Is there anything Trump could do to lose your support? Was he right when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose support? I mean this seriously. Do you have a line he should never cross and if you do, what is it?


Challenge for the forum: let's try to keep this discussion civil for as long as possible

Jouhou wrote:

Is there anything Trump could do to lose your support? Was he right when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose support? I mean this seriously. Do you have a line he should never cross and if you do, what is it?


Challenge for the forum: let's try to keep this discussion civil for as long as possible

I suppose if he shot Hilary or Obama he would maintain a lot of support...

Jouhou wrote:

Challenge for the forum: let's try to keep this discussion civil for as long as possible

I'm on your side here, I really am, but I would recommend changing the title of this thread if you are challenging others to keep it civil. Just my 2 cents.

Jouhou wrote:

Is there anything Trump could do to lose your support? Was he right when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose support? I mean this seriously. Do you have a line he should never cross and if you do, what is it?


Challenge for the forum: let's try to keep this discussion civil for as long as possible

As a conservative, and libertarian, but also a sentient being and thinker, I commend you for your grade A trolling here.

You clamor for civility whilst branding Trump supporters as cultists. That's a surefire way to kick off a good conversation.

slider wrote:

Jouhou wrote:

Is there anything Trump could do to lose your support? Was he right when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose support? I mean this seriously. Do you have a line he should never cross and if you do, what is it?


Challenge for the forum: let's try to keep this discussion civil for as long as possible

As a conservative, and libertarian, but also a sentient being and thinker, I commend you for your grade A trolling here.

You clamor for civility whilst branding Trump supporters as cultists. That's a surefire way to kick off a good conversation.

You see, the point was I'm going after a subset of "Trump supporters". If you take a close look at polling, about 15% of voters are only supporting him because of the (R) next to his name. They aren't the ones I'm curious about. I'm curious about the roughly 25% of the population that actually believe the man to be a good leader.

The light jab is meant to get those ones into the thread, and why I posed civility as a "challenge"

With Trump I don't know if the word support used for normal politicians really applies. I'm sure many people voted for him without ever supporting him, nor liking him, nor finding him decent or presidential. So they can't really be disappointed by the result.

A good test of someone's character is denying them what they want and seeing how they deal with that. TRump is being denied full and total and complete control over every aspect of everything. Demanding parades, demanding respect, demanding loyalty. Democrats saw Russian interference and are allowing law enforcement to investigate the Russian connections.

I, too, am curious about how trumpettes can blindly support this man even with the constant statements and reports he keeps putting out there? Why is there so much denial from them?

seb146 wrote:

A good test of someone's character is denying them what they want and seeing how they deal with that. TRump is being denied full and total and complete control over every aspect of everything. Demanding parades, demanding respect, demanding loyalty. Democrats saw Russian interference and are allowing law enforcement to investigate the Russian connections.

I, too, am curious about how trumpettes can blindly support this man even with the constant statements and reports he keeps putting out there? Why is there so much denial from them?

Anyone can demand to be taken seriously. Doesn't mean a thing.

Most Trump supporters do so because he's not a Democrat. This isn't anything surprising.

Democrats would be defending Clinton if she were president. It's better than having a republican. Duh.

Casobs wrote:

Democrats would be defending Clinton if she were president. It's better than having a republican. Duh.

Boy have we become a cynical bunch.

Why not take some time and seriously consider the following questions?

-How many of the "anti-Trump" posters identified as Republican prior to the election?

-How many of the "anti-Trump" posters still identify as true conservatives?

-How many of the "anti-Trump" posters have an active history on here of defending Clinton, or even being passionate about her, during the election?

-What is the general substance of the "anti-Trump" posters arguments against Trump?

-What is the general substance of the "anti-Democrat" posters against the Democrats?

Don't know why, but for some reason, when I read the thread title I thought this was about cheap alcoholic malt beverages

Casobs wrote:

seb146 wrote:

A good test of someone's character is denying them what they want and seeing how they deal with that. TRump is being denied full and total and complete control over every aspect of everything. Demanding parades, demanding respect, demanding loyalty. Democrats saw Russian interference and are allowing law enforcement to investigate the Russian connections.

I, too, am curious about how trumpettes can blindly support this man even with the constant statements and reports he keeps putting out there? Why is there so much denial from them?

Anyone can demand to be taken seriously. Doesn't mean a thing.

Most Trump supporters do so because he's not a Democrat. This isn't anything surprising.

Democrats would be defending Clinton if she were president. It's better than having a republican. Duh.

Except no. A lot of people, left, right, and center, voted for Hillary because of how rotten tRump is. She did win the popular vote by ~3,000,000 after all. That was the whole issue. Hillary would have been replaced by a stronger and better Democrat in 2020. And we would not have had to deal with the gas lighting and lying and ego stroking in the mean time. There are true Hillary supporters who believe she is the be all and end all, just like tRump supporters but, there are others who believe she was more qualified out of the four (or more) choices presented to us and simply wanted someone qualified. Even if she was not our first choice in the primary.

I keep making the argument that anyone would have been better than tRump on the Republican side. What was wrong with Ben Carson? What was wrong with Michelle Bachmann? What was wrong with Paul Ryan? Lindsey Graham? Republicans want people with no experience. I just named four Republicans who are much better than tRump IMO. What was wrong with them?

Jouhou wrote:

Is there anything Trump could do to lose your support? Was he right when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose support? I mean this seriously. Do you have a line he should never cross and if you do, what is it?

Interesting question where you probably fail to get an answer to.

seb146 wrote:

I keep making the argument that anyone would have been better than tRump on the Republican side. What was wrong with Ben Carson? What was wrong with Michelle Bachmann? What was wrong with Paul Ryan? Lindsey Graham? Republicans want people with no experience. I just named four Republicans who are much better than tRump IMO. What was wrong with them?

Trump went up against two of these people in the primaries and wiped the floor with them (maybe one, I cannot recall if Graham ran in 2016 or only 2012). Considering Trump's support among registered Republicans this party is basically his now and what he is saying is now the GOP platform.

Look at the recent senate primary in Virginia where a known White Supremacist won big in places like Farifax county and that is one of the most affluent districts in the country. Also look at Mark Sanford losing his primary when he was critical of Trump. The days of the old GOP are now gone as the only conservatives that are denouncing trump are not actively involved with the government or are retiring.

Jouhou wrote:

Is there anything Trump could do to lose your support? Was he right when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose support? I mean this seriously. Do you have a line he should never cross and if you do, what is it?

Challenge for the forum: let's try to keep this discussion civil for as long as possible

Well considering you have Rugy Giuliani on TV saying that the president cannot face charges (unless congress brings them) if he were to kill another person such as Comey it seems like that is the perception.

seb146 wrote:

Casobs wrote:

seb146 wrote:

A good test of someone's character is denying them what they want and seeing how they deal with that. TRump is being denied full and total and complete control over every aspect of everything. Demanding parades, demanding respect, demanding loyalty. Democrats saw Russian interference and are allowing law enforcement to investigate the Russian connections.

I, too, am curious about how trumpettes can blindly support this man even with the constant statements and reports he keeps putting out there? Why is there so much denial from them?

Anyone can demand to be taken seriously. Doesn't mean a thing.

Most Trump supporters do so because he's not a Democrat. This isn't anything surprising.

