studentdrbev
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Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 12:52 am

It looks like Gray divorces is on the rise and it has become a trend these days.

https://academic.oup.com/psychsocgerontology/article/67/6/731/614154

For those who doesn't know, Gray divorce means getting divorced after the age of 40 for absolutely no logical reasons (as their kids are grown up and the parents want a free time can be one of the non-logical reasons). Young adults these days are looking forward into Gray divorces even before they are married and get into mutual understanding once married.

Does anyone know how is this going to affect their kids? Or even the personal lives of the divorcees? Does true love cease to exit anymore? Why don't most of the people care on staying together to the rest of their lives?

For those in their late 30s and above: What is your take on this trend? Will you be affected negatively in case Gray divorce happens in you lives?
For those who already had Grey divorces: How have your lives been after the divorce? Do you regret your decision? Do you plan on marrying once more or prefer to stay single for the rest of you lives and why?

Being in my 20s, I'm completely bewildered by this trend. I hardly wonder there is any meaning to life anymore (which is complimented by various events like 'Tide pods' etc.).
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 3:21 am

You're acting as if this is mainstream. For every couple thinking about this, there are probably 9 other couples who carry on with their lives. For starters, gray divorce may be illogical to you, but may make perfect sense to the couple:
-They may be unhappy but choose to stay together until their children are grown to handle the split
-Priorities in life differ (one spouse may want to be a world explorer; the other will die at work)
-An empty nest may signify that there's no reason to remain together (the bond holding the marriage together is no longer there)
-No longer a taboo so the couple decides to end their union instead of working the issues out

Since when does marriage become an unbreakable contract? It became negotiable the moment the state decided to grant benefits to married couples. If you adhere to a religious lifestyle, marriage should be perpetual (yet as we all know, we can get divorced and then ask for forgiveness because that's how it all works). If you live a secular lifestyle, marriage is merely being together in the eyes of the state and be eligible for benefits.

Divorcing for the sake of it shouldn't affect anyone if the parents are committed to carrying on the household they've built. And if not, then some people actually get along better when they're single (it just wasn't meant to be). I don't subscribe to divorcing for the sake of it. But if someone else goes through with it, that's their decision.

When I finally take my wedding vows, I plan to make them last as long as feasible. But I'm also a realist and if a marriage doesn't work out, then it doesn't work out. I will not be bound to an eternity with someone whose company I don't enjoy anymore. And I will no doubt get an earful from the righteous crowd, telling me that I should have known my partner better before committing to him, but to them I'll say that I have yet to meet someone who has been a good judge of character since the day they were born, so those who know about it is because they've gone through it several times and can pick up hints.

As for life's meaning: life means whatever you make of it. I pity you if you let these things get to you.
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Aesma
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 3:42 am

People that I both know well enough to have an opinion, and have divorced are family members. Most of the divorces were logical, one however would correspond to what you're talking about. I think the main problem was that this couple (uncle/aunt) was working together. To improve matters the aunt got her own job but that wasn't enough, or too late, and they divorced (she left him). Soon after the uncle found someone else, who is now basically part of the family, while the aunt is single AFAIK, and we almost never see her anymore. I feel she made the wrong choice as there was nothing really bad in their marriage, no violence or anything like that, no adultery, but well, it happened.

For my part I'm not convinced I'll ever get married, although if I find the right woman and the only downside is she wants a marriage, I'm not totally against it either. In my country laws are reasonable, none of this "she gets half your fortune" BS, not that I have a fortune to lose.
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seb146
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:04 am

My parents married in 1969 and they found separate living spaces in 1997. They were much happier together after 1997. Some people get married for the right societal reasons but the wrong personal reasons.

Popular media (film and television) is still telling people they NEED to be in a relationship. That could be it. People still pine away for someone and "oh, woe is me" if they don't have anyone and just get desperate for someone. Just my two cents.
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af773atmsp
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:23 am

One of my friend's parents still live together, but rarely talk to each other. Since early college he's said he would be fine with them getting divorced, but they're still together for whatever reason.

I'm 24 and am shocked when I see friends on Facebook posting about getting engaged, but I'm just not used to it. When I was in high school I thought a relationship was a necessity, but now I think it would be more of an inconvenience. That could change, but that's my mindset right now.
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Francoflier
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:24 am

studentdrbev wrote:
Being in my 20s, I'm completely bewildered by this trend.


I'm curious to know why this is bewildering to you.

