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KarelXWB
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Malaysia Airlines to retrofit A380 fleet for Hajj flights

Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:00 pm

Malaysia Airlines is unable to find a buyer for its A380 fleet and is now exploring other options, like configuring the cabin into a high density arrangement and use it on charter flights.

“What we will have to do is be imaginative,” he said. “There is a clear opportunity for the aircraft from markets such as China, but airlines don’t want to buy the aircraft and are nervous of such an investment, yet they have routes that can clearly support the operation of the type on a wet-lease basis.”

The tentative plan will see the formation of such a wet-lease operator that will be a sister business to Malaysia Airlines that could see the aircraft remain flying for charter work and third party contracts.

Bellew acknowledged that the aircraft will likely remain in Malaysia Airlines operation through to late 2018 to support Hajj and Umrah flying and could continue to play a role in this market. “The Hajj and Umrah is now a 9-10 month business and the Boeing 747-400s are getting towards end of cycle. The A380, perhaps in a higher density arrangement to how we fly it, will be an ideal aircraft to support this market. I see a future for the aircraft doing this. I think it could ultimately absorb 6 to 12 aircraft,” he said.


Article
http://www.routesonline.com/news/29/bre ... operation/

-----------------------

Told you so. The MAS A380 fleet is pretty young thus still too expensive for many operators. As parking it too expensive, Malaysia Airlines will have no choice but to continue operating the aircraft.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
Tedd
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:12 pm

Since WW at BA said he`d be interested used A380`s, wouldn`t these RR powered Malaysian examples be ideal?
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:16 pm

Tedd wrote:
wouldn`t these RR powered Malaysian examples be ideal?


What BA wants is a 12-years old A380. The MAS fleet is much younger (thus being too expensive).
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
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Polot
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:18 pm

Tedd wrote:
Since WW at BA said he`d be interested used A380`s, wouldn`t these RR powered Malaysian examples be ideal?

He might not have liked the price, or with uncertainties up ahead (brexit, what looks to be a global economic slowdown, etc) he might have changed his mind in regards to more A380s at the moment.
 
Tedd
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:29 pm

Thanks guy`s!
I`m thinking of ways of helping out with the sale of these Malaysian birds, & I`m wondering if Ryan Air might
be interested in using them to compete on their proposed North American service?!
 
737max8
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 5:14 pm

Tedd wrote:
Thanks guy`s!
I`m thinking of ways of helping out with the sale of these Malaysian birds, & I`m wondering if Ryan Air might
be interested in using them to compete on their proposed North American service?!


And jump from a 737-800 to an A380? That would be quite an interesting mix.
The thoughts and opinions expressed in my comments do not represent that of any airline or affiliate.
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ikolkyo
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:04 pm

A380 for this airline was a mistake, should have went the 77W route.
 
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piedmontf284000
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:14 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
A380 for this airline was a mistake, should have went the 77W route.


Same can be said for China Southern, Asiana, Thai, and Korean Airlines.
 
migair54
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:15 pm

So if the operation for Hajj can absorb 6 to 12 aircraft, that means that MH needs to get more planes, maybe they can get the ones from TG also.
 
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AirbusA343
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:15 pm

Tedd wrote:
Thanks guy`s!
I`m thinking of ways of helping out with the sale of these Malaysian birds, & I`m wondering if Ryan Air might
be interested in using them to compete on their proposed North American service?!


An A380 is way too big for RYR at the moment! If they were to ever launch a North American service, they are much better off with 787s which aren't too big on capacity.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:16 pm

Korean already has the 77W
 
Varsity1
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:20 pm

In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.
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ikolkyo
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:28 pm

piedmontf284000 wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
A380 for this airline was a mistake, should have went the 77W route.


Same can be said for China Southern, Asiana, Thai, and Korean Airlines.


Asiana, Korean and CZ are news to me. They having issues as well?
 
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Dutchy
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:30 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.


No Boeing poured money into a new version of the 747, so both Airbus and Boeing overestimated the marked for very large planes.
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AirbusA343
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:32 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
piedmontf284000 wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
A380 for this airline was a mistake, should have went the 77W route.


