compensateme
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:14 pm

IPFreely wrote:
Have they really? A quick check of fares one month from today (JFK-SFO r/t departing March 11, returning March 18) shows DL's lowest available economy fare is $464.40 and AA's lowest available economy fare is $442.40. Maybe the "free" meal isn't so free after all.


Fares change on a regular basis, a small sample is virtually meaningless. Case in point: on the same dates you mentioned, DL's lowest fare is currently $399 whereas AA is $472 (nonstop flights only).

b727fa wrote:
IFE is free. And why these two routes? They are the tightest and most competitive routes in the US. While market share is desireable (and it matters), but Delta is really driving our Net Promoter Score. This is a big part of what's driving the change. Delta may not make a ton of money or gain a lot of market share, the increase of the NPS is what matters to the brand at this point.


Disagree; if the free meals don't pay dividends to DL in some manner -- increasing average fares, increasing market share, bringing more passengers to DL, etc. -- no way will DL continue to provide them. The cost of the service + loss of buy on board profits makes this a quite costly proposition -- no way will DL continue it because it feels warm and fuzzy about its NPS.
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
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N644US
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:16 pm

IPFreely wrote:
compensateme wrote:
They've raised the bar on a competitive, highly lucrative battleground route.


Have they really? A quick check of fares one month from today (JFK-SFO r/t departing March 11, returning March 18) shows DL's lowest available economy fare is $464.40 and AA's lowest available economy fare is $442.40. Maybe the "free" meal isn't so free after all.


Really? I've seen DL as low as $256.40 r/t in V class (r/t departing 27 Feb, return 03 Mar) compared to AA's $286.40 on the same dates.
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spacecadet
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:05 am

IPFreely wrote:
Have they really? A quick check of fares one month from today (JFK-SFO r/t departing March 11, returning March 18) shows DL's lowest available economy fare is $464.40 and AA's lowest available economy fare is $442.40. Maybe the "free" meal isn't so free after all.


If AA gave me the option of including a proper hot meal in my ticket price for $20 (or just charged it and then included the meal like Delta's doing), I'd take them up on it.

A lot of people seem to assume that all passengers want *both* the cheapest fares *and* all the amenities we used to have. No, most of us care about value. The race to the bottom with fares is because airlines keep removing stuff, so of course we're not going to keep paying higher prices. But give us more and plenty of people will feel fine paying a bit more for it. I mean, to be honest, the difference between $442 and $464 is not even meaningful to me - I don't care. I wouldn't base my choice based solely on that price difference. I would think about what's justifying that price difference. A hot meal would be a big differentiator.

Airlines need to learn this. It's literally economics 101, one of the first things anybody learns in a basic economics class. Look up "perceived value".
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USAirALB
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:13 am

IIRC, airlines often don't make any money off BOB. It just simply offsets the loss that would occur if airlines provide free catering.
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:33 am

toobz wrote:
Compensate hopefully this is just the beginning. I know DL was testing the market a while ago with meals. They obviously were pleased with the results (duhh who would bitch about a free meal lol). But hopefully this will roll out to other markets as well.

You'd be surprised. I seem to recall a TR poster who would post about how everything was below expectations and that was the reason they flew F (not first/business class, but F).
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tjh8402
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:50 am

spacecadet wrote:
IPFreely wrote:
Have they really? A quick check of fares one month from today (JFK-SFO r/t departing March 11, returning March 18) shows DL's lowest available economy fare is $464.40 and AA's lowest available economy fare is $442.40. Maybe the "free" meal isn't so free after all.


If AA gave me the option of including a proper hot meal in my ticket price for $20 (or just charged it and then included the meal like Delta's doing), I'd take them up on it.

A lot of people seem to assume that all passengers want *both* the cheapest fares *and* all the amenities we used to have. No, most of us care about value. The race to the bottom with fares is because airlines keep removing stuff, so of course we're not going to keep paying higher prices. But give us more and plenty of people will feel fine paying a bit more for it. I mean, to be honest, the difference between $442 and $464 is not even meaningful to me - I don't care. I wouldn't base my choice based solely on that price difference. I would think about what's justifying that price difference. A hot meal would be a big differentiator.

Airlines need to learn this. It's literally economics 101, one of the first things anybody learns in a basic economics class. Look up "perceived value".


I think the success of NK and G4 would cause one to beg to differ. People like having things "unbundled" so they can save $ paying for nothing or only pay for the service. I do wish the carriers had a BOB order ahead hot meal option for coach passengers, but I doubt many would take them up on it.
 