Democrats would be defending Clinton if she were president. It's better than having a republican. Duh.

Except no. A lot of people, left, right, and center, voted for Hillary because of how rotten tRump is. She did win the popular vote by ~3,000,000 after all. That was the whole issue. Hillary would have been replaced by a stronger and better Democrat in 2020. And we would not have had to deal with the gas lighting and lying and ego stroking in the mean time. There are true Hillary supporters who believe she is the be all and end all, just like tRump supporters but, there are others who believe she was more qualified out of the four (or more) choices presented to us and simply wanted someone qualified. Even if she was not our first choice in the primary.

I keep making the argument that anyone would have been better than tRump on the Republican side. What was wrong with Ben Carson? What was wrong with Michelle Bachmann? What was wrong with Paul Ryan? Lindsey Graham? Republicans want people with no experience. I just named four Republicans who are much better than tRump IMO. What was wrong with them?

They were more of the status quo. Same old stuff. People wanted to shake things up a bit. Things already sucked so why not blow it all up? It's not like they're going to get their jobs back anyway. Let's throw a wrench into everything.

And look at where we are. Things are fine. Economy is great. Unemployment is low. Twitter insults mean nothing. Trade is up. It's all ok.... Just look around.

It's not based on any logic or anything. It's all feelings. It's not hard to understand.

Who is the last republican president you voted for Seb?

Casobs wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Casobs wrote:

Anyone can demand to be taken seriously. Doesn't mean a thing.

Most Trump supporters do so because he's not a Democrat. This isn't anything surprising.

Democrats would be defending Clinton if she were president. It's better than having a republican. Duh.

Except no. A lot of people, left, right, and center, voted for Hillary because of how rotten tRump is. She did win the popular vote by ~3,000,000 after all. That was the whole issue. Hillary would have been replaced by a stronger and better Democrat in 2020. And we would not have had to deal with the gas lighting and lying and ego stroking in the mean time. There are true Hillary supporters who believe she is the be all and end all, just like tRump supporters but, there are others who believe she was more qualified out of the four (or more) choices presented to us and simply wanted someone qualified. Even if she was not our first choice in the primary.

I keep making the argument that anyone would have been better than tRump on the Republican side. What was wrong with Ben Carson? What was wrong with Michelle Bachmann? What was wrong with Paul Ryan? Lindsey Graham? Republicans want people with no experience. I just named four Republicans who are much better than tRump IMO. What was wrong with them?

They were more of the status quo. Same old stuff. People wanted to shake things up a bit. Things already sucked so why not blow it all up? It's not like they're going to get their jobs back anyway. Let's throw a wrench into everything.

And look at where we are. Things are fine. Economy is great. Unemployment is low. Twitter insults mean nothing. Trade is up. It's all ok.... Just look around.

It's not based on any logic or anything. It's all feelings. It's not hard to understand.

Who is the last republican president you voted for Seb?

The numbers may look great on the outside, just like they did when Obama was president. Keep in mind that he was a Washington outsider, as well. His family was not wealthy, he put himself through school and unemployment numbers went down while the Stock Market rose. Our world standing improved. Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

seb146 wrote:

Casobs wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Except no. A lot of people, left, right, and center, voted for Hillary because of how rotten tRump is. She did win the popular vote by ~3,000,000 after all. That was the whole issue. Hillary would have been replaced by a stronger and better Democrat in 2020. And we would not have had to deal with the gas lighting and lying and ego stroking in the mean time. There are true Hillary supporters who believe she is the be all and end all, just like tRump supporters but, there are others who believe she was more qualified out of the four (or more) choices presented to us and simply wanted someone qualified. Even if she was not our first choice in the primary.

I keep making the argument that anyone would have been better than tRump on the Republican side. What was wrong with Ben Carson? What was wrong with Michelle Bachmann? What was wrong with Paul Ryan? Lindsey Graham? Republicans want people with no experience. I just named four Republicans who are much better than tRump IMO. What was wrong with them?

They were more of the status quo. Same old stuff. People wanted to shake things up a bit. Things already sucked so why not blow it all up? It's not like they're going to get their jobs back anyway. Let's throw a wrench into everything.

And look at where we are. Things are fine. Economy is great. Unemployment is low. Twitter insults mean nothing. Trade is up. It's all ok.... Just look around.

It's not based on any logic or anything. It's all feelings. It's not hard to understand.

Who is the last republican president you voted for Seb?

The numbers may look great on the outside, just like they did when Obama was president. Keep in mind that he was a Washington outsider, as well. His family was not wealthy, he put himself through school and unemployment numbers went down while the Stock Market rose. Our world standing improved. Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

It's about feelings. I keep saying that. The only thing ardent fans care about is feelings and owning the libs. Stop trying to introduce logic into it. It's a fan club. Just like Obama voters would never vote for a republican super Trump fans won't vote for a Democrat. It'll all switch over to the Dems after this or the next election cycle. Everyone needs to chill.

It's all emotion based voting. That is the answer.

To the OP: I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple.

seb146 wrote:

Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We're still not going to those honest conversations when you deliberately misrepresent and smear people who view things differently. It's long time to be a mature person. We'll be waiting.

MSPNWA wrote:

To the OP: I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple.

So, by your own admission, he has your mindless support until the next election?

The self-deception is astonishing.

[quote=“MSPNWA”]

seb146 wrote:

Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We're still not going to those honest conversations when you deliberately misrepresent and smear people who view things differently. It's long time to be a mature person. We'll be waiting.[/quote]

Oh what a priceless double standard and cop out.

MSPNWA wrote:

To the OP: I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple.

And that is a reasonable statement.

MSPNWA wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We're still not going to those honest conversations when you deliberately misrepresent and smear people who view things differently. It's long time to be a mature person. We'll be waiting.

Who did I "misrepresnt" and "smear"?

Casobs wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Casobs wrote:

They were more of the status quo. Same old stuff. People wanted to shake things up a bit. Things already sucked so why not blow it all up? It's not like they're going to get their jobs back anyway. Let's throw a wrench into everything.

And look at where we are. Things are fine. Economy is great. Unemployment is low. Twitter insults mean nothing. Trade is up. It's all ok.... Just look around.

It's not based on any logic or anything. It's all feelings. It's not hard to understand.

Who is the last republican president you voted for Seb?

The numbers may look great on the outside, just like they did when Obama was president. Keep in mind that he was a Washington outsider, as well. His family was not wealthy, he put himself through school and unemployment numbers went down while the Stock Market rose. Our world standing improved. Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

It's about feelings. I keep saying that. The only thing ardent fans care about is feelings and owning the libs. Stop trying to introduce logic into it. It's a fan club. Just like Obama voters would never vote for a republican super Trump fans won't vote for a Democrat. It'll all switch over to the Dems after this or the next election cycle. Everyone needs to chill.

It's all emotion based voting. That is the answer.