Same can be said for China Southern, Asiana, Thai, and Korean Airlines.


Asiana, Korean and CZ are news to me. They having issues as well?


Pretty much all airlines apart from Emirates that operate A380s have an issue with them. QR and EY don't have as much of a problem as the rest though.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:35 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.

....yet then Boeing went on to offer the 748i, which as a pax aircraft was a significantly bigger flop by any standard of measure.

So not like it has all that much merit to stand on, in that regard.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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piedmontf284000
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:48 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.

....yet then Boeing went on to offer the 748i, which as a pax aircraft was a significantly bigger flop by any standard of measure.

So not like it has all that much merit to stand on, in that regard.


"Take my advice, I'm not using it"...Typical Boeing management in a nutshell.
 
NichCage
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:48 pm

The A380 is simply too big. Hopefully Malaysia Airlines can find a good use for them, because if not getting rid of them is challenging.
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:06 pm

AirbusA343 wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
piedmontf284000 wrote:

Same can be said for China Southern, Asiana, Thai, and Korean Airlines.


Asiana, Korean and CZ are news to me. They having issues as well?


Pretty much all airlines apart from Emirates that operate A380s have an issue with them. QR and EY don't have as much of a problem as the rest though.


LH, BA, and QF (Seem to be finding their niche) don't seem to have issues with them. Other airlines don't seem very vocal about these issues if they are a big issue, I will say that CZ seems like an odd airline to have the A380.
 
Blotto
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:52 pm

I wonder if they ever considered using their A380s in their cooperation with EK. Qantas flies them via DXB and so could MH if they have the 5th freedom rights. I guess EK would be happy to add some German destinations. So why not fly KUL-DXB-SXF in collaboration with EK circumventing their limitations in traffic rights.
So having an A380 network with KUL-LHR, KUL-DXB-LHR and KUL-DXB-SXF should be sustainable even for MH and keep all 6 AC employed.
 
moby147
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 8:33 pm

It's a shame, I had two of the best flights ever on MH A380 ok it was upstairs in J but still.........

Moby147
 
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rotating14
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 8:43 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.


Yes and no. Boeing will never admit it but I'm convinced that the 748i was solely on the market to take market share from the A380. It was no secret at Boeing that the A380 was superior to the 748i but the minds at Chicago thought that enhancements to the engines, fuselage etc would make it attractive to widebody buyers like operators of the 747, A346, 77W, etc.


If they believed more into the point to point narrative and less in the 748i and invested more into the supply chain of the 787 program in its infancy, Boeing wouldn't likely be in the red as they are in deferred costs . But as hindsight is 20/20, nobody could have foreseen the 748 budget pitfalls nor the 787 mishaps. Life goes on.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 8:53 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
A380 for this airline was a mistake, should have went the 77W route.


Indeed. But when MH ordered the A380 the 77W didn't exist yet.
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rotating14
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:08 pm

KarelXWB wrote:
Tedd wrote:
wouldn`t these RR powered Malaysian examples be ideal?


What BA wants is a 12-years old A380. The MAS fleet is much younger (thus being too expensive).


Really?!? That's odd since the first tranche of A380s were heavy and less efficient than current day models.
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:17 pm

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
A380 for this airline was a mistake, should have went the 77W route.


Indeed. But when MH ordered the A380 the 77W didn't exist yet.


It did exist, 77W and 77L were launched in 2000 with the 77W first flying in 2003. MH placed its A380 order in 2003.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:27 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
I will say that CZ seems like an odd airline to have the A380.

What's so odd about the largest airline in the world's most populous country, having the largest aircraft?

Granted, the lore is that the A380 was ordered for CA, who objected, and thus relegated to CZ.
But still, it seems pretty fitting. SoCal to Guangdong definitely has the volume to sustain A380 service, if the yield is there.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:42 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.

....yet then Boeing went on to offer the 748i, which as a pax aircraft was a significantly bigger flop by any standard of measure.