IPFreely
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:39 am

tjh8402 wrote:
I think the success of NK and G4 would cause one to beg to differ. People like having things "unbundled" so they can save $ paying for nothing or only pay for the service. I do wish the carriers had a BOB order ahead hot meal option for coach passengers, but I doubt many would take them up on it.


The people who say they're happy to pay $20 extra for a ticket that includes $3 worth of food served on board are the same people who whine if the ticket is $20 less and they're charged $10 if they take the food on board.

The bottom line -- despite the title of this thread -- is that there is no such thing as a free lunch.
 
compensateme
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:33 am

tjh8402 wrote:
I think the success of NK and G4 would cause one to beg to differ. People like having things "unbundled" so they can save $ paying for nothing or only pay for the service. I do wish the carriers had a BOB order ahead hot meal option for coach passengers, but I doubt many would take them up on it.


There's no such thing as "unbundling;" NK has even acknowledged in the past that it will unbundle only when it believes people will pay the fees. Unbundling is just pure marketing hype. Sure, there's a very, very small percentage of people who "beat" the fees, but the lion's share aren't. It's generally cheaper to pay the RT$60 for baggage than it is to spend time + purchase the items at your destination.

People fly NK, F9 and G4 because, even with fees, they're cheap. A.net is good at finding the samples in which they aren't always the cheapest, but DOT data generally shows that even with the fees added in (and many people who fly the legacies get stuck paying for baggage anyway), they're still - on average - significantly cheaper.
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
jagraham
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:59 pm

compensateme wrote:
[quote="JBLUA320"As there's no competitive reason to do so, why should they? There's no reason to dilute the revenue by offering a service the market doesn't demand.

They've raised the bar on a competitive, highly lucrative battleground route. Remember, too, that these routes are usually exempt from simple status upgrades unless you're at the very top of the chart. That results in a tremendous number of high value customers flying Economy and/or Comfort+ so it makes sense to have an offering in those cabins to differentiate the Economy/Comfort+ experience from that of UA's Economy/Economy Plus and AA's Main Cabin/Main Cabin Extra. The meal service will be an upgrade of the Delta experience in both its Y and W cabins.


Try booking First Class on ATL/DTW/MSP-LAX on flights scheduled just outside the upgrade window; you'll notice that, on average, fewer than half the seats are available. This is consistent with prior statements from DL that an average of 50% of its system domestic First Class seats are purchased instead of upgraded (and the number is going to be higher on these routes -- longer flights, solid business market, difficulty of upgrades, etc.). In other words, fewer than 8 people, on average, are upgraded on these flights.

I mentioned this only because one poster suggested this as motivation for the return of meal service, and several people have agreed with the comments. I think it's foolhardy to suggest that DL's offering complimentary meal service to compensate for the few people who aren't upgraded; it'd be much cheaper to hand out a coupon for a complimentary buy-on-board product to the few high value passengers.

DL's doing this simply for one reason: to increase market share in the market. Like I said before, if it works, it might spread into a handful of other markets like BOS/LAX. If it doesn't, Flight Fuel will return. But Keep Dreaming if you think DL's "raising the bar" and this service will return to ATL-LAX/SEA/SFO/etc. in the future.[/quote]

Yes, DL could give meal coupons - they already give drink coupons in some limited circumstances. And they could modulate the meals if they were doing that; it's more than a few people between NY and Cali that are upgrade eligible. I never saw upgrades until the two years I was Diamond, and then only rarely.

And don't discount the profit up front. I'm sure Delta is very happy to sell those seats rather than give them to upgrades (sob), and it adds markedly to their bottom line. If they don't put too many lie flat seats on those routes.
 
spacecadet
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Sun Feb 12, 2017 7:29 pm

IPFreely wrote:
The people who say they're happy to pay $20 extra for a ticket that includes $3 worth of food served on board are the same people who whine if the ticket is $20 less and they're charged $10 if they take the food on board.


Thanks for proving my point! I literally said three comments above yours that this is an assumption many people make, and I'm here to prove you wrong. Because no, I do not "whine" about a ticket being $20 less and then being charged $10 for food, so I am proof that these are not the "same people". You are lumping two different groups in with each other just because you don't like either group. You're ending up making a straw man argument. In fact, I have repeatedly and *specifically* said in other threads that I would pay $20 or even $30 more for my ticket if it meant getting a hot meal. (Here's an example: viewtopic.php?t=1336925#p18968525 )

Delta is in fact doing exactly what I wished somebody would in that reply.

