do something for the passengers that the airline did not have.
I had a similar case aboard a Varig CDG-GRU flight in mid 90's when the CDG catering was on strike and some crew members deboarded with the pilot's credit card and 1hr later there were carts and more carts full of coke And McDonalds burgers for a fully loaded MD-11, then the pilot took off, landed in Madrid an hour later and the plane was stocked with catering from there.
There was not a single passenger who did not admire the attitude of the pilot and the way the crew handled the case, always announcing the events via speakers and listening to everyone.
But it was the 90's, when flying was a pleasure, not a obligation for young kids aiming to travel free to update their social media platforms, not to serve... and Varig was Varig...
 
bennett123
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 1:05 pm

Telling point is the plane was AC and the pilot WS.
 
YYZYYT
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:13 pm

wjcandee wrote:
MSJYOP28Apilot wrote:
I am not sure why AC used YFC as the alternate for YYT. Wouldnt YHZ, YQB or YUL have been better choices? Especially late at night it is always better to use a larger city with a busier airport as an alternate if the destination weather is forecast to be marginal or bad. Even if payload, i.e paying passengers and cargo/bags needs to be offloaded due to landing weight it is better customer service wise to have the majority of the passengers in a place where there are more resources. Diverting to a station with limited service late at night is recipe for a nightmare customer service wise. Late at night also means pilots are often close to timing out after working during the day so the risk for overnighting in the diverting point is pretty high.


All true, and I don't purport to know Canada well, but here in the US, there's a Domino's Pizza in like every single town -- 5000 locations in the US. I don't know the Canadian equivalent -- TIm Horton's maybe? -- but there has to be some kind of reliable, universally-available food chain that delivers something that everyone can enjoy, even if it's a 6-foot submarine sandwich.


Yes, we do- often it's a Domino's pizza. :smile:

As for your other point, the choice of YFC is strange... I have been diverted on that routing many times (note my username), and its either YHZ or YQM (which is still much bigger than YFC). Perhaps the weather was marginal in some but not all? That can happen, I was once diverted due to a winter storm, first to YHZ... which changed to BGR... then to YQM... all while we were in the air trying to reach the diversion.

Final point: Ouch, what a PR schooling for AC

Weather is weather, I understand that, but a different reaction by different carriers can have a huge effect.
 
oldannyboy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:23 pm

Faro wrote:
oldannyboy wrote:
:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..



Doing what they were told to do is not an excuse...letting children cry because they're hungry whilst righteously sticking to corporate feeding policy does not work as logic...

What one can understand is that a lower-level employee may not have the personal financial resources to buy a planeload of people lunch, yes...

Either way, bad day for AC...


Faro


No Faro, in most companies any lower ranking individual could potentially be punished for taking liberties such as "offering pizza" to customers, if such an action is not recognized and contemplated among company policies. Maybe you have no idea how rigid big companies are. Then again, if a Director, Senior Pilot or CEO decides to do such a thing on their own c/c it's a different story, but normal employees are not encouraged to do anything beyond the regular call of duty lest it becomes "expected norm" for similar incidents in the future.
 
oldannyboy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:29 pm

Ouch, what a PR schooling for AC

Weather is weather, I understand that, but a different reaction by different carriers can have a huge effect.[/quote]

...beg to disagree... It's not a different carrier's reaction: it's one individual's personal action, which has really nothing to do with how better WestJet supposedly is in comparison to AC.
 
AirbusCanada
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:48 pm

Faro wrote:
oldannyboy wrote:
:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..



Doing what they were told to do is not an excuse...letting children cry because they're hungry whilst righteously sticking to corporate feeding policy does not work as logic...

What one can understand is that a lower-level employee may not have the personal financial resources to buy a planeload of people lunch, yes...

Either way, bad day for AC...


Faro


Wonder what the Air Canada captain was doing when the WestJet pilot giving away free food to everyone?
Did he/she offer to pay back the Westjet employee?
Did he/she grabbed pizza slices for him/herself paid for by the competition?

Obviously He has much more authority or at least personal financial resources to order a few pizzas.
 
