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DIRECTFLT
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US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:58 am

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/us-mili ... d=58830081

The U.S. military announced Monday that, by the end of the week, it will send 5,200 active duty troops to the southwest border, as well as helicopters and heavy equipment to build new barriers, to meet a request from the Department of Homeland Security to augment resources in anticipation of the arrival of two caravans of migrants currently in Mexico. Gen. Terrence O'Shaughnessy described the 5,200 troops to be deployed as just “the start of this operation” that could be adjusted as needed.

In announcing the deployment, the head of Customs and Border Protection (CBP) cited concerns over the migrant caravans as reasons why his agency was adding 1,000 personnel along the border and requesting assistance from the Department of Defense. He said the caravan in Mexico now numbers 3,500 people and cited a second group of 3,000 that has become a concern because it has had violent interactions with security personnel as it attempted to enter Mexico Sunday. Last week, in an exclusive interview with ABC News, Vice President Mike Pence would not rule out the option of closing down the border ahead of the midterm elections.


The President ran on securing the border. Another promise being kept. Thank goodness President Trump is a man of action.
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A3801000
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:51 am

A dwindling group of refugees and migrants a thousand miles away is not a crisis. There are laws to deal with it.

Hyping this threat has nothing to do with national security. It’s only the worst kind of political stunt.

The migrants are 2 months away if they make it at all. Tomorrow is one week before the midterm election, which is what all of this is about. There is no invasion.
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:40 am

Gotta hand it to these migrants. They're scientists on the road. How else could they be carrying smallpox, a disease that has been officially eradicated and is only known to reside at the CDC in Atlanta and the VECTOR Institute in Russia? At least, Fox News and guest lend credibility to the report.

So either they're brilliant scientists that are bringing the disease in vials, the disease is spreading and Mexico refuses to treat it, or Russia gave it to them (unless Trump instructed the CDC to release the virus to make a point).
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dragon-wings
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:08 am

This is nothing more than fear mongering by Trump and the Republicans.
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mdsh00
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:40 pm

Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.
 
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777222LR
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:48 pm

It's a political stunt, it's divisive, it's being paid for by the people so Trump can rile up his base. They are nowhere near the US, but yes, let's spend millions of taxpayer dollars so your president can look like a tough guy and can finally play with his GI Joes. "Pew pew!"
 
afcjets
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:39 pm

mdsh00 wrote:
Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.


The caravan itself was a political stunt.
 
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:59 pm

afcjets wrote:
mdsh00 wrote:
Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.


The caravan itself was a political stunt.


Evidence?
 
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casinterest
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:59 pm

afcjets wrote:
mdsh00 wrote:
Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.


The caravan itself was a political stunt.


only if you believe the racist and xenophobic lies coming out of the GOP. Why would the GOP care about a caravan that won't get here till probably well after christmas or ever?
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:00 pm

afcjets wrote:
mdsh00 wrote:
Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.


The caravan itself was a political stunt.


Not the point of this thread but ok...
 
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:11 pm

afcjets wrote:
mdsh00 wrote:
Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.


The caravan itself was a political stunt.


Do you have very small hands and something that looks like a very small mushroom?
 
Flighty
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:20 pm

I think something like 75% of American voters (note the distinction) are perfectly glad and ok with troops on the border.

It's not like he is authorizing an illegal war, like his election opponent did. This is rainbows and unicorns compared to that.

Ask yourself, if 65-75% of Americans favor a policy, why doesn't your political party favor it? Trump is a fool and yet he is the only person to pick up this obvious political red meat? I am getting tired of this fool outsmarting his competition again and again.
 
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casinterest
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:24 pm

Flighty wrote:
I think something like 75% of American voters (note the distinction) are perfectly glad and ok with troops on the border.

It's not like he is authorizing an illegal war, like his election opponent did. This is rainbows and unicorns compared to that.

Ask yourself, if 65-75% of Americans favor a policy, why doesn't your political party favor it? Trump is a fool and yet he is the only person to pick up this obvious political red meat? I am getting tired of this fool outsmarting his competition again and again.


I think the number is 25-35%. Ask yourself why we should waste money sending troops to the border for xenophobic and racist lies by the President?
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:37 pm

casinterest wrote:
afcjets wrote:
mdsh00 wrote:
Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.