As for the success of airlines that "unbundle", wow, what a shock that some people prefer one thing, while others prefer something else! There is no one-size-fits-all airline. Delta is obviously trying to go a little more upscale and bust out of the race to the bottom, which can *only be good for them* (and us) in the long run. At the very least, it means now you have a choice as to what you want included in your ticket price. At best, it will start a trend and what we used to call "full service" carriers will return to something approaching that and stop competing against LCC's that "unbundle" everything. There is room for both business models, just as there is room for both Mercedes and Kia to sell cars. Over the past few decades, we've increasingly had a situation where the Mercedes' of the airline world are trying to compete against the Kias. And that just makes no sense. Not every airline needs to be Kia.

Also, while "unbundling" is one thing, you typically cannot even *buy* a hot meal on those types of airlines. I'm not specifically against unbundling and I'd still consider flying on such an airline as long as I could get a straight total price quote for all the options I choose. But that's not really possible, and neither is it possible to even choose options like this. So unbundling is really a separate thing; this is about availability. I understand that one or two airlines do let you purchase a hot meal separately, but most don't. I'd be fine flying those airlines and buying my meal, though, as long as I could compare the total cost at the time I'm shopping for fares rather than being surprised by the extra fee later. Don't make it look like your fare is cheaper than Delta's only to make me have to pay extra *after I've already bought my ticket* for the same level of service Delta provides. Again, not all of us want to pay the cheapest possible price solely for a place to put our butts.
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cokepopper
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:01 pm

In addition Apr 24th Delta will be adding an addition 10 flights:
BOS-SFO, BOS-LAX, BOS-SEA, DCA-LAX, JFK-PDX, JFK-SAN, JFK-SEA, SEA-FLL, SEA-MCO and SEA-RDU.
http://news.delta.com/delta-debuts-free ... 12-markets

Delta’s new meal program will feature a variety of options for customers depending on the time of day of their flight. In the morning, customers will have the option to choose between a Honey Maple Breakfast Sandwich, Luvo Breakfast Medley or fruit and cheese plate. During the day, customers will be able to select from a Mesquite-Smoked Turkey Combo, Luvo Mediterranean Whole Grain Veggie Wrap, or fruit and cheese plate. For overnight flights, customers will be offered a breakfast bar during the pre-arrival beverage service.
 
tlecam
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:09 pm

Did DL remove the warmers from any of their planes that they'd use on these routes? Quickly looking at the flights here, I'd imagine that the planes are a mix of 752, 738 and 739. I'm not sure about 319 and 320.
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IPFreely
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:15 pm

spacecadet wrote:
Again, not all of us want to pay the cheapest possible price solely for a place to put our butts.


Of course your "I'm happy to pay more to get more" argument falls apart completely. All of these routes have better food, seating, and other amenities in J and F class.
 
cokepopper
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:18 pm

compensateme wrote:
toobz wrote:
It's very obvious folks why DL is starting with these markets. They are trying to differentiate themselves from the competition.


It IS obvious why: because NYC-LAX/SFO are the highest volume, most competitive routes in the country; in the recent past, a higher caliber product has crept even into economy class. DL's merely trying to increase its market share; if it's successful, free meals could spread into other markets like BOS-LAX/SFO but if it isn't, Flight Fuel will return.

But to those why think this may evolve on a systemwide basis (e.g. free meals on ATL/DTW/MSP-LAX)... to mimic the OP,

Keep dreaming



Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.
 
airzona11
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:32 pm

IPFreely wrote:
spacecadet wrote:
Again, not all of us want to pay the cheapest possible price solely for a place to put our butts.


Of course your "I'm happy to pay more to get more" argument falls apart completely. All of these routes have better food, seating, and other amenities in J and F class.


The problem is that it is feast or famine. There is a very large disparity on these routes between travel classes, and rightfully so there is a huge disparity in ticket prices. That is why airlines are adding economy plus, get people to buy up to the next class. On this route I think a PY product would be desirable but those are in very limited deployments. So what is the next best thing? Make economy class better. It is a lot more feasible to spend a few extra bucks on a superior Y product vs magnitudes more to fly F/J on a 4-5 hour flight.

Sure the one time traveler purchasing on Kayak will fare shop. But if you are used to getting peanuts/nothing/or buy on board, and you get served a proper meal on DL are you saying those people would not be influenced to try DL again? If you are NY SF or LA based. You can pretty much choose all the major airlines on most routes, this for sure has to drive traffic to DL. Who knows in what scale, but doubtful this is negative to the bottom line.
 
compensateme
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:50 pm

cokepopper wrote:
Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.


No, DL will be truly raising the bar when it begins offering complimentary meal service on equivalent flights from its hubs instead of select, highly competitive routes.