This is not the same thing as Obama. Comparing Obama to tRump is comparing Gulfstream V to a Pinto. I know there are reasonable Republican candidates that Obama voters would vote for or, at the very least, consider. The tRump base (NOT TRUMP VOTERS IN GENERAL) would never ever be caught dead voting for ANYONE with a (D) behind their name. Obama voters understand that was a part of history but we need to move on to another candidate. Granted, there is probably some who will treat Obama the way Republicans treat Reagan. But, a vast majority of Obama voters understand he was not the greatest but certainly not the worst and are looking for someone as good, just not him.

seb146 wrote:

Casobs wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Except no. A lot of people, left, right, and center, voted for Hillary because of how rotten tRump is. She did win the popular vote by ~3,000,000 after all. That was the whole issue. Hillary would have been replaced by a stronger and better Democrat in 2020. And we would not have had to deal with the gas lighting and lying and ego stroking in the mean time. There are true Hillary supporters who believe she is the be all and end all, just like tRump supporters but, there are others who believe she was more qualified out of the four (or more) choices presented to us and simply wanted someone qualified. Even if she was not our first choice in the primary.

I keep making the argument that anyone would have been better than tRump on the Republican side. What was wrong with Ben Carson? What was wrong with Michelle Bachmann? What was wrong with Paul Ryan? Lindsey Graham? Republicans want people with no experience. I just named four Republicans who are much better than tRump IMO. What was wrong with them?

They were more of the status quo. Same old stuff. People wanted to shake things up a bit. Things already sucked so why not blow it all up? It's not like they're going to get their jobs back anyway. Let's throw a wrench into everything.

And look at where we are. Things are fine. Economy is great. Unemployment is low. Twitter insults mean nothing. Trade is up. It's all ok.... Just look around.

It's not based on any logic or anything. It's all feelings. It's not hard to understand.

Who is the last republican president you voted for Seb?

The numbers may look great on the outside, just like they did when Obama was president. Keep in mind that he was a Washington outsider, as well. His family was not wealthy, he put himself through school and unemployment numbers went down while the Stock Market rose. Our world standing improved. Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We should have 'locked the bitch up" the bias on her 'investigation" was laughable I can only hope she will eventually meet her justice one day. If you want to talk about cults how about the bots who followed Obummer. I was watching Laura Ingraham tonight and it was funny to see how the media and hollyweird just fawned over that guy with Chris Matthews thrill down his leg being the most comical. Oh and holding power? PLEEEZE this is precisely why the dems want illegals and amnesty it is their future voting base. Look Trump for a lot of reasons people have issues with him and I can see why he can and is like a child at times he cannot take criticism at all and is a egomaniac but Obama was an egomaniac as well guess it comes with the job. ACA was a noble cause but as usual government can never do anything right. More people have been hurt by ACA then helped. Offering coverage for those who don't have it by punishing those who do is not a good system not to mention the deductables so high you might as well not have insurance. Getting off fossil fuels? You mean like Al Gore? who preaches lean and green but zips around in his private jet and huge SUV and not to mention he has a vested interest in green projects since it will line his pockets. Talk about conflicts of interest. Come on Seb lets face it both parties suck. They both have their vested interests and ways to stay in power. That's why I didn't vote for 20+ years. I won't live to see anyone of any party do a damn thing but further their own interests. I got sucked into Trump but I have again lost interest in all of it. I am here to point out the hypocrisy of liberals but both parties are guilty of it. Oh and Puerto Rico was a disaster before the hurricanes ever hit that island but I guess you can blame Trump for that too why not.

jetero wrote:

[
So, by your own admission, he has your mindless support until the next election?

Oh what a priceless double standard and cop out.

Where has that been admitted? Did you even read what I said?

Truth hurts obviously.

seb146 wrote:

Who did I "misrepresnt" and "smear"?

If you don't know, then we're still not having that conversation. Give you a hint - it *might* be in what I quoted from you. Generally that's how it works in a forum.

So much energy being put into hating Trump.

Hilary was shithouse, hence why Trump even had a sniff.

Instead of addressing why the libs ended up with Hilary as their option, they instead start thread after thread after thread about Trump.

Pathetic bunch.

Trump's a knob. Yet he still beat you. That should be the left's main concern. But being pathetic, it's not.

Fun to watch but

stratosphere wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Casobs wrote:

They were more of the status quo. Same old stuff. People wanted to shake things up a bit. Things already sucked so why not blow it all up? It's not like they're going to get their jobs back anyway. Let's throw a wrench into everything.

And look at where we are. Things are fine. Economy is great. Unemployment is low. Twitter insults mean nothing. Trade is up. It's all ok.... Just look around.

It's not based on any logic or anything. It's all feelings. It's not hard to understand.

Who is the last republican president you voted for Seb?

The numbers may look great on the outside, just like they did when Obama was president. Keep in mind that he was a Washington outsider, as well. His family was not wealthy, he put himself through school and unemployment numbers went down while the Stock Market rose. Our world standing improved. Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We should have 'locked the bitch up" the bias on her 'investigation" was laughable I can only hope she will eventually meet her justice one day.

She tesitfied under oath. She took full responsibility for her actions. How should she be locked up when the investigation was closed with no criminal wrongdoing found? The REPUBLICANS found NOTHING. AGAIN. As usual, she is guilty because "Hillary" is a key word that sets off righties. The only thing righties think, hear, and speak when "Hillary" is said is hate and lies and vitriol.

I still have no clue as to why tRump is better. Just that he is not Hillary.

Oh, wait... He is not a career politician. That's it. I am not a career politician, either. I guess I should be president next. Well, that wouldn't work.... I have never declared bankruptcy, never been with prostitutes, and hate that foreign governments want to decide our leaders. I guess I would be awful....

MSPNWA wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Who did I "misrepresnt" and "smear"?

If you don't know, then we're still not having that conversation. Give you a hint - it *might* be in what I quoted from you. Generally that's how it works in a forum.

So I didn't. Thanks.

Freakysh wrote:

So much energy being put into hating Trump.

Hilary was shithouse, hence why Trump even had a sniff.

Instead of addressing why the libs ended up with Hilary as their option, they instead start thread after thread after thread about Trump.

Pathetic bunch.

Trump's a knob. Yet he still beat you. That should be the left's main concern. But being pathetic, it's not.

Fun to watch but

Because he won the popular vote by ~3,000,000? That's right... He only won the low-information, flyover state vote. All because "but her emails!" And you all fell for it. That was her worst "scandal." Doing what other high ranking government officials have been doing under both Republican and Democratic leadership. All so you righties could lulz at "liberals." No other reason. I hope destroying the Republic was worth it.

Everyone kept telling you how toxic tRump was. Even your own mouthpieces. But, no. It is so much better to watch "liberals" go ballistic over tRump saying "I am going to lie to you and tell you that you never heard a lie..."

It would be so funny, if it were not true.

seb146 wrote:

Freakysh wrote:

So much energy being put into hating Trump.

Hilary was shithouse, hence why Trump even had a sniff.

Instead of addressing why the libs ended up with Hilary as their option, they instead start thread after thread after thread about Trump.

Pathetic bunch.

Trump's a knob. Yet he still beat you. That should be the left's main concern. But being pathetic, it's not.

Fun to watch but

Because he won the popular vote by ~3,000,000? That's right... He only won the low-information, flyover state vote. All because "but her emails!" And you all fell for it. That was her worst "scandal." Doing what other high ranking government officials have been doing under both Republican and Democratic leadership. All so you righties could lulz at "liberals." No other reason. I hope destroying the Republic was worth it.

Everyone kept telling you how toxic tRump was. Even your own mouthpieces. But, no. It is so much better to watch "liberals" go ballistic over tRump saying "I am going to lie to you and tell you that you never heard a lie..."

It would be so funny, if it were not true.

