Is DL ready for the A350?

airboeingbus · Fri Jan 27, 2017 10:56 pm

With DL's first A350 currently under final assembly I was wondering if they are ready to accept the new type. It's been rather quiet regarding the order and I am just wondering what has been happening behind the scenes to add this new type and a new engine manufacteire to DL's fleet.

OA412 · Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:06 pm

It's not a new engine manufacturer. DL has a history of RR engined aircraft. The 772 fleet is RR powered, as was the large L1011 fleet.

KTPAFlyer · Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:22 pm

Wow, time flies! I never realized Delta's A350 was in final assembly! How much longer until we see EIS at DTW? It will be exciting to see the first US carrier begin A350 ops here!

Dldiamondboy · Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:27 pm

OA412 wrote:
It's not a new engine manufacturer. DL has a history of RR engined aircraft. The 772 fleet is RR powered, as was the large L1011 fleet.

Only the 8 ER's are Rolls powered. The 10 LR's are powered by the GE90-110B1L

DDR · Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:30 pm

Always excited to see a new Airbus in a U.S. fleet! Can't wait to see her.

Newbiepilot · Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:33 pm

I am sure there is lots of planning going on within the engineering teams. Parts provisioning will be ramping up now. The maintenance program will need to be submitted to the FAA soon as well. Dozens of mechanics will also go through the A350 training classes. The A350 is a much more advanced airplane with software controlling so many different controls that I suspect they will have a dedicated team of mechanics while they learn the airplane. And of course pilot training is probably going on too.

airboeingbus · Sat Jan 28, 2017 2:10 am

KTPAFlyer wrote:
Wow, time flies! I never realized Delta's A350 was in final assembly! How much longer until we see EIS at DTW? It will be exciting to see the first US carrier begin A350 ops here!

I believe around June to July time, that's when it should be delivered to DL at least.

tjerome · Sat Jan 28, 2017 2:47 am

airboeingbus wrote:
KTPAFlyer wrote:
Wow, time flies! I never realized Delta's A350 was in final assembly! How much longer until we see EIS at DTW? It will be exciting to see the first US carrier begin A350 ops here!

I believe around June to July time, that's when it should be delivered to DL at least.

I belive the first delivery is in April and EIS won't be until September. This is a whole new type of aircraft and it will take a while to get everyone familiarized with it.

Even with the 321 being a common type with the 319 and 320, first delivery was in March and did not enter revenue service until May.

bluefltspecial · Sat Jan 28, 2017 6:55 am

While we're aware that DL plans to put these on Asia routes, any guesses on what routes they will be doing pilot proving on? I'd love to see them on the transcon flights from JFK, but I might be dreaming. They will have the new Delta One Suites and Delta Prem Economy so it would be right suited for that market... dare to dream, dream big I always say.

intotheair · Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:00 am

Will be interesting, too, to see whether the A350 supplants the A330 in most of DL's advertising.

RL777 · Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:18 am

Exciting times, I believe this will be the first time an American airline operate a true long haul Airbus. The A359 will look great in DL colors, should be seeing it at SEA soon enough. Its a strong candidate to take over for the A330 on the HKG route.

777Mech · Sat Jan 28, 2017 8:10 am

airboeingbus wrote:
With DL's first A350 currently under final assembly I was wondering if they are ready to accept the new type. It's been rather quiet regarding the order and I am just wondering what has been happening behind the scenes to add this new type and a new engine manufacteire to DL's fleet.

All of the MX workcards have been completed, now it's just tying up loose ends until they submit the maintenance program to the FAA in March. The first delivery will be in late May, and it will promptly go back to Airbus Corporate Jet Center for 2Ku wifi installation. Should EIS in late September 1st.

Thunderboltdrgn · Sat Jan 28, 2017 8:11 am

tjerome wrote:
airboeingbus wrote:
KTPAFlyer wrote:
Wow, time flies! I never realized Delta's A350 was in final assembly! How much longer
until we see EIS at DTW? It will be exciting to see the first US carrier begin A350 ops here!

I believe around June to July time, that's when it should be delivered to DL at least.

I belive the first delivery is in April and EIS won't be until September. This is a whole new type of aircraft and it will take a while to get everyone familiarized with it.