DL's average Y fare on BOS/LAX is 10% less than that on ATL/MSP-LAX and 20% less than that on DTW.
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
ual777newpaint
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:08 pm

compensateme wrote:
cokepopper wrote:
Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.


No, DL will be truly raising the bar when it begins offering complimentary meal service on equivalent flights from its hubs instead of select, highly competitive routes.

DL's average Y fare on BOS/LAX is 10% less than that on ATL/MSP-LAX and 20% less than that on DTW.



+1

I live in Boston. Why should I care that those who live in NYC get free meals when flying JFK-LAX/SFO? Delta flies nonstop from BOS-LAX(and soon to SFO), and only offers their normal domestic product. It looks like First class will offer flatbed seats on BOS-SFO, but with the normal domestic service (thin, though "Westin Heavenly" blanket, 2 meal options), and BOB in coach.

Also, I would be more than happy to pay for a meal in Economy if it were of the same quality as their international meals/what they'll serve on JFK-LAX/SFO. The Mesquite-Smoked Turkey Combo is a salty, cold, flavorless sandwich which comes in a paper bag along with a portion of potato chips. I do not consider that to be a meal.
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NYCAdvantage
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:32 pm

I guess your wish is goig to be granted by Delta,
"Delta Air Lines Inc. is resuming free meals in coach on 12 transcontinental U.S. routes after customers responded enthusiastically to a test program in select markets.

The carrier on March 1 will debut complimentary meals on routes from New York’s John F. Kennedy International Airport to Los Angeles and San Francisco. On April 24, the offering will expand to another 10 cross-country flights out of New York, Boston, Seattle and Washington, Delta said in a statement Thursday."
 
toobz
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:38 pm

hahaha so happy to see DL proving more and more people wrong. Same people once again....can never find anything positive to say about DL lmfao..yes they are Raising the Bar
 
NYCAdvantage
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:39 pm

I guess your wish is going to be granted by Delta,
"Delta Air Lines Inc. is resuming free meals in coach on 12 transcontinental U.S. routes after customers responded enthusiastically to a test program in select markets.

The carrier on March 1 will debut complimentary meals on routes from New York’s John F. Kennedy International Airport to Los Angeles and San Francisco. On April 24, the offering will expand to another 10 cross-country flights out of New York, Boston, Seattle and Washington, Delta said in a statement Thursday."
 
KLDC10
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:41 pm

NYCAdvantage wrote:
I guess your wish is goig to be granted by Delta,
"Delta Air Lines Inc. is resuming free meals in coach on 12 transcontinental U.S. routes after customers responded enthusiastically to a test program in select markets.

The carrier on March 1 will debut complimentary meals on routes from New York’s John F. Kennedy International Airport to Los Angeles and San Francisco. On April 24, the offering will expand to another 10 cross-country flights out of New York, Boston, Seattle and Washington, Delta said in a statement Thursday."


Excellent news!
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michman
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:42 pm

ual777newpaint wrote:
compensateme wrote:
cokepopper wrote:
Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.


No, DL will be truly raising the bar when it begins offering complimentary meal service on equivalent flights from its hubs instead of select, highly competitive routes.

DL's average Y fare on BOS/LAX is 10% less than that on ATL/MSP-LAX and 20% less than that on DTW.



+1

I live in Boston. Why should I care that those who live in NYC get free meals when flying JFK-LAX/SFO? Delta flies nonstop from BOS-LAX(and soon to SFO), and only offers their normal domestic product. It looks like First class will offer flatbed seats on BOS-SFO, but with the normal domestic service (thin, though "Westin Heavenly" blanket, 2 meal options), and BOB in coach.

Also, I would be more than happy to pay for a meal in Economy if it were of the same quality as their international meals/what they'll serve on JFK-LAX/SFO. The Mesquite-Smoked Turkey Combo is a salty, cold, flavorless sandwich which comes in a paper bag along with a portion of potato chips. I do not consider that to be a meal.



Um, did you read the formal announcement a few posts back? BOS-SFO, BOS-LAX, and BOS-SEA will be getting free meals in coach as well.
 
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SANFan
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:45 pm

Me thinks the thread title should be changed..

bb
 
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OA412
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:50 pm

compensateme wrote:
No, DL will be truly raising the bar when it begins offering complimentary meal service on equivalent flights from its hubs instead of select, highly competitive routes.

DL's average Y fare on BOS/LAX is 10% less than that on ATL/MSP-LAX and 20% less than that on DTW.