The caravan itself was a political stunt.


only if you believe the racist and xenophobic lies coming out of the GOP. Why would the GOP care about a caravan that won't get here till probably well after christmas or ever?


:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:43 pm

Flighty wrote:
I think something like 75% of American voters (note the distinction) are perfectly glad and ok with troops on the border.

I think that about 95% of statistics are made up on the spot.
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readytotaxi
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:49 pm

Do you have the statistics to back that up? :rotfl:

Really, the USA is threatened by a bunch of people walking towards it? :white:
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scbriml
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:54 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
Flighty wrote:
I think something like 75% of American voters (note the distinction) are perfectly glad and ok with troops on the border.

I think that about 95% of statistics are made up on the spot.


It's 92.43%, actually! :wink2:
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Flighty
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:00 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
Do you have the statistics to back that up? :rotfl:

Really, the USA is threatened by a bunch of people walking towards it? :white:


Sure, it is not difficult to look up questions Americans have answered to pollsters on this topic. Here is the opening paragraph.
"At least two-thirds of Americans favor each of five specific measures designed to address immigration issues -- ranging from 68% who would vote for increased government spending on security measures and enforcement at U.S. borders, to 85% who would vote for a requirement that employers verify the immigration status of all new hires. More than seven in 10 would vote for a pathway to citizenship for undocumented immigrants now living in this country. "

https://news.gallup.com/poll/160307/ame ... osals.aspx

Also, when I read the NYT on immigration articles, I often see people say this: "I am extremely liberal, but I think we need to end birthright citizenship. It is completely nuts."

Polls seem to vary with between 35-50% of Americans favoring a repeal of automatic birthright citizenship. I see this as a much newer space as we realize what full global migration looks like. It could (arguably, has) result in very large pay cuts for Americans and a lot of crowding issues in the future.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/poll-ameri ... tizenship/
Last edited by Flighty on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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trpmb6
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:04 pm

casinterest wrote:

I think the number is 25-35%. Ask yourself why we should waste money sending troops to the border for xenophobic and racist lies by the President?


As usual, the devil is in the details. The problem is how pollsters ask the questions. They introduce bias in how they are asked. Sometimes this is just to make questions simpler to answer, other times there is underlying bias by the pollster.

The number being cited above is from a Harvard/Harris poll that shows close to 80% of Americans support a "secure" border. Which makes sense. Nobody wants a terrorist coming across.

But that same poll also found that 3/4ths of Americans support letting DACA recipients stay. It also found that about 50% of Americans are not in favor of a physical barrier (did not specify as to why).

That same poll also found that the majority of Americans are in favor of ending chain migration and ending lottery based immigration, but improving legal, merit based immigration. By improving, the wording seemed to suggest time lines and making it less difficult to navigate the hoops and hurdles that have become our immigration system.

The reader of this post may or may not have noticed but I used the various different manipulative language techniques people use to brag about polls that they think are in their favor. Changing percentages, using words like "about", using fractions, saying "majority" when that could really be a small number in the case of a multiple choice answer.

In sum, I think most American's do favor curbing illegal immigration across the border, and the more prominent method of visa overstays. But the "how" is more of an issue. I don't really think a border wall will be effective. And in many places it can't even be built. But I do think as a country we have a right to know who comes in and out.

As for the caravan, well, they're making a long arduous trip to seek asylum. Why can't they go to a main border crossing and simply apply there? What if we made a commitment to mobilize extra personnel there to process all of them? Would that be satisfactory?
 
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:09 pm

afcjets wrote:
casinterest wrote:
afcjets wrote:

The caravan itself was a political stunt.


only if you believe the racist and xenophobic lies coming out of the GOP. Why would the GOP care about a caravan that won't get here till probably well after christmas or ever?


:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.


Really? Where is the first mention of this caravan that is "threatening" the US?
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tommy1808
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:10 pm

A3801000 wrote:
A dwindling group of refugees and migrants a thousand miles away is not a crisis. There are laws to deal with it..


Shows how the US has changed from the land of the brave to the home of the cowards under Trump.

