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Devilfish
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:56 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
Unidentified Customer 8 x 777-300/ER (15 Mar)

carlokiii wrote:
I have a feeling this is an order from a South East Asian carrier.

:wideeyed: Might these include the 77Ws that 5J was rumored (around that time) to be launching their nonstop TPAC flights to SFO and LAX with :?: Eight frames seem too many for them -- four sounds more reasonable to start. But they haven't even begun their planned HNL route...do their services to SYD, MEL and the ME nearly qualify them for EDTO to the western seaboard...and with the 77W at that :!: Perhaps the A339 couldn't make the distance (granting revised specs) profitably with 5J's usual configuration... :crowded: ...while the A359 would be on the quite expensive side. :scratchchin:
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
Varsity1
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:22 pm

Devilfish wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
Unidentified Customer 8 x 777-300/ER (15 Mar)

carlokiii wrote:
I have a feeling this is an order from a South East Asian carrier.

:wideeyed: Might these include the 77Ws that 5J was rumored (around that time) to be launching their nonstop TPAC flights to SFO and LAX with :?: Eight frames seem too many for them -- four sounds more reasonable to start. But they haven't even begun their planned HNL route...do their services to SYD, MEL and the ME nearly qualify them for EDTO to the western seaboard...and with the 77W at that :!: Perhaps the A339 couldn't make the distance (granting revised specs) profitably with 5J's usual configuration... :crowded: ...while the A359 would be on the quite expensive side. :scratchchin:


I don't think so, but if it is we will see a 550 seat 777.
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Someone83
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jun 30, 2017 7:58 am

 
Jayafe
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jun 30, 2017 8:03 am

Someone83 wrote:


One step closer to be bought by Ryanair. Massive 7M8 + growing 789 fleet would be a killing combination.
 
pabloeing
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jun 30, 2017 8:07 am

With this order.....UX have 26 B787's in the future fleet
 
Momo1435
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jun 30, 2017 12:53 pm

Nice new customer for the 787. It shows that the 787-9 remains very popular on the leasing front this year with a good number of orders and lease placements.
 
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Polot
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jun 30, 2017 12:59 pm

With how quiet widebodies orders have been in the first half of this year (and how quiet it was expected to remain for the rest of the year) the 787 has had a good past couple of weeks. 56 firm orders (assuming the BOC order is firm) since Paris plus I believe there are about 17 MOUs announced at the airshow but not firmed.
 
pabloeing
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jun 30, 2017 1:55 pm

One Question in the new UX B787-9 order from BOC...the Airline said that in the future the fleet will be of 24 B787's.....but now have 8 B787-8 and have 14 B787-9 in order.....with this 4 more....26.....but UX spokeman said 24......¿Who is wrong?
 
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BobMUC
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:32 am

News are just coming in on German online sources:
"China Aviation Supplies Holding Company" (CAS) has signed a contract with Airbus about 140 aircraft: 100 A320 family + 40 A350.
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:33 am

China buys 100 A320s and 40 A350s:

China Aviation Supplies Holding Company (CAS) has signed with Airbus a General Terms Agreement (GTA) for the purchase of a total of 140 aircraft. The agreement comprises of 100 A320 Family aircraft and 40 A350 XWB Family aircraft, reflecting the strong demand of Chinese airlines in all market segments including domestic, low cost, regional and international long haul.


http://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-re ... irbus.html
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Wed Jul 05, 2017 4:16 pm

Big A350 order.
-Dave
 
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A330freak
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:00 pm

Have there been any undisclosed 747-8Fs recently?

because


The Doha-based airline also recently ordered two Boeing 747-8 freighters, al-Baker said.


http://www.reuters.com/article/qatar-ai ... SD5N1GY01O
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:06 pm

Are they referring to the BBJ perhaps?

As reported in the 747 production thread, a second 747-8i BBJ has been acquired.

Image
A7-HHE, Boeing 747-8KB, 37544 / 1439, Qatar Amiri Flight, CDG/LFPG, 2016-02-16 by Alain Durand, on Flickr
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
Momo1435
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:16 pm

I don't think it's on the books yet. The 737 MAX order (20x) that Al Baker said he had firmed up in Paris is also not yet firm on Boeing's books.

Boeing should announce their monthly numbers in a couple of hours, maybe these 2 orders will be included in this update.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:47 pm

KarelXWB wrote:
Are they referring to the BBJ perhaps?


Maybe, but I'm sure even U-turn Al knows the difference between a BBJ and a freighter. :duck:

I guess they could easily be leased or contracted in from another operator?
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
chiki
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 06, 2017 2:36 pm

KarelXWB wrote:
Are they referring to the BBJ perhaps?