This! It's one thing to offer free meals on highly competitive routes, another to up the ante on routes where you're not actually competing with anyone. It's a nice gesture, but it's hardly "raising the bar."
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clrd4t8koff
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:51 pm

ual777newpaint wrote:
+1

I live in Boston. Why should I care that those who live in NYC get free meals when flying JFK-LAX/SFO?


Because BOS-LAX/SFO are longer flights than JFK-LAX/SFO, as well as competitive business routes, so by principal you should get at least the same Y service

ual777newpaint wrote:
Delta flies nonstop from BOS-LAX(and soon to SFO), and only offers their normal domestic product. It looks like First class will offer flatbed seats on BOS-SFO, but with the normal domestic service (thin, though "Westin Heavenly" blanket, 2 meal options), and BOB in coach.


Uh, did you not read the press release that was posted a little upthread? BOS-LAX/SFO (and several other markets) will receive complimentary meals in coach starting April 24th - http://news.delta.com/delta-debuts-free ... 12-markets
 
panamair
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:00 pm

OA412 wrote:
compensateme wrote:
No, DL will be truly raising the bar when it begins offering complimentary meal service on equivalent flights from its hubs instead of select, highly competitive routes.

DL's average Y fare on BOS/LAX is 10% less than that on ATL/MSP-LAX and 20% less than that on DTW.

This! It's one thing to offer free meals on highly competitive routes, another to up the ante on routes where you're not actually competing with anyone. It's a nice gesture, but it's hardly "raising the bar."


Um, how exactly are JFK-PDX or SEA-FLL or SEA-RDU or even SEA-MCO "highly competitive"??? MSP-LAX sees more carriers on it than any one of those routes. In addition, on some of the 'free-food' routes, DL is already the leader with the most flights in the market (JFK-SAN, JFK-SEA) even though they are quite competitive....
 
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Keith2004
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:14 pm

As predicted people are still complaining,

Delta started with a couple routes and is now expanding it to 12,

I guess anything less than 7 course meals in economy on ALL routes is the same as the competition

So score is, Routes with meals in Y
DL - 12
AA- 0
UA- 0

Still Basically the same right :duck:

If them adding meals to these 12 routes makes AA and UA do the same, did they not raise the bar since the bar was NO meals on any of the routes?
 
MSPNWA
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:23 pm

cokepopper wrote:
Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.

Let's inject some facts in this "enhancement". This will do more for PR purposes than for their customers. In total this is for even fewer flights than JFK-SFO/LAX! These additions are even more rare. Some are seasonal. Many are red-eyes, so no meal eastbound. Also, the term "meal" is being butchered, and it doesn't surprise me that an dishonest DL is doing the stretching. A sandwich is a meal? A fruit and cheese plate? No, DL, that's not a meal. That's a good snack, like your BOB products are. And some of the Luvo stuff is nearly inedible, and I'll eat about anything on an airplane. Let's go through each route starting during the first week of the program:

LAX-DCA - 1x daily
LAX-BOS - 13x weekly, 6x weekly red-eye
SFO-BOS - launches June 8th, 13X weekly, 6x weekly red-eye.
SEA-BOS - 1x daily
SEA-RDU - launches June 8th, 1x daily
SEA-FLL - seasonal, ends one week after meals start, 1x weekly, red-eye
SEA-MCO - seasonal, 1x daily, red-eye
SEA-JFK - 27x weekly, 7x weekly red-eye
SAN-JFK - 20x weekly, 6x weekly red-eye
PDX-JFK - 11x weekly


DL will be truly changing the game when they offer real food on their common, less competitive routes. Why SEA-FLL/MCO/RDU, routes you hardly fly, but not SEA-ATL? It's a slap in the face. As it stands, this is mostly a PR stunt. Few "meals" will be served, and those that pay the most will get the least.
 
compensateme
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:29 pm

panamair wrote:
Um, how exactly are JFK-PDX or SEA-FLL or SEA-RDU or even SEA-MCO "highly competitive"??? MSP-LAX sees more carriers on it than any one of those routes. In addition, on some of the 'free-food' routes, DL is already the leader with the most flights in the market (JFK-SAN, JFK-SEA) even though they are quite competitive....


By average fares, they're more competitive than MSP-LAX. SEA/RDU is a long, thin route DL hasn't started yet, but AS' average fares aren't anything to write home about...
You're not the CEO; you were a menial aircraft support mechanic intern, and that was four years ago.
 
airzona11
Posts: 316
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:44 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:36 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
cokepopper wrote:
Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.