Not just the simple fact the a few thousand unarmed refugee seekers are enough to send adult diaper sales soaring, but that dealing with them somehow needs 1.5 armed troops per refugee on top of existing personell to feel able to handle the situation.

No wonder Japan runs into China´s open arms......

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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:14 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
casinterest wrote:

I think the number is 25-35%. Ask yourself why we should waste money sending troops to the border for xenophobic and racist lies by the President?


As usual, the devil is in the details. The problem is how pollsters ask the questions. They introduce bias in how they are asked. Sometimes this is just to make questions simpler to answer, other times there is underlying bias by the pollster.

The number being cited above is from a Harvard/Harris poll that shows close to 80% of Americans support a "secure" border. Which makes sense. Nobody wants a terrorist coming across.

But that same poll also found that 3/4ths of Americans support letting DACA recipients stay. It also found that about 50% of Americans are not in favor of a physical barrier (did not specify as to why).

That same poll also found that the majority of Americans are in favor of ending chain migration and ending lottery based immigration, but improving legal, merit based immigration. By improving, the wording seemed to suggest time lines and making it less difficult to navigate the hoops and hurdles that have become our immigration system.

The reader of this post may or may not have noticed but I used the various different manipulative language techniques people use to brag about polls that they think are in their favor. Changing percentages, using words like "about", using fractions, saying "majority" when that could really be a small number in the case of a multiple choice answer.

In sum, I think most American's do favor curbing illegal immigration across the border, and the more prominent method of visa overstays. But the "how" is more of an issue. I don't really think a border wall will be effective. And in many places it can't even be built. But I do think as a country we have a right to know who comes in and out.

As for the caravan, well, they're making a long arduous trip to seek asylum. Why can't they go to a main border crossing and simply apply there? What if we made a commitment to mobilize extra personnel there to process all of them? Would that be satisfactory?



As the end of all of this, nothing about the Caravan is illegal. They are legally migrating north to present their case for asylum. Once at the border, I would trust they will follow the procedure for asylum, and be admitted or denied based on that merit.

Having said that, it should be recognized that many in this Caravan will not make it to the US border. They will find jobs in Mexico,legal or illegal, or pay for food. These folks are desperate if they are leaving the conditions of their own countries. Some may be jailed ,or attacked , or held hostage on the journey. Some may take deals with illegal transporters that will make them work to pay off transport to the border and illegally crossing it.

For those that reach a border checkpoint and follow legal procedure , then they should have their asylum claims heard.

It seems to me that Trump could do a lot more good with foreign aid to the countries that keep sending these refugees, rather than wasting time tilting at windmills of racism and xenophobia.
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afcjets
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:15 pm

casinterest wrote:
afcjets wrote:
casinterest wrote:

only if you believe the racist and xenophobic lies coming out of the GOP. Why would the GOP care about a caravan that won't get here till probably well after christmas or ever?


:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.


Really? Where is the first mention of this caravan that is "thr eatening" the US?


The caravan was designed to illicit the exact response you are getting from Trump. 5000 US troops meeting helpless women and children at the border. Never mind the majority are not women and children, just like never mind the kids still separated from their parents are because in most if not all cases it’s the parents choice to want them to stay here.
Last edited by afcjets on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
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casinterest
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:18 pm

afcjets wrote:
The caravan was designed to illicit the exact response you are getting from a Trump. 5000 US troops meeting helpless women and children at the border. Never mind the majority are not women and children, just like never mind the kids still separated from their parents are because in most if not all cases it’s the parents choice to want them to stay here.


The caravan was designed? How do you know who makes up the caravan? Trump has already claimed MS13 made up the caravan along with ISIS. Those were proven to be lies . Keep changing the subject all you want, but Trump is the one leading the racist, and xenophobic charge against a LEGAL caravan using taxpayer dollars.
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Flighty
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:20 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
casinterest wrote:

I think the number is 25-35%. Ask yourself why we should waste money sending troops to the border for xenophobic and racist lies by the President?


As usual, the devil is in the details. The problem is how pollsters ask the questions. They introduce bias in how they are asked. Sometimes this is just to make questions simpler to answer, other times there is underlying bias by the pollster.

