http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... o-phoenix/

Your thoughts on this?

I doubt it. The EK route map probably isn't the greatest source as FLL has already been announced and is not currently listed on the route map.

Not a chance, both are served via their partnership with B6

I don't believe they fly to Detroit, maybe its an error and they meant Detroit considering on a map it inst that far off? Buffalo doesn't seem remotely possible even with the distance to Canada. Phoenix on the other hand isnt that crazy IMO.

I can see PHX but BUF? Even with feed from Canada I don't see them being able to fill a 777!

0% chance of BUF, and while they might start PHX eventually, I doubt it'll be for at least another 5 years.

Putting aside the timing question, can anything in EK's fleet do PHX-DXB reliably in the summer? It's about the same distance as JNB-ATL, which does not always make it nonstop. JNB is higher, but PHX is hotter.

Cubsrule wrote:

Putting aside the timing question, can anything in EK's fleet do PHX-DXB reliably in the summer? It's about the same distance as JNB-ATL, which does not always make it nonstop. JNB is higher, but PHX is hotter.

The A380 might. 4 engines are always better for hot/high. Maybe a one stop via Europe?

The chances of BUF in my books are pretty high, reminds me of when somebody said they'd start svc to FAR. Not so far fetched now, is it!

Perhaps they are following G4's footsteps and serving Niagara Falls Int'l and Phoenix Gateway in the future with Plattsburgh and Bellingham to follow.

Coronado990 wrote:

Perhaps they are following G4's footsteps and serving Niagara Falls Int'l and Phoenix Gateway in the future with Plattsburgh and Bellingham to follow.

I was just wondering about the possibility of Bellingham, definitely a smart move to grab YVR traffic! And Plattsburgh would be smart for YUL, now even tiny airports can claim they are truly Int'l

This person does have a great track record with MidEast rumors.

8/4/2016 Rumor: Emirates Airline To Buy A Controlling Stake In Qatar Airways
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... -takeover/

2/19/2014
Rumor: Turkish To Wet Lease A380s
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... ase-a380s/

10/25/2016
AA to add AUH
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... abu-dhabi/

1/21/2015
Royal Air Maroc to join Star Alliance
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... -alliance/

I can see Phoenix happening sometime in the long term future, maybe five or so years down the road.

On the other hand for Buffalo, stop making April Fools jokes so far away from April Fools Day!

Adding Buffalo as a destination for Emirates? Yah, and also add remote Alaska.

Buffalo? ! What's Next? Macon? Peoria? My money is on Knoxville - TYS

I think EK certainly has better destinations to offer before they offer Phoenix. That being said, if EK did add Phoenix, the timings would be sub-par as it would likely have to depart between 14:00 and 17:00 (assuming the connectivity is wanted to match the existing connectivity from other US West Coast markets) which are the hotter parts of the day.

reasonable wrote:

BUF? Why wouldn't they just serve DTW by the same reasoning + inherently stronger market to the ME and India?

If EK were going to make such a move, it would not just generally be to serve "Canada," but rather to serve the Golden Horseshoe (Toronto area) specifically. That is significantly closer to BUF than to DTW.

alasizon wrote:

I think EK certainly has better destinations to offer before they offer Phoenix. That being said, if EK did add Phoenix, the timings would be sub-par as it would likely have to depart between 14:00 and 17:00 (assuming the connectivity is wanted to match the existing connectivity from other US West Coast markets) which are the hotter parts of the day.

Not necessarily. EK could scheduled it's departure at 9am to catch the early morning inbound flights from the West Coast and Mountain Time zone traffic. (Seattle has a 9am flight starting later this month) or they could do what BA did when they started PHX with the DC-10 depart 2230-2300 hrs.

Back in 2010 then Mayor Phil Gordon did travel to Dubai in an effort to get EK to fly to PHX. http://archive.azcentral.com/arizonarep ... ights.html

On a good day, high season, BUF-DXB can fill a G550. Is it a rumor that EK is buying them?

910A wrote:

alasizon wrote:

I think EK certainly has better destinations to offer before they offer Phoenix. That being said, if EK did add Phoenix, the timings would be sub-par as it would likely have to depart between 14:00 and 17:00 (assuming the connectivity is wanted to match the existing connectivity from other US West Coast markets) which are the hotter parts of the day.

Not necessarily. EK could scheduled it's departure at 9am to catch the early morning inbound flights from the West Coast and Mountain Time zone traffic. (Seattle has a 9am flight starting later this month) or they could do what BA did when they started PHX with the DC-10 depart 2230-2300 hrs.

