Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
PlanesNTrains wrote:I'm surprised AS has already moved them to D in SEA. I'd think they'd want to squat on those B gates for awhile to keep DL from growing, but perhaps this was all pre-negotiated with the airport authority before?
wedgetail737 wrote:I wonder that when DL moves to T2/T3, will AS (assuming VX is already absorbed by then) will move to T5.
theSFOspotter wrote:AS is still in the A and VX in T2. No connection I'm pretty sure
PlanesNTrains wrote:I'm surprised AS has already moved them to D in SEA. I'd think they'd want to squat on those B gates for awhile to keep DL from growing, but perhaps this was all pre-negotiated with the airport authority before?
QXAS wrote:wedgetail737 wrote:I wonder that when DL moves to T2/T3, will AS (assuming VX is already absorbed by then) will move to T5.
Wouldn't AS remain at T6 and the used to be Virgin America operations joint the AS operations at T6? It would make more sense than AS moving its whole setup to another terminal.
SANFan wrote:I'm expecting AAG in SAN will soon move VX into T1W, where AS currently resides, using up to 7 of the 8 gates there.
ty97 wrote:QXAS wrote:wedgetail737 wrote:I wonder that when DL moves to T2/T3, will AS (assuming VX is already absorbed by then) will move to T5.
Wouldn't AS remain at T6 and the used to be Virgin America operations joint the AS operations at T6? It would make more sense than AS moving its whole setup to another terminal.
Yes, this is the plan at LAX, announced by LAWA last year as part of the much larger series of moves that will result in Delta taking over T2/T3. The first domino in those moves will be AA moving its 4 T6 gates to T5 late this month.
wedgetail737 wrote:ty97 wrote:QXAS wrote:Wouldn't AS remain at T6 and the used to be Virgin America operations joint the AS operations at T6? It would make more sense than AS moving its whole setup to another terminal.
Yes, this is the plan at LAX, announced by LAWA last year as part of the much larger series of moves that will result in Delta taking over T2/T3. The first domino in those moves will be AA moving its 4 T6 gates to T5 late this month.
Oh...ok. AS would have pretty much all of T6 to itself, except for Great Lakes, Mokulele and Copa.
ericm2031 wrote:AS needs to get out of the international terminal on SFO before any connection would happen, so probably nothing until T1 is finished
HeeseokKoo wrote:I thought SFO T2 is adding 15th gate and that would squeeze at least half of AS flights. But I don't know if the project is going on or not.
viewtopic.php?t=1341187
http://media.flysfo.com/media/sfo/Desig ... -07-16.pdf
N292UX wrote:Will AS be inheriting VX's A320s?
N292UX wrote:Will AS be inheriting VX's A320s?
HeeseokKoo wrote:I thought SFO T2 is adding 15th gate and that would squeeze at least half of AS flights. But I don't know if the project is going on or not.
viewtopic.php?t=1341187
http://media.flysfo.com/media/sfo/Desig ... -07-16.pdf
ty97 wrote:QXAS wrote:wedgetail737 wrote:I wonder that when DL moves to T2/T3, will AS (assuming VX is already absorbed by then) will move to T5.
Wouldn't AS remain at T6 and the used to be Virgin America operations joint the AS operations at T6? It would make more sense than AS moving its whole setup to another terminal.
Yes, this is the plan at LAX, announced by LAWA last year as part of the much larger series of moves that will result in Delta taking over T2/T3. The first domino in those moves will be AA moving its 4 T6 gates to T5 late this month.
EA CO AS wrote:N292UX wrote:Will AS be inheriting VX's A320s?
Yes, but it remains to be seen if they will be kept in the long term.
atypical wrote:ericm2031 wrote:AS needs to get out of the international terminal on SFO before any connection would happen, so probably nothing until T1 is finished
That's around 2022 just to get back the number of B gates demolished and 2024 for the remainder. I think they will integrate long before then.HeeseokKoo wrote:I thought SFO T2 is adding 15th gate and that would squeeze at least half of AS flights. But I don't know if the project is going on or not.
viewtopic.php?t=1341187
http://media.flysfo.com/media/sfo/Desig ... -07-16.pdf
That's a 5 year plan. To squeeze another gate out is going to require at least 1 gate to be modified (unless it is on the terminal building itself) so it would need to be closed during construction. That won't probably happen at least until the first new B gates open and they can somewhat relieve the pressure. Doing this anytime soon (assuming a gate closure in the interim) would cause worse disruptions. I also think AS has a couple periods where they have AC at 3 gates. 16 flights a day around a 14 hour period is two gates easy and is too tight at VX gates for all flights to remain. Some will be dropped and some rebanked.
blacksoviet wrote:EA CO AS wrote:N292UX wrote:Will AS be inheriting VX's A320s?
Yes, but it remains to be seen if they will be kept in the long term.
Are the A320s older than the 734s?
blacksoviet wrote:EA CO AS wrote:N292UX wrote:Will AS be inheriting VX's A320s?
Yes, but it remains to be seen if they will be kept in the long term.