Even with the 321 being a common type with the 319 and 320, first delivery was in March and did not enter revenue service until May.

I think April is a little too optimistic since it just entered fuselage join. As said above June is probably more realistic.
See production list https://sites.google.com/site/a350xwbpr ... ction-list

Asiana #1 which is 20 MSN # ahead of DL #1 is expected in April.

LAX772LR · Sat Jan 28, 2017 8:19 am

bluefltspecial wrote:
While we're aware that DL plans to put these on Asia routes, any guesses on what routes they will be doing pilot proving on?

Dunno, though 99% chance that LAX will be the terminal destination, as it almost always is for new widebodies.
Best guesses would be DTW-LAX and/or ATL-LAX.

RL777 wrote:
Exciting times, I believe this will be the first time an American airline operate a true long haul Airbus.

Hardly. DL's been flying Airbuses on 14hr+ flights for years now.
And since they weren't splashing down short of the destination.... they sound pretty "true" to me.

kurtverbose · Sat Jan 28, 2017 8:31 am

OA412 wrote:
It's not a new engine manufacturer. DL has a history of RR engined aircraft. The 772 fleet is RR powered, as was the large L1011 fleet.

Also, they announced in 2015 that Delta would become an approved maintenance centre for Trent 7000 and XWB engines.

http://www.deltatechops.com/mro-capabilities/view/category/rolls-royce-approved-maintenance-center

Balerit · Sat Jan 28, 2017 9:12 am

You can bet there is plenty going on behind the scenes. Courses overseas for the first group of engineers, certification exams, the whole shebang.

klm617 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:54 am

bluefltspecial wrote:
While we're aware that DL plans to put these on Asia routes, any guesses on what routes they will be doing pilot proving on? I'd love to see them on the transcon flights from JFK, but I might be dreaming. They will have the new Delta One Suites and Delta Prem Economy so it would be right suited for that market... dare to dream, dream big I always say.

I would say something out of Atlanta.

Dalmd88 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 1:34 am

kurtverbose wrote:
OA412 wrote:
It's not a new engine manufacturer. DL has a history of RR engined aircraft. The 772 fleet is RR powered, as was the large L1011 fleet.

Also, they announced in 2015 that Delta would become an approved maintenance centre for Trent 7000 and XWB engines.

http://www.deltatechops.com/mro-capabilities/view/category/rolls-royce-approved-maintenance-center

The new engine shop for the Trent will be in the current TOC 1 hangar. Bay One has already moved out to the old Northwest hangar on the south side of the airport. Bays 2-4 will move in the next few months. Construction for the new shops I think has begun in the old Bay One space. I think the shop will be up and running in about a year with some contract engines.

smi0006 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 1:46 am

Does anyone have any photos of the cabin? I personally find the interior design fascinating whilst seats have been relaxed be interesting to see if the passport plum makes an appearance in the new cabins.

Any chance we could see LAX-SYD on this bird? Long enough route to justify the weight reduction from the 77L which range isn't really needed

crazyplane1234 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:03 am

intotheair wrote:
Will be interesting, too, to see whether the A350 supplants the A330 in most of DL's advertising.

Considering how the A350 is a more modern aircraft, this is almost certain.

SFOtoORD · Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:20 am

airboeingbus wrote:
With DL's first A350 currently under final assembly I was wondering if they are ready to accept the new type. It's been rather quiet regarding the order and I am just wondering what has been happening behind the scenes to add this new type and a new engine manufacteire to DL's fleet.

Nah, I heard they're just going to wing it. Figured they'd wait until arrived and have some maintenance dude (or dude Type) read the manual and put in the AA batteries. And then just surprise some passengers with a brand spankin' new plane on their route.

ehaase · Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:50 am

Delta has ordered 25 of these, but has only 7 747's to replace. I guess Delta has lots of new Asian routes planned.

davescj · Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:18 am

ehaase wrote:
Delta has ordered 25 of these, but has only 7 747's to replace. I guess Delta has lots of new Asian routes planned.

They cancelled the 787s that NW had ordered. Also, DL has to start thinking about 767 replacement. I would expect both of those factors (as well as the retirement of 744) is all part of the plan.

DL777200LR · Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:04 am

Balerit wrote:
You can bet there is plenty going on behind the scenes. Courses overseas for the first group of engineers, certification exams, the whole shebang.