Let's inject some facts in this "enhancement". This will do more for PR purposes than for their customers. In total this is for even fewer flights than JFK-SFO/LAX! These additions are even more rare. Some are seasonal. Many are red-eyes, so no meal eastbound. Also, the term "meal" is being butchered, and it doesn't surprise me that an dishonest DL is doing the stretching. A sandwich is a meal? A fruit and cheese plate? No, DL, that's not a meal. That's a good snack, like your BOB products are. And some of the Luvo stuff is nearly inedible, and I'll eat about anything on an airplane. Let's go through each route starting during the first week of the program:

LAX-DCA - 1x daily
LAX-BOS - 13x weekly, 6x weekly red-eye
SFO-BOS - launches June 8th, 13X weekly, 6x weekly red-eye.
SEA-BOS - 1x daily
SEA-RDU - launches June 8th, 1x daily
SEA-FLL - seasonal, ends one week after meals start, 1x weekly, red-eye
SEA-MCO - seasonal, 1x daily, red-eye
SEA-JFK - 27x weekly, 7x weekly red-eye
SAN-JFK - 20x weekly, 6x weekly red-eye
PDX-JFK - 11x weekly


DL will be truly changing the game when they offer real food on their common, less competitive routes. Why SEA-FLL/MCO/RDU, routes you hardly fly, but not SEA-ATL? It's a slap in the face. As it stands, this is mostly a PR stunt. Few "meals" will be served, and those that pay the most will get the least.


Who is it a slap in the face to? You admit they improved their competitive routes. This is a good thing. It is a PR move, and they are improving their product, they should use it as a PR move.

They are increasing the service and offering. That is raising the bar. What does AS, UA, AA, WN, B6, VX, etc offer in economy on those routes? What is dishonest? What isn't an improvement?
 
MSPNWA
Posts: 2063
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Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:48 pm

airzona11 wrote:

Who is it a slap in the face to? You admit they improved their competitive routes. This is a good thing. It is a PR move, and they are improving their product, they should use it as a PR move.

They are increasing the service and offering. That is raising the bar. What does AS, UA, AA, WN, B6, VX, etc offer in economy on those routes? What is dishonest? What isn't an improvement?


I just told you the answer to every question you have. Read it again.
 
phllax
Posts: 363
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 6:53 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:52 pm

Booked LAX-JFK earlier in the week for travel on 7/1 and was able to book the full range of special meals, including kids meals.
 
toobz
Posts: 692
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:33 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:54 pm

Phllax that's great to hear that a paying customer finds value in DLs changes. Hope you and your family have a great trip on DL :)
 
airzona11
Posts: 316
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:44 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 6:58 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
airzona11 wrote:

Who is it a slap in the face to? You admit they improved their competitive routes. This is a good thing. It is a PR move, and they are improving their product, they should use it as a PR move.

They are increasing the service and offering. That is raising the bar. What does AS, UA, AA, WN, B6, VX, etc offer in economy on those routes? What is dishonest? What isn't an improvement?


I just told you the answer to every question you have. Read it again.


Ah so the route you fly doesn't get a meal. Got it.

Interesting times to see how AA and DL will respond, no doubt they will.
 
MSPNWA
Posts: 2063
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 2:48 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:28 pm

airzona11 wrote:
Ah so the route you fly doesn't get a meal. Got it.

Interesting times to see how AA and DL will respond, no doubt they will.

About at least 99.992% of DL passengers will be unaffected by the addition of these 10 routes. With JFK-LAX/SFO, it only drops to about 99.978% of DL passengers. But yeah, let's get excited and say that DL is "raising the bar".
 
toobz
Posts: 692
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:33 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:49 pm

blah blah blahhhhhhhhh...UA, AA and AS are obviously raising the bar though right..? LOL..Didn't think so
 
mikegigs
Posts: 39
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2014 8:03 pm

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 8:59 pm

I really don't understand how these topics always turn into such heated debates over whether airlines are raising the bar or not. If an airline makes any passenger improvements, I'm happy! Doesn't matter if it's DL, UA, AA, WN or anybody else. Even a small step forward is better than one backward.

Congrats to Delta and their passengers on these routes.
BOS born and raised, undoubtedly biased to Logan ;)
 
lowfareair
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:40 pm

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:38 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
cokepopper wrote:
DL will be truly changing the game when they offer real food on their common, less competitive routes. Why SEA-FLL/MCO/RDU, routes you hardly fly, but not SEA-ATL? It's a slap in the face.


No, it's just that only CONUS routes over 2,300 miles are getting the additional free food. SEA-ATL is only 2,182 miles, quite below any of the other routes.
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1408
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:35 pm

cokepopper wrote:
Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.