So not like it has all that much merit to stand on, in that regard.



Boeing bet the house on point to point (787). Airbus bet the house on hub to hub (A380). Both had reactionary programs to the other's project (A350 and 748). Boeing was right.
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flightsimer
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:52 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.


No Boeing poured money into a new version of the 747, so both Airbus and Boeing overestimated the marked for very large planes.

LAX772LR wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
In hindsight Boeing was dead on and Airbus dead wrong on the A380.

....yet then Boeing went on to offer the 748i, which as a pax aircraft was a significantly bigger flop by any standard of measure.

So not like it has all that much merit to stand on, in that regard.

I think Varsity meant between Airbus developing the A380 VLA versus Boeing developing the 787, medium sized long haul aircraft.

The amount Boeing "poured in" for the 747-8 versus what Airbus spent is considerably different though. Boeing had been in talks with multiple airlines about an updated 747 well before the A380 was even launched. It started out as the 747-500X and 747-600X which would have had new wings and engines and stretched fuselages. Those plans were shelved and a more modest -500/600 plan was drawn out to use the current wing with a root plug. That too was shelved and they settled on the -8 program which was to use many advancements from the 787 program...

Remember the 747-8 program took a delay due to resources being diverted to the 787 and then the GFC hit. Boeing also has publicly said they turned down airlines who tried to low ball their way into getting 747's, then the price of gas sky rocketed... So could we have seen more 747's ordered? I think so as well as more A380's. However, once the airlines got exposed to the fuel prices they saw just a few years ago, they have come to realize that there is a lot less risk involved with the A330, 787, A350 and 777 programs.

Also it should be pointed out, Boeing has always been more conservative when it came to the VLA market. Boeing and Airbus actually worked together in the early 1990's on a joint aircraft idea that would have been the replacement to the 747. Boeing though backed out as they saw limited market for it, but Airbus continued on and eventually developed the A380. Boeing has always forecasted lower VLA market numbers as well. So even though they spent the money on the 747-8 program it was not a big gamble at the time. A lot happened in the world outside of Boeing's control in between those few years when the plane was supposed to hit the market and when it actually did that could not have been predicted when the plane was launched.
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Turnhouse1
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 9:56 pm

rotating14 wrote:
KarelXWB wrote:
Tedd wrote:
wouldn`t these RR powered Malaysian examples be ideal?


What BA wants is a 12-years old A380. The MAS fleet is much younger (thus being too expensive).


Really?!? That's odd since the first tranche of A380s were heavy and less efficient than current day models.


BA want new A380s at 12-year old A380 prices. There is probably a price where they will take the Malaysian ones, Malaysian appear to be exploring if there is a better deal for them doing something else.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:02 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
I will say that CZ seems like an odd airline to have the A380.

What's so odd about the largest airline in the world's most populous country, having the largest aircraft?

Granted, the lore is that the A380 was ordered for CA, who objected, and thus relegated to CZ.
But still, it seems pretty fitting. SoCal to Guangdong definitely has the volume to sustain A380 service, if the yield is there.


Agreed. I always thought that the A380 would get far more orders from China due to the sheer number of prospective fliers. I wonder
if Airbus & Boeing for that matter have been disappointed in the lack of enthusiasm for VLA`s from that sector, or was there never
going to be that expectation?
The Chinese economy has floundered for a while now, could an upturn in fortune there bring any hope for orders, remembering that
with the A380 & B747-8 gone, it could be many decades before we see anything larger than a 777X or stretched version.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:03 pm

Saudia were rumored to be looking at A380 but dont think they are keen on used ones.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:03 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
Boeing bet the house on point to point (787). Airbus bet the house on hub to hub (A380). Both had reactionary programs to the other's project (A350 and 748). Boeing was right.

Being "right" didn't give them any real advantage though, as the A350 is thus far showing itself to be an absolutely magnificent aircraft in both performance and sales; and while the A380's development costs are an albatross to Airbus, so are the 787's to Boeing.

Pretty much a draw, in all regards.