The first maintenance A350 training classes were at the Airbus facility in Miami in October while the training department prepared for the A350 and since January Delta has been training technicians in house in the Atlanta training center.

Balerit · Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:26 am

DL777200LR wrote:
Balerit wrote:
You can bet there is plenty going on behind the scenes. Courses overseas for the first group of engineers, certification exams, the whole shebang.

The first maintenance A350 training classes were at the Airbus facility in Miami in October while the training department prepared for the A350 and since January Delta has been training technicians in house in the Atlanta training center.

Ah, okay. At SAA they used to send the first batch of engineers to the county of origin which was nice. When we got our B747-400's I attended a week long ground run course in BA's simulators at Heathrow, as our simulators weren't up and running. My course though was done in-house at SAA. These days I guess it's cheaper to send an instructor to the airline.

RL777 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:49 am

LAX772LR wrote:
bluefltspecial wrote:
While we're aware that DL plans to put these on Asia routes, any guesses on what routes they will be doing pilot proving on?

Dunno, though 99% chance that LAX will be the terminal destination, as it almost always is for new widebodies.
Best guesses would be DTW-LAX and/or ATL-LAX.

RL777 wrote:
Exciting times, I believe this will be the first time an American airline operate a true long haul Airbus.

Hardly. DL's been flying Airbuses on 14hr+ flights for years now.
And since they weren't splashing down short of the destination.... they sound pretty "true" to me.

Fair enough, I've never really considered the A330 even the 200 to be a "true" long haul aircraft but your right. Many carriers, not only DL are operating the aircraft on some longer sectors.

MSPNWA · Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:51 am

LAX772LR wrote:
Hardly. DL's been flying Airbuses on 14hr+ flights for years now.
And since they weren't splashing down short of the destination.... they sound pretty "true" to me.

14 hours at less-than-full payload is not long-haul in the standard sense. The A330 range is a clear gap behind the 747/A340/777/A380/787/A350 families. Even DL's MD-11 had more range than their current A332s. I guess it all comes full circle. Almost exactly 30 years after Northwest ordered the A340, a long-range Airbus will finally be with a U.S. carrier. Been a long wait, and it will great to see.

flyDTW1992 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 10:35 am

MSPNWA wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
Hardly. DL's been flying Airbuses on 14hr+ flights for years now.
And since they weren't splashing down short of the destination.... they sound pretty "true" to me.

14 hours at less-than-full payload is not long-haul in the standard sense.

......According to who?

flyDTW1992 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 10:51 am

ehaase wrote:
Delta has ordered 25 of these, but has only 7 747's to replace. I guess Delta has lots of new Asian routes planned.

There were 16, though. The gap as they retire 744s has been backfilled by the other widebodies.

A330freak · Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:09 am

It looks like they already have a simulator for the aircraft, as well as door trainers (or are in the process of accepting them).

Simulator:
https://twitter.com/A350fans/status/786129060250390529

Door Trainers
https://twitter.com/EDMLTD/status/795941124905041924
https://twitter.com/EDMLTD/status/806486715485585408

smi0006 wrote:
Does anyone have any photos of the cabin? I personally find the interior design fascinating whilst seats have been relaxed be interesting to see if the passport plum makes an appearance in the new cabins.

Any chance we could see LAX-SYD on this bird? Long enough route to justify the weight reduction from the 77L which range isn't really needed

DL last year revelaled a bit of info on the Business and Premium economy seats that'll be installed on the aircraft.

More in the following links (The first 2 are 360 degree images/graphics of what the business and premium economy cabins will look like)
https://www.facebook.com/delta/photos/a ... =3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/delta/photos/a ... =3&theater
http://news.delta.com/worlds-first-all- ... -delta-one
http://www.delta.com/content/www/en_US/ ... onomy.html

As a Sydneysider I do hope they'll put it on the LAX-SYD route. The following article says they will and it makes sense for them to do it, the bigger question is probably when.
https://www.ausbt.com.au/delta-eyes-syd ... me-flipper

Clipper101 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:33 am

OA412 wrote:
Only the 8 ER's are Rolls powered. The 10 LR's are powered by the GE90-110B1L

GE is sole engine supplier on triple seven LR's !