YYZYYT
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:35 pm

oldannyboy wrote:
Ouch, what a PR schooling for AC

Weather is weather, I understand that, but a different reaction by different carriers can have a huge effect.


...beg to disagree... It's not a different carrier's reaction: it's one individual's personal action, which has really nothing to do with how better WestJet supposedly is in comparison to AC.[/quote]

Fair point.

But it will almost certainly play out as "WJ v. AC" in people's minds, and in the ongoing PR war.. and, as pointed out by Wjcandee in his thoughtful post, corporate culture likely has something do with it.
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:41 pm

Faro wrote:
oldannyboy wrote:
:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..



Doing what they were told to do is not an excuse...letting children cry because they're hungry whilst righteously sticking to corporate feeding policy does not work as logic


Faro


Why can't people take responsibility for themselves? They could've just as easily picked up the phone and ordered their own food! But no, everyone is looking for a free lunch....

It's great that the WS pilot did this, but it was his own personal choice. It didn't have anything to do with WS as a company. And don't fault or criticize the AC employees for not do anything, you don't know the entire situation, company procedures, or even their personal financial situation. I know it would be tough for me to buy pizza for an entire aircraft full of people!!
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:44 pm

MSJYOP28Apilot wrote:
I am not sure why AC used YFC as the alternate for YYT. Wouldnt YHZ, YQB or YUL have been better choices? Especially late at night it is always better to use a larger city with a busier airport as an alternate if the destination weather is forecast to be marginal or bad. Even if payload, i.e paying passengers and cargo/bags needs to be offloaded due to landing weight it is better customer service wise to have the majority of the passengers in a place where there are more resources. Diverting to a station with limited service late at night is recipe for a nightmare customer service wise. Late at night also means pilots are often close to timing out after working during the day so the risk for overnighting in the diverting point is pretty high.


It's called "legal alternates"! You can look it up, you can't just divert to an airport because you want to....
 
cumulushumilis
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:56 pm

Most airports are small knit communities and most folks know each other. When it comes to IROPS and delays acts of kindness occur regardless of airline allegiance. Airline and airport employee assist another carriers passengers on a everyday basis and do the best they can with the resources they half. Contrary to popular belief the Red Guys are not the bad guys, they want to do the right thing. Countless acts like this one go unreported on a daily bases. Good on the WestJet guy for helping out and I can guarantee in another airport half way across the country and Air Canada colleague is performing an act of kindness as well.

That being said...
..beg to disagree... It's not a different carrier's reaction: it's one individual's personal action, which has really nothing to do with how better WestJet supposedly is in comparison to AC.


WestJet as a corporate culture has a history of performing acts of kindness, it's encouraged throughout all levels of the organization. My opinion is that a WestJet employee will proactively assist others in needs because they are given the empowerment and support to do so. That is the difference....
 
oldannyboy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:29 pm

Wonder what the Air Canada captain was doing when the WestJet pilot giving away free food to everyone?

probably busy taking care of paperwork & re-route...? Maybe the WS pilot was not as busy me thinks...
Did he/she offer to pay back the Westjet employee?

Why should s/he??
Did he/she grabbed pizza slices for him/herself paid for by the competition?

..perhaps?if it's genuinely offered why say no?
 
wjcandee
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:47 pm

oldannyboy wrote:
Ouch, what a PR schooling for AC

Weather is weather, I understand that, but a different reaction by different carriers can have a huge effect.


...beg to disagree... It's not a different carrier's reaction: it's one individual's personal action, which has really nothing to do with how better WestJet supposedly is in comparison to AC.[/quote]

I had a reaction, but YYZYYT beat me to it. It's one person's action in the context of a corporate culture. AC had a policy to feed people in such a circumstance (i.e. give them vouchers), but it couldn't be fulfilled so the AC employee gave up.
 
FGITD
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:02 pm

Very harsh to say that the air Canada agents just gave up. A ground agent is almost certainly making minimum wage, or not far from it. They simply don't have the means to make something like this happen.