That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see the 787/A350 become more complimentary than competitive... sort of an inverse of the common A330/777 combination of the last decade and a half.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:07 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see the 787/A350 become more complimentary than competitive... sort of an inverse of the common A330/777 combination of the last decade and a half.


This, even heading that way a bit now. Will be interesting how the additional versions shake out.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:09 pm

flightsimer wrote:
The amount Boeing "poured in" for the 747-8 versus what Airbus spent is considerably different though.


Yes, considerably less. The 747-8i was always an afterthought to keep business away from the A380. You can debate on how effective that strategy was.

You can not debate the fact that the 748-8F has no competition except perhaps the 777F.

Besides, one can imagine the situation now with respect PAR (the US presidential airplane) if there was not a 747-8i or F.

bt
Intelligent seeks knowledge. Enlightened seeks wisdom.
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:19 pm

Tedd wrote:
Agreed. I always thought that the A380 would get far more orders from China due to the sheer number of prospective fliers.

And it may yet be the case, as the A380 is still around for the far foreseeable future, and Chinese pax numbers are going nowhere but up.

That said, as HKG and the big3 mainland hubs become more congested, we might continue to see further fragmentation of the market before we see consolidation on NLAs.

Over the last few years, we've seen the likes of Chengdu, Wuhan, Hainan, Xi'an, Nanjing, Jinan, Kunming, Qingdao, Hangzhou, Changsha, and Fuzhou being added or announced for nonstop service to the USA. Most of those markets are not daily, and served by only one side... wouldn't be surprised to see them, and others like them, fill out before NLA service is heavily pushed at HKG or the primary mainland gateways.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:34 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
I will say that CZ seems like an odd airline to have the A380.

What's so odd about the largest airline in the world's most populous country, having the largest aircraft?

Granted, the lore is that the A380 was ordered for CA, who objected, and thus relegated to CZ.
But still, it seems pretty fitting. SoCal to Guangdong definitely has the volume to sustain A380 service, if the yield is there.


Oh I agree the A380 belongs with a Chinese airline, I mean it odd in the sense of the airline that is operating them.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:45 pm

Is it really that hard for an airline in the most heavily populated part of the world to fill the A380? I know some carriers prefer frequency over capacity but surely MAS could use them as high density carpet bombers? (Not literally carpet bombing I might add)

Slightly off topic but for all the moaning about how bad the A380 and 747-8 are, at least they've done better than three A.net stalwarts. The 767-400, the 757-300 and the 777-200LR.
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:13 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
Oh I agree the A380 belongs with a Chinese airline, I mean it odd in the sense of the airline that is operating them.

Not sure why: as CZ is the largest of the Chinese airlines and carries the most pax, both by fairly significant margins.

Granted, their international/domestic mix is less than CA, but IINM, CA has a higher O&D ratio and is less connection reliant.... neither of which is as conducive to NLAs as it is to smaller aircraft + frequency.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:20 pm

UltimoTiger777 wrote:
Slightly off topic but for all the moaning about how bad the A380 and 747-8 are, at least they've done better than three A.net stalwarts. The 767-400, the 757-300 and the 777-200LR.

The A380 yes, but not sure why you're grouping the 748 into that, as the 772LR and 753 both outsold it.

Including freighter numbers doesn't really improve the picture, relative to the development history of the other aircraft and their related/concurrent derivatives.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:59 pm

piedmontf284000 wrote:
Same can be said for China Southern, Asiana, Thai, and Korean Airlines.

What makes you say that KE is having issues operating the A380?
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smi0006
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:07 am

AirbusA343 wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
piedmontf284000 wrote:

Same can be said for China Southern, Asiana, Thai, and Korean Airlines.


Asiana, Korean and CZ are news to me. They having issues as well?


Pretty much all airlines apart from Emirates that operate A380s have an issue with them. QR and EY don't have as much of a problem as the rest though.


