qf789
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Qantas announces non-stop PER-LHR flights

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:05 am

Qantas and the operators of Perth Airport are poised to strike a deal within days to allow the first non-stop flights from Australia to Europe through the airline’s domestic terminal.

With Qantas boss Alan Joyce set to fly to WA tomorrow to make an announcement alongside airport chiefs and Premier Colin Barnett, it is understood the airline and Perth Airport are close to finalising the landmark agreement.


https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/wa/a/ ... ngs/#page1

First flights have previously been reported to start in April 2018
Last edited by qf789 on Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: updated title
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Miami
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:06 am

Very interesting news. I like it. But can you make a profit out of it?
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
Milesdependent
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:23 am

Hopefully the flights will start out at SYD to allow SYD-PER on the 788. Would definitely give that a go.

However: I wonder if they will target people out of SYD and MEL with these services, or is it better to keep these folks on QF1/9, and target PER and ADL where existing traffic is pretty much all going EK. They could charge a premium ex PER perhaps, but not likely ex ADL.
 
Gemuser
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:42 am

Milesdependent wrote:
Hopefully the flights will start out at SYD to allow SYD-PER on the 788. Would definitely give that a go.

However: I wonder if they will target people out of SYD and MEL with these services, or is it better to keep these folks on QF1/9, and target PER and ADL where existing traffic is pretty much all going EK. They could charge a premium ex PER perhaps, but not likely ex ADL.

Actually if they are to target any east coast city IMHO it will be BNE as BNE does not have a direct link to DXB on QF metal only code shares. So a B789 operating BNE-PER-LHR-PER-BNE-LAX-JFK-LAX-BNE would seem reasonable.

Gemuser
 
KrustyTheKlown
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:50 am

Will the flight be all business class or will people withstand 16+ hours in a 787's economy class seat?
 
waoz1
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:52 am

Be interesting to see if its just PER-LHR
 
kaitak
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:53 am

Well, QF has already announced its planned 789 configuration and its a three class (J/W/Y), with nine abreast in Economy. I don't think I could stick eighteen hours on a plane, let alone in Economy. Still, glad they've reached agreement with PER and I hope it's a big success for them!
 
redadeco
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:54 am

Gemuser wrote:
Milesdependent wrote:
Hopefully the flights will start out at SYD to allow SYD-PER on the 788. Would definitely give that a go.

However: I wonder if they will target people out of SYD and MEL with these services, or is it better to keep these folks on QF1/9, and target PER and ADL where existing traffic is pretty much all going EK. They could charge a premium ex PER perhaps, but not likely ex ADL.

Actually if they are to target any east coast city IMHO it will be BNE as BNE does not have a direct link to DXB on QF metal only code shares. So a B789 operating BNE-PER-LHR-PER-BNE-LAX-JFK-LAX-BNE would seem reasonable.

Gemuser


Far from reasonable, BNE-PER is 5h30, add it to the expected 18 hours minimum for PER-LHR and you end up spending 24 hours in the air.

When going through the Gulf it's roughly 21-22hrs total, and transiting through AUH/DXB is a far superior experience than PER.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:58 am

Can't see any other announcement than PER-LHR occurring really.

Any future services are likely to be rolled out over time.

KrustyTheKlown wrote:
Will the flight be all business class or will people withstand 16+ hours in a 787's economy class seat?


The 789 configuration will be premium heavy but there will still be a significant Y class component.

It needs to be lower density to ensure the ULH routes can be achieved.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:05 am

redadeco wrote:
Gemuser wrote:
Milesdependent wrote:
Hopefully the flights will start out at SYD to allow SYD-PER on the 788. Would definitely give that a go.

However: I wonder if they will target people out of SYD and MEL with these services, or is it better to keep these folks on QF1/9, and target PER and ADL where existing traffic is pretty much all going EK. They could charge a premium ex PER perhaps, but not likely ex ADL.

Actually if they are to target any east coast city IMHO it will be BNE as BNE does not have a direct link to DXB on QF metal only code shares. So a B789 operating BNE-PER-LHR-PER-BNE-LAX-JFK-LAX-BNE would seem reasonable.

Gemuser


Far from reasonable, BNE-PER is 5h30, add it to the expected 18 hours minimum for PER-LHR and you end up spending 24 hours in the air.

When going through the Gulf it's roughly 21-22hrs total, and transiting through AUH/DXB is a far superior experience than PER.