Furthermore, this is exactly the type of thing that an employee with the authority of a captain (from almost any airline) can pull off without being questioned. If the basic ground agents did this, they'd likely be told "good job....but who told you to do it, and why?"

It's a matter of rank and financial ability more so than willingness
 
bennett123
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:36 pm

So where was the AC Captain.
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:01 pm

bennett123 wrote:
So where was the AC Captain.


Probably dealing with flight planning, crew scheduling, looking at weather, organizing fueling.....etc etc....

What else are you expecting him/her to do?
 
AirbusCanada
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:22 pm

Whiteguy wrote:

Why can't people take responsibility for themselves? They could've just as easily picked up the phone and ordered their own food! But no, everyone is looking for a free lunch....

It's great that the WS pilot did this, but it was his own personal choice. It didn't have anything to do with WS as a company. And don't fault or criticize the AC employees for not do anything, you don't know the entire situation, company procedures, or even their personal financial situation. I know it would be tough for me to buy pizza for an entire aircraft full of people!!


People can certainly take responsibility and order food from local sources.

However, this incident highlights how MBA educated Corporate decision makers treat passengers as $$$$ item as oppose to a Human being who need food/shelter and moral support when stranded in an unknown airport.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Fri Feb 17, 2017 11:33 pm

People on a.net dont live on Earth. A gate agent or flight attendant is not personally responsible to feed passengers on their low salaries. They cant just buy pizza they dont have corporate credit cards and it wouldnt have been approved without this huge story.

Pizza for a plane of hungry passengers would be more then a gate agent of flight attendant makes in a whole day! You really cant expect someone who makes so little money to really pay for passengers when it isnt their fault. They are not experts on the area either, so the WestJet pilot had more time to find open pizza places, he also probably wast trying to deal with angry passengers from air canada at the same time.

This was Air Canada being cheap and a West Jet pilot cashing in on the opportunity. plane and simple. The problem here are the cheap executives at Air Canada not the people at the airport that day. Its a weather delay the AC agents probably followed protocol.

Also the meal vouchers were not totally useless, they could have been used at their final destination for snacks or breakfast etc. I know its not great but the agents were still right to give out what they could. The problem here is AC being cheap and trying to act like they care after the story not the employees at the airport that day. They represent the airline but are following set guidelines, they are not decision makers, they are not given enough power and authority. The west jet pilot probably knew the publicity he would be paid back and he also makes alot more money.
 
Gr8Circle
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 12:15 am

Whiteguy wrote:
Osiris wrote:
In this day and age there are almost always food options available, no matter how basic. The AC employee saying they couldn't do anything just couldn't be bothered to try. Hats off to the Westjet pilot.


More often that not the agents hands are tied by the company policies. This is an individual paying for pizza rather then a cooperation, big difference. Also big difference between a Capt salary versus a CSA salary!!! I wouldn't be to harsh on the AC employee, they do the best they can with what the have to work with!


I was at ORD last year and there were severe thunderstorms in the evening.....all departures were delayed.....I had to fly on an AC flight to YYZ and was contemplating the prospect of spending a night in a hotel nearby (AC agents were handing out hotel coupons to all who asked)........four AC flights were piled up and passengers were really impatient and even rude....but the AC staff kept a smile on their face all throughout, joked with some passengers and generally kept things lively and light hearted until all flights (severely delayed) were off the ground....it was a stellar performance by AC staff a ORD that day and I will always remember it.......they have their bad days, but they certainly can shine on a really good (bad) day......
 
NichCage
Posts: 501
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:01 am

I think WestJet is an amazing airline to fly on. The airline has amazing employees!
 
kivalliqboy1
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:07 pm

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:48 am

A few years ago, I think in YWG, I was waiting for an Air Canada flight to YYC... late arrival followed by a mechanical and what ended up being a 3 or 4 hour delay.

After AC announced another delay, there was an "airport wide" announcement from WestJet about their "on time" departure to YYC followed by an invitation for delayed passengers to come to their gate for coffee and donuts. Was pretty cheeky but a much appreciated gesture.