FMD you're a drama queen.

He's President. Deal with it

jetero wrote:

MSPNWA wrote:

To the OP: I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple.

So, by your own admission, he has your mindless support until the next election?

The self-deception is astonishing.

[quote=“MSPNWA”]

seb146 wrote:

Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We're still not going to those honest conversations when you deliberately misrepresent and smear people who view things differently. It's long time to be a mature person. We'll be waiting.

To be fair, I think he's saying he's one of the 15% of trump supporters who are really just supporting the (R) next to his name. Not the 25% who I genuinely find frightening. I know the 15% have a line where they say enough is enough, but the 25% make me wonder. And none of those people who are on this forum have come in here and told us yet what exactly their limits are, if they exist.

seb146 wrote:

stratosphere wrote:

seb146 wrote:

The numbers may look great on the outside, just like they did when Obama was president. Keep in mind that he was a Washington outsider, as well. His family was not wealthy, he put himself through school and unemployment numbers went down while the Stock Market rose. Our world standing improved. Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We should have 'locked the bitch up" the bias on her 'investigation" was laughable I can only hope she will eventually meet her justice one day.

She tesitfied under oath. She took full responsibility for her actions. How should she be locked up when the investigation was closed with no criminal wrongdoing found? The REPUBLICANS found NOTHING. AGAIN. As usual, she is guilty because "Hillary" is a key word that sets off righties. The only thing righties think, hear, and speak when "Hillary" is said is hate and lies and vitriol.

I still have no clue as to why tRump is better. Just that he is not Hillary.

Oh, wait... He is not a career politician. That's it. I am not a career politician, either. I guess I should be president next. Well, that wouldn't work.... I have never declared bankruptcy, never been with prostitutes, and hate that foreign governments want to decide our leaders. I guess I would be awful....

If Russia was so bad I wonder why Hillary had her hands all up in uranium one OH GOSH! ..I am ok with any and all attacks on Trump he deserves it . But Hillary and the Clintons in general I cannot for the life of me understand why you all defend them. They are as evil and corrupt as it gets and it's out in the open but you are all blind and they are all teflon much like John Gotti was you know "teflon don" but even he got it in the end as they will too. Why is Haiti still a third would S hole after all that money the Clintons raised to rebuild that country after the earthquake? Haiti looks as bad if not worse than when the earthquake hit. But I am sure nothing is suspect here. Also seems like a lot of people wind up dead that have any connections to them must be a flu or something. She has thousands of E mails from a private server and Obama said he didn't know about until the media exposed it but has now been found out that Obama got E mails from that private server so he knew it all along. Then she destroyed thousands of E mails after being supoenaed and smashed hard drives and the bleachbit deal but no she has nothing to hide (rolls eyes) yeah go ahead keep on defending these scumbags.

Colt 45 and 2 zig zags...

Oh wrong thread.

stratosphere wrote:

seb146 wrote:

stratosphere wrote:

We should have 'locked the bitch up" the bias on her 'investigation" was laughable I can only hope she will eventually meet her justice one day.

She tesitfied under oath. She took full responsibility for her actions. How should she be locked up when the investigation was closed with no criminal wrongdoing found? The REPUBLICANS found NOTHING. AGAIN. As usual, she is guilty because "Hillary" is a key word that sets off righties. The only thing righties think, hear, and speak when "Hillary" is said is hate and lies and vitriol.

I still have no clue as to why tRump is better. Just that he is not Hillary.

Oh, wait... He is not a career politician. That's it. I am not a career politician, either. I guess I should be president next. Well, that wouldn't work.... I have never declared bankruptcy, never been with prostitutes, and hate that foreign governments want to decide our leaders. I guess I would be awful....

If Russia was so bad I wonder why Hillary had her hands all up in uranium one OH GOSH! ..I am ok with any and all attacks on Trump he deserves it . But Hillary and the Clintons in general I cannot for the life of me understand why you all defend them. They are as evil and corrupt as it gets and it's out in the open but you are all blind and they are all teflon much like John Gotti was you know "teflon don" but even he got it in the end as they will too. Why is Haiti still a third would S hole after all that money the Clintons raised to rebuild that country after the earthquake? Haiti looks as bad if not worse than when the earthquake hit. But I am sure nothing is suspect here. Also seems like a lot of people wind up dead that have any connections to them must be a flu or something. She has thousands of E mails from a private server and Obama said he didn't know about until the media exposed it but has now been found out that Obama got E mails from that private server so he knew it all along. Then she destroyed thousands of E mails after being supoenaed and smashed hard drives and the bleachbit deal but no she has nothing to hide (rolls eyes) yeah go ahead keep on defending these scumbags.

Republicans use private and unsecured emails and smart phones and we should not care

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/pol ... e9d8f20036
http://thehill.com/homenews/administrat ... hite-house

They are told to destroy their computers and phones and we should not care

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/n ... es-w521199

But no private company should ever follow the rules when Hillary is less than six degrees of separation from any company!

https://www.factcheck.org/2017/10/facts-uranium-one/

Russia is crowing they have a puppet in the White House. How is that better than Hillary? Knowing righties have been played?

As far as "defending those scum bags" at least they had the cajones to testify under oath and face law enforcement in front of God and America. She is not ideal but she is better than tRump!

Jouhou wrote:

jetero wrote:

MSPNWA wrote:

To the OP: I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple.

So, by your own admission, he has your mindless support until the next election?

The self-deception is astonishing.

[quote=“MSPNWA”]

seb146 wrote:

Now, hurling insults seems to be the American thing to do. Hating anyone not white is the American thing to do. Our world standing is crumbling and the right is cheering that on. The right is cheering hatred of immigrant children. The right is cheering people getting sick. The right is cheering taking away press passes and firing editorial staff. The right is cheering 1984.

The right keeps insisting, suggesting, and outright demanding that Democrats vote for who the right wants. "Anyone but Hillary" or "Swift Boating" or "Nobama." The only reason righties get involved in politics is to hold power. Not actually do anything, but hold power and hurl insults.

What is the alternative to ACA? What is the alternative to long term education loans? What is the solution for Puerto Rico? What is the solution for Flint? What is the solution for getting off fossil fuel? At least these questions are answered by Democrats. Nothing actually gets done, but it is better than "but her emails!" or "lock the bi*ch up!"

We're still not going to those honest conversations when you deliberately misrepresent and smear people who view things differently. It's long time to be a mature person. We'll be waiting.

To be fair, I think he's saying he's one of the 15% of trump supporters who are really just supporting the (R) next to his name. Not the 25% who I genuinely find frightening. I know the 15% have a line where they say enough is enough, but the 25% make me wonder. And none of those people who are on this forum have come in here and told us yet what exactly their limits are, if they exist.

What does it matter.

There's the 75% of libs that don't have a line where they say Trump has done something good. They'll always find a negative spin to any of his actions.

End of the day, who gives a fark

Dutchy wrote:

Jouhou wrote:

Is there anything Trump could do to lose your support? Was he right when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose support? I mean this seriously. Do you have a line he should never cross and if you do, what is it?

Interesting question where you probably fail to get an answer to.

That was my assumption when I saw the threat, but I didn't want to post that.
No Trump fan will specify a hard, red line Trump can't cross or they abbandom him, because after 1.5 years they know they probably don't have enough imagination to come up with anything that he may not actually do one day.