Many other Asian and Gulf hubs offer far more advantages in time and connectivity advantages than PER does.

At the end of the day, SIN/HKG/DXB/AUH/DOH offer a vastly superior network that can feed their services and a more bearable flight time to endure such a journey.
 
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mariner
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:06 am

qf789 wrote:
Qantas and the operators of Perth Airport are poised to strike a deal within days to allow the first non-stop flights from Australia to Europe through the airline’s domestic terminal.

With Qantas boss Alan Joyce set to fly to WA tomorrow to make an announcement alongside airport chiefs and Premier Colin Barnett, it is understood the airline and Perth Airport are close to finalising the landmark agreement.


Let's hope this isn't a case of the media jumping the gun - again. Image

mariner
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:10 am

KrustyTheKlown wrote:
Will the flight be all business class or will people withstand 16+ hours in a 787's economy class seat?


Well, if you fly for example BOG-IST on TK, you also have to "withstand" 16 hours in an economy class seat, although on a A332. So, nothing new there...
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:10 am

mariner wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Qantas and the operators of Perth Airport are poised to strike a deal within days to allow the first non-stop flights from Australia to Europe through the airline’s domestic terminal.

With Qantas boss Alan Joyce set to fly to WA tomorrow to make an announcement alongside airport chiefs and Premier Colin Barnett, it is understood the airline and Perth Airport are close to finalising the landmark agreement.


Let's hope this isn't a case of the media jumping the gun - again. Image

mariner


You mean like the Perth media stating that Japan Airlines was close to announcing PER-NRT daily a year ago? Journalists ever get things wrong.... haha
 
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RL777
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:17 am

Regardless of how the flight will do profitability and operational is yet to be seen, however this is an exciting time! Its seemingly been ages that the topic of London-Australia nonstop has been discussed on here and now its finally coming to fruition. I'm assuming it'll be operated in the same configuration that has been announced for their 789s ? If so would mean cargo capacity will be irrelevant.
 
ZK-NBT
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 6:50 am

LHR-OZ has been talked about a lot recently however this seems like the best chance for it to start. Same config as announced or else they would have announced something else. Some of the other proposed routes are pretty long MEL-DFW, SYD-ORD, SYD-JFK, they won't all happen with the first 8 frames I don't think.
 
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:10 am

This has a potential to be a very profitable route for them, a direct flight, premium heavy cabin and utilising the 789 should see plenty of patronage with good operating costs and high yield.
They will have 32" pitch in economy, but at standard nine abreast such a long flight might not be to everyone's taste...
I suspect they will arrange timings so that ADL-PER and DRW-PER flights connect in as well.
 
smi0006
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:19 am

I hope we see a big QF announcement - PER-LHR with details around airport facilitation - (what will they do for the lounge?) a US route and a reveal of their 789 premium economy.
 
smi0006
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:20 am

smi0006 wrote:
I hope we see a big QF announcement - PER-LHR with details around airport facilitation - (what will they do for the lounge? Old VA space would be free in T4 could be done up as a small but high end business zone, kitchen would already be present and could be done post customs) a US route and a reveal of their 789 premium economy.
 
rta
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:38 am

Its great that we have the technology to do flights like these, but that is personally way too long of a flight for me to sit through.
 
downdata
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:52 am

Well you never know... maybe Perth's growing population can sustain a 3 weekly... id rather go through a hub in SIN/HKG/DXB/middle of ocean then PER unless QF discounts the fares to say... $2000 return in J
 
Gemuser
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 8:01 am

LionelHutz wrote:
This has a potential to be a very profitable route for them, a direct flight, premium heavy cabin and utilising the 789 should see plenty of patronage with good operating costs and high yield.
They will have 32" pitch in economy, but at standard nine abreast such a long flight might not be to everyone's taste...
I suspect they will arrange timings so that ADL-PER and DRW-PER flights connect in as well.

Sorry I just don't see it! Its an ULH flight, with all that implies for costs, even lumping PER, DRW & ADL together it's not a great market.It does not appeal to East Coasts passengers because it about 2 hours longer to LHR, has lousey connections to Europe and has an 18 hour sector length v a14 hour one.

IMHO it will live or die on PER/ADL/DRW O&D traffic and I think that market is not big enough, without substantial East Coast connecting traffic, which I have doubts it'll get. Still QF people are not idiots [I hope] so they must think it work, at least for awhile. I hope it does work.