Back in 2010 then Mayor Phil Gordon did travel to Dubai in an effort to get EK to fly to PHX. http://archive.azcentral.com/arizonarep ... ights.html

The problem with the later departure is going to be gate availability assuming a 2.5-3 hour turnaround (yes it can be done in less). Right now there are only 2 777 capable gates and at the time of the required arrival for that, BA will be using one and WS the other. Yes WS doesn't need the ADG V capable gate but there isn't another open gate at that time.

For an earlier departure, PHX is another 900 miles further than SEA and that translates into another two hours or so of flying time. I don't think a 7A departure would be viable and likewise leaving at 9A would blow most of the connections that the SEA flight would link up with.

I can't imagine a wide body jet in BUF. The airport mainly has narrow body jets and I don't even know if the airbridges can handle a 777.

I don't see BUF as so crazy as it seems. It would be a way to add more flights to Toronto and bother Air Canada and the Canadian government. Maybe they have numbers of people from Vancouver using SEA-DXB (which is or used to be double daily), and Vancouver to SEA is much longer and a bigger hassle than Toronto to BUF.

Even BUF website has specific sections about Canada and Toronto:

http://www.buffaloairport.com/Canadian/
http://www.buffaloairport.com/Toronto/

md2012 wrote:

I can't imagine a wide body jet in BUF. The airport mainly has narrow body jets and I don't even know if the airbridges can handle a 777.

DC10 and L1011 flights used to be regulars at BUF by AA and EA

It was a big deal when BUF got a daily B6 flight to LAX earlier this year, I laughed so hard when I read the title of this thread. I'm from Buffalo and when I'm home, spot at the airport all the time, and would love this to be true for no other reason than to make spotting more interesting, but even with the nearby Canadian market, I just can't fathom it. The 5X and FX A300s and occasional 764 Bills charters dwarf the usual mixture of scheduled RJs, 737s, A320s and MD/717s. A 777 would look so out of place! Methinks that BUF is on EK's route map because of their codeshare with B6.

Emirates will be flying to Joplin, MO from Dubai on an Airbus 330 with 3 times a week in Spring 2019.

Sure right! Rolling my eyes. Buffalo? I doubt it.

Q

IMHO, Emirates serving BUF has to be a really early April Fools Joke. PHX however makes more sense, but I would expect them in ATL, EWR, DTW and DEN before PHX.

Buffalo will never happen.

klm617 wrote:

md2012 wrote:

I can't imagine a wide body jet in BUF. The airport mainly has narrow body jets and I don't even know if the airbridges can handle a 777.

DC10 and L1011 flights used to be regulars at BUF by AA and EA

AA even flew BUF-LGA with DC10s. UA may have flown them ORD alongside AA, can't recall.

Interesting that the EK route map shows both PHX and BUF.

alasizon wrote:

The problem with the later departure is going to be gate availability assuming a 2.5-3 hour turnaround (yes it can be done in less). Right now there are only 2 777 capable gates and at the time of the required arrival for that, BA will be using one and WS the other. Yes WS doesn't need the ADG V capable gate but there isn't another open gate at that time.

For an earlier departure, PHX is another 900 miles further than SEA and that translates into another two hours or so of flying time. I don't think a 7A departure would be viable and likewise leaving at 9A would blow most of the connections that the SEA flight would link up with.

Dallas flights to DXB leaves at 1150hrs or 1250hrs depending on the season, arrives in DXB the same time as the SEA flight, just adjust for the time difference and yes it could be done. Blown connections, do you realize that if you took the earliest flights from So. Cal from SAN, SAN, LAX, BUR, ONT, LBG, PSP, and other airports such as SJC,SMF,SLC,LAS etc you can't make a 9am connection out of SEA, and in theory a before noon departure at PHX would work. (Assuming AA has a interline agreement with EK and you would know that better than I). Will it happen, heck I don't know, but it was more interesting discussing this than if AA is drawing down PHX.

787fan8 wrote:

http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/2016/11/08/emirates-buffalo-phoenix/

Your thoughts on this?

What regional jet are they going to buy 125 of?

Buffalo? No. Phoenix, in time I could see that, but I, along with some others here, think we will see EK tails at Newark, Detroit, Atlanta, and Denver before then.

787fan8 wrote:

Your thoughts on this?

The title of the thread literally made me laugh out loud. I can see Phoenix...maybe...someday. But Buffalo? Awesome. What's next after that -- direct service from Dubai to Ft. Wayne, Indiana? Albuquerque, New Mexico? Casper, Wyoming?

Buffalo would be for one reason alone, to push the Canadian government into giving them more flights.