I just had the pleasure of flying on Delta across the pond. As with my other Delta experiences, it was very pleasant. Excellent staff at the airports on both ends, excellent inflight crews, nice onboard food offerings in both Business and Coach. Delta does a really good job. Here's where I have a problem - and it's mainly on this site. WHY do the DL fanboys here feel the need to congratulate themselves at every turn and jump up and down to tell the whole world how great they are? There's something to be said for a being humble. There really is. Continue doing what you do to make Delta a really nice airline and then just be humble and don't brag at every. single. turn. This bit about acting like Delta is the second coming of Christ is nauseating and does nothing to endear the airline and it's people to anyone. And they have really nice people and a nice product. It's not necessary to tell everyone that you're better than the competition. Just let them discover it for themselves. Let the haters hate - don't feel like you have to defend yourself or your airline to them all the time - the product will defend itself - and it does.
 
toobz
Posts: 692
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:33 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:44 pm

well compared to other US airlines, DL is better and does try to stand out. We are very proud of that. Glad you had a nice trip with DL :)
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1408
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:04 pm

toobz wrote:
well compared to other US airlines, DL is better and does try to stand out. We are very proud of that. Glad you had a nice trip with DL :)


This is exactly what I'm talking about. Being humble is a whole lot more endearing than this. A little pride goes a long way.
 
FSDan
Posts: 1110
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:18 pm

ASFlyer wrote:
cokepopper wrote:
Hopefully you can admit with todays announcement that Delta is truly raising the bar.
And Delta is Differentiating itself from the competition.


I just had the pleasure of flying on Delta across the pond. As with my other Delta experiences, it was very pleasant. Excellent staff at the airports on both ends, excellent inflight crews, nice onboard food offerings in both Business and Coach. Delta does a really good job. Here's where I have a problem - and it's mainly on this site. WHY do the DL fanboys here feel the need to congratulate themselves at every turn and jump up and down to tell the whole world how great they are? There's something to be said for a being humble. There really is. Continue doing what you do to make Delta a really nice airline and then just be humble and don't brag at every. single. turn. This bit about acting like Delta is the second coming of Christ is nauseating and does nothing to endear the airline and it's people to anyone. And they have really nice people and a nice product. It's not necessary to tell everyone that you're better than the competition. Just let them discover it for themselves. Let the haters hate - don't feel like you have to defend yourself or your airline to them all the time - the product will defend itself - and it does.


The reality as far as I see it is that DL is a good airline, and has been a trendsetter among the U.S. legacy airlines in recent years (in both good ways and bad, I would argue). They also have a PR department that is constantly in overdrive and as a result often underwhelms.

With that reality in mind, there are some people on this site (and not surprisingly many are DL employees) who only see and/or acknowledge the good things DL does. There are definitely many things that DL does that are exciting, but there can also be nauseating spin in the press releases. On the other side, there are people on this site who have a sort of vendetta and can't accept that DL is actually a really good airline that does, in fact, set the bar in the U.S. airline industry in many different ways. Everyone knows who those people are, but it's still tiring to listen to the endless complaints every time DL enhances their service in some way. I think both groups of people could benefit from trying to see things from the other side a bit more often. Just my two cents.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
jumbojet
Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:27 pm

ASFlyer wrote:
[. Here's where I have a problem - and it's mainly on this site. WHY do the DL fanboys here feel the need to congratulate themselves at every turn and jump up and down to tell the whole world how great they are? .


care to quote a post where the fanboys are contratulating and jumping up and down and telling the whole world how great DL is? I read every single post on this thread, and other DL threads, and I do not get that sense. I mean, is there anything wrong with posting this and making the statement that DL is upping their game? I don't take that as jumping up and down and high fiving....

Offering free meals again when other airlines are charging for overhead bin space is in fact, upping the game, like it or not, it is. DL is now the only airline that offers a complimentary meal in coach (or as NWA spins it, a free snack) on transcon flights. I have not taken a single post in this thread that would even remotely lead me to believe that DL fanboys are 'high-fiving and jumping up and down.
 
toobz
Posts: 692
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:33 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Fri Feb 17, 2017 12:35 am

correct Jumbo..we are just reporting the news and some (same) people don't like it
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1408
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Fri Feb 17, 2017 12:42 am

jumbojet wrote:
ASFlyer wrote:
[. Here's where I have a problem - and it's mainly on this site. WHY do the DL fanboys here feel the need to congratulate themselves at every turn and jump up and down to tell the whole world how great they are? .


care to quote a post where the fanboys are contratulating and jumping up and down and telling the whole world how great DL is? I read every single post on this thread, and other DL threads, and I do not get that sense. I mean, is there anything wrong with posting this and making the statement that DL is upping their game? I don't take that as jumping up and down and high fiving....