Gemuser
 
KaiTak747
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 8:10 am

To make a flight of this length work the yields will have to be very high, but somehow I don't think they will be able to achieve the desired yields. I also question the premium of flying non stop on a flight of this length, I for one would take a stopover somewhere any day.

There are so many options form AUS-UK/Europe on EK, EY, QR, TG,MH ,SQ, CX, that I I really don't think the market for a PER-LHR non-stop is there.

Regardless it would nice to see Qantas make a success of this flight.
 
OMAAbound
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 8:42 am

It'll never Happen Personally, looking at pax comfort people will soon decided a stop in the ME would be significantly better.

For example, we're going LHR-SYD for arguments sake, LHR-PER 18 hours, 90 minute connection in PER, then PER-SYD 3 hours.

Or you could route through the ME with 6 hours to Dubai, then 13 hours down to Sydney.

IF it happens, and I say that with a big IF, it certainly won't last long.

OMAA
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rebr
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:31 am

OMAAbound wrote:
For example, we're going LHR-SYD for arguments sake, LHR-PER 18 hours, 90 minute connection in PER, then PER-SYD 3 hours.

Or you could route through the ME with 6 hours to Dubai, then 13 hours down to Sydney.


Maybe I am missing something but I fail to see how people calculate flight times here. LHR-PER-SYD is 150 miles longer then LHR-DXB-SYD, surely that doesn't add more then 2 hours of flying?
I personally think this 18 hours is a bit exaggerated. The currently longest flight DXB-AKL is 200nm shorter then LHR-PER, and does this on average in just above 15 hours. Admitted the return leg takes a while longer, but the same goes for DXB-SYD, SYD-DXB takes significantly longer then DXB-SYD.

I hope this will happen. To me the "too long" argument doesn't hold. If I have to fly PER-LHR, I'd prefer a directly flight over PER-...anything...-LHR. In the end you have to sit almost the same amount of time inside a tube, and I might as well get it over and done with in one go. Now connecting in PER would be less desirably of course :)
 
smi0006
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:36 am

I think it's too easy to generalise and say people prefer stop overs - 8 hate them. They disrupt my sleep, and my ability be comfortable. How long is decent, landing, transit, take off, climb? - no thank you. I want to get onboard plan mysleep and movies. Separating a journey makes that second so hard.
 
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Heavierthanair
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:06 am

G'day

A little bird with good connections to the upper echelons at Qantas tells me that for reliability reasons this flight will be operated by Douglas Commercial Model 3 aircraft (AKA the DC3) equipped with external auxiliary fuel tanks and capable of air to air refueling. :wave:

Seriously, I doubt people will be willing to part with considerable extra money required to make that flight pay for itself. That flight is at the limit of the 787 performance with related higher costs and likely reduced payload. I don't see that coming as yet :crazy:

Cheers

Peter
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CARST
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:15 am

What's up with all of you? That flight LHR-PER might be in the ultra-long-haul category, but as long as oil stays cheap these flights are here to stay and even more routes will be started. LHR-PER is just a tad longer than DXB-AKL. On February, 6th QR will start DOH-AKL, which will be even longer and blocked at 17 hours.

Image
Credit to http://www.gcmap.com

And saying these flights are too long just seems not right. People flying longhaul frequently get annoyed by "too short" longhaul flights which don't give you enough time to sleep. Your usual longhaul 9 hour flight has a one hour climb and one hour descent phase. Then you have one or two meal services. You might end up with 5 hours of useable time to sleep. But because sleeping on an aircraft isn't that easy for many people, the real time will be even shorter.
So flights in the 14-17 hour category will be much better for the bio-rythm of the human body, then stopping somewhere inbetween. You can relax, have two full meal services (instead of a meal and a small snack), you will have 8 hours of sleep and even can watch movie. Of course Y shouldn't be configured as tight as on regular, shorter longhaul-flights. But I say, there might be people avoiding such a long flight, but there will be more people paying a premium to get on the non-stop service. Even people from SYD and MEL, who don't want to transfer in Dubai at 3 o'clock in the night...

Good luck QF!
 
qf789
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:57 am

KaiTak747 wrote:
There are so many options form AUS-UK/Europe on EK, EY, QR, TG,MH ,SQ, CX,


This is one reason why QF is going to operate a PER-LHR route. The QF CEO said only about 6 weeks ago that their current operation is a challenge due to the number of competitors on that market and a PER-LHR non-stop would improve QF's operation into LHR

Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce says a nonstop service between Perth and London would lead to the airline having an improved operation into the UK capital.