As reported in the 747 production thread, a second 747-8i BBJ has been acquired.

Image
A7-HHE, Boeing 747-8KB, 37544 / 1439, Qatar Amiri Flight, CDG/LFPG, 2016-02-16 by Alain Durand, on Flickr

i thinkits to replace the leased 747 400BCF
 
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qf789
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 07, 2017 7:42 am

Airbus June Orders

138 new orders
Yemenia - Yemen Airways 4x A320neo (converted from A320ceo)
Cebu Pacific 7 x A321ceo
Hifly 2 x A330-200
GECAS 100 x A320neo
Delta 10 x A321ceo
Vueling 3 x A320ceo
ALC 12 x A321neo

cancellation of 4 x A350-900 - Qatar
Forum Moderator
 
Momo1435
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 07, 2017 6:59 pm

Boeing update:

Changes since last update: 31 new orders (Aviation Capital Group for 20 737s, BOC Aviation for four 787s and Unidentified Customer(s) for seven 737s). In the changes category, reduced 737 orders by seven and 787 orders by four. Identified Monarch Airlines for five 737s previously listed as unidentified.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries


The BOC Aviation order for 4 787s is an order transfer from Air Europa, the 4 cancellations are them. The ACG order is the 737-10 order from the Paris Airshow booked on 30-Jun-2017.

It's also confirmed that the unidentified order for 19 787's were for the 787-10. Any doubt that it's not Singapore Airlines is not needed anymore.

The net total for the 1st half year = 381
 
mffoda
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Sun Jul 09, 2017 2:50 pm

From NYT...

Boeing Selected for $294 Million Deal With Algeria's Tassel Airlines (3 x 737-800's)

https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2017/07 ... oeing.html
harder than woodpecker lips...
 
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qf789
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 13, 2017 3:42 pm

Boeing Weekly Update

No new orders. In the changes category, reduced 747 orders by three.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries
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Polot
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 13, 2017 3:45 pm

qf789 wrote:
No new orders. In the changes category, reduced 747 orders by three.

Probably the remainder of Transaero's order.
 
anshabhi
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 13, 2017 3:57 pm

Polot wrote:
qf789 wrote:
No new orders. In the changes category, reduced 747 orders by three.

Probably the remainder of Transaero's order.

B748 is officially futureless now.
 
starrion
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 13, 2017 4:13 pm

anshabhi wrote:
Polot wrote:
qf789 wrote:
No new orders. In the changes category, reduced 747 orders by three.

Probably the remainder of Transaero's order.

B748 is officially futureless now.


It's future is cargo which is what it was originally intended for. The real question is if there is enough 400F and 400BCFs aging out to maintain a production line.
Knowledge Replaces Fear
 
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Stitch
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 13, 2017 4:13 pm

anshabhi wrote:
Polot wrote:
qf789 wrote:
No new orders. In the changes category, reduced 747 orders by three.

Probably the remainder of Transaero's order.

B748 is officially futureless now.


Well there will be two orders for the VC-25 replacement, but that's realistically it.
 
Geoff1947
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 13, 2017 4:50 pm

anshabhi wrote:
Polot wrote:
qf789 wrote:
No new orders. In the changes category, reduced 747 orders by three.

Probably the remainder of Transaero's order.

B748 is officially futureless now.


Yes two of the passenger version in the unfilled orderbook now. One for KE ready for delivery in the next few weeks the other presumed to be a BBJ that has already been built.

Geoff
 
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Stitch
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:25 pm

Geoff1947 wrote:
Yes two of the passenger version in the unfilled orderbook now. One for KE ready for delivery in the next few weeks the other presumed to be a BBJ that has already been built.


Per the 747-8 Production Thread, the BBJ is LN 1495 for Qatar Amiri flight.
 
MileHFL400
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:19 pm

6 new orders added for Boeing this week. 4 777 current gen's and 2 B747's. any guesses?
Thanks and best Regards
AA
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:24 pm

MileHFL400 wrote:
6 new orders added for Boeing this week. 4 777 current gen's and 2 B747's. any guesses?



777s could be UA's order from Paris and the 747s could be UPS.
 
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Boeing778X
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:38 pm

anshabhi wrote:
Polot wrote:
qf789 wrote:
No new orders. In the changes category, reduced 747 orders by three.

Probably the remainder of Transaero's order.

B748 is officially futureless now.