Marriage is a great thing, so long as you enjoy the company of the person you married. If it turns out over time that you don't, then it can become a drag that ruins your life.
Few people know the person they marry very well. It takes years of life in common to get to that point, and my personal opinion is that people rushing into marrying after a short fling is the single biggest cause for failed marriages.

I agree that marriage should not be taken lightly, otherwise why do it at all? But it should not become a life sentence regardless of how much it makes you miserable.

The one important metric in this is the children, of course. Every failed marriage is different and it is hard to generalize.
Kids will generally not enjoy the sight of their parents separating, but speaking from experience, they will be much happier living with 2 parents who are separated but happy than 2 parents living together but miserable.
A marriage that ends in an amicable mutual understanding between the parties which leads to a peaceful and stressless separation for everyone involved will be much better than one which degenerates into verbal or physical violence on a regular basis.

The traditional idea of marriage as depicted by religious values and old beliefs has always been a recipe for disaster. It encourages people to stay together through social and peer pressure at the expense of their quality of life or even sanity. It doesn't make much sense in modern society, where a more reasoned and open approach to unions and family is more beneficial.
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studentdrbev
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:44 am

Francoflier wrote:
I'm curious to know why this is bewildering to you.


Everyone does get into a relationship before they get married, don't they? If you already know that marriage with a particular woman won't workout, then why would you marry her in the first place?

Furthermore, parents should set a good example for their kids for their physical, mental and social well-being. True there are kids who grew up with single parents and have contributed to the society a lot, but only after loads of sufferings and internal conflict.
 
studentdrbev
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:50 am

einsteinboricua wrote:
You're acting as if this is mainstream.


This is indeed becoming mainstream. The study says it all. There has been a gradual yet steady increase in Grey divorces.

einsteinboricua wrote:
As for life's meaning: life means whatever you make of it. I pity you if you let these things get to you.


What gets to me is, we humans are going back to behaving like apes from which we have evolved (If you believe in evolution theory, that is). So, what is the point in devolving ourselves into animals?
 
coolian2
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:15 am

Overall your post reads like a kids these days/get off my lawn/I'm too brilliant for my age group mashup.

I dont know of anyone getting into a relationship, let alone marriage not hoping for it to work out. Circumstances change, people change.
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studentdrbev
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:38 am

coolian2 wrote:
Circumstances change, people change.


At least one point gets proved here. 'Change is the only thing that doesn't change'
 
tommy1808
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:45 am

einsteinboricua wrote:
-No longer a taboo so the couple decides to end their union instead of working the issues out
.


- no social pressure to remain married if issues can't be worked out/interests have diverged too far.
- generally less pressure to conform to social norms.

Heck, even that devil woman Mother Theresa congratulated her friend Lady Di to the end of her marriage. ...

I think that, if a divorced couple can't remain friends, they waited to long with breaking up.

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studentdrbev
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:01 am

tommy1808 wrote:
I think that, if a divorced couple can't remain friends, they waited to long with breaking up


Thats valid with divorces with unsolvable problems or even with varied interests (still opposite poles of the magnets attract :bouncy: )

The problem with Gray divorces is they breakup for absolutely no reason. They just break up for the sole purpose of enjoying their own lives and make time for themselves. They just punch out some kids and feel that their responsibility is over, which just makes me wonder that humans ARE truely selfish.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:40 am

studentdrbev wrote:
The problem with Gray divorces is they breakup for absolutely no reason. They just break up for the sole purpose of enjoying their own lives and make time for themselves.


The pursuit of happiness is a perfectly valid reason to change ones life.

They just punch out some kids and feel that their responsibility is over, which just makes me wonder that humans ARE truely selfish.


Are you equating divorce with abandoning kids?

You know what is selfish, demanding people to stay in unhappy relationships because their reason to quit don't resonate with you.
Why would I even want my gf/wife to stay with me if she is not happy? Shouldn't I want her to be happy? Wouldn't not letting her go be selfish?

Love can't fix everything and sometimes loving someone means letting them go.

Best regards
Thomas
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bgm
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:46 am

studentdrbev wrote:
The problem with Gray divorces is they breakup for absolutely no reason.


That is simply not true. You even said it yourself:

studentdrbev wrote:
They just break up for the sole purpose of enjoying their own lives and make time for themselves.


It may not be the reason that you like or approve of, but it is a reason. What business is it of yours why a couple separates or divorces? They are two consenting adults who have made a decision, together, that they would be happier apart. Why should they stay together if they are not happy together?