Plus once they think about it, they probably realize Trump has done lots of stuff they considered beyond the pale before, unless they have no moral or ethics.

Best regards
Thomas

Freakysh wrote:

What does it matter.

There's the 75% of libs that don't have a line where they say Trump has done something good. They'll always find a negative spin to any of his actions.

This is actually a fair whataboutism. I am on record saying that it this North Korea - USA meeting leads to something good, I will give Trump some credits for this. I do not follow American politics that closely of course, so I haven't seen anything what Trump did so far warrant me to give him a compliment. But there are many things Trump could do which I consider good, but you would all consider them bad for the country.

Dutchy wrote:

Freakysh wrote:

What does it matter.

There's the 75% of libs that don't have a line where they say Trump has done something good. They'll always find a negative spin to any of his actions.

This is actually a fair whataboutism. I am on record saying that it this North Korea - USA meeting leads to something good, I will give Trump some credits for this. I do not follow American politics that closely of course, so I haven't seen anything what Trump did so far warrant me to give him a compliment. But there are many things Trump could do which I consider good, but you would all consider them bad for the country.

Freaky is about as American as you are Dutchy, he says what he says from an outsiders perspective. However, he does seem to indicate he'd join the ranks of the Khmer Rubes if he did live here.

The authentic ones we see all the time in here have fallen silent, interestingly.

MSPNWA wrote:

Where has that been admitted? Did you even read what I said?

How else does this translate? I don't speak Iowan.

MSPNWA wrote:

I won't support him if a superior candidate is present.

MSPNWA wrote:

Truth hurts obviously.

I would say it does, but I would also say you don't know it from an ear of corn.

Freakysh wrote:

He's President. Deal with it

Freaky for someone so concerned about making post after post after post with essentially the same theme, when are you going to stop with the "get over it," "nothing to see here," "suck it up," "just accept it" posts?

The President of the United States is an unabashed liar and, if he didn't conspire with a foreign government to get into office, he sure as hell did conspire with a bunch of criminals. That's not surprisingly a conversation topic in the United States. GET OVER IT.

Freakysh wrote:

Jouhou wrote:

jetero wrote:

So, by your own admission, he has your mindless support until the next election?

The self-deception is astonishing.

[quote=“MSPNWA”]

We're still not going to those honest conversations when you deliberately misrepresent and smear people who view things differently. It's long time to be a mature person. We'll be waiting.

To be fair, I think he's saying he's one of the 15% of trump supporters who are really just supporting the (R) next to his name. Not the 25% who I genuinely find frightening. I know the 15% have a line where they say enough is enough, but the 25% make me wonder. And none of those people who are on this forum have come in here and told us yet what exactly their limits are, if they exist.

What does it matter.

There's the 75% of libs that don't have a line where they say Trump has done something good. They'll always find a negative spin to any of his actions.

End of the day, who gives a fark

Kinda like the 75% of righties that don't have a line where they say Obama has done something good?

Look at the Iran deal. None of the righties knew much about it or cared, except the money that was contractually obligated to Iran and belonged to them in the first place. Once tRump cancelled the deal and he and MSM said it was awful is when the base got involved and simply parroted the reasons why Obama made a bad deal.

Repeal and replace. We all agree that ACA was not the best. But, it was better than what was before. TRump and Republicans took the teeth out of it and We The People are now paying for it. The base are even celebrating going deep into debt because "Obamacare was awful!" I don't get it.

I still want to know, honestly, why tRump over a candidate of substance? I have given three names that I believe would have been better than him. So far, all I have gotten is "he is unfiltered" and "he knows what his base wants to hear." That's it. That is not leadership. That is motivational speaking or one of those 1-900 psychics.

There is a scene in the 1990s movie "Jeffrey" about a motivational speaker played by Sigourney Weaver. She uses a lot of words. The best words. Words that her people love. She says nothing. But her people feel great when she uses the best words. Is that what righties are saying?

seb146 wrote:

Freakysh wrote:

Jouhou wrote:

To be fair, I think he's saying he's one of the 15% of trump supporters who are really just supporting the (R) next to his name. Not the 25% who I genuinely find frightening. I know the 15% have a line where they say enough is enough, but the 25% make me wonder. And none of those people who are on this forum have come in here and told us yet what exactly their limits are, if they exist.

What does it matter.

There's the 75% of libs that don't have a line where they say Trump has done something good. They'll always find a negative spin to any of his actions.

End of the day, who gives a fark

Kinda like the 75% of righties that don't have a line where they say Obama has done something good?

Look at the Iran deal. None of the righties knew much about it or cared, except the money that was contractually obligated to Iran and belonged to them in the first place. Once tRump cancelled the deal and he and MSM said it was awful is when the base got involved and simply parroted the reasons why Obama made a bad deal.

Repeal and replace. We all agree that ACA was not the best. But, it was better than what was before. TRump and Republicans took the teeth out of it and We The People are now paying for it. The base are even celebrating going deep into debt because "Obamacare was awful!" I don't get it.

I still want to know, honestly, why tRump over a candidate of substance? I have given three names that I believe would have been better than him. So far, all I have gotten is "he is unfiltered" and "he knows what his base wants to hear." That's it. That is not leadership. That is motivational speaking or one of those 1-900 psychics.

There is a scene in the 1990s movie "Jeffrey" about a motivational speaker played by Sigourney Weaver. She uses a lot of words. The best words. Words that her people love. She says nothing. But her people feel great when she uses the best words. Is that what righties are saying?

The Iran deal seems like something where we gave something to Iran and didnt get anything in return. With respect to Mr. Obama, based on what I have seen in the North Korea deal, there is very little difference in the Iran Deal and the Korean deal aside from the man who struck them. Which is why you have each sides base applauding their own guy, and criticizing the other guy. I am not convinced either deal was good for the US.

As for the ACA, there is one provision in there that is better than what we had before, which is the preexisting conditions. I have no issues with that. The rest of the law seems to make no sense, and my premiums have skyrocketed. At my employer for example, under a bankruptcy union contract the Health Care benefits were very generous (Sort of one of those cadillac plans talked about). Now my company is very profitable and is trying to negotiate a contract with less generous Health Care benefits saying the old benefits are now too expensive. While I dont see how an employer can afford something in a bankruptcy contract and not in a contract during a profitable period, the fact that the latter comes after the ACA makes me believe the ACA had a lot to do with it. We clearly need something better. I think if you leave the individual mandate in and go back to the old way it would help a bit. But the costs of health care themselves have never been addressed, only the insurance side, and until you address the actual costs this issue will never be solved.

You mentioned Carson, Rubio, and Bachmann. I would have been happy with any of those candidates. I did not vote for Trump in the primary as I have always been a never Trumper. If you look at the primary results, most of the primary voters didnt even vote for Trump. Trump's support in the primary came from two places. Rednecks in the south, and Moderates in Blue States who may have felt any of the other candidates was too conservative, or crossed over hoping to manipulate the nomination to improve Hillary's chances. There are red states where Trump is hated (Utah comes to mind). The only thing I can think of as to why Trump is because many conservative voters are so sick of Washington they wanted someone who had no association what so ever. And while some good things have happened, a lot of very inhumane stuff is happening, and it makes me sick. But one question I have to my democratic friends. Everyone knew Hillary was toxic and was also hated. Why not someone more reasonable like a Joe Biden, or a Dianne Feinstein type. Even Bernie, as whacko as I think some of his ideas are, would have been better.

