Stitch, did not know that. Even worse! The 380 and 747 have to be among the worst product development fiascos in world corporate history.

Planeflyer wrote:

I still can't understand why B launched either. Their mistake was not nearly as costly as that made on the 380 but it was dumber. Nothing worse than missing a putt after seeing the line.

Think how much faster the 787 issues could have been resolved if they weren't wasting their resources on the 8.

Boeing probably thought that as the 747 had sold well for so many years, many airlines would re order to replace the current -400 fleet. Which isn't the case.

747 was developed as a freighter because they thought SST was the way forward.

Forgot we were on the orders thread. Rant over.

Three more A330-200s for Level:

http://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-re ... level.html

KarelXWB wrote:

Three more A330-200s for Level:

http://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-re ... level.html

That doesnt detail if these are new orders, or they are again re assigning the IB deliveries, same they did with the previous ones. Meanwhile, a decrepit A340 keeps flying MAD-JFK....

That is going to hit IB results, just hope they dont do the same with the A359s expected for 2018 in MAD.

As another article claims:

The carrier’s parent company International Airlines Group (IAG) has confirmed it is converting three options for the aircraft into firm orders, for delivery in summer 2018.

https://www.businesstraveller.com/busin ... aft-order/

Summary of Airbus orders up to end of June

AIRBUS

Orders
Aercap 1 x A320ceo
AirAsia 3 x A320ceo
Air France 3 x A350-900
ALC 12 x A321neo
BOC Aviation 2 x A320ceo
CALC 9 x A320ceo, 2 x A320neo
Cebu Pacific 7 x A321ceo
China Southern 20 x A350-900
Delta Airlines 40 x A321ceo
GECAS 100 x A320neo
HiFly 2 x A330-200
Iberia 1 x A330-200
K Air Airlines 8 x A320ceo
Nile Air 2 x A321neo
Spirit Airlines 2 x A320ceo
Undisclosed 3 x A319ceo (13 March)
Undisclosed 3 x A319ceo (10 April)
Undisclosed 10 X A350-900 (28 April)
Undisclosed 5 x A320ceo (2 May)
Undisclosed 4 x A320neo {3 May)
VivaAerobus 1 x A320ceo
Vueling 3 x A320ceo
Yemenia – Yemen Airways 4 x A320neo

Gross 248
Cancellations 45
Net 203

Cancellations/Changes
Air France 2 x A388 (converted to 3 x A359)
Avianca 5 x A319neo (converted to 5 x A320ceo)
CALC 6 x A320neo (converted to A320ceo)
Nile Air 2 x A321ceo (converted to A321neo)
Qatar Airways 4 x A350-900
Spirit Airlines 2 x A320neo (converted to A320ceo)
Transasia 6 x A321neos, 4 x A338
Undisclosed 4 x A320neo (April)
Undisclosed 2 x A320neo (April)
Undisclosed 5 x A320neo (May – converted to A320ceo)
Undisclosed 4 x A320ceo (May – converted to A320neo)
Yemenia – Yemen Airways 4 x A320ceo (converted to A320neo)

Boeing summary up to end of June

BOEING

Orders
AerCap 30 x 787-9
Arik Air 2 x 787-9
Australia P-8 4 X 737-800A
Aviation Capital Group 20 x 737MAX
BDS USAF Tanker Program 15 x 767-2C
BOC Aviation 4 x 787-9
Boeing Business Jet 1 x 737MAX, 2 X 737BBJ, 2 x 737BBJ2
CALC 50 x 737MAX
EL Al 2 x 787-8, 1 x 787-9
Fedex 1 x 777F
Indian Navy P-8 4 x 737-800A
Monarch Airlines 5 x 737MAX
Norwegian 2 x 737MAX
Primera Air 8 x 737 MAX
Ryanair 10 x 737MAX
SMBC Aviation Capital 3 x 737-800
Tassilli Airlines 3 x 737-800
UK P-8 2 x 737-800A
Unidentified Customer 9 X 737MAX (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 1 x 737MAX (15 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 13 x 737MAX (21 Mar) – BOC Aviation
Unidentified Customer 30 x 737MAX (25 Mar) – CDB Aviation
Unidentified Customer 41 x 737MAX (31 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 3 x 737MAX (28 Apr)
Unidentified Customer 15 x 737MAX (16 Jun)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737MAX (27 Jun)
Unidentified Customer 2 x 737-800 (23 Jan)
Unidentified Customer 3 x 737-800 (14 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737-800 (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 10 x 737-800 (21 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 4 x 737-800 (22 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 4 x 737-800 (28 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737-800 (31 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 10 x 737-900/ER (14 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 1 x 747-8 (2 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 8 x 777-300/ER (15 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 20 x 777X (19 Jun)
Unidentified Customer 4 x 787-8 (29 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 5 x 787-9 (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 2 x 787-9 (17 Apr)
Unidentified Customer 19 x 787-10 (21 Jun)
United Airlines 4 x 777-300/ER
United States Navy 11 x 737-800A
Westjet 10 x 787-9