I'm pretty sure QF are happy, they don't want any more the current fleet fits the right niche. The aircraft is just that a niche aircraft that isn't overly flexible.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:07 am

UltimoTiger777 wrote:
Is it really that hard for an airline in the most heavily populated part of the world to fill the A380? I know some carriers prefer frequency over capacity but surely MAS could use them as high density carpet bombers? (Not literally carpet bombing I might add)

Slightly off topic but for all the moaning about how bad the A380 and 747-8 are, at least they've done better than three A.net stalwarts. The 767-400, the 757-300 and the 777-200LR.


Malaysia is not that close to the populous centers of Asia - at least 6+ hours from China, 3+ hours from Indonesia & 5+ hours from India. Not to mention the fact that those market are already saturated.

ikolkyo wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
A380 for this airline was a mistake, should have went the 77W route.


Indeed. But when MH ordered the A380 the 77W didn't exist yet.


It did exist, 77W and 77L were launched in 2000 with the 77W first flying in 2003. MH placed its A380 order in 2003.


I was under the impression that the 77W was still a paper plane then.

In any case, the MH of 2003 was a far different animal than the MH of 2016. Back then things were still very optimistic.
Last edited by TheFlyingDisk on Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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smi0006
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:08 am

LAX772LR wrote:
Tedd wrote:
Agreed. I always thought that the A380 would get far more orders from China due to the sheer number of prospective fliers.

And it may yet be the case, as the A380 is still around for the far foreseeable future, and Chinese pax numbers are going nowhere but up.

That said, as HKG and the big3 mainland hubs become more congested, we might continue to see further fragmentation of the market before we see consolidation on NLAs.

Over the last few years, we've seen the likes of Chengdu, Wuhan, Hainan, Xi'an, Nanjing, Jinan, Kunming, Qingdao, Hangzhou, Changsha, and Fuzhou being added or announced for nonstop service to the USA. Most of those markets are not daily, and served by only one side... wouldn't be surprised to see them, and others like them, fill out before NLA service is heavily pushed at HKG or the primary mainland gateways.


I agree, if anything the A380 came 20 years too early. Once the Chinese secondary markets become congested too, perhaps sooner between marjor markets and A380 regional in China would be handy. Flying ferry really.
 
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:16 am

moby147 wrote:
It's a shame, I had two of the best flights ever on MH A380 ok it was upstairs in J but still.........

Moby147



That seems to be the real challenge here, customers by most reports (myself included) love them, but they're hard for the airlines to make work consistently and profitably...
 
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MrHMSH
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:28 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Malaysia is not that close to the populous centers of Asia - at least 6+ hours from China, 3+ hours from Indonesia & 5+ hours from India. Not to mention the fact that those market are already saturated.


Jakarta is less than 2 hours away, Sumatra is literally across the strait, major cities Hong Kong and Guangzhou are just over 3hrs, the wealthy Singapore is within swimming distance, the Philippines are 3hrs away, all of Thailand and Vietnam are less than 3hrs away. The only parts that are far away are India and Northern China, plus Japan and South Korea. All of SE Asia is close (and hardly sparsely populated!) and Southern China is close.
 
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zkojq
Posts: 2841
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:29 am

KarelXWB wrote:
configuring the cabin into a high density arrangement

Honestly, MH should have done this from the outset. There's no need for first, the Business cabin should be kept small and the aircraft should have been in a 600+ seat configuration. IMO that would have worked much better for the airline and they wouldn't have needed to consider selling the fleet. One of the biggest problems with the A380 in my opinion is that airlines configure them with first class seating, making it inflexible, especially when they're the only aircraft in the fleet to have first.

Varsity1 wrote:
Airbus bet the house on hub to hub (A380).

Except that they didn't 'bet the house' on the A380 program at all.