If you click on BUF one the route map, its says"Technical Difficulties" that isn't showing on any other destination. Gotta be a glitch.

klm617 wrote:
md2012 wrote:
I can't imagine a wide body jet in BUF. The airport mainly has narrow body jets and I don't even know if the airbridges can handle a 777.



DC10 and L1011 flights used to be regulars at BUF by AA and EA


AA even flew BUF-LGA with DC10s. UA may have flown them ORD alongside AA, can't recall.
 

Thenoflyzone


Posts: 2343
Joined: 15 years ago

AA flew DC10's to LGA, ORD, DTW,and briefly BDL (Flight 96 would have continued to BDL) at various times with the final DC10 flight being to ORD all from the old East Terminal. In fact there was a time AA had over 40 daily departures and a pilot and flight attendant base at BUF.
EA flew L10's and A300's to ATL and YYZ from the old West Terminal
Both terminals have since been demolished.

In the new terminal at Gate 1 which is widebody capable and has a FIS station
Air Transat had weekly scheduled A310 service to Mexico
Northwest had 2 or 3 B742 charters
Virgin had an A346 charter not too long ago
Some YYZ diversions have been handled there including a 777w
I know this is minimal, but there are capable facilities available.

AS far as Emirates service, I doubt it would happen, but in my experience I've learned never to say never. There was even a time for about a year in the 70's World Airways had scheduled 747 service to Hong Kong from IAG. Between Canada, Western NY and Northern PA there are approx.10 million people within 2 hours driving distance who could use BUF. To be honest it's a very nice facility.

I don't think EK to BUF is that outrageous. Think of BUF as Toronto (South). Since EK can only serve YYZ thrice weekly, a 4x weekly flight to BUF with some sort of ground transport to Toronto may be the best EK can do if they wish to expand. It requires thinking out of the box but if you think about it it it is really not that ridiculous based on the circumstances...

whywhyzee wrote:

Buffalo would be for one reason alone, to push the Canadian government into giving them more flights.

That is definitely the only reason why EK would do so, to stick it to the Canadian government. The thing with BUF is it's relatively short runway. BUF-Europe-DXB would be no problem, but BUF-DXB nonstop, I'm not so sure at least with any meaningful cargo payload.

PHX I could see eventually.

I heard they are planning a daily Dubai- Aspen with an A380. They also will announce on Friday, 2 flights a day from Dubai to St Barts. They are just waiting to see if they will be weight restricted

SCQ83 wrote:

I don't see BUF as so crazy as it seems. It would be a way to add more flights to Toronto and bother Air Canada and the Canadian government.

BUF to FLL (as a proxy for domestic vs. Canada-US generally) can make sense for Canadians, as land border crossings can be free in both directions while air is not, and the taxes can be a big component of short-haul fare. BUF-DXB holds no significant tax/ airport fee arbitrage vs. YYZ-DXB. Will they get Canadians to drive and cross the border? To enjoy the drive and border hassles and spend more money while doing it?

BUF-FLL n/s, r/t, taxes per ITA Matrix

US Transportation Tax (US)
$11.51
US September 11th Security Fee (AY)
$11.20
US Passenger Facility Charge (XF)
$9.00
US Flight Segment Tax (ZP)
$8.00

YYZ-FLL n/s, r/t, per ITA Matrix

Canadian Goods and Services Tax (XG)
CA$13.71
USDA APHIS Fee (XA)
CA$5.30
US Immigration Fee (XY)
CA$9.40
US Customs Fee (YC)
CA$7.40
Toronto Airport Improvement Fee (SQ)
CA$25.00
Canadian Harmonized Sales Tax (ON) (RC)
CA$3.25
US International Arrival Tax (US)
CA$23.90
Canadian Air Travelers Security Charge (CA)
CA$12.10
US International Departure Tax (US)
CA$23.90
US September 11th Security Fee (AY)
CA$7.50
US Passenger Facility Charge (XF)
CA$6.00


YYZ-DXB

United Arab Emirates International Advanced Passenger Information Fee (ZR)
CA$1.80
Toronto Airport Improvement Fee (SQ)
CA$25.00
Canadian Harmonized Sales Tax (ON) (RC)
CA$3.25
Canadian Air Travelers Security Charge (CA)
CA$25.91
United Arab Emirates Passenger Facilities Charge (F6)
CA$12.80
United Arab Emirates Passenger Service Charge (AE)
CA$27.40
United Arab Emirates Security and Safety Fee (TP)
CA$1.80
total CDN97.96

BUF-FLL-DXB

United Arab Emirates International Advanced Passenger Information Fee (ZR)
$1.40
US International Departure Tax (US)
$17.80
US September 11th Security Fee (AY)
$11.20
US Passenger Facility Charge (XF)
$13.50
United Arab Emirates Passenger Facilities Charge (F6)
$9.50
USDA APHIS Fee (XA)
$3.96
US Immigration Fee (XY)
$7.00
US Customs Fee (YC)
$5.50
United Arab Emirates Passenger Service Charge (AE)
$20.40
United Arab Emirates Security and Safety Fee (TP)
$1.40
US International Arrival Tax (US)
$17.80
total $109.46

DFW789ER wrote:

If you click on BUF one the route map, its says"Technical Difficulties" that isn't showing on any other destination. Gotta be a glitch.