Gross 438
Cancellations 57
Net 381

Cancellations/Changes
Air Europa 4 x 787 (converted to BOC Aviation)
Arik Air 2 x 748 (converted into 2 x 787-9)
Transaero 1 x 748
Nippon Cargo 2 x 748F
Unidentified Customer 9 x 737 (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 1 x 737 (23 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 13 x 737 (30 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 3 x 737 (30 April)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737 (27 Jun) possible conversion to 737MAX
Westjet 15 x 737

Boeing Weekly Update

Two new orders (Business Jet / VIP Customer(s) for one 737 and Unidentified Customer(s) for one 787). Identified flydubai for one 737 previously listed as unidentified.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries

The order for 10 x A350-900s listed as Unidentified has been announced as Ethiopian.

Southwest has deferred its final 4 737-800 options and converted to 737MAX8, 2 in 2021 and 2 in 2022

https://worldairlinenews.com/2017/07/28 ... 8-options/

Boeing, BOC Aviation Finalize Order for 10 737 MAX 10s

http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2017-08-03- ... 37-MAX-10s

No Boeing update, July numbers will be released in a week's time

ALC har ordered 2 additional A330-900neo.
Page163-164 here:

http://redirect.viglink.com/?format=go& ... DNXdhSEE...

Airbus books 4 aircraft for July

Undisclosed 1 x A350-1000
IAG 3 x A330-200

Cancellations

2 x A321neo

I wonder who the lone A350K order is for?

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articl ... ly-440018/

Air Lease Corporation Finalize Order for 12 737 MAXs:

http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2017-08-08- ... 2-737-MAXs

KarelXWB wrote:

Air Lease Corporation Finalize Order for 12 737 MAXs:

http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2017-08-08- ... 2-737-MAXs

Also added two 787-9s. I checked back and those are new - they weren't announced at Paris. Lessors are pretty strong for the 787-9s and frankly widebodies in general right now.

Devilfish wrote:

I wonder who the lone A350K order is for?

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articl ... ly-440018/

ACJ maybe?

LA704 wrote:

Devilfish wrote:

I wonder who the lone A350K order is for?

ACJ maybe?

Or a leasing company. VS had a lease option which they may have taken up and this is the replacement, maybe.

JerseyFlyer wrote:

LA704 wrote:

Devilfish wrote:

I wonder who the lone A350K order is for?

ACJ maybe?

Or a leasing company. VS had a lease option which they may have taken up and this is the replacement, maybe.

Or converting an option of some sort?

Or IAG for BA? They might have placed the order along with the level a330s but may not want to reveal it as yet?

I don't see why and how IAG could place a secret order. That stuff needs board approval and as a public company we would likely know about it.

It is not a "secret" order... It has happened in the past where a company has placed a ufo only to reveal it to the markets at the appropriate time...

qf789 wrote:

Cancellations

2 x A321neo

ICBC. See here: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... je-440037/

Hamlet69

Devilfish wrote:

I wonder who the lone A350K order is for?

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articl ... ly-440018/

My hunch (and that's all it is) is VS. While BA makes sense on the surface as they just finished renegotiating their delivery positions, and such contract changes often see other changes (new orders, model switches, etc.), BA does not usually go down the 'Unidentified' route. VS, on the other hand, has recent history doing just such a thing with 789 top-ups.

I might also throw Etihad out there as a wild-card, too.

Regards,

Hamlet69

Wonder how long it will take to firm the 748's for AF1.

starrion wrote:

Wonder how long it will take to firm the 748's for AF1.

