It looks like the ANC haven’t watched and learnt much from what happened across the border in Zimbabwe.

Black South Africans need to take their land back from white ‘foreigners’, the leader of Black First Land First told RT. However, the president of the Transvaal Agricultural Union says this will lead to an ‘Arab Spring’.

South Africa's parliament voted on Tuesday in favor of new legislation that could see land from white farmers seized without providing any compensation.

I wonder what make the govt think this policy will be a success in South Africa when it was such a failure in Zimbabwe?

I guess this means that apartheid should be enforced again.

"told RT" Russia Today

787Driver wrote:

I guess this means that apartheid should be enforced again.

Basically it means the legacy that Mandela wanted for the country has been shat on, this is not what his vision of South Africa was. The ANC are corrupt, race based politics have failed and now they are blaming white people for 24 years of failures.

Dutchy wrote:

"told RT" Russia Today

Is News.com.au better.

SOUTH Africa’s parliament has voted in favour of a motion that will begin the process of amending the country’s Constitution to allow for the confiscation of white-owned land without compensation.

The motion was brought by Julius Malema, leader of the radical Marxist opposition party the Economic Freedom Fighters, and passed overwhelmingly by 241 votes to 83 against. The only parties who did not support the motion were the Democratic Alliance, Freedom Front Plus, Cope and the African Christian Democratic Party.


How about the Independant.co.uk
South Africa votes through motion to seize land from white farmers without compensation

'We must ensure that we restore the dignity of our people without compensating the criminals who stole our land'

Or Bloomberg.com

More than two decades after white-minority rule ended in South Africa, most of its profitable farms and estates are still owned by white people, and about 95 percent of the country’s wealth is in the hands of 10 percent of the population. The ruling African National Congress has vowed to step up wealth distribution and promised “radical economic transformation,” including constitutional changes to allow the government to expropriate land without paying for it.

It’s all the same news regardless of site.

Kiwirob wrote:

787Driver wrote:

I guess this means that apartheid should be enforced again.

Basically it means the legacy that Mandela wanted for the country has been shat on, this is not what his vision of South Africa was. The ANC are corrupt, race based politics have failed and now they are blaming white people for 24 years of failures.

Yep...and look at what they did to Mandela for fighting to dispose of Apartheid...?!! He spent his entire adult life in prison.

Looks like ALL the demons of South Africa's past of savage and vicious White Rule (which included land theft without compensation)...is now hovering and poised to strike back with revenge, it's called KARMA.

Sad part is, people that had little or nothing to do with that past (only benefiting from it's advantages) are about to suffer along with those very souls who fought tooth and nail to keep Apartheid.

BN747

I'm gonna have to look to Trevor Noahs opinion on this one. He usually can find an amusing way to spin current events in his home country. Comedians make news less distressing.

BN747 the white South Africans can leave. There’s counties that will take them, the blacks on the other hand have a Zimbabwe like future to look forward to, it didn’t need to be like this.

Great, we're going to end up with loads of them in East Cost Bays and the moaning about how New Zealand isn't like South Africa will get louder and louder.

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 the white South Africans can leave. There’s counties that will take them, the blacks on the other hand have a Zimbabwe like future to look forward to, it didn’t need to be like this.

No it did not.

But to use your 'they did not learn' formula here in the US, did Americans learn from the G. W. Bush Presidency?

No, they did not.

Becuz, as bad as Bush was...it was a bad tumor that swelled into what we know as Trump/Drumpf.

So, can humanity get any closer to the edge global calamity as did Hitler/WWII?...it's on it's way, if the current madness is mitigated.

BN747

BN747 wrote:

But to use your 'they did not learn' formula here in the US, did Americans learn from the G. W. Bush Presidency?

No, they did not.

Becuz, as bad as Bush was...it was a bad tumor that swelled into what we know as Trump/Drumpf.

The discussion is about South Africa... No need to drag Trump into very single thread.

Why am I not surprised certain people get all their news from Comedy Central?

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 the white South Africans can leave. There’s counties that will take them.

What countries want to take white South Africans? They have no relationship to the European countries from where their ancestors came from, nor are they likely to share European values at this point. It would be like Norway inviting Americans of Norwegian descent into Norway complete with access to social security and elections, just because they have some distant relative 200 years ago who came from Norway.

Kiwirob wrote:

the blacks on the other hand have a Zimbabwe like future to look forward to, it didn’t need to be like this.

Too true. Yet another country where the blacks have to learn it the hard way.