At least as far as PAX models are concerned.
United Airlines: $#!ttin' On Everyone Since 1931
 
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Polot
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:38 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
MileHFL400 wrote:
6 new orders added for Boeing this week. 4 777 current gen's and 2 B747's. any guesses?



777s could be UA's order from Paris and the 747s could be UPS.

UA's 77W order from Paris was firmed that week and is already in the books.
 
fcogafa
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:51 pm

Are these the 2 B748F's for Qatar as mentioned recently? Maybe Aeroflot for the B777s?
 
Arion640
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:43 pm

Have I missed something but who are the 30 unidentified 777 orders for?
319 320 321 346 388 733 744 752 753 763 772 77E 773 77W 788 E175 E195 F70 DH8C DH8D AT75
 
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Stitch
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:43 pm

Arion640 wrote:
Have I missed something but who are the 30 unidentified 777 orders for?


20 of them are known to be 777-9's for Singapore Airlines.
 
Arion640
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:46 pm

Stitch wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Have I missed something but who are the 30 unidentified 777 orders for?


20 of them are known to be 777-9's for Singapore Airlines.


Thought so, knew I read it somewhere.
319 320 321 346 388 733 744 752 753 763 772 77E 773 77W 788 E175 E195 F70 DH8C DH8D AT75
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:49 pm

Polot wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
MileHFL400 wrote:
6 new orders added for Boeing this week. 4 777 current gen's and 2 B747's. any guesses?



777s could be UA's order from Paris and the 747s could be UPS.

UA's 77W order from Paris was firmed that week and is already in the books.


Hm, wonder who It's for.
 
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AviationAddict
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:31 am

Rumor on the UA thread is they are expected to place a second 4 frame order sometime this year so it could still be UA.
 
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gennadius
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:19 am

ikolkyo wrote:
MileHFL400 wrote:
6 new orders added for Boeing this week. 4 777 current gen's and 2 B747's. any guesses?



777s could be UA's order from Paris and the 747s could be UPS.


The two 747s are likely the -8Fs that Akbar al-Baker said they were going to order a couple of weeks ago.
Per ardua, ad astra
 
mjoelnir
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:50 am

starrion wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
Polot wrote:
Probably the remainder of Transaero's order.

B748 is officially futureless now.


It's future is cargo which is what it was originally intended for. The real question is if there is enough 400F and 400BCFs aging out to maintain a production line.


Promoting a myth, the main sales were supposed too be the 747-8i.
 
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VirginFlyer
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:01 am

mjoelnir wrote:
starrion wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
B748 is officially futureless now.


It's future is cargo which is what it was originally intended for. The real question is if there is enough 400F and 400BCFs aging out to maintain a production line.


Promoting a myth, the main sales were supposed too be the 747-8i.

Without wanting to indulge the usual suspects in their A vs B urination contests, but is that in fact the case? The -8F was the one developed first which always had me assuming it was the primary variant. Are there any sources which can be cited which show what Boeing's thinking was at the time of launching the 747-8?

V/F
It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens.

Celebrating the Bicentenary of the Birth of Bahá'u'lláh, 21-22 October 2017
 
mjoelnir
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:41 am

VirginFlyer wrote:
mjoelnir wrote:
starrion wrote:

It's future is cargo which is what it was originally intended for. The real question is if there is enough 400F and 400BCFs aging out to maintain a production line.


Promoting a myth, the main sales were supposed too be the 747-8i.

Without wanting to indulge the usual suspects in their A vs B urination contests, but is that in fact the case? The -8F was the one developed first which always had me assuming it was the primary variant. Are there any sources which can be cited which show what Boeing's thinking was at the time of launching the 747-8?

V/F


747-8F and 747-8 Intercontinental were designed together. Both were launched at the same time in November 2005. The changes between the 747-400 passenger version and the 747-8i are that extensive that Boeing hardly imagined a handful of sold frames. I can not be bothered to dig it up, but there are somewhere out there on the internet the sales expectations for the 747-8.
 
David_itl
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:52 am

viewtopic.php?t=385061 contains this

"In contrast with Airbus's predicted market, Boeing foresees sales of only 900 aircraft carrying 450 passengers or more, and expects to capture half those sales with the 747-8. Randy J. Tinseth, Boeing Commercial Airplanes' director of marketing and product analysis, expects 60% of BCA's 747-8 sales to come in passenger aircraft, the remaining 40% from freighters."
 