I do hope that Trump is primaried, and that someone more reasonable like the people that Seb has mentioned is nominated. But I dont see that is happening, and it seems like these days if you oppose Trump you yourself are primaried and run out of town. All while the Dems move way to the left at the same time. What I would give for another party right now. Both parties right now scare me.

apodino wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Freakysh wrote:

What does it matter.

There's the 75% of libs that don't have a line where they say Trump has done something good. They'll always find a negative spin to any of his actions.

End of the day, who gives a fark

Kinda like the 75% of righties that don't have a line where they say Obama has done something good?

Look at the Iran deal. None of the righties knew much about it or cared, except the money that was contractually obligated to Iran and belonged to them in the first place. Once tRump cancelled the deal and he and MSM said it was awful is when the base got involved and simply parroted the reasons why Obama made a bad deal.

Repeal and replace. We all agree that ACA was not the best. But, it was better than what was before. TRump and Republicans took the teeth out of it and We The People are now paying for it. The base are even celebrating going deep into debt because "Obamacare was awful!" I don't get it.

I still want to know, honestly, why tRump over a candidate of substance? I have given three names that I believe would have been better than him. So far, all I have gotten is "he is unfiltered" and "he knows what his base wants to hear." That's it. That is not leadership. That is motivational speaking or one of those 1-900 psychics.

There is a scene in the 1990s movie "Jeffrey" about a motivational speaker played by Sigourney Weaver. She uses a lot of words. The best words. Words that her people love. She says nothing. But her people feel great when she uses the best words. Is that what righties are saying?

The Iran deal seems like something where we gave something to Iran and didnt get anything in return. With respect to Mr. Obama, based on what I have seen in the North Korea deal, there is very little difference in the Iran Deal and the Korean deal aside from the man who struck them. Which is why you have each sides base applauding their own guy, and criticizing the other guy. I am not convinced either deal was good for the US.

As for the ACA, there is one provision in there that is better than what we had before, which is the preexisting conditions. I have no issues with that. The rest of the law seems to make no sense, and my premiums have skyrocketed. At my employer for example, under a bankruptcy union contract the Health Care benefits were very generous (Sort of one of those cadillac plans talked about). Now my company is very profitable and is trying to negotiate a contract with less generous Health Care benefits saying the old benefits are now too expensive. While I dont see how an employer can afford something in a bankruptcy contract and not in a contract during a profitable period, the fact that the latter comes after the ACA makes me believe the ACA had a lot to do with it. We clearly need something better. I think if you leave the individual mandate in and go back to the old way it would help a bit. But the costs of health care themselves have never been addressed, only the insurance side, and until you address the actual costs this issue will never be solved.

You mentioned Carson, Rubio, and Bachmann. I would have been happy with any of those candidates. I did not vote for Trump in the primary as I have always been a never Trumper. If you look at the primary results, most of the primary voters didnt even vote for Trump. Trump's support in the primary came from two places. Rednecks in the south, and Moderates in Blue States who may have felt any of the other candidates was too conservative, or crossed over hoping to manipulate the nomination to improve Hillary's chances. There are red states where Trump is hated (Utah comes to mind). The only thing I can think of as to why Trump is because many conservative voters are so sick of Washington they wanted someone who had no association what so ever. And while some good things have happened, a lot of very inhumane stuff is happening, and it makes me sick. But one question I have to my democratic friends. Everyone knew Hillary was toxic and was also hated. Why not someone more reasonable like a Joe Biden, or a Dianne Feinstein type. Even Bernie, as whacko as I think some of his ideas are, would have been better.

I do hope that Trump is primaried, and that someone more reasonable like the people that Seb has mentioned is nominated. But I dont see that is happening, and it seems like these days if you oppose Trump you yourself are primaried and run out of town. All while the Dems move way to the left at the same time. What I would give for another party right now. Both parties right now scare me.

Finally an honest answer. Thank you. There are points I would like to take up about the Iran deal and Hillary, but this thread is about the right wing base being so infatuated with tRump, so I will leave it alone. Thank you.

apodino wrote:

The Iran deal seems like something where we gave something to Iran and didnt get anything in return.

Except we did get something in the Iran deal. We got a tangible, measurable timeline to Iran drawing down nuclear capabilities as well as the right for the US to send inspectors to ensure compliance. And yes, we unfroze Iran's assets, but that's part of the deal.

With North Korea's "deal" (not sure it even qualifies), NK gets worldwide credibility and acknowledgement, a drawing down of military exercises in South Korea, and the US got....a photo op for Trump and a hollow promise with no enforcement mechanisms, which is essentially what NK has been doing for the last 30 years.

Goddamn, we might be able to get to a better place in this country if Republicans would pay the same attention to facts that the rest of us are.

Jouhou wrote:

To be fair, I think he's saying he's one of the 15% of trump supporters who are really just supporting the (R) next to his name. Not the 25% who I genuinely find frightening. I know the 15% have a line where they say enough is enough, but the 25% make me wonder. And none of those people who are on this forum have come in here and told us yet what exactly their limits are, if they exist.

Haha. Almost couldn't be more wrong. But keep guessing. The last thing I care about in a politician is the letter next to their name. Wish the country as a whole voted the same way.

jetero wrote:

How else does this translate? I don't speak Iowan.

Let's try it again. I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple. I don't speak Iowan either (ick), so that shouldn't be your problem.

MSPNWA wrote:

Jouhou wrote:

To be fair, I think he's saying he's one of the 15% of trump supporters who are really just supporting the (R) next to his name. Not the 25% who I genuinely find frightening. I know the 15% have a line where they say enough is enough, but the 25% make me wonder. And none of those people who are on this forum have come in here and told us yet what exactly their limits are, if they exist.

Haha. Almost couldn't be more wrong. But keep guessing. The last thing I care about in a politician is the letter next to their name. Wish the country as a whole voted the same way.

So why didn't you vote for Gary Johnson or Jill Stein or write in a candidate? Just curious.

Let's try it again. I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple.

So you agree with mocking disabled reporters or grabbing women by their private parts or multiple marriages when the official party platform is "marriage is one man one woman, decreed by God"?

MSPNWA wrote:

Jouhou wrote:

To be fair, I think he's saying he's one of the 15% of trump supporters who are really just supporting the (R) next to his name. Not the 25% who I genuinely find frightening. I know the 15% have a line where they say enough is enough, but the 25% make me wonder. And none of those people who are on this forum have come in here and told us yet what exactly their limits are, if they exist.

Haha. Almost couldn't be more wrong. But keep guessing. The last thing I care about in a politician is the letter next to their name. Wish the country as a whole voted the same way.

jetero wrote:

How else does this translate? I don't speak Iowan.

Let's try it again. I don't support him when he does something I don't agree with, and I won't support him if a superior candidate is present. Very simple. I don't speak Iowan either (ick), so that shouldn't be your problem.

So you're saying you are one of us independents that still supports trump? I know there were many who voted for him but I thought he lost most of us after the election.

seb146 wrote:

A good test of someone's character is denying them what they want and seeing how they deal with that. TRump is being denied full and total and complete control over every aspect of everything. Demanding parades, demanding respect, demanding loyalty. Democrats saw Russian interference and are allowing law enforcement to investigate the Russian connections.