When I did something similar for the other guys passengers and put it in my First Air corporate credit card, the President pulled me aside to thank me for it. $100 in coffee and snacks at the right time works better than $1000 in advertising, I think.
 
MHG
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 9:08 am

Well, I think one thing seems to be overlooked.
Although I am looking at this from a European point of view I am pretty sure that airlines on the North American continent (USA/CDN) fear possible legal risks with individuals taking such actions.
If the WS pilot takes action like he did there must be some assurance for him that his management will back his actions in case something goes wrong.
Which is principally a good thing - corporate culture wise -
But at AC I guess customer loyalty and clever PR has not such a priority ...
Seems two very different corporate cultures were at play.
IMHO WS is still in the "junior position" on the Canadian market requiring more efforts to attract customers. The WS captain recognized the opportunity for great PR and took action.
I miss the sound of rolls royce darts and speys
 
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MillwallSean
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 10:19 am

With the captain in question being European, English to be precise, and a fairly recent migrant to Canada, Id say looking at this with a European lens makes full sense.
I doubt the pilot would have considered potential management issues instead enjoying his "cheeky" moment giving it large to the competitor. A winwin for him. The management considerations were probably not something he even considered.

With Westjet having been featured as a feel good story on TV and in newspapers across the world, the lad deserves a medal from management. Westjet have gotten more positive exposure in a day or two through this lad, than their PR department have managed in a full calendaryear. He has earnt his salary tenfold through ordering couple of cheap pizzas.

I must say that Wjcandee post about brand loyalty and its correlation to org. culture is something often missed. The AC staff, at every level, didn't have the training and support from their org. culture to take initiative and arranging something here. They did nothing wrong, but still lost and became publicly humiliated. Thats on management. Can i just add that creating a strong organisational culture takes time though, its not something done over a few months. Its a continuous effort where not just management leads but also staff is empowered and involved and where symbols, anecdotes and training goes hand in hand.
No One Likes Us - We Dont Care.
 
AvroLanc
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:27 pm

Good for the WS pilot for doing the right thing. Keep in mind folks we no nothing about the AC employee(new hire/financial status etc), no blame shouldd go to him. There may have been around 100 people who could have easily stepped up and splurged for some pizza for the good of all, a little kindness can go along way and make many lives easier.
707,717,727,732,734,737,738,742,744,767,773,DC8,9,10,MD80,L1011,HSTrident,BAC111,DHComet.DH8-100,Q400,CRJ100,200,700,EM75,90,A310,319,320,321,333
 
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SomebodyInTLS
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:43 pm

Faro wrote:
oldannyboy wrote:
:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..



Doing what they were told to do is not an excuse...letting children cry because they're hungry whilst righteously sticking to corporate feeding policy does not work as logic...


C'mon! Seriously...?

I honestly do NOT believe you would voluntarily pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza FROM YOUR OWN WALLET because your company isn't going to do it.
"As with most things related to aircraft design, it's all about the trade-offs and much more nuanced than A.net likes to make out."
 
IPFreely
Posts: 1380
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:19 pm

SomebodyInTLS wrote:
I honestly do NOT believe you would voluntarily pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza FROM YOUR OWN WALLET because your company isn't going to do it.


From the article: "Samms said four or five pizzas were ordered."

I like good pizza as much as the next person but I've never ordered a $500 pizza before.

And how did the AC agent know the company wouldn't pay for pizza? Did the agent call his or her manager or the station manager, explain the situation, and ask if AC would reimburse the cost of food? Or did he or she just do nothing?




AirbusCanada wrote:
Wonder what the Air Canada captain was doing when the WestJet pilot giving away free food to everyone?


Or the Air Canada first officer, purser, or flight attendants who are all complicit in this debacle.
 
cumulushumilis
Posts: 95
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:49 pm

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:00 am

As a previous frontline employee working for a carrier, not going to saying which one.. I have bought 200 dollars worth of Tim's coffee and donuts during an IROP situation.. I was promptly reembursed , but more importantly I was empowered to make that decision. There was no questioning it was just done it was part of the business.
 