Are the A320s older than the 734s?
blacksoviet wrote:What replaced the Concourse B gates that have already been demolished? What will replace the rest of the B gates currently being used by WN?
anonms wrote:blacksoviet wrote:What replaced the Concourse B gates that have already been demolished? What will replace the rest of the B gates currently being used by WN?
The already-demolished gates haven't been replaced; airlines have been displaced mostly to IT-A (US was moved to T1C). Once the new T1B has been built and the gates on the eastern side are activated, then the old T1B currently being used by WN will be torn down so that the western side of the new concourse can be finished.
EA CO AS wrote:blacksoviet wrote:EA CO AS wrote:
Yes, but it remains to be seen if they will be kept in the long term.
Are the A320s older than the 734s?
No. Since their launch in 2007, VX has only leased new Airbus equipment, to my knowledge.
Skycondition wrote:EA CO AS wrote:blacksoviet wrote:Are the A320s older than the 734s?
No. Since their launch in 2007, VX has only leased new Airbus equipment, to my knowledge.
Not quite.
Four are used from Jazeera Airways (tails 639, 640, 641 and 642. Fun fact: The exit window placards still show arabic instructions.
In addition, tails 521 and 522 (A319's) and tail 623 (A320) were subleased to Skybus and TAM before VX got their wings.
The average fleet age is 6.8 years. The 319's average 9.3 and the 320's average 6.4 years.
blacksoviet wrote:ty97 wrote:QXAS wrote:Wouldn't AS remain at T6 and the used to be Virgin America operations joint the AS operations at T6? It would make more sense than AS moving its whole setup to another terminal.
Yes, this is the plan at LAX, announced by LAWA last year as part of the much larger series of moves that will result in Delta taking over T2/T3. The first domino in those moves will be AA moving its 4 T6 gates to T5 late this month.
Will UA ever get any of the gates in T6 back? Right now, UA needs 1-2 additional mainline gates at LAX. Aircraft are being held for too long. T7 doesn't have enough gates. Why did UA give up all of their CO gates?
ty97 wrote:blacksoviet wrote:ty97 wrote:
Yes, this is the plan at LAX, announced by LAWA last year as part of the much larger series of moves that will result in Delta taking over T2/T3. The first domino in those moves will be AA moving its 4 T6 gates to T5 late this month.
Will UA ever get any of the gates in T6 back? Right now, UA needs 1-2 additional mainline gates at LAX. Aircraft are being held for too long. T7 doesn't have enough gates. Why did UA give up all of their CO gates?
My understanding was that UA had subleased the T6 gates to AA but did not give them up formally. However, the huge terminal move going on right now appears to involve a completely new set of gate lease agreements with LAWA. Not sure if UA is in that discussion at all but my gut (which is sometimes wrong) says that UA is out of T6 for good.
ty97 wrote:blacksoviet wrote:ty97 wrote:
Yes, this is the plan at LAX, announced by LAWA last year as part of the much larger series of moves that will result in Delta taking over T2/T3. The first domino in those moves will be AA moving its 4 T6 gates to T5 late this month.
Will UA ever get any of the gates in T6 back? Right now, UA needs 1-2 additional mainline gates at LAX. Aircraft are being held for too long. T7 doesn't have enough gates. Why did UA give up all of their CO gates?
My understanding was that UA had subleased the T6 gates to AA but did not give them up formally. However, the huge terminal move going on right now appears to involve a completely new set of gate lease agreements with LAWA. Not sure if UA is in that discussion at all but my gut (which is sometimes wrong) says that UA is out of T6 for good.
SFOtoORD wrote:ty97 wrote:blacksoviet wrote:Will UA ever get any of the gates in T6 back? Right now, UA needs 1-2 additional mainline gates at LAX. Aircraft are being held for too long. T7 doesn't have enough gates. Why did UA give up all of their CO gates?
My understanding was that UA had subleased the T6 gates to AA but did not give them up formally. However, the huge terminal move going on right now appears to involve a completely new set of gate lease agreements with LAWA. Not sure if UA is in that discussion at all but my gut (which is sometimes wrong) says that UA is out of T6 for good.
IIRC UAs lease on the T6 gates ended at the same time their sublease to AA ended which basically means UA won't be taking them back.
NameOmitted wrote:AS is releasing photos of their new SEA lounge in for Concourse C. The article is a bunch of publicity stills, but what made it worth sharing was, as the author points out, there is absolutely no attempt to integrate anything VX into this space. Given that this is a flagship space, and given that we are still doing a certain amount of tea-leaf reading as to the merger, that makes this worth sharing.
https://loungereview.com/first-look-alaska-lounge-seattle-tacoma-airport-concourse-c/
EA CO AS wrote:N292UX wrote:Will AS be inheriting VX's A320s?
Yes, but it remains to be seen if they will be kept in the long term.
NameOmitted wrote:AS is releasing photos of their new SEA lounge in for Concourse C. The article is a bunch of publicity stills, but what made it worth sharing was, as the author points out, there is absolutely no attempt to integrate anything VX into this space.
DocLightning wrote:EA CO AS wrote:N292UX wrote:Will AS be inheriting VX's A320s?