VSMUT wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 the white South Africans can leave. There’s counties that will take them.

What countries want to take white South Africans?

Wake up to reality calling...

...white (Europrean & US + Canada) countries are certainly (and have done so historically) willing to accept whites refugees from anywhere...as long as they are not Jews (depending on current moods) and Muslims (remembering the Bosnian & Croats beefing and fleeing).

VSMUT wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

the blacks on the other hand have a Zimbabwe like future to look forward to, it didn’t need to be like this.

Too true. Yet another country where the blacks have to learn it the hard way.

What is this lesson, 'the Blacks' ...must learn? And from whom? Zimbabwe? South Africa is no Zimbabwe. Their only common frame of reference is both sustained vicious, savage and
brutal White Rule ..for decades. How they each unraveled is entirely different. A similar result is not guaranteed.

L410Turbolet wrote:

BN747 wrote:

But to use your 'they did not learn' formula here in the US, did Americans learn from the G. W. Bush Presidency?

No, they did not.

Becuz, as bad as Bush was...it was a bad tumor that swelled into what we know as Trump/Drumpf.

The discussion is about South Africa... No need to drag Trump into very single thread.

Anyone capable of reading can easily discern the discussion is largely about some learning so lesson of some kind.

Why must you scramble to shield Trump because his admin is a sterling example of people NOT learning from Bush/Republican rule?

Why did you not pitch a bitch about Bush's name being brought up since 'focusing on learning (main thread subject) ' escapes you...?

BN747

VSMUT wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 the white South Africans can leave. There’s counties that will take them.

What countries want to take white South Africans? They have no relationship to the European countries from where their ancestors came from, nor are they likely to share European values at this point. It would be like Norway inviting Americans of Norwegian descent into Norway complete with access to social security and elections, just because they have some distant relative 200 years ago who came from Norway.

Kiwirob wrote:

the blacks on the other hand have a Zimbabwe like future to look forward to, it didn’t need to be like this.

Too true. Yet another country where the blacks have to learn it the hard way.

What countries will take them? Australia is talking about offering white farmers refugee status!

Given how horrifically cynical Australia’s refugee policy is generally, and these guys Peter Dutton is talking about offering refugee status to are white, this is just a cruel, cruel joke.

Australian, NZ, Canada, UK, Netherlands, all took in a lot white South Africans in the 90’s, and will take them again. I wouldn’t be surprised it they are able to claim refugee status, the meet all the requirements IMO. For the most part they are good hard working people who integrate very easily into the host society.

BN747 this isn’t a discussion about America, it’s South Africa, if you look at a map you’ll see they are a long long way away from each other.

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 this isn’t a discussion about America, it’s South Africa, if you look at a map you’ll see they are a long long way away from each other.

'Learning' which is in your title, and you started this thread about how 'blacks in SA' haven't learned (what exactly, you've yet to explain 'learning what' precisely...I'm merely pointing
out the people in America (and many other nations also DO NOT learn from past mistakes (if that is what you're getting at. But I don't think you have the slightest clue as to what who is suppose to learn what and/or from whom.

As far as geographic knowledge is concern, I can free-hand mind you, DRAW a map of the globe, the continents, and many of the nations within...with out looking at anything professional world map images.
I'd wager you couldn't match that feat if your life depended on it...

....so please stick your theme about who is suppose to learn what AND from whom..instead of getting miffed at my pointing how no nation really learns from past egregious mistakes.
Japan is considering re-arming (have they learned?) If President Dumbass is allowed to continue his streak of insanity, Germany might consider re-arming...so again, to YOUR Topic title, you are the OP here, So what is the stardard and just who is to learn what and from whom do they learn it?

Please, by all means...provide your showcase example of who has actually learned ANYTHING from ANYONE as far as 'national reform' is concerned before you go off proclaiming to know what the Black South Africans are doing, besides exposing a flimsy thinly veiled racist slant in your initial insinuations.

BN747

BN747 wrote:

What is this lesson, 'the Blacks' ...must learn? And from whom? Zimbabwe? South Africa is no Zimbabwe. Their only common frame of reference is both sustained vicious, savage and brutal White Rule ..for decades. How they each unraveled is entirely different. A similar result is not guaranteed.

The lesson would be not to tear down a well working infrastructure and economy overnight in the name of petty nationalism and cronyism. And yes, Zimbabwe would be a good place to learn from. So would Tanzania, which coincidentally wasn't ruled by savage and brutal whites for decades but still wound up stuck in useless African socialism. (And maybe even from the UK after 2021...)