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cpd
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:25 am

Faro wrote:
oldannyboy wrote:
:
CrisAA wrote:
All of you bashing that employee forget that undoubtedly they were not the top of the chain there and were doing what they were told to do.


:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..



Doing what they were told to do is not an excuse...letting children cry because they're hungry whilst righteously sticking to corporate feeding policy does not work as logic...

What one can understand is that a lower-level employee may not have the personal financial resources to buy a planeload of people lunch, yes...

Either way, bad day for AC...


Faro


But you fail to realise that some uncaring, thoughtless management types would very happily get extremely angry with a gate agent who exercised creativity and intuition to save a bad situation because it was outside of the standard procedures. I suppose you'd do this only once and then get reprimanded for it. These sorts of situations need to be documented so that it isn't a "grey" area. That way the staff know that they can go ahead and sort out food/coffee/tea for the passengers without problems.

Good on the Westjet staffer for seeing a golden opportunity to get some positive PR.
 
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neutrino
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:34 am

IPFreely wrote:
SomebodyInTLS wrote:
I honestly do NOT believe you would voluntarily pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza FROM YOUR OWN WALLET because your company isn't going to do it.


From the article: "Samms said four or five pizzas were ordered."

I like good pizza as much as the next person but I've never ordered a $500 pizza before.


Why do you spoil his party by putting actual facts in the way of his alternative fact? ;)
Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis
 
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Faro
Posts: 1567
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:36 am

SomebodyInTLS wrote:
C'mon! Seriously...?

I honestly do NOT believe you would voluntarily pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza FROM YOUR OWN WALLET because your company isn't going to do it.



Seriously?...if I had enough money and were not hankering for more...if parents were left stricken not knowing how to answer little children's pleas for food...if people were startring to get moody and restless asking themselves if and when any food would materialise...looking at each other askance: is that guy hiding a sandwich?...surely he can see that little girl needs a bite much more urgently than he...etc/etc/etc...then Seriously, yes...I would pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza From My Own Wallet...

I can perhaps conceive of many people who would'nt...but that is not what we're talking about here...I guess in a rather corny way...it's part of whatever makes each of us 'human'...each in our own separate and personal ways...


Faro
Last edited by Faro on Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
The chalice not my son
 
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Faro
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:39 am

cpd wrote:
Faro wrote:
oldannyboy wrote:
:

:checkmark:

Sometimes on A.net you really have to wonder how many people have actually worked in the real world..



Doing what they were told to do is not an excuse...letting children cry because they're hungry whilst righteously sticking to corporate feeding policy does not work as logic...

What one can understand is that a lower-level employee may not have the personal financial resources to buy a planeload of people lunch, yes...

Either way, bad day for AC...


Faro


But you fail to realise that some uncaring, thoughtless management types would very happily get extremely angry with a gate agent who exercised creativity and intuition to save a bad situation because it was outside of the standard procedures. I suppose you'd do this only once and then get reprimanded for it. These sorts of situations need to be documented so that it isn't a "grey" area. That way the staff know that they can go ahead and sort out food/coffee/tea for the passengers without problems.

Good on the Westjet staffer for seeing a golden opportunity to get some positive PR.




Yes, I admit that is something I did not realise...that a gate agent trying to buy people pizza would get in trouble from his/her company...amazing!...all I can say is that if he/she does get in trouble with his/her company...they can and will find ample support and comfort from the press...


Faro
The chalice not my son
 
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SomebodyInTLS
Posts: 559
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Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 11:49 am

neutrino wrote:
IPFreely wrote:
SomebodyInTLS wrote:
I honestly do NOT believe you would voluntarily pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza FROM YOUR OWN WALLET because your company isn't going to do it.


From the article: "Samms said four or five pizzas were ordered."

I like good pizza as much as the next person but I've never ordered a $500 pizza before.


Why do you spoil his party by putting actual facts in the way of his alternative fact? ;)


Full disclosure - I hadn't read the article; but the discussion here implied pizza for a planeload of people...
"As with most things related to aircraft design, it's all about the trade-offs and much more nuanced than A.net likes to make out."
 