Offering free meals again when other airlines are charging for overhead bin space is in fact, upping the game, like it or not, it is. DL is now the only airline that offers a complimentary meal in coach (or as NWA spins it, a free snack) on transcon flights. I have not taken a single post in this thread that would even remotely lead me to believe that DL fanboys are 'high-fiving and jumping up and down.


I'm sure you don't take any of the posts that way. I wouldn't expect you to. I think a number of people, however, do. Since you asked for a particular quote, here's one:

"Effective March 1, all Delta non-stop transcon flights between JFK/LAX/SFO and return will feature free complimentary meals in the main cabin.
Passengers will be offered one of three choices, including a vegetarian option.

Delta continues to raise the bar."


So much more effective just leaving that last sentence out. Maybe you think it's integral - I think it's just a way of trying to say that you're better than the rest. Why? If it's true than others will decide that for themselves. All I'm saying is, there's a difference between coming here and making a post about an enhancement and leaving it at that and then coming here and making the same post, with the added "and Delta once again raises the bar among U.S. airlines". Maybe it's just me - and I'm not the airliners.net post police so do whatever you think is right. It just dawned on me as I was flying on a Delta flight to London that Delta has a really nice product. Sometimes I look at DL with a negative light because of some perceived arrogance here and on other online forums where DL employees and fanboys post. A more humble approach is so much more attractive. My perception of DL is tainted by some of those that post here and it's not necessarily a good thing. You don't need to tell people how to feel about something if your product can stand on it's own. To that, I've also flown on AA and UA recently and had a really nice experience - so there's that too, right? DL is currently probably the most successful of the three legacy carriers by most measures, but AA and UA aren't going to be left in the dust. They'll catch up - the competitive nature of the airline industry would require them to if they want to be successful.

The poster just above yours has a very valid point too - the anti-DL posters are just as bad. Both sides are tiring. Isn't there enough negativity these days without having to constantly try to drag each other down to lift yourself up? It's exhausting (and extremely predictable) to read the constant back and forth. I've allowed myself to get drug into in the past but really, it's just bad energy.
 
MSPNWA
Posts: 2063
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 2:48 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:01 am

lowfareair wrote:
No, it's just that only CONUS routes over 2,300 miles are getting the additional free food. SEA-ATL is only 2,182 miles, quite below any of the other routes.

That's what I thought too, but curiously LAX-MIA at 2,342 isn't included. So 2,350? Either way the policy applies to a minute fraction of DL flights.
 
jb1087xna
Posts: 246
Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 2:11 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:19 am

MSPNWA wrote:
That's what I thought too, but curiously LAX-MIA at 2,342 isn't included. So 2,350? Either way the policy applies to a minute fraction of DL flights.


Not sure why DL is being bashed for adding any kind of upgrade, whether 10 people or 10 million people are touched by it.
A320/321/330 B717/722/733/735/737/738/739/744/752/762/763 CR1/2/7/9 D95 E145 M82/88/90
Next Up: XNA-ATL-SAN and back.
 
klkla
Posts: 681
Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 8:51 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:30 am

ASFlyer wrote:
WHY do the DL fanboys here feel the need to congratulate themselves at every turn and jump up and down to tell the whole world how great they are? There's something to be said for a being humble. There really is. Continue doing what you do to make Delta a really nice airline and then just be humble and don't brag at every. single. turn. This bit about acting like Delta is the second coming of Christ is nauseating and does nothing to endear the airline and it's people to anyone.


It's hardly just DL fanboys that do this. AA, UA and AS fanboys are just as bad.
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1408
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:59 am

klkla wrote:
ASFlyer wrote:
WHY do the DL fanboys here feel the need to congratulate themselves at every turn and jump up and down to tell the whole world how great they are? There's something to be said for a being humble. There really is. Continue doing what you do to make Delta a really nice airline and then just be humble and don't brag at every. single. turn. This bit about acting like Delta is the second coming of Christ is nauseating and does nothing to endear the airline and it's people to anyone.


It's hardly just DL fanboys that do this. AA, UA and AS fanboys are just as bad.


Actually, the AS fan boys really don't. Find the last post where an AS fan boy claimed to be better than the rest.
 
toobz
Posts: 692
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:33 am

Re: Delta brings back free Y class meals on NYC transcon

Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:55 am

DL isn't the best when it comes to everything. But they are doing more than any other US airline to better their service. That's all that's been said. And maybe when AS does something to differentiate themselves, AS fanboys will have their chance.

Edited to add: Last comment was not meant as mean. AS is a great airline. I live in the NW and use them frequently as well.

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