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VirginFlyer
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:27 am

David_itl wrote:
http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=385061 contains this

"In contrast with Airbus's predicted market, Boeing foresees sales of only 900 aircraft carrying 450 passengers or more, and expects to capture half those sales with the 747-8. Randy J. Tinseth, Boeing Commercial Airplanes' director of marketing and product analysis, expects 60% of BCA's 747-8 sales to come in passenger aircraft, the remaining 40% from freighters."

There we go then :-)

So they were expecting to sell 450, of which 180 would be -8Fs, and 270 -8Is. Currently sales stand at 86 and 48 respectively. Interesting.

V/F
It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens.

Celebrating the Bicentenary of the Birth of Bahá'u'lláh, 21-22 October 2017
 
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Stitch
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 2:04 pm

VirginFlyer wrote:
So they were expecting to sell 450, of which 180 would be -8Fs, and 270 -8Is. Currently sales stand at 86 and 48 respectively. Interesting.


Both Boeing and Airbus significantly over-estimated the number of VLAs they would each sell, as well as the total market.
 
StTim
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 2:34 pm

VirginFlyer wrote:
David_itl wrote:
http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=385061 contains this

"In contrast with Airbus's predicted market, Boeing foresees sales of only 900 aircraft carrying 450 passengers or more, and expects to capture half those sales with the 747-8. Randy J. Tinseth, Boeing Commercial Airplanes' director of marketing and product analysis, expects 60% of BCA's 747-8 sales to come in passenger aircraft, the remaining 40% from freighters."

There we go then :-)

So they were expecting to sell 450, of which 180 would be -8Fs, and 270 -8Is. Currently sales stand at 86 and 48 respectively. Interesting.

V/F



I think the market estimate of 900 was for passenger frames. So Boeing was estimating 450 -8I's

As Stitch neatly points out - both Airbus and Boeing overestimated the market for VLA's.
 
starrion
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:14 pm

StTim wrote:
VirginFlyer wrote:
David_itl wrote:
http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=385061 contains this

"In contrast with Airbus's predicted market, Boeing foresees sales of only 900 aircraft carrying 450 passengers or more, and expects to capture half those sales with the 747-8. Randy J. Tinseth, Boeing Commercial Airplanes' director of marketing and product analysis, expects 60% of BCA's 747-8 sales to come in passenger aircraft, the remaining 40% from freighters."

There we go then :-)

So they were expecting to sell 450, of which 180 would be -8Fs, and 270 -8Is. Currently sales stand at 86 and 48 respectively. Interesting.

V/F



I think the market estimate of 900 was for passenger frames. So Boeing was estimating 450 -8I's

As Stitch neatly points out - both Airbus and Boeing overestimated the market for VLA's.


And that is only the last overestimate. At one point Airbus thought there might be sales for up to 1500 VLA between 2000-2020.

In reality there has only been 457 VLA orders for both the A380 and the 748. Less than half of the estimate, and a third of the estimate the A380 was launched on. Hard to predict the utter collapse of the four engine market, but hopefully the billions wasted on these two programs will force a deeper look at the assumptions that analysts use to make these predictions.
Knowledge Replaces Fear
 
starrion
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:16 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
starrion wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
B748 is officially futureless now.


It's future is cargo which is what it was originally intended for. The real question is if there is enough 400F and 400BCFs aging out to maintain a production line.


Promoting a myth, the main sales were supposed too be the 747-8i.


I was actually referring to the fact that when originally designed, the 747 was intended to be a cargo aircraft.
Knowledge Replaces Fear
 
olle
Posts: 765
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:38 am

Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 5:15 pm

It seems that Airbus and Boeing has overestimated Widebody market in general.

777x is supposed to be produced 10 per month.

A350 10 per month

787 14 per month

A330 6-7 per month....

How long time will this work?
 
Planeflyer
Posts: 720
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2014 3:49 am

Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 5:34 pm

I still can't understand why B launched either. Their mistake was not nearly as costly as that made on the 380 but it was dumber. Nothing worse than missing a putt after seeing the line.

Think how much faster the 787 issues could have been resolved if they weren't wasting their resources on the 8.
 
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SamYeager2016
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 5:45 pm

Perhaps we could return this thread to its original purpose and discuss 747 orders or the lack of them elsewhere?
 
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Stitch
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Re: Airbus And Boeing 2017 Orders

Fri Jul 21, 2017 6:52 pm

Planeflyer wrote:
Think how much faster the 787 issues could have been resolved if they weren't wasting their resources on the 8.


The opposite happened - Boeing re-assigned engineering resources from the 747-8 program to get the 787 program back on track, which resulted in significant delays to the 747-8. Boeing ended up hiring Russian and Japanese contract engineers to get the 747-8 program back on track.
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