“But I have to say, London is a challenge because you have over 30 carriers operating on that market and we have extremely low airfares,” Joyce said.

“That’s one of the reasons we are considering an operation like Perth-London.

“If we can make it work out of Perth that is a way of actually having a very good operation we believe into London.”


http://australianaviation.com.au/2016/1 ... challenge/
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redroo
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 12:09 pm

The current QF1 takes 25:05 hours door to door.

A 5hr flight to Perth, a 2 hour layout and an 18 hour flight to London still brings you in under 25:05

DXB introduced a long layout in the desert in the middle of the night. BKK used to be 90 mins. We can gain back some of that time in PER and give qantas a point of difference to the other 30 carriers on the kangaroo route. Bring it on!!
 
ozglobal
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 12:56 pm

I can make no sense of this at all, other than for marketing buzz. I do Eu - Oz twice a year at least for the last 15 years in a row. Non-stop is only beneficial if it is "non-stop". PER certainly doesn't have the market to sustain the traffic daily non-stop, so it will be topped up from SYD, MEL and BNE. But in that case, for those passengers, tell me, what is the point??? One stop is one stop and DXB or HKG or SIN make much more sense. I call this marketing. Will probably be once or twice weekly then quietly die after the buzz has been created.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
usflyer123
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 1:36 pm

i know that LHR-PER market has tremendous size of VFR traffic, but does it also have a large business traffic?
for most people the sky is the limit. for those who love aviation, the sky is home...
 
airbazar
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 1:38 pm

CARST wrote:
What's up with all of you? That flight LHR-PER might be in the ultra-long-haul category, but as long as oil stays cheap these flights are here to stay and even more routes will be started. LHR-PER is just a tad longer than DXB-AKL. On February, 6th QR will start DOH-AKL, which will be even longer and blocked at 17 hours.

I agree entirely. ULH is here to stay as long as fuel doesn't go up too much.
JNB-ATL 16+ hours
AKL-DXB 17+
SFO-SIN 17+
QR is about to introduce DOH-AKL and DOH-SCL. Plus countless 15+ routes. The flying public has spoken. They don't mind spending 16 hours on a plane as long as it is for the right price. An extra hour is not going to make a huge difference.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 1:46 pm

airbazar wrote:
CARST wrote:
What's up with all of you? That flight LHR-PER might be in the ultra-long-haul category, but as long as oil stays cheap these flights are here to stay and even more routes will be started. LHR-PER is just a tad longer than DXB-AKL. On February, 6th QR will start DOH-AKL, which will be even longer and blocked at 17 hours.

I agree entirely. ULH is here to stay as long as fuel doesn't go up too much.
JNB-ATL 16+ hours
AKL-DXB 17+
SFO-SIN 17+
QR is about to introduce DOH-AKL and DOH-SCL. Plus countless 15+ routes. The flying public has spoken. They don't mind spending 16 hours on a plane as long as it is for the right price. An extra hour is not going to make a huge difference.


The last part is where things become harder in ULH flights.

Qantas are going with a lower density cabin configuration to achieve the range which actually makes it important to gain a fare premium.

The lower yield traffic will likely still be funneled through DXB, along with any pax heading for other European destinations, so the non-stop will need to gain enough that are willing to pay higher fares to make this work.

Things change quickly in aviation and there are many factors that will make or break this strategy. We will see what transpires.
 
AngMoh
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 1:58 pm

airbazar wrote:
I agree entirely. ULH is here to stay as long as fuel doesn't go up too much.
JNB-ATL 16+ hours
AKL-DXB 17+
SFO-SIN 17+
QR is about to introduce DOH-AKL and DOH-SCL. Plus countless 15+ routes. The flying public has spoken. They don't mind spending 16 hours on a plane as long as it is for the right price. An extra hour is not going to make a huge difference.


"They don't mind spending 16 hours on a plane as long as it is for the right price." This is for me the key question. Unless you live in Perth, you don't save any time. And then it will be more expensive. I just don't get this one. The other ones listed above eliminate a stop, but SYD/MEL/BNE/ADL-PER-LHR just moves a stop to a location which is worse than the previous one.