From the USAF and Boeing press releases it sounds like the contract has been signed so I would guess tomorrow with the Thursday Update.

http://m.atwonline.com/leasing/air-leas ... 87-9-order

2 new 787-9s were ordered by Air Lease Corp.

Boeing weekly update

14 new orders (Air Lease Corporation for 12 737s and two 787s).

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/index. ... deliveries

rotating14 wrote:

http://m.atwonline.com/leasing/air-lease-corp-finalizes-737-max-787-9-order

2 new 787-9s were ordered by Air Lease Corp.

KLM?

No KLM is switching another 787-9 for a dash 10 so they will get 8 instead of 7 dash 10.s..They need more capacity..
Source: Up in the sky.nl

Two notes from the latest Boeing update:

- In addition to the Blue Air and Mauritania UFO's disclosed at Paris, Ethiopian has been revealed as a purchaser of x10 more 737 MAX's from last year. This brings their total MAX orders to 30.

- QR would appear to be behind the latest UFO order for x4 77W's. Booked the same day as the UFO x2 748F order, which is believed for QR. Also matches the same number of A350's cancelled by QR in June.

Regards,

Hamlet69

Miquel787 wrote:

No KLM is switching another 787-9 for a dash 10 so they will get 8 instead of 7 dash 10.s..They need more capacity..
Source: Up in the sky.nl

ALC might have taken the open delivery slot from the KLM conversion. One of the 2 new ALC orders is with GE engines and switched back 1 of their previous orders to no engine selection. One of their existing customer could get one earlier then planned.

I find it interesting that even though their most recent deals have all been for the 787-9 they still decided not to convert their open -10 orders to the -9.

Hamlet69 wrote:

- QR would appear to be behind the latest UFO order for x4 77W's. Booked the same day as the UFO x2 748F order, which is believed for QR. Also matches the same number of A350's cancelled by QR in June.

Regards,

Hamlet69

Looks like they used A350 delivery delays to ditch four frames without financial penalties and replace them directly with four 77Ws, of which they already have a large fleet. Simply up-sizing, or reducing capital expenditure?

Hamlet69 wrote:

QR would appear to be behind the latest UFO order for x4 77W's. Booked the same day as the UFO x2 748F order, which is believed for QR. Also matches the same number of A350's cancelled by QR in June.

JerseyFlyer wrote:

Looks like they used A350 delivery delays to ditch four frames without financial penalties and replace them directly with four 77Ws, of which they already have a large fleet. Simply up-sizing, or reducing capital expenditure?

Considering QR was the major launch customer for the A350 and Airbus in RFPs was matching the "cheap" prices Boeing was charging for the 787 at the time, even with the 777-300ER's current "end of life" discounts, I would not be surprised if QR paid as much, if not more, for their four 777-300ERs then they would have for those four A350-900s.

With what appears to be QR's subsequent reversal on their cancellation (via the intervention of the Qatari Emir and PM), this looks like they're adding capacity. Which may imply they feel that their current issues with their neighbors on overflights may soon be over.

Boeing Summary up to end of July

BOEING

Orders
AerCap 30 x 787-9
ALC 12 x 737MAX, 2 x 787-9
Arik Air 2 x 787-9
Australia P-8 4 X 737-800A
Aviation Capital Group 20 x 737MAX
BDS USAF Tanker Program 15 x 767-2C
BOC Aviation 4 x 787-9
Boeing Business Jet 2 x 737MAX, 2 X 737BBJ, 2 x 737BBJ2
CALC 50 x 737MAX
EL Al 2 x 787-8, 1 x 787-9
Fedex 1 x 777F
Indian Navy P-8 4 x 737-800A
Monarch Airlines 5 x 737MAX
Norwegian 2 x 737MAX
Primera Air 8 x 737 MAX
Ryanair 10 x 737MAX
SMBC Aviation Capital 3 x 737-800
Tassilli Airlines 3 x 737-800
UK P-8 2 x 737-800A
Unidentified Customer 9 X 737MAX (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 13 x 737MAX (21 Mar) – BOC Aviation
Unidentified Customer 30 x 737MAX (25 Mar) – CDB Aviation
Unidentified Customer 41 x 737MAX (31 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 3 x 737MAX (28 Apr)
Unidentified Customer 15 x 737MAX (16 Jun)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737MAX (27 Jun)
Unidentified Customer 2 x 737-800 (23 Jan)
Unidentified Customer 3 x 737-800 (14 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737-800 (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 10 x 737-800 (21 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 4 x 737-800 (22 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 4 x 737-800 (28 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737-800 (31 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 10 x 737-900/ER (14 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 1 x 747-8 (2 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 2 x 747-8F (16 Jul) - Qatar
Unidentified Customer 8 x 777-300/ER (15 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 4 x 777-300/ER (16 July) - Qatar
Unidentified Customer 20 x 777X (19 Jun)
Unidentified Customer 4 x 787-8 (29 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 1 x 787-8 (25 Jul)
Unidentified Customer 5 x 787-9 (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 2 x 787-9 (17 Apr)
Unidentified Customer 19 x 787-10 (21 Jun)
United Airlines 4 x 777-300/ER
United States Navy 11 x 737-800A
Westjet 10 x 787-9