Kiwirob wrote:

Australian, NZ, Canada, UK, Netherlands, all took in a lot white South Africans in the 90’s, and will take them again. I wouldn’t be surprised it they are able to claim refugee status, the meet all the requirements IMO. For the most part they are good hard working people who integrate very easily into the host society.

The 90s is a long time ago. Have they guaranteed that recently? You know, after the immigrant flood 2-3 years ago? And how are they going to prevent the system from being misused by every black South African, but not compromise western values of not discriminating against different ethnicities? What about the Indian-South Africans, should we suddenly take all of them in too? Our welfare system can't sustain endless amounts of immigrants, and skin colour makes no difference. These aren't Europeans. They are Africans, and they should stay in Africa and fix the problems there (if need be with our help), not run away from them.

If they really are so skilled and hard working as you say, they can already apply to enter the EU legally.

BN747 wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 this isn’t a discussion about America, it’s South Africa, if you look at a map you’ll see they are a long long way away from each other.

'Learning' which is in your title, and you started this thread about how 'blacks in SA' haven't learned (what exactly, you've yet to explain 'learning what' precisely...I'm merely pointingout the people in America (and many other nations also DO NOT learn from past mistakes (if that is what you're getting at. But I don't think you have the slightest clue as to what who is suppose to learn what and/or from whom.

BN747

He's saying the ANC government didn't learn from what happened in Zimbabwe.

He said that explicitly in his opening post.

VSMUT wrote:

BN747 wrote:

What is this lesson, 'the Blacks' ...must learn? And from whom? Zimbabwe? South Africa is no Zimbabwe. Their only common frame of reference is both sustained vicious, savage and brutal White Rule ..for decades. How they each unraveled is entirely different. A similar result is not guaranteed.

The lesson would be not to tear down a well working infrastructure and economy overnight in the name of petty nationalism and cronyism. And yes, Zimbabwe would be a good place to learn from. So would Tanzania, which coincidentally wasn't ruled by savage and brutal whites for decades but still wound up stuck in useless African socialism. (And maybe even from the UK after 2021...)

So since you speak as someone so well-informed on the matter, what infrastruture in Harare, Zimbabwe is no longer today? As far as we know the airport is still operational, YouTube some landings by Emirates, Ethiopian and others and see for yourself that the 3 or 4 jetway equipped Terminal is fully functional.

Here is a link of some travelers trip downtown Harare
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URFYUNZ_qvI

...looks perfectly normal to me. I'd wager any amount of money, YOU would be safer walking down this street in Harare as opposed to ANY street in Southside Chicago.

So do tell VSMUT, what are you basing all this 'tearing down' of things on?

Cronyism? What is going on right here in America, the pillar of doing things right? All kinds of paid-for-Congress 'welfare for Military Contractors and the Military Industrial Complex, Big Pharma ripping people off as fast they can and Wall Street - having their regulatory restraints removed = 2007/8 Economic implosion again...

Go ahead, let's hear it about the whole tearing down saga...I can't wait to hear it.

Airstud wrote:

He's saying the ANC government didn't learn from what happened in Zimbabwe.

He said that explicitly in his opening post.

And so what happened in Zimbabwe? Did it fall apart? They've tossed Mugabe, is there another Idi Amin on the horizon? Is it unsafe to travel there? Has Harare fallen into chaos and ruin?

Quit with the 3rd grade answers already...what is so devastating that has occurred other than white farmers booted out the lands that were originally stolen from black natives have been returned to them?

BN747

BN747 wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

787Driver wrote:

I guess this means that apartheid should be enforced again.

Basically it means the legacy that Mandela wanted for the country has been shat on, this is not what his vision of South Africa was. The ANC are corrupt, race based politics have failed and now they are blaming white people for 24 years of failures.

Yep...and look at what they did to Mandela for fighting to dispose of Apartheid...?!! He spent his entire adult life in prison.

Looks like ALL the demons of South Africa's past of savage and vicious White Rule (which included land theft without compensation)...is now hovering and poised to strike back with revenge, it's called KARMA.

Sad part is, people that had little or nothing to do with that past (only benefiting from it's advantages) are about to suffer along with those very souls who fought tooth and nail to keep Apartheid.

BN747

What land theft are you referring to?

Modern day south africa was uninhabitable costal desert (much like modern Namibia) until the dutch brought along modern irrigation techniques from europe. There were a few thousand nomadic bushman in the area, but that's it. The black 'south africans' that reside there today are immigrants from the central african republics that ironically moved there for work created by the europeans/modern economy.