The number being cited above is from a Harvard/Harris poll that shows close to 80% of Americans support a "secure" border. Which makes sense. Nobody wants a terrorist coming across.

But that same poll also found that 3/4ths of Americans support letting DACA recipients stay. It also found that about 50% of Americans are not in favor of a physical barrier (did not specify as to why).

That same poll also found that the majority of Americans are in favor of ending chain migration and ending lottery based immigration, but improving legal, merit based immigration. By improving, the wording seemed to suggest time lines and making it less difficult to navigate the hoops and hurdles that have become our immigration system.

The reader of this post may or may not have noticed but I used the various different manipulative language techniques people use to brag about polls that they think are in their favor. Changing percentages, using words like "about", using fractions, saying "majority" when that could really be a small number in the case of a multiple choice answer.

In sum, I think most American's do favor curbing illegal immigration across the border, and the more prominent method of visa overstays. But the "how" is more of an issue. I don't really think a border wall will be effective. And in many places it can't even be built. But I do think as a country we have a right to know who comes in and out.

As for the caravan, well, they're making a long arduous trip to seek asylum. Why can't they go to a main border crossing and simply apply there? What if we made a commitment to mobilize extra personnel there to process all of them? Would that be satisfactory?


Yes, any question that asks, "do you want problem X to be met with a solution, or remain unsolved" people will vote for a solution. Some solutions are pure evil, but "do you want a secure border," (to me, that means guys with guns), the answer is generally 70++% yes, a super majority, so it shouldn't even be a political question in the first place. Both Dems and Reps should strongly favor it (if they want to win general elections instead of primaries).

The caravan is not making a "long arduous trip" to seek asylum as refugees, they are seeking economic profit, because they are unsatisfied at home. This is like millennial refugee, people who are bored, upset with parents, looking to party, make money etc. There was a time when the word refugee meant life or death. Some people misuse words because they don't know what they mean.
 
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:22 pm

casinterest wrote:

As the end of all of this, nothing about the Caravan is illegal. They are legally migrating north to present their case for asylum. Once at the border, I would trust they will follow the procedure for asylum, and be admitted or denied based on that merit.

Having said that, it should be recognized that many in this Caravan will not make it to the US border. They will find jobs in Mexico,legal or illegal, or pay for food. These folks are desperate if they are leaving the conditions of their own countries. Some may be jailed ,or attacked , or held hostage on the journey. Some may take deals with illegal transporters that will make them work to pay off transport to the border and illegally crossing it.

For those that reach a border checkpoint and follow legal procedure , then they should have their asylum claims heard.

It seems to me that Trump could do a lot more good with foreign aid to the countries that keep sending these refugees, rather than wasting time tilting at windmills of racism and xenophobia.


Are you sure? What if their goal is Canada? Must the US let them walk through the USA? Is this status an unlimited ticket to border crossings for life? What if their goal is Denmark?
 
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casinterest
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:26 pm

Flighty wrote:
casinterest wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:

As usual, the devil is in the details. The problem is how pollsters ask the questions. They introduce bias in how they are asked. Sometimes this is just to make questions simpler to answer, other times there is underlying bias by the pollster.

The number being cited above is from a Harvard/Harris poll that shows close to 80% of Americans support a "secure" border. Which makes sense. Nobody wants a terrorist coming across.

But that same poll also found that 3/4ths of Americans support letting DACA recipients stay. It also found that about 50% of Americans are not in favor of a physical barrier (did not specify as to why).

That same poll also found that the majority of Americans are in favor of ending chain migration and ending lottery based immigration, but improving legal, merit based immigration. By improving, the wording seemed to suggest time lines and making it less difficult to navigate the hoops and hurdles that have become our immigration system.

The reader of this post may or may not have noticed but I used the various different manipulative language techniques people use to brag about polls that they think are in their favor. Changing percentages, using words like "about", using fractions, saying "majority" when that could really be a small number in the case of a multiple choice answer.

In sum, I think most American's do favor curbing illegal immigration across the border, and the more prominent method of visa overstays. But the "how" is more of an issue. I don't really think a border wall will be effective. And in many places it can't even be built. But I do think as a country we have a right to know who comes in and out.