I, too, am curious about how trumpettes can blindly support this man even with the constant statements and reports he keeps putting out there? Why is there so much denial from them?

I really wish there was a "like" feature on this forum like there is on Facebook. But since there isn't, I'll just say ditto.

apodino wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Freakysh wrote:

What does it matter.

There's the 75% of libs that don't have a line where they say Trump has done something good. They'll always find a negative spin to any of his actions.

End of the day, who gives a fark

Kinda like the 75% of righties that don't have a line where they say Obama has done something good?

Look at the Iran deal. None of the righties knew much about it or cared, except the money that was contractually obligated to Iran and belonged to them in the first place. Once tRump cancelled the deal and he and MSM said it was awful is when the base got involved and simply parroted the reasons why Obama made a bad deal.

Repeal and replace. We all agree that ACA was not the best. But, it was better than what was before. TRump and Republicans took the teeth out of it and We The People are now paying for it. The base are even celebrating going deep into debt because "Obamacare was awful!" I don't get it.

I still want to know, honestly, why tRump over a candidate of substance? I have given three names that I believe would have been better than him. So far, all I have gotten is "he is unfiltered" and "he knows what his base wants to hear." That's it. That is not leadership. That is motivational speaking or one of those 1-900 psychics.

There is a scene in the 1990s movie "Jeffrey" about a motivational speaker played by Sigourney Weaver. She uses a lot of words. The best words. Words that her people love. She says nothing. But her people feel great when she uses the best words. Is that what righties are saying?

The Iran deal seems like something where we gave something to Iran and didnt get anything in return. With respect to Mr. Obama, based on what I have seen in the North Korea deal, there is very little difference in the Iran Deal and the Korean deal aside from the man who struck them. Which is why you have each sides base applauding their own guy, and criticizing the other guy. I am not convinced either deal was good for the US.

As for the ACA, there is one provision in there that is better than what we had before, which is the preexisting conditions. I have no issues with that. The rest of the law seems to make no sense, and my premiums have skyrocketed. At my employer for example, under a bankruptcy union contract the Health Care benefits were very generous (Sort of one of those cadillac plans talked about). Now my company is very profitable and is trying to negotiate a contract with less generous Health Care benefits saying the old benefits are now too expensive. While I dont see how an employer can afford something in a bankruptcy contract and not in a contract during a profitable period, the fact that the latter comes after the ACA makes me believe the ACA had a lot to do with it. We clearly need something better. I think if you leave the individual mandate in and go back to the old way it would help a bit. But the costs of health care themselves have never been addressed, only the insurance side, and until you address the actual costs this issue will never be solved.

You mentioned Carson, Rubio, and Bachmann. I would have been happy with any of those candidates. I did not vote for Trump in the primary as I have always been a never Trumper. If you look at the primary results, most of the primary voters didnt even vote for Trump. Trump's support in the primary came from two places. Rednecks in the south, and Moderates in Blue States who may have felt any of the other candidates was too conservative, or crossed over hoping to manipulate the nomination to improve Hillary's chances. There are red states where Trump is hated (Utah comes to mind). The only thing I can think of as to why Trump is because many conservative voters are so sick of Washington they wanted someone who had no association what so ever. And while some good things have happened, a lot of very inhumane stuff is happening, and it makes me sick. But one question I have to my democratic friends. Everyone knew Hillary was toxic and was also hated. Why not someone more reasonable like a Joe Biden, or a Dianne Feinstein type. Even Bernie, as whacko as I think some of his ideas are, would have been better.

I do hope that Trump is primaried, and that someone more reasonable like the people that Seb has mentioned is nominated. But I dont see that is happening, and it seems like these days if you oppose Trump you yourself are primaried and run out of town. All while the Dems move way to the left at the same time. What I would give for another party right now. Both parties right now scare me.

I really agree with your question as to why Democrats offered Hillary as the candidate. It really makes me angry. Out of all of the talented people in the country who have the intellect, integrity, seriousness, and fundamental understanding of American and world history who could have been recruited to run, the party chose to offer someone who is toxic, disfavored by a large number of the electorate, and a representation of the old, tired Democratic guard. I consider myself an independent and moderate so I didn't feel any obligation to vote for Hillary out of a sense of loyalty to the Democratic party, but I felt I was forced to vote for her because of how fearful and sickened I was of the idea of someone like Donald Trump seriously having a chance of being elected to the United States presidency. This entire phenomenon is horrific and I can only hope that the country cleanses itself of the soot that is building up and proves to the world how a real democracy that is supposed to be an example of fairness, equality, success of diversity, morality, enlightenment and prosperity can overcome this type of a domestic political crisis. Ok. It's 1:38 a.m. and I've worn myself out. Insomnia has been cured. Goodnight.

jdstJD wrote:

apodino wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Kinda like the 75% of righties that don't have a line where they say Obama has done something good?

Look at the Iran deal. None of the righties knew much about it or cared, except the money that was contractually obligated to Iran and belonged to them in the first place. Once tRump cancelled the deal and he and MSM said it was awful is when the base got involved and simply parroted the reasons why Obama made a bad deal.

Repeal and replace. We all agree that ACA was not the best. But, it was better than what was before. TRump and Republicans took the teeth out of it and We The People are now paying for it. The base are even celebrating going deep into debt because "Obamacare was awful!" I don't get it.

I still want to know, honestly, why tRump over a candidate of substance? I have given three names that I believe would have been better than him. So far, all I have gotten is "he is unfiltered" and "he knows what his base wants to hear." That's it. That is not leadership. That is motivational speaking or one of those 1-900 psychics.

There is a scene in the 1990s movie "Jeffrey" about a motivational speaker played by Sigourney Weaver. She uses a lot of words. The best words. Words that her people love. She says nothing. But her people feel great when she uses the best words. Is that what righties are saying?

The Iran deal seems like something where we gave something to Iran and didnt get anything in return. With respect to Mr. Obama, based on what I have seen in the North Korea deal, there is very little difference in the Iran Deal and the Korean deal aside from the man who struck them. Which is why you have each sides base applauding their own guy, and criticizing the other guy. I am not convinced either deal was good for the US.

As for the ACA, there is one provision in there that is better than what we had before, which is the preexisting conditions. I have no issues with that. The rest of the law seems to make no sense, and my premiums have skyrocketed. At my employer for example, under a bankruptcy union contract the Health Care benefits were very generous (Sort of one of those cadillac plans talked about). Now my company is very profitable and is trying to negotiate a contract with less generous Health Care benefits saying the old benefits are now too expensive. While I dont see how an employer can afford something in a bankruptcy contract and not in a contract during a profitable period, the fact that the latter comes after the ACA makes me believe the ACA had a lot to do with it. We clearly need something better. I think if you leave the individual mandate in and go back to the old way it would help a bit. But the costs of health care themselves have never been addressed, only the insurance side, and until you address the actual costs this issue will never be solved.