Gross 460
Cancellations 60
Net 400

Cancellations/Changes
Air Europa 4 x 787 (converted to BOC Aviation)
Arik Air 2 x 748 (converted into 2 x 787-9)
Transaero 4 x 748
Nippon Cargo 2 x 748F
Unidentified Customer 9 x 737 (16 Feb)
Unidentified Customer 1 x 737 (23 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 13 x 737 (30 Mar)
Unidentified Customer 3 x 737 (30 April)
Unidentified Customer 7 x 737 (27 Jun) possible conversion to 737MAX
Westjet 15 x 737

Boeing Weekly Update

14 new orders (BOC Aviation for ten 737s and Unidentified Customer(s) for four 737s).

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries

Kish Air signs MoU for 10 x B737MAX

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... 20s-jadidi

Cathay Pacific has signed a MoU with Airbus for 32 A321neo.

From Reuters:
"Aug 21 (Reuters) - Cathay Pacific Airways Ltd 0293.HK

Entered into a non-binding memorandum of understanding with Airbus S.A.S​‍
Memorandum of understanding in relation to acquisition of 32 Airbus A321- 200neo aircraft from Airbus S.A.S​
Airbus aircraft are intended to be operated mainly by Cathay Dragon
Price of the Airbus aircraft in aggregate is about us$4,064 million"

Here's the official announcement:

https://www.cathaypacific.com/cx/en_AU/ ... craft.html

Cathay Dragon has signed a memorandum of understanding (MOU), preparatory to executing formal legal documentation, for the acquisition of 32 Airbus A321neo aircraft. The MOU, signed today between the Cathay Pacific Group and Airbus in Toulouse, France, is valued at approximately HK$31.7 billion at current list prices. It is intended to see Cathay Dragon’s single-aisle fleet replaced and expanded from 2020.

The new aircraft, which are scheduled to be delivered between 2020 and 2023, are intended to replace Cathay Dragon’s existing single-aisle fleet of 23 aircraft, comprising 15 Airbus A320s and eight Airbus A321s.

Boeing Weekly Update

10 new orders (Japan Investment Adviser Co., Ltd. for ten 737s).

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries

Boeing Weekly Update

Seven new orders (SunExpress Airlines for seven 737s). In the changes category, reduced 737 orders by seven.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries

qf789 wrote:

Boeing Weekly Update

Seven new orders (SunExpress Airlines for seven 737s). In the changes category, reduced 737 orders by seven.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries

Is this an NG to MAX conversion?

Someone83 wrote:

qf789 wrote:

Boeing Weekly Update

Seven new orders (SunExpress Airlines for seven 737s). In the changes category, reduced 737 orders by seven.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries

Is this an NG to MAX conversion?

Looks like it. As of the end of July SunExpress had 32 unfilled 737 orders with 25 737 Max already on order, meaning 7 737NGs were left to be delivered. Looks they they switched those last 7 to the MAX.

Airbus books 12 orders for August

10 A321ceo Wizz Air
1 A320neo Frontier
1 ACJ319neo undisclosed

Boeing Weekly Update

2 747's

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/#/orders-deliveries

Must be USAF.

seabosdca wrote:

Must be USAF.

Or perhaps Qatar Airways.

seabosdca wrote:

Must be USAF.

Would USAF be unidentified?