As for the caravan, well, they're making a long arduous trip to seek asylum. Why can't they go to a main border crossing and simply apply there? What if we made a commitment to mobilize extra personnel there to process all of them? Would that be satisfactory?



As the end of all of this, nothing about the Caravan is illegal. They are legally migrating north to present their case for asylum. Once at the border, I would trust they will follow the procedure for asylum, and be admitted or denied based on that merit.

Having said that, it should be recognized that many in this Caravan will not make it to the US border. They will find jobs in Mexico,legal or illegal, or pay for food. These folks are desperate if they are leaving the conditions of their own countries. Some may be jailed ,or attacked , or held hostage on the journey. Some may take deals with illegal transporters that will make them work to pay off transport to the border and illegally crossing it.

For those that reach a border checkpoint and follow legal procedure , then they should have their asylum claims heard.

It seems to me that Trump could do a lot more good with foreign aid to the countries that keep sending these refugees, rather than wasting time tilting at windmills of racism and xenophobia.


Are you sure? What if their goal is Canada? Must the US let them walk through the USA? Is this status an unlimited ticket to border crossings for life? What if their goal is Denmark?

So you are saying Canada and Denmark are better than the US? Trump supporters are really trying to destroy the US aren't they?

Or are you admitting you don't know anything about US border laws and transit visa's?
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:27 pm

afcjets wrote:
casinterest wrote:
afcjets wrote:

The caravan itself was a political stunt.


only if you believe the racist and xenophobic lies coming out of the GOP. Why would the GOP care about a caravan that won't get here till probably well after christmas or ever?


:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.


Evidence? You keep saying this is a stunt and a creation of the left, but you cannot back that claim up. Is that because the claim is ridiculous?
 
afcjets
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:31 pm

casinterest wrote:
afcjets wrote:
Keep changing the subject all you want, but Trump is the one leading the racist, and xenophobic charge against a LEGAL caravan using taxpayer dollars.


This is exactly why it’s backfiring. No one believes (not that they ever did) or even cares when the left cries racism anymore.
 
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:31 pm

Flighty wrote:
The caravan is not making a "long arduous trip" to seek asylum as refugees, they are seeking economic profit, because they are unsatisfied at home. This is like millennial refugee, people who are bored, upset with parents, looking to party, make money etc. There was a time when the word refugee meant life or death. Some people misuse words because they don't know what they mean.


How many of these asylum seekers have you spoken to? If you've not had direct contact with hem, what is your source of information? Why are you under the assumption that the primary reason people have sought out asylum throughout history is no longer valid and there is some new, nefarious plot afoot?
 
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casinterest
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:34 pm

afcjets wrote:
casinterest wrote:
afcjets wrote:
Keep changing the subject all you want, but Trump is the one leading the racist, and xenophobic charge against a LEGAL caravan using taxpayer dollars.


This is exactly why it’s backfiring. No one believes (not that they ever did) or even cares when the left cries racism anymore.


Maybe that's because you no longer care that you are working with a racist anymore? It doesn't change the fact that it is flat out racism and xenophobia that you are supporting .
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seb146
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:34 pm

afcjets wrote:
mdsh00 wrote:
Nothing more than a political stunt. He's trying to distract from the bad press over the weekend. Most likely this caravan will be two pickup trucks by December.


The caravan itself was a political stunt.


If anything, by the Honduran government

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ka ... his-is-why

An article about why people are fleeing Honduras. Many have said they will stop in Mexico City and speak to the Mexican government about asylum.

But, don't let facts get in the way.
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:36 pm

Just another reason to keep the MAHA (not a misspelling; wait for it) crew happy. As long as the orange one can Make America Hate Again they believe they are successful. And, what is more successful than hate of brown, non-English speaking people?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
afcjets
Posts: 2220
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:38 pm

2122M wrote:
afcjets wrote:
casinterest wrote:

only if you believe the racist and xenophobic lies coming out of the GOP. Why would the GOP care about a caravan that won't get here till probably well after christmas or ever?


:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.


Evidence? You keep saying this is a stunt and a creation of the left, but you cannot back that claim up. Is that because the claim is ridiculous?