MartijnNL · Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:10 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
14 hours at less-than-full payload is not long-haul in the standard sense.

14 hours in the air is not long haul? I once flew SIN-CDG on an Air France A380 in 13 hours. Wasn't that a long haul flight? And what about travelling in a KLM MD-11 for almost 11 hours, AMS-SFO? Also not long haul? What is the definition of a long haul flight? Has that definition, if there is one, changed in recent years?

StTim · Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:18 pm

I always thought 14 hours was straying towards ULH territory. Have flow many many miles and can only think of a handful 14 hours and more.

Thunderboltdrgn · Sun Jan 29, 2017 1:06 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
14 hours in the air is not long haul? I once flew SIN-CDG on an Air France A380 in 13 hours. Wasn't that a long haul flight? And what about travelling
in a KLM MD-11 for almost 11 hours, AMS-SFO? Also not long haul? What is the definition of a long haul flight? Has that definition, if there is one, changed in recent years?

That question have been asked before viewtopic.php?t=461349

Cebo29 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 1:32 pm

First A350XWB general familiarization training at OC3 started on 1/16. No signs of construction on the new Rolls test cell building next to TechOps.

Dalmd88 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 1:45 pm

Cebo29 wrote:
First A350XWB general familiarization training at OC3 started on 1/16. No signs of construction on the new Rolls test cell building next to TechOps.

The test cell construction should start soon. I think they were waiting to get the parking lots resealed and striped first. The test cell area was being used as parking each week while they closed a portion of the lot to do the sealing.

Cebo29 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:09 pm

That's what our MD88 instructor informed us when I asked him and drove past the proposed RR test cell couple of weeks back. But still no sign of construction.

johns624 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:17 pm

smi0006 wrote:
Any chance we could see LAX-SYD on this bird? Long enough route to justify the weight reduction from the 77L which range isn't really needed

I'm curious about that, myself. We're going to be flying that route in January, 2018.

MIflyer12 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:34 pm

smi0006 wrote:
Any chance we could see LAX-SYD on this bird? Long enough route to justify the weight reduction from the 77L which range isn't really needed

IMHO, a pretty good chance, in order to get Business suites and Premium eco on the route before the 77Ls (and 777s) are reconfigured.

Cebo29 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:36 pm

Up to 12/26 LAX to SYD is a 777LR. Will see what happens when the January schedule comes out.

PIEAvantiP180 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:32 pm

davescj wrote:
ehaase wrote:
Delta has ordered 25 of these, but has only 7 747's to replace. I guess Delta has lots of new Asian routes planned.

They cancelled the 787s that NW had ordered. Also, DL has to start thinking about 767 replacement. I would expect both of those factors (as well as the retirement of 744) is all part of the plan.

To my understandig that is what the A339 order for 25 frames is for. A350 will be for tpac and the A339 for tatl to replace the oldest 763er in the fleet. Does anyone know the time line and numbers by year all the A350 deliveries are scheduled to occur with the deferment of 2018 deliveries to 2019-2020 time frame?

commavia · Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:59 pm

Delta's A350s look like they're going to be quite nice, and a solid offering for the long missions on which they'll no doubt ultimately be deployed. I, too, will be interested to see which routes - after any proving or familiarization runs - will see the A350 first. DTW and/or LAX transpacific seem like obvious choices given the stage lengths and competition.

DeSpringbokke · Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:34 pm

commavia wrote:
Delta's A350s look like they're going to be quite nice, and a solid offering for the long missions on which they'll no doubt ultimately be deployed. I, too, will be interested to see which routes - after any proving or familiarization runs - will see the A350 first. DTW and/or LAX transpacific seem like obvious choices given the stage lengths and competition.

My guess is four years from now, after all have been delivered assuming no deferments, the A350-900s will be primarily based out of DTW/LAX with some SEA/ATL flying. In the long run, its possible, may even be probable, SEA-Asia will be primarily operated on A330-900NEOs as the aircraft will be able to perform SEA-Asia without issue, with the possible exception of SEA-HKG. In the article announcing the order, Delta mentioned that in addition to Trans-Atlantic flying, the A330-900NEOs would operate West Coast-Asia, which effectively translates to SEA-Asia.

alfa164 · Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:22 pm

A330freak wrote:
It looks like they already have a simulator for the aircraft, as well as door trainers (or are in the process of accepting them).