Over the past 50 years the black populations of SA has grown over 900%, the white population has fell by about -7%.

It's devolving into a classic Rhodesia/Zimbabwe. Economic suicide justified by past injustices.

VSMUT wrote:

If they really are so skilled and hard working as you say, they can already apply to enter the EU legally.

I don’t think many if any white South Africans have used people smugglers to get themselves into Europe, I don’t think any black South Africans have either. Besides why would a black South African want to leave the deck is now stacked massively in there favour.

BN747 wrote:

As far as geographic knowledge is concern, I can free-hand mind you, DRAW a map of the globe, the continents, and many of the nations within...with out looking at anything professional world map images.
I'd wager you couldn't match that feat if your life depended on it...

I doubt anyone’s life has ever depended on their skill in drawing a freehand map of the world. My son can draw perfect circles, that’s not going to save his life either.

BN747 wrote:

And so what happened in Zimbabwe? Did it fall apart? They've tossed Mugabe, is there another Idi Amin on the horizon? Is it unsafe to travel there? Has Harare fallen into chaos and ruin?

Quit with the 3rd grade answers already...what is so devastating that has occurred other than white farmers booted out the lands that were originally stolen from black natives have been returned to them?

BN747

Surely you can't be serious.

Fall apart would be a very kind description. Harare is indeed very dangerous and lacking in basic infrastructure and food security.

It is one of the few first world countries to devolve into a third world country in modern times.

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 wrote:

As far as geographic knowledge is concern, I can free-hand mind you, DRAW a map of the globe, the continents, and many of the nations within...with out looking at anything professional world map images.
I'd wager you couldn't match that feat if your life depended on it...

I doubt anyone’s life has ever depended on their skill in drawing a freehand map of the world. My son can draw perfect circles, that’s not going to save his life either.

That W-E-A-K reply simply reveals speaks volumes.
Who said anything about 'life depending skills' umm that would be things like my having owned serveral successful businesses in life owning a couple travel agencies (14 employees) among other ventures - you're welcome to add your kid and your skills together to try out match that if you can...seriously doubtful.

Varsity1 wrote:

What land theft are you referring to?

Modern day south africa was uninhabitable costal desert (much like modern Namibia) until the dutch brought along modern irrigation techniques from europe. There were a few thousand nomadic bushman in the area, but that's it. The black 'south africans' that reside there today are immigrants from the central african republics that ironically moved there for work created by the europeans/modern economy.

Over the past 50 years the black populations of SA has grown over 900%, the white population has fell by about -7%.

It's devolving into a classic Rhodesia/Zimbabwe. Economic suicide justified by past injustices.

Although this smells like a rip from Wikipedia, even if 100% factual, what is also 100% fact...it was not land there up for grabs, it was territory to indigenous people who
were NOT White. Nothing you can say will mitigate the fact that these lands and people, inhabited or not, were the victims of European savage colonia conquest...THEFT!

Case closed.

If Harare and Jo'Burg get burned to the ground and left in ruins, it's their choice..not for you nor any other person not living there to sit in judgement and dish
out from your high horse on what they should do with it. The actual workers who built said infrastructure more than likely do still live there and have trained their sons
in similar crafts & trade. Just as Harare is NOT falling apart, neither will Jo'Burg, Capetown or any other South African town. Crime there will do what it does everywhere
else, ebb and flow, rise and fall. But given that many other African nations are making impressive strides in modernization, one can reasonably conclude that the current trend
is toward advancement in many forms - criminals in tow.

This thread was not thrown up by the OP out of concern for the native people and their choices...it was Racist Firebomb (not the 1st by this individual mind you) with the
sole intent to specifically say 'Look at the Blacks in S.A...taking over and f**cking everything up'. So next time KiwiRob, just come full throated with your objective, you can't hide
from your past fire-bombing threads, those of us who've been here long enough already know what to expect from you, just let it fly, bro!

Or if you really are concerned...put forth some effort that reflects that...becuz as of yet, no such effort has availed itself.

Although Trump/Drumpf is not President/Prime Minister of New Zealand (OP's home)
The Orange Menace has made it de rigueur to be out & proud and show your true colors (globally) and emboldened as they are, I don't expect them to hold back now.

BN747

Varsity1 wrote:

What land theft are you referring to?