On another note, I'm rather frustrated at how the quality of comments on these forums has fallen substantially since the website stopped charging for membership.
Most recent planes I've been in: A318 F-GUGQ, A319 F-GRHR, A320ceo D-AIZH, A320neo D-AINE, A330-300 VH-QPD, A350-900 B-LRA, A380-800 D-AIMH, B737-600 LN-RPA, B737-700 OY-JTY, B737-800 LN-NGA, B767-300 ZK-NCI, B777-300 ZK-OKN, B787-9 VH-ZNA, CS100 HB-JBG
 
Motorhussy
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:59 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
UltimoTiger777 wrote:
Is it really that hard for an airline in the most heavily populated part of the world to fill the A380? I know some carriers prefer frequency over capacity but surely MAS could use them as high density carpet bombers? (Not literally carpet bombing I might add)

Slightly off topic but for all the moaning about how bad the A380 and 747-8 are, at least they've done better than three A.net stalwarts. The 767-400, the 757-300 and the 777-200LR.


Malaysia is not that close to the populous centers of Asia - at least 6+ hours from China, 3+ hours from Indonesia & 5+ hours from India. Not to mention the fact that those market are already saturated.

ikolkyo wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:

Indeed. But when MH ordered the A380 the 77W didn't exist yet.


It did exist, 77W and 77L were launched in 2000 with the 77W first flying in 2003. MH placed its A380 order in 2003.


I was under the impression that the 77W was still a paper plane then.

In any case, the MH of 2003 was a far different animal than the MH of 2016. Back then things were still very optimistic.


And the juggernaut that is the modern day EK was not what it is today. And BTW, the 77W first flew in commercial service with AF in April 2004. The A380 was already flying at that point and its economics were proven; the same cannot be said for the 77W (at that point).

And TheFlyingDisk, you may want to have a look at Malaysia on a map, it may not be where you think it is.
come visit the south pacific
 
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ikolkyo
Posts: 1551
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:10 am

Motorhussy wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
UltimoTiger777 wrote:
Is it really that hard for an airline in the most heavily populated part of the world to fill the A380? I know some carriers prefer frequency over capacity but surely MAS could use them as high density carpet bombers? (Not literally carpet bombing I might add)

Slightly off topic but for all the moaning about how bad the A380 and 747-8 are, at least they've done better than three A.net stalwarts. The 767-400, the 757-300 and the 777-200LR.


Malaysia is not that close to the populous centers of Asia - at least 6+ hours from China, 3+ hours from Indonesia & 5+ hours from India. Not to mention the fact that those market are already saturated.

ikolkyo wrote:

It did exist, 77W and 77L were launched in 2000 with the 77W first flying in 2003. MH placed its A380 order in 2003.


I was under the impression that the 77W was still a paper plane then.

In any case, the MH of 2003 was a far different animal than the MH of 2016. Back then things were still very optimistic.


And the juggernaut that is the modern day EK was not what it is today. And BTW, the 77W first flew in commercial service with AF in April 2004. The A380 was already flying at that point and its economics were proven; the same cannot be said for the 77W (at that point).

And TheFlyingDisk, you may want to have a look at Malaysia on a map, it may not be where you think it is.


The A380 had its first commercial service in 2007, 3 years after the 77W. The A380 wasn't even flying until 2005.
 
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neutrino
Posts: 1235
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Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:37 am

zkojq wrote:
On another note, I'm rather frustrated at how the quality of comments on these forums has fallen substantially since the website stopped charging for membership.

Yeah, those pesky new members on a free- lunch. ;) (where's the "duck" emoticon when I need it?)
Seriously, there are a few new contributors of real quality, especially those who had been lurking for a long time who know what they are talking about. Otoh, quite a number came across as clueless but trying to be smart, indiscriminately sh#tting all over the place. As just one example, take a look at the now high number of those OPs that posted wrongly here in Civil Aviation when its patently obvious the subject matter belong to some other sections. The mods certainly had, and still will be having, a busy time moving them to where they should be in the first place.
Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis
 
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neutrino
Posts: 1235
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 5:33 pm

Re: MAS changes A380 plans, again

Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:42 am

Just saw this. I was incredulous as its about USD334. Upon checking their website, it turns out that the price is only for one way though its stated on the ad that it is for an "ALL-INCLUSIVE RETURN FARE". False advertising? Still, the displayed amount of SGD841 or USD619, SIN-LHR-SIN, in the website is really (but not ridiculously) low too.

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Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis

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