“This was planned, just as the one before it in April of this year was. Back then, the other "caravan" started a similar odyssey. It was organized by a group called "Pueblo Sin Fronteras," or People Without Borders. What do they seek? That the U.S. "open the borders to us because we are as much citizens as the people of the countries where we are and/or travel."”


https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... -meddling/
 
seb146
Posts: 18278
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:40 pm

afcjets wrote:
2122M wrote:
afcjets wrote:

:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.


Evidence? You keep saying this is a stunt and a creation of the left, but you cannot back that claim up. Is that because the claim is ridiculous?


“This was planned, just as the one before it in April of this year was. Back then, the other "caravan" started a similar odyssey. It was organized by a group called "Pueblo Sin Fronteras," or People Without Borders. What do they seek? That the U.S. "open the borders to us because we are as much citizens as the people of the countries where we are and/or travel."”


https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... -meddling/


And many of them were deported through legal processes by the United States. This current group is not even close to the Mexico-US border. I know some of the racists in the United States are concerned with voter fraud; that this caravan not even at the border will all vote Democrat. If you all are so concerned with voter fraud, why not take it up with Georgia and North Carolina who are refusing LEGAL ballots from blacks and Democrats?
Last edited by seb146 on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Flighty
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:41 pm

casinterest wrote:
Flighty wrote:
casinterest wrote:


As the end of all of this, nothing about the Caravan is illegal. They are legally migrating north to present their case for asylum. Once at the border, I would trust they will follow the procedure for asylum, and be admitted or denied based on that merit.

Having said that, it should be recognized that many in this Caravan will not make it to the US border. They will find jobs in Mexico,legal or illegal, or pay for food. These folks are desperate if they are leaving the conditions of their own countries. Some may be jailed ,or attacked , or held hostage on the journey. Some may take deals with illegal transporters that will make them work to pay off transport to the border and illegally crossing it.

For those that reach a border checkpoint and follow legal procedure , then they should have their asylum claims heard.

It seems to me that Trump could do a lot more good with foreign aid to the countries that keep sending these refugees, rather than wasting time tilting at windmills of racism and xenophobia.


Are you sure? What if their goal is Canada? Must the US let them walk through the USA? Is this status an unlimited ticket to border crossings for life? What if their goal is Denmark?

So you are saying Canada and Denmark are better than the US? Trump supporters are really trying to destroy the US aren't they?

Or are you admitting you don't know anything about US border laws and transit visa's?


I was trying to ASK you a logical question. If these travelers have an absolute right to walk through any country to the country of their choice, THEN can we all claim that right on an unlimited basis?

What are the limitations to your worldview on immigration, if any?
 
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casinterest
Posts: 7032
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:43 pm

Flighty wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Flighty wrote:

Are you sure? What if their goal is Canada? Must the US let them walk through the USA? Is this status an unlimited ticket to border crossings for life? What if their goal is Denmark?

So you are saying Canada and Denmark are better than the US? Trump supporters are really trying to destroy the US aren't they?

Or are you admitting you don't know anything about US border laws and transit visa's?


I was trying to ASK you a logical question. If these travelers have an absolute right to walk through any country to the country of their choice, THEN can we all claim that right on an unlimited basis?

What are the limitations to your worldview on immigration, if any?


Anyone got some logs ? We have a gas-lighter with reading incomprehension issues. .
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
seb146
Posts: 18278
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:44 pm

Flighty wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Flighty wrote:

Are you sure? What if their goal is Canada? Must the US let them walk through the USA? Is this status an unlimited ticket to border crossings for life? What if their goal is Denmark?

So you are saying Canada and Denmark are better than the US? Trump supporters are really trying to destroy the US aren't they?

Or are you admitting you don't know anything about US border laws and transit visa's?


I was trying to ASK you a logical question. If these travelers have an absolute right to walk through any country to the country of their choice, THEN can we all claim that right on an unlimited basis?

What are the limitations to your worldview on immigration, if any?


The caravan's goal is the United States. They have said this. They have also said they will take a break in Mexico City and negotiate with Mexico about staying there. Any talk of Canada or Denmark is not valid.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
2122M
Posts: 775
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:54 pm

afcjets wrote:
2122M wrote:
afcjets wrote:

:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.