Modern day south africa was uninhabitable costal desert (much like modern Namibia) until the dutch brought along modern irrigation techniques from europe. There were a few thousand nomadic bushman in the area, but that's it. The black 'south africans' that reside there today are immigrants from the central african republics that ironically moved there for work created by the europeans/modern economy.

That is a rather inaccurate description of both South Africa's geography and history. Only the most northwestern part is uninhabitable desert belonging to the Kalahari. The rest of the western half of South Africa is semidesert except for the Cape and the Indian Ocean coast which have a mediterranean climate. The whole east half is savannah and grasslands. When the dutch founded Cape Town the region was inhabited by Khoikhoi that had lived there for more than 1,000 years. The fantasy that the country was empty before the arrival of the europeans is a myth created to retrospectively justify the white land grab.

The lands not going back to the Khoikhoi is it, barely any of them are left, it’s going back to the supporters of the ANC who are immigrants just like the Dutch and English.

BN747 wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

BN747 wrote:

As far as geographic knowledge is concern, I can free-hand mind you, DRAW a map of the globe, the continents, and many of the nations within...with out looking at anything professional world map images.
I'd wager you couldn't match that feat if your life depended on it...

I doubt anyone’s life has ever depended on their skill in drawing a freehand map of the world. My son can draw perfect circles, that’s not going to save his life either.

That W-E-A-K reply simply reveals speaks volumes.
Who said anything about 'life depending skills' umm that would be things like my having owned serveral successful businesses in life owning a couple travel agencies (14 employees) among other ventures - you're welcome to add your kid and your skills together to try out match that if you can...seriously doubtful.

Varsity1 wrote:

What land theft are you referring to?

Modern day south africa was uninhabitable costal desert (much like modern Namibia) until the dutch brought along modern irrigation techniques from europe. There were a few thousand nomadic bushman in the area, but that's it. The black 'south africans' that reside there today are immigrants from the central african republics that ironically moved there for work created by the europeans/modern economy.

Over the past 50 years the black populations of SA has grown over 900%, the white population has fell by about -7%.

It's devolving into a classic Rhodesia/Zimbabwe. Economic suicide justified by past injustices.

Although this smells like a rip from Wikipedia, even if 100% factual, what is also 100% fact...it was not land there up for grabs, it was territory to indigenous people who
were NOT White. Nothing you can say will mitigate the fact that these lands and people, inhabited or not, were the victims of European savage colonia conquest...THEFT!

Case closed.

If Harare and Jo'Burg get burned to the ground and left in ruins, it's their choice..not for you nor any other person not living there to sit in judgement and dish
out from your high horse on what they should do with it. The actual workers who built said infrastructure more than likely do still live there and have trained their sons
in similar crafts & trade. Just as Harare is NOT falling apart, neither will Jo'Burg, Capetown or any other South African town. Crime there will do what it does everywhere
else, ebb and flow, rise and fall. But given that many other African nations are making impressive strides in modernization, one can reasonably conclude that the current trend
is toward advancement in many forms - criminals in tow.

This thread was not thrown up by the OP out of concern for the native people and their choices...it was Racist Firebomb (not the 1st by this individual mind you) with the
sole intent to specifically say 'Look at the Blacks in S.A...taking over and f**cking everything up'. So next time KiwiRob, just come full throated with your objective, you can't hide
from your past fire-bombing threads, those of us who've been here long enough already know what to expect from you, just let it fly, bro!

Or if you really are concerned...put forth some effort that reflects that...becuz as of yet, no such effort has availed itself.

Although Trump/Drumpf is not President/Prime Minister of New Zealand (OP's home)
The Orange Menace has made it de rigueur to be out & proud and show your true colors (globally) and emboldened as they are, I don't expect them to hold back now.

BN747

You mentioned life depending skills, not me.

So ultimately if you’re ridiculous comments are to be taken seriously you’d expect everyone to return to the nation where there ancestors cake from. Using the US as an example let’s hand back the US to the Native Americans and Hawaiians, all the Europeans, Africans and Asians can fuck off back to Europe, African and Asia. That’s your end game isn’t it, otherwise all your comments are bullshit.

BN747 wrote:

As far as geographic knowledge is concern, I can free-hand mind you, DRAW a map of the globe, the continents, and many of the nations within...with out looking at anything professional world map images.
I'd wager you couldn't match that feat if your life depended on it...

BN747

OMFG!!!

This is the funniest thing I've ever read on a forum!

So we have one white farmer being murdered every 5 days on average. These black murderers are equal to KKK members turn of the 20th century. Animalistic racism at a murderous level.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 62306.html