For cost purposes, the optimum stop is half way, and the closest viable location to the half way point is DBX. That is why QF signed up to partner with EK.
727 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 742 743 744 752 762 772 773 77W 789 A300 A310 A319 A320 A321 A332 A333 A343 A345 A346 A359 A388 DC-9 DC-10 MD11 MD81 MD82 MD87 F70 ERJ145 E175 E190 E195 ATR72 CRJ200 CRJ700 CRJ900 BAE146 RJ85
 
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LionelHutz
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 2:14 pm

Gemuser wrote:
LionelHutz wrote:
This has a potential to be a very profitable route for them, a direct flight, premium heavy cabin and utilising the 789 should see plenty of patronage with good operating costs and high yield.
They will have 32" pitch in economy, but at standard nine abreast such a long flight might not be to everyone's taste...
I suspect they will arrange timings so that ADL-PER and DRW-PER flights connect in as well.

Sorry I just don't see it! Its an ULH flight, with all that implies for costs, even lumping PER, DRW & ADL together it's not a great market.It does not appeal to East Coasts passengers because it about 2 hours longer to LHR, has lousey connections to Europe and has an 18 hour sector length v a14 hour one.

IMHO it will live or die on PER/ADL/DRW O&D traffic and I think that market is not big enough, without substantial East Coast connecting traffic, which I have doubts it'll get. Still QF people are not idiots [I hope] so they must think it work, at least for awhile. I hope it does work.

Gemuser


Well PER+ADL+DRW provide about 3.5m to draw on (not that all ADL/DRW will go via PER) so I remain hopeful that will be enough ;)
 
qf002
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 2:35 pm

AngMoh wrote:
For cost purposes, the optimum stop is half way, and the closest viable location to the half way point is DBX. That is why QF signed up to partner with EK.


The ME hubs are actually just about the worst stopover points by this measure. DXB splits SYD-LHR into 6500nm and 3000nm sectors and adds substantially to the great circle distance. BKK or HKG both split SYD-LHR into 5200nm and 4000nm sectors and are both pretty much right on the great circle distance.

QF partnered with EK for many reasons but the length of the two sectors was not one of them.
 
belfordrocks
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:03 pm

LionelHutz wrote:
Gemuser wrote:
LionelHutz wrote:
This has a potential to be a very profitable route for them, a direct flight, premium heavy cabin and utilising the 789 should see plenty of patronage with good operating costs and high yield.
They will have 32" pitch in economy, but at standard nine abreast such a long flight might not be to everyone's taste...
I suspect they will arrange timings so that ADL-PER and DRW-PER flights connect in as well.

Sorry I just don't see it! Its an ULH flight, with all that implies for costs, even lumping PER, DRW & ADL together it's not a great market.It does not appeal to East Coasts passengers because it about 2 hours longer to LHR, has lousey connections to Europe and has an 18 hour sector length v a14 hour one.

IMHO it will live or die on PER/ADL/DRW O&D traffic and I think that market is not big enough, without substantial East Coast connecting traffic, which I have doubts it'll get. Still QF people are not idiots [I hope] so they must think it work, at least for awhile. I hope it does work.

Gemuser


Well PER+ADL+DRW provide about 3.5m to draw on (not that all ADL/DRW will go via PER) so I remain hopeful that will be enough ;)


Doesn't ADL already have convenient one stops via DXB/SIN/KUL and DRW via SIN/KUL? I wish QF luck with PER-LHR but can't see this being fruitful. Karratha/Broome/regional Western Australia will add a handful of connecting passengers a day at most.
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ahj2000
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Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:10 pm

Remember they really only need 230 pax to fill these flights. They aren't sending an A380 over. I'm sure it'll be a "niche" flight but capturing 180 of those Y pax shouldn't be that difficult considering how large the Kangaroo is.
-Andrés Juánez
 
anshabhi
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Re: Qantas set to announce in stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:16 pm

Still 300 miles shorter than AI's DEL-SFO (9400 miles) yet 2 hours longer!!
Last edited by anshabhi on Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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anshabhi
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Re:

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:20 pm

ahj2000 wrote:
Remember they really only need 230 pax to fill these flights. They aren't sending an A380 over. I'm sure it'll be a "niche" flight but capturing 180 of those Y pax shouldn't be that difficult considering how large the Kangaroo is.

Their population is 23 million (2%) of that of India and population density is 2.3 /km^2. Sure by area, it's huge!
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AussieCanuck92
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:36 pm

Wonder if it's possible that after the initial experiment with this route whether Qantas could have later 789s delivered in a 2-4-2 format in Y. Could help in payload restrictions and offer a better product, set themselves apart in a way.
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scbriml
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:40 pm

qf002 wrote:
DXB splits SYD-LHR into 6500nm and 3000nm sectors and adds substantially to the great circle distance.