You mentioned Carson, Rubio, and Bachmann. I would have been happy with any of those candidates. I did not vote for Trump in the primary as I have always been a never Trumper. If you look at the primary results, most of the primary voters didnt even vote for Trump. Trump's support in the primary came from two places. Rednecks in the south, and Moderates in Blue States who may have felt any of the other candidates was too conservative, or crossed over hoping to manipulate the nomination to improve Hillary's chances. There are red states where Trump is hated (Utah comes to mind). The only thing I can think of as to why Trump is because many conservative voters are so sick of Washington they wanted someone who had no association what so ever. And while some good things have happened, a lot of very inhumane stuff is happening, and it makes me sick. But one question I have to my democratic friends. Everyone knew Hillary was toxic and was also hated. Why not someone more reasonable like a Joe Biden, or a Dianne Feinstein type. Even Bernie, as whacko as I think some of his ideas are, would have been better.

I do hope that Trump is primaried, and that someone more reasonable like the people that Seb has mentioned is nominated. But I dont see that is happening, and it seems like these days if you oppose Trump you yourself are primaried and run out of town. All while the Dems move way to the left at the same time. What I would give for another party right now. Both parties right now scare me.

I really agree with your question as to why Democrats offered Hillary as the candidate. It really makes me angry. Out of all of the talented people in the country who have the intellect, integrity, seriousness, and fundamental understanding of American and world history who could have been recruited to run, the party chose to offer someone who is toxic, disfavored by a large number of the electorate, and a representation of the old, tired Democratic guard. I consider myself an independent and moderate so I didn't feel any obligation to vote for Hillary out of a sense of loyalty to the Democratic party, but I felt I was forced to vote for her because of how fearful and sickened I was of the idea of someone like Donald Trump seriously having a chance of being elected to the United States presidency. This entire phenomenon is horrific and I can only hope that the country cleanses itself of the soot that is building up and proves to the world how a real democracy that is supposed to be an example of fairness, equality, success of diversity, morality, enlightenment and prosperity can overcome this type of a domestic political crisis. Ok. It's 1:38 a.m. and I've worn myself out. Insomnia has been cured. Goodnight.

Hillary is not running again. Literally EVERY other Democratic candidate will face THE EXACT SAME HATE as Hillary. Period. The right does not care. The base will believe it.

Hillary was put forward because there was no one else. Bernie was good but not known, other than "at least he is not Hillary!" The end game is gaining support. Bernie would not do that the first term. Hillary would only continue the Obama hatred. That is: the name is Obama so we HAVE to hate him. Hillary would be the same. No reason for hatred other than the name.

Republicans say "I would consider any Democratic candidate that is not Hillary" but, the truth is they will NEVER EVER consider ANYONE with a (D) behind their name. Even a rich white straight Christian guy.

jdstJD wrote:

apodino wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Kinda like the 75% of righties that don't have a line where they say Obama has done something good?

Look at the Iran deal. None of the righties knew much about it or cared, except the money that was contractually obligated to Iran and belonged to them in the first place. Once tRump cancelled the deal and he and MSM said it was awful is when the base got involved and simply parroted the reasons why Obama made a bad deal.

Repeal and replace. We all agree that ACA was not the best. But, it was better than what was before. TRump and Republicans took the teeth out of it and We The People are now paying for it. The base are even celebrating going deep into debt because "Obamacare was awful!" I don't get it.

I still want to know, honestly, why tRump over a candidate of substance? I have given three names that I believe would have been better than him. So far, all I have gotten is "he is unfiltered" and "he knows what his base wants to hear." That's it. That is not leadership. That is motivational speaking or one of those 1-900 psychics.

There is a scene in the 1990s movie "Jeffrey" about a motivational speaker played by Sigourney Weaver. She uses a lot of words. The best words. Words that her people love. She says nothing. But her people feel great when she uses the best words. Is that what righties are saying?

The Iran deal seems like something where we gave something to Iran and didnt get anything in return. With respect to Mr. Obama, based on what I have seen in the North Korea deal, there is very little difference in the Iran Deal and the Korean deal aside from the man who struck them. Which is why you have each sides base applauding their own guy, and criticizing the other guy. I am not convinced either deal was good for the US.

As for the ACA, there is one provision in there that is better than what we had before, which is the preexisting conditions. I have no issues with that. The rest of the law seems to make no sense, and my premiums have skyrocketed. At my employer for example, under a bankruptcy union contract the Health Care benefits were very generous (Sort of one of those cadillac plans talked about). Now my company is very profitable and is trying to negotiate a contract with less generous Health Care benefits saying the old benefits are now too expensive. While I dont see how an employer can afford something in a bankruptcy contract and not in a contract during a profitable period, the fact that the latter comes after the ACA makes me believe the ACA had a lot to do with it. We clearly need something better. I think if you leave the individual mandate in and go back to the old way it would help a bit. But the costs of health care themselves have never been addressed, only the insurance side, and until you address the actual costs this issue will never be solved.

You mentioned Carson, Rubio, and Bachmann. I would have been happy with any of those candidates. I did not vote for Trump in the primary as I have always been a never Trumper. If you look at the primary results, most of the primary voters didnt even vote for Trump. Trump's support in the primary came from two places. Rednecks in the south, and Moderates in Blue States who may have felt any of the other candidates was too conservative, or crossed over hoping to manipulate the nomination to improve Hillary's chances. There are red states where Trump is hated (Utah comes to mind). The only thing I can think of as to why Trump is because many conservative voters are so sick of Washington they wanted someone who had no association what so ever. And while some good things have happened, a lot of very inhumane stuff is happening, and it makes me sick. But one question I have to my democratic friends. Everyone knew Hillary was toxic and was also hated. Why not someone more reasonable like a Joe Biden, or a Dianne Feinstein type. Even Bernie, as whacko as I think some of his ideas are, would have been better.

I do hope that Trump is primaried, and that someone more reasonable like the people that Seb has mentioned is nominated. But I dont see that is happening, and it seems like these days if you oppose Trump you yourself are primaried and run out of town. All while the Dems move way to the left at the same time. What I would give for another party right now. Both parties right now scare me.

I really agree with your question as to why Democrats offered Hillary as the candidate. It really makes me angry. Out of all of the talented people in the country who have the intellect, integrity, seriousness, and fundamental understanding of American and world history who could have been recruited to run, the party chose to offer someone who is toxic, disfavored by a large number of the electorate, and a representation of the old, tired Democratic guard. I consider myself an independent and moderate so I didn't feel any obligation to vote for Hillary out of a sense of loyalty to the Democratic party, but I felt I was forced to vote for her because of how fearful and sickened I was of the idea of someone like Donald Trump seriously having a chance of being elected to the United States presidency. This entire phenomenon is horrific and I can only hope that the country cleanses itself of the soot that is building up and proves to the world how a real democracy that is supposed to be an example of fairness, equality, success of diversity, morality, enlightenment and prosperity can overcome this type of a domestic political crisis. Ok. It's 1:38 a.m. and I've worn myself out. Insomnia has been cured. Goodnight.

Sums things up pretty well. I voted for Hillary in '16. But it was literally only because I thought she actually wanted the job vs Donald "Holy shit, how did I get here?" Trump. Beyond that, no measurable difference.

I'm not optimistic about our prospects in '20, but hopefully someone on the Democratic side can unseat this doofus. ..

vrbarreto wrote:

I suppose if he shot Hilary or Obama he would maintain a lot of support...

He didn't have to they shot themselves.

As for what he can do to lose my support I guess if he raised taxes to 60% on the rich, let anyone come in country illegally and let our enemies walk all over us I would probably stop supporting him but we already lived through that so.