SaschaYHZ
Posts: 209
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 4:41 pm

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 12:36 pm

Living in YHZ, I believe weather may have been a reason for the choice of diversion. I can't speak for the weather in Fredricton, but we had roughly 60cms (almost 24 inches) of snow fall over a few days here in YHZ.
 
Nytram
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 10:45 am

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 1:22 pm

Having traveled on both airlines - this is AC culture v Westjet culture. WJ is customer oriented just as the old CP Air culture put customer first.Some AC people came from that merger and they shine! WJ allow their people to think outside the envelope.
 
bennett123
Posts: 7741
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Sun Feb 19, 2017 6:17 pm

Reminds me of something that happened to me about 10 years ago.

Customer made a mistake, this could be fixed in 10 minutes.

SOP was if customer made a mistake with no company error, then it was up to the customer to fix it.

This would have meant a disgruntled customer taking months to get it sorted by contacting HMRC, (our IRS).

Took several days to get my manager to see that the SOP was not always the best way.

Sadly too many companies let SOP turn people into robots.
 
OSUk1d
Posts: 129
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 2:43 am

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:09 am

Faro wrote:
SomebodyInTLS wrote:
C'mon! Seriously...?

I honestly do NOT believe you would voluntarily pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza FROM YOUR OWN WALLET because your company isn't going to do it.



Seriously?...if I had enough money and were not hankering for more...if parents were left stricken not knowing how to answer little children's pleas for food...if people were startring to get moody and restless asking themselves if and when any food would materialise...looking at each other askance: is that guy hiding a sandwich?...surely he can see that little girl needs a bite much more urgently than he...etc/etc/etc...then Seriously, yes...I would pay a couple of thousand bucks in pizza From My Own Wallet...

I can perhaps conceive of many people who would'nt...but that is not what we're talking about here...I guess in a rather corny way...it's part of whatever makes each of us 'human'...each in our own separate and personal ways...


Faro


On a site thats full of ridiculous posts, this might be the most melodramatic thing I've read on here. Thanks for the laugh.
 
User avatar
cpd
Posts: 4950
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:22 am

bennett123 wrote:
Reminds me of something that happened to me about 10 years ago.

Customer made a mistake, this could be fixed in 10 minutes.

SOP was if customer made a mistake with no company error, then it was up to the customer to fix it.

This would have meant a disgruntled customer taking months to get it sorted by contacting HMRC, (our IRS).

Took several days to get my manager to see that the SOP was not always the best way.

Sadly too many companies let SOP turn people into robots.


Exactly the point I was making before. Pretty bad situation.
 
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neutrino
Posts: 1187
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 5:33 pm

Re: Westjet pilot buys pizza for Air Canada passengers

Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:43 am

Company rules are cast in stone. That's what people are brainwashed to believe but its generally true. However, how many realize that stones can be broken up and even smashed to smithereens? Of course that might come with a price.
My belief is just do what one feels is the right thing to do, rules & regulations be damned. I've done it many times and had been censured and even suffered some consequences but on the main, there are happy endings.
Just a case in point. As a new employee in management position, I once went against the company director's express order to halt negotiations on a major deal by my department because of some misunderstandings between him and the customer. Under his nose, over the weekend, I connived with a junior, who was very well versed with the case but clueless on what to do next, to close the deal at no disadvantage to the company. With the hefty cash deposit in the bag, and the equipment order faxed to our principal before the director stepped into the office on the Monday. After he went through the details, he was in two minds; happy that a good profit project seemingly gone to the drain was rescued and angry he was blatantly disobeyed....by a new hire to boot. I was summoned to his office and faced his wrath, enduring his sharp lecture for a good twenty minutes which ended with a reluctant smile from him with these words: "Anyway, well done BUT don't do this again". I replied "Yes sir, I WON'T do this again....the same way" and left him in a pensive mood. In the years that followed, I often clashed with him but just about every (different) episode end in the advantage to the company. Eventually he came to know my style of disobedience of SOPs which is not detrimental to his business and he sort of let me be so long as I let him know in advance at least briefly what my next unconventional move entails.
Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis

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