PHX says the same thing. Not convinced this is a glitch (yes, mainly because I totally want this to be real).

ChrisFallon77 wrote:

I heard they are planning a daily Dubai- Aspen with an A380. They also will announce on Friday, 2 flights a day from Dubai to St Barts. They are just waiting to see if they will be weight restricted

That's good one! LOL Maybe Airbus can modify new super harder brake system on an A380 at St Barts. St Barts airport will have to cut the trees down along runway. LOL!

Q

Now both BUF and PHX have disappeared from the map while the already announced FLL has been added.

Would BUF be able to fill A321neo to London for example?

MIflyer12 wrote:

SCQ83 wrote:

I don't see BUF as so crazy as it seems. It would be a way to add more flights to Toronto and bother Air Canada and the Canadian government.

BUF to FLL (as a proxy for domestic vs. Canada-US generally) can make sense for Canadians, as land border crossings can be free in both directions while air is not, and the taxes can be a big component of short-haul fare. BUF-DXB holds no significant tax/ airport fee arbitrage vs. YYZ-DXB. Will they get Canadians to drive and cross the border? To enjoy the drive and border hassles and spend more money while doing it?

The problem with EK and YYZ is that they cannot add more flights to Canada because of the bilateral agreement.

Again EK can track easily how many Canadians or Canada-passport holders use SEA and maybe they think there is market for a flight from BUF given that:

- Toronto in general has more VFR connections to the Middle East / India (Vancouver is more East Asia)
- Toronto to BUF is an shorter connection than Vancouver to SEA. Also EK could sell the advantage of using a "small" airport (not the case for SEA) with quick TSA, passport control, etc. Also for people living in Hamilton and that area is not that crazy.

usflyer msp wrote:

I don't think EK to BUF is that outrageous. Think of BUF as Toronto (South). Since EK can only serve YYZ thrice weekly, a 4x weekly flight to BUF with some sort of ground transport to Toronto may be the best EK can do if they wish to expand. It requires thinking out of the box but if you think about it it it is really not that ridiculous based on the circumstances...

BUF website shows coach services from BUF to Toronto on Coach Canada and Greyhound (about 3 hours). So EK adding a coach service to the Toronto area wouldn't be that crazy IMO.

Looking to the financial results I believe they will cut routes.

Phoenix will not happen. Without a large cargo volume it would not make enough to sustain it. Phoenix is more a leasure destination.

BUFJACK10 wrote:

klm617 wrote:
md2012 wrote:
I can't imagine a wide body jet in BUF. The airport mainly has narrow body jets and I don't even know if the airbridges can handle a 777.



DC10 and L1011 flights used to be regulars at BUF by AA and EA


AA even flew BUF-LGA with DC10s. UA may have flown them ORD alongside AA, can't recall.
 

Thenoflyzone


Posts: 2343
Joined: 15 years ago

AA flew DC10's to LGA, ORD, DTW,and briefly BDL (Flight 96 would have continued to BDL) at various times with the final DC10 flight being to ORD all from the old East Terminal. In fact there was a time AA had over 40 daily departures and a pilot and flight attendant base at BUF.
EA flew L10's and A300's to ATL and YYZ from the old West Terminal
Both terminals have since been demolished.

In the new terminal at Gate 1 which is widebody capable and has a FIS station
Air Transat had weekly scheduled A310 service to Mexico
Northwest had 2 or 3 B742 charters
Virgin had an A346 charter not too long ago
Some YYZ diversions have been handled there including a 777w
I know this is minimal, but there are capable facilities available.

AS far as Emirates service, I doubt it would happen, but in my experience I've learned never to say never. There was even a time for about a year in the 70's World Airways had scheduled 747 service to Hong Kong from IAG. Between Canada, Western NY and Northern PA there are approx.10 million people within 2 hours driving distance who could use BUF. To be honest it's a very nice facility.

747 & DC-10 have shorter T-O distances than the 777-300ER/200LR does.

finnishway wrote:

Would BUF be able to fill A321neo to London for example?

This is a planned route for DY, you'll see it soon enough.