Evidence? You keep saying this is a stunt and a creation of the left, but you cannot back that claim up. Is that because the claim is ridiculous?


“This was planned, just as the one before it in April of this year was. Back then, the other "caravan" started a similar odyssey. It was organized by a group called "Pueblo Sin Fronteras," or People Without Borders. What do they seek? That the U.S. "open the borders to us because we are as much citizens as the people of the countries where we are and/or travel."”


https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... -meddling/


First of all, why doesn't IBD name the authors of their opinion pieces?

Second, why are you quoting an opinion piece as proof of a left wing conspiracy?

Third, Of course there is an organizer for this caravan. You think a few thousand people are all on the same WhatApp group chat? But you seem to think that these cannot be legit asylum seekers simply because someone helped organize a group so people would not have to go through this dangerous journey alone.

For a more nuanced view of this groups activities (with an actual named author): https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/who ... re-n862566
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 16769
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:05 pm

afcjets wrote:
2122M wrote:
afcjets wrote:

:rotfl: It’s a political stunt from your side, a stupid one that is backfiring.


Evidence? You keep saying this is a stunt and a creation of the left, but you cannot back that claim up. Is that because the claim is ridiculous?


“This was planned, just as the one before it in April of this year was. Back then, the other "caravan" started a similar odyssey. It was organized by a group called "Pueblo Sin Fronteras," or People Without Borders. What do they seek? That the U.S. "open the borders to us because we are as much citizens as the people of the countries where we are and/or travel."”


https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... -meddling/

"We interrupt the coverage of the MAGA shooter who was convinced the Jews were bringing in violent refugees to return to our coverage of the left (read: Soros/Jews) paying a caravan of violent refugees". Phenomenal :roll: Seriously. What a dumb link--to an opinion piece?

This is not the first caravan, nor the last. We have policies in place to handle things like this. And illegal immigration has been at historical lows for a years. What exactly are you concerned about?

afcjets wrote:
casinterest wrote:
afcjets wrote:
Keep changing the subject all you want, but Trump is the one leading the racist, and xenophobic charge against a LEGAL caravan using taxpayer dollars.


This is exactly why it’s backfiring. No one believes (not that they ever did) or even cares when the left cries racism anymore.

Yah you've moved onto bigger and better things, like the MAGA bomber, and the MAGA Kroger shooter, and the MAGA Pittsburgh shooter--and that was barely one week. Honey you have left "racist" so far behind in the rear view mirro you're careening toward something far bigger and uglier
Last edited by MaverickM11 on Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
bagoldex
Posts: 846
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 3:33 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:09 pm

2122M wrote:
afcjets wrote:
2122M wrote:

Evidence? You keep saying this is a stunt and a creation of the left, but you cannot back that claim up. Is that because the claim is ridiculous?


“This was planned, just as the one before it in April of this year was. Back then, the other "caravan" started a similar odyssey. It was organized by a group called "Pueblo Sin Fronteras," or People Without Borders. What do they seek? That the U.S. "open the borders to us because we are as much citizens as the people of the countries where we are and/or travel."”


https://www.investors.com/politics/edit ... -meddling/


First of all, why doesn't IBD name the authors of their opinion pieces?


It's an editorial. No paper that I'm aware of, at least in the US or UK, lists individual names on such pieces.

Here are two of the crackpots behind their editorials ...

Terry Jones - https://twitter.com/ibd_tjones?lang=en
John Merline - https://twitter.com/ibd_jmerline?lang=en
Last edited by bagoldex on Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Flighty
Posts: 9723
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:07 am

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:17 pm

seb146 wrote:
Flighty wrote:
casinterest wrote:
So you are saying Canada and Denmark are better than the US? Trump supporters are really trying to destroy the US aren't they?

Or are you admitting you don't know anything about US border laws and transit visa's?


I was trying to ASK you a logical question. If these travelers have an absolute right to walk through any country to the country of their choice, THEN can we all claim that right on an unlimited basis?

What are the limitations to your worldview on immigration, if any?


The caravan's goal is the United States. They have said this. They have also said they will take a break in Mexico City and negotiate with Mexico about staying there. Any talk of Canada or Denmark is not valid.