Substantially? The difference is less than 300nm. On a journey of nearly 9,200nm minimum, that's not a substantial difference, IMHO.
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LionelHutz
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:58 pm

belfordrocks wrote:
Doesn't ADL already have convenient one stops via DXB/SIN/KUL and DRW via SIN/KUL? I wish QF luck with PER-LHR but can't see this being fruitful. Karratha/Broome/regional Western Australia will add a handful of connecting passengers a day at most.


DRW, like regional WA, would only add a handful, but probably win out over SIN & KUL as those flights have horrid early morning departures :cry:
ADL might be a tougher sell, but should add a few...

ahj2000 wrote:
Remember they really only need 230 pax to fill these flights. They aren't sending an A380 over. I'm sure it'll be a "niche" flight but capturing 180 of those Y pax shouldn't be that difficult considering how large the Kangaroo is.


This is my contention, it should not be an unachievable ask in terms of bums on seats (those EY & QR flights out of PER must already be taking quite a few pax heading to the UK).
 
qf002
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:15 pm

scbriml wrote:
Substantially? The difference is less than 300nm. On a journey of nearly 9,200nm minimum, that's not a substantial difference, IMHO.


Yes, I would say a 3.1% difference is quite substantial, especially if you are talking about routing flights in the most efficient way possible.
 
Andy33
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:36 pm

Does anyone know where the LHR slot for this flight would come from?
 
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Rajahdhani
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:36 pm

qf789 wrote:
KaiTak747 wrote:
There are so many options form AUS-UK/Europe on EK, EY, QR, TG,MH ,SQ, CX,


This is one reason why QF is going to operate a PER-LHR route. The QF CEO said only about 6 weeks ago that their current operation is a challenge due to the number of competitors on that market and a PER-LHR non-stop would improve QF's operation into LHR

Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce says a nonstop service between Perth and London would lead to the airline having an improved operation into the UK capital.

“But I have to say, London is a challenge because you have over 30 carriers operating on that market and we have extremely low airfares,” Joyce said.

“That’s one of the reasons we are considering an operation like Perth-London.

“If we can make it work out of Perth that is a way of actually having a very good operation we believe into London.”


http://australianaviation.com.au/2016/1 ... challenge/


...and to add, the QF/EK partnership is going to show its weight here. With that tie-in, QF should now build upon that and focus on high-yield if/when it can. It's a smart move, and hopefully - a profitable one.
 
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:41 pm

Andy33 wrote:
Does anyone know where the LHR slot for this flight would come from?


QF have 2 slot pairs which are currently leased to BA
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Rajahdhani
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:55 pm

AngMoh wrote:
"They don't mind spending 16 hours on a plane as long as it is for the right price." This is for me the key question. Unless you live in Perth, you don't save any time. And then it will be more expensive. I just don't get this one. The other ones listed above eliminate a stop, but SYD/MEL/BNE/ADL-PER-LHR just moves a stop to a location which is worse than the previous one.

For cost purposes, the optimum stop is half way, and the closest viable location to the half way point is DBX. That is why QF signed up to partner with EK.


So, put the cost-conscious passengers/part of your operation - on that route.

They are attempting to create a response to a (perhaps perceived) premium demand, and finally have the aircraft with which to conceivably do it (at a time and within a relationship where) they can do just that. There is the LHR bound pressure to innovate and/or expand to other destinations, as the competitive pressures mount (and already exist).

One way, to increase yield is to move the LHR slot to a less competitive environment (confident in the fact that any 'surrendered' capacity will essentially be picked up by partner EK, who too is under pressure to improve yields) - and what better than PER?
 
rutankrd
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:57 pm

Andy33 wrote:
Does anyone know where the LHR slot for this flight would come from?


Those leased to BA in all likely hood
 
Andy33
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Re: Qantas set to announce non-stop PER-LHR flights within days

Sat Dec 10, 2016 6:12 pm

rutankrd wrote:
Those leased to BA in all likely hood


That makes sense, and BA aren't at all short of their own slots these days so it won't do them much damage.
Slot times would be interesting, mainly in terms of connectivity at both ends of the new QF service, but also in terms of which BA flights need to be provided with alternative slots

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