Simulator:
https://twitter.com/A350fans/status/786129060250390529

Door Trainers
https://twitter.com/EDMLTD/status/795941124905041924
https://twitter.com/EDMLTD/status/806486715485585408

smi0006 wrote:
Does anyone have any photos of the cabin? I personally find the interior design fascinating whilst seats have been relaxed be interesting to see if the passport plum makes an appearance in the new cabins.

Any chance we could see LAX-SYD on this bird? Long enough route to justify the weight reduction from the 77L which range isn't really needed

DL last year revelaled a bit of info on the Business and Premium economy seats that'll be installed on the aircraft.

More in the following links (The first 2 are 360 degree images/graphics of what the business and premium economy cabins will look like)
https://www.facebook.com/delta/photos/a ... =3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/delta/photos/a ... =3&theater
http://news.delta.com/worlds-first-all- ... -delta-one
http://www.delta.com/content/www/en_US/ ... onomy.html

As a Sydneysider I do hope they'll put it on the LAX-SYD route. The following article says they will and it makes sense for them to do it, the bigger question is probably when.
https://www.ausbt.com.au/delta-eyes-syd ... me-flipper

I am surprised the "plum" accent color wasn't added somewhere in the interior of these new frames.

ZK-NBT · Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:48 pm

Cebo29 wrote:
Up to 12/26 LAX to SYD is a 777LR. Will see what happens when the January schedule comes out.

There's nothing to stop DL changing that though to have an A350 on it by say October, I'm Not saying that will happen but have they announced a single long haul A350 route yet officially? SYD has been mentioned elsewhere as a potential route.

Cebo29 · Mon Jan 30, 2017 2:10 am

Per the schedule until 12/26 it shows 77LR for LAX-SYD. We'll see when the January schedule comes. The A350 will be based in DTW when it arrives later this year. All subject to change as always.

hkcanadaexpat · Mon Jan 30, 2017 2:30 am

DeSpringbokke wrote:
In the long run, its possible, may even be probable, SEA-Asia will be primarily operated on A330-900NEOs as the aircraft will be able to perform SEA-Asia without issue, with the possible exception of SEA-HKG. In the article announcing the order, Delta mentioned that in addition to Trans-Atlantic flying, the A330-900NEOs would operate West Coast-Asia, which effectively translates to SEA-Asia.

I wouldn't be surprised in the least if the first A339 are based in SEA actually. The longest routes currently operated by the 763ERs are SEA-ICN/PEK/PVG (also operated on the shorter SEA-NRT/LHR segments). So if it would make a lot of sense in terms of costs savings to replace those 763 routes first (this is obviously a simplistic approach that doesn't account for the additional seat count on the A339 vs the B763 as well as other factors). The other long 763 sectors are SLC-CDG/LHR/AMS (though no frames are based on SLC, rather rotate through from the European bases) and East Coast-Africa (ACC/LOS) which is split between JFK/ATL.

gatibosgru · Mon Jan 30, 2017 2:39 am

intotheair wrote:
Will be interesting, too, to see whether the A350 supplants the A330 in most of DL's advertising.

I'm always so happy to see the A330 on their ads everywhere! It is probably, in my opinion, the most photogenic plane! I'm sure the A350 will look amazing as well, DL's marketing time definitely knows how to present their birds.

intotheair · Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:25 am

gatibosgru wrote:
intotheair wrote:
Will be interesting, too, to see whether the A350 supplants the A330 in most of DL's advertising.

I'm always so happy to see the A330 on their ads everywhere! It is probably, in my opinion, the most photogenic plane! I'm sure the A350 will look amazing as well, DL's marketing time definitely knows how to present their birds.

I agree! A few days ago on the street, I noticed another DL "Dream up, LA" ad with an A330 flying off into the sunset. It looked stunning!

LAX772LR · Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:31 am

MSPNWA wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
Hardly. DL's been flying Airbuses on 14hr+ flights for years now.
And since they weren't splashing down short of the destination.... they sound pretty "true" to me.

14 hours at less-than-full payload is not long-haul in the standard sense.

Considering that there is no "standard sense," nor any official source to determine what does, or does not, meet such a threshold.... let's just say:

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