Yes, but it remains to be seen if they will be kept in the long term.
AS really needs the lift. Certainly, they could obtain one-for-one 738 replacements for the A320s but at what cost? Even if the airframes can be had inexpensively or be traded one-for-one for the A320, it still costs money to rebrand the interiors, update all the maintenance stuff, bring them up to AS fleet standard, etc.
Given that VX already has an A320 maintenance program and a fleet of 65+ frames now, there's already an economy of scale to continue to operate that fleet. In the long term, AS will probably want to settle back into a single supplier, but the A320s are young, they are efficient, they are popular with passengers, and they're perfectly good.
DocLightning wrote:Even if the airframes can be had inexpensively or be traded one-for-one for the A320, it still costs money to rebrand the interiors, update all the maintenance stuff, bring them up to AS fleet standard, etc.
EA CO AS wrote:NameOmitted wrote:AS is releasing photos of their new SEA lounge in for Concourse C. The article is a bunch of publicity stills, but what made it worth sharing was, as the author points out, there is absolutely no attempt to integrate anything VX into this space.
Which is intentional, since the VX brand won't be surviving.
SFOtoORD wrote:EA CO AS wrote:NameOmitted wrote:AS is releasing photos of their new SEA lounge in for Concourse C. The article is a bunch of publicity stills, but what made it worth sharing was, as the author points out, there is absolutely no attempt to integrate anything VX into this space.
Which is intentional, since the VX brand won't be surviving.
That wasn't his point and you knew that. AS has tried to portray that they'll bring some of the best of VX to AS, but that clearly isn't the case and brings strange joy to many AS proponents.
usxguy wrote:I guess Alaska should bring in:
-> Seatback IFE that doesn't always work
-> Seats that seem to have a high failure rate
-> 100% Buy on Board
-> Changing Premium Cabin to mirror Virgin - only a few select rows and are typically 50% to 100% more than the cost of a Y ticket
-> Charge for each and every movie you want to watch
-> Reduce the size of the galley space so FAs barely have room to breathe
-> Reduce the size of the lavatories so the passengers can't even do a #2
did I forget anything?
hiflyeras wrote:usxguy wrote:I guess Alaska should bring in:
-> Seatback IFE that doesn't always work
-> Seats that seem to have a high failure rate
-> 100% Buy on Board
-> Changing Premium Cabin to mirror Virgin - only a few select rows and are typically 50% to 100% more than the cost of a Y ticket
-> Charge for each and every movie you want to watch
-> Reduce the size of the galley space so FAs barely have room to breathe
-> Reduce the size of the lavatories so the passengers can't even do a #2
did I forget anything?
LOL love it! And grumpy FA's from having to answer the seatback ordering system instead of a cart service. Praying that AS does not adopt this system.
JayWings wrote:hiflyeras wrote:usxguy wrote:I guess Alaska should bring in:
-> Seatback IFE that doesn't always work
-> Seats that seem to have a high failure rate
-> 100% Buy on Board
-> Changing Premium Cabin to mirror Virgin - only a few select rows and are typically 50% to 100% more than the cost of a Y ticket
-> Charge for each and every movie you want to watch
-> Reduce the size of the galley space so FAs barely have room to breathe
-> Reduce the size of the lavatories so the passengers can't even do a #2
did I forget anything?
LOL love it! And grumpy FA's from having to answer the seatback ordering system instead of a cart service. Praying that AS does not adopt this system.
That makes two of us... rumor is they are looking for ways but I hope not!
wedgetail737 wrote:NameOmitted wrote:AS is releasing photos of their new SEA lounge in for Concourse C. The article is a bunch of publicity stills, but what made it worth sharing was, as the author points out, there is absolutely no attempt to integrate anything VX into this space. Given that this is a flagship space, and given that we are still doing a certain amount of tea-leaf reading as to the merger, that makes this worth sharing.
https://loungereview.com/first-look-alaska-lounge-seattle-tacoma-airport-concourse-c/
First of all, why would AS include VX aspects in their lounge at Concourse C. VX operates out of Concourse D. Secondly, SEA has always been primarily AS. VX has hardly an existence at SEA...even with upcoming service to DAL. Lastly, VX will be fully integrated in to AS by 2019, at which there will no longer be a VX brand.
usxguy wrote:VX had a GREAT product 7 years ago. *7 years* that's allowed other airlines to meet the VX product, or beat it.
The VX employee pages are full of a lot of complaints - and have been for the past 3 years. That's nothing Alaska can fix until VX is gone, unfortunately. Including the bad VX apples in mgt that caused a lot of the discourse.
Alaska is NO Singapore/Emirates, but they're certainly not the "ValuJet" some portray it to be. I thought the C club was very well done, I like the "newness" of it and I do thank VX for that - Alaska has been more ballsy and open with marketing & trends than before. Seems like yesterday everyone was complaining about the lack of prayer cards in F.... And I'll gladly take AS 41" seat pitch in F over DL/AA/UA anyday. That's a lot more roomier, add in foot rests and its on a touch above AA (which I think has the best F seat in a 737 for domestic)