And my goals include being Jessica Alba's next husband... so what?
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 16769
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:31 pm

Flighty wrote:
seb146 wrote:
Flighty wrote:

I was trying to ASK you a logical question. If these travelers have an absolute right to walk through any country to the country of their choice, THEN can we all claim that right on an unlimited basis?

What are the limitations to your worldview on immigration, if any?


The caravan's goal is the United States. They have said this. They have also said they will take a break in Mexico City and negotiate with Mexico about staying there. Any talk of Canada or Denmark is not valid.


And my goals include being Jessica Alba's next husband... so what?

And the answer to both is (probably) no. Case closed. Now why do you *really* think Trump is making this a national security crisis?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
afcjets
Posts: 2220
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:18 pm

Maybe the same reason Mexico’s president is.

“Women and children have been shoved to the fore of the columns to hide the fact that many of the 4,000 to 10,000-strong throng of people are in fact working-age males, not families. Already, in crossing the narrow entry from Guatemala into Mexico, the peaceful "caravan" members got violent, injuring four Mexican border police who stood in their way. It prompted a response from Mexico's president.

"Violent entry into the country not only threatens our sovereignty, but also puts the migrants themselves at risk," Mexico's President Pena Nieto said on social media. "Mexico does not permit and will not permit entry into its territory in an irregular fashion, much less in a violent fashion."”
 
bhill
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:39 pm

Folks...there is a reason these are Active Duty and not NG troops....if the majority of the citizens were for this, one would think the Governors would free up NG troops for this....show...
Carpe Pices
 
2122M
Posts: 775
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:45 pm

afcjets wrote:
Maybe the same reason Mexico’s president is.

“Women and children have been shoved to the fore of the columns to hide the fact that many of the 4,000 to 10,000-strong throng of people are in fact working-age males, not families. Already, in crossing the narrow entry from Guatemala into Mexico, the peaceful "caravan" members got violent, injuring four Mexican border police who stood in their way. It prompted a response from Mexico's president.

"Violent entry into the country not only threatens our sovereignty, but also puts the migrants themselves at risk," Mexico's President Pena Nieto said on social media. "Mexico does not permit and will not permit entry into its territory in an irregular fashion, much less in a violent fashion."”


Nieto also offered legal status and a path to permanent residency to the migrants.
 
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trpmb6
Posts: 1427
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Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:49 pm

bhill wrote:
Folks...there is a reason these are Active Duty and not NG troops....if the majority of the citizens were for this, one would think the Governors would free up NG troops for this....show...


NG troops have been mobilized in the past.

None of these personnel being sent down will be "deputized" which means they can't really enforce anything or make arrests. At least per my understanding. Feel free to correct me someone if that is incorrect. My reading of it suggests these personnel will just be used to mobilize and move CBP assets around and to supplement administrative tasks.
 
salttee
Posts: 2761
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 3:26 am

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:56 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
None of these personnel being sent down will be "deputized" which means they can't really enforce anything or make arrests.

And they cannot be "deputized" because of the posse comitatus act. That's how we can know that this is just some show business from Trump.
 
Flighty
Posts: 9723
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:07 am

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:26 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Flighty wrote:
seb146 wrote:

The caravan's goal is the United States. They have said this. They have also said they will take a break in Mexico City and negotiate with Mexico about staying there. Any talk of Canada or Denmark is not valid.


And my goals include being Jessica Alba's next husband... so what?

And the answer to both is (probably) no. Case closed. Now why do you *really* think Trump is making this a national security crisis?


Trump understands that putting some troops on the border will make voters happy. And he is right, it will.
 
bagoldex
Posts: 846
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 3:33 pm

Re: US military to send 5,200 troops, helicopters, heavy equipment to border

Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:02 pm

Flighty wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Flighty wrote:

And my goals include being Jessica Alba's next husband... so what?

And the answer to both is (probably) no. Case closed. Now why do you *really* think Trump is making this a national security crisis?


Trump understands that putting some troops on the border will make voters happy. And he is right, it will.


Some will be happy. Most will recognize it as a political ploy and a poor use of government resources.

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