This needs to be filed under other 'weird a.net-ism' gems like the relentless pink fashion threads... :duck:
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BartSimpson
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:01 am

Oh boy... I read "Gay divorces" the entire thread and wondered "What is so surprising about that, given that gay marriages are now legally established?".
 
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:14 am

Here's a view on marriage. (Not necessarily my view though) ,,,,

https://youtu.be/6n5XSw6YhuI?t=3m1s
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Francoflier
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:18 am

studentdrbev wrote:
Everyone does get into a relationship before they get married, don't they? If you already know that marriage with a particular woman won't workout, then why would you marry her in the first place?


It's a bit more complicated than that, now, isn't it?

Love is a highly volatile emotion and affection, like everything that has to do with the psyche, does not necessarily follow the rule of reason.

No one enters a marriage hoping it to fail and few people really want to consider that possibility. You enter a long term relationship trying to make it work.
Affection is usually stronger in the first part of a relationship, as it gets mixed with stronger emotions that cloud one's judgement. It makes people rush into decisions regarding commitment without much forethought.
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doug_or
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:07 am

studentdrbev wrote:

The problem with Gray divorces is they breakup for absolutely no reason. They just break up for the sole purpose of enjoying their own lives and make time for themselves. They just punch out some kids and feel that their responsibility is over, which just makes me wonder that humans ARE truely selfish.


So what is this thread ACTUALY about? Your parents? A friend's parents? Do you understand people over 40 are also humans with feeling and hopes and desires? Have you ever been in any kind of romantic relationship?
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mmo
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:27 pm

studentdrbev wrote:
The problem with Gray divorces is they breakup for absolutely no reason. They just break up for the sole purpose of enjoying their own lives and make time for themselves. They just punch out some kids and feel that their responsibility is over, which just makes me wonder that humans ARE truely selfish.


Sorry, but you don't make any sense at all. If your comments about "punch out some kids" were true, they would be getting divorced at a much younger age. Being a "Gray", I think the issue is they are not selfish and have stayed married until the kids were grown and on their own. They have not been selfish as they have remained together to ensure the kids grew and were self sufficient.

As for me, I got married when I was 33, she was 23 and we are approaching 34 years in May. Our youngest (of 3) is 22 and on her own. I love it just having my wife and myself around now. We get along now just we did when we were first married. Having and raising kids is a lot of work and it never seems to end. So, I can see why some couples would divorce and get some of their hard earned "me time".

Also, some couples divorce out of economic necessity and your study does not address that issue.

Anyhow, I think you better check your logic as you are contradicting yourself.
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Aesma
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:16 pm

mmo wrote:
Also, some couples divorce out of economic necessity and your study does not address that issue.


What do you mean ?

The opposite seems common, people who don't divorce because they can't afford to live on their own. Especially women who may not have a good job, or no job at all.
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:27 pm

Aesma wrote:
mmo wrote:
Also, some couples divorce out of economic necessity and your study does not address that issue.


What do you mean ?

The opposite seems common, people who don't divorce because they can't afford to live on their own. Especially women who may not have a good job, or no job at all.

Combined income tax bracket may be higher than individual (it usually ends up being exactly half of the combined one). However, if there's a significant salary gap between the spouses, it often is better for each to be on their own.

School aid eligibility may also play a role. I know of classmates whose parents divorced just to that their children are eligible for student aid (the combined income of the family put the student above eligibility, but being being claimed under one tax return (usually the smaller income earner), they're eligible for aid). A guy I studied with for years went through that. His parents' plan was that as soon as he graduated they'd get married again (his dad died shortly before he graduated so it was never meant to be again...but still...this does happen).
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vikkyvik
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:18 pm

studentdrbev wrote:
Everyone does get into a relationship before they get married, don't they?


No.

studentdrbev wrote:
True there are kids who grew up with single parents and have contributed to the society a lot, but only after loads of sufferings and internal conflict.


Is that a fact? Or just something that you THINK is true?

studentdrbev wrote:
They just break up for the sole purpose of enjoying their own lives and make time for themselves.


As others have noted, that's a perfectly valid reason.

tommy1808 wrote:
You know what is selfish, demanding people to stay in unhappy relationships because their reason to quit don't resonate with you.
Why would I even want my gf/wife to stay with me if she is not happy? Shouldn't I want her to be happy? Wouldn't not letting her go be selfish?


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luckyone
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:41 am

With all due respect the premise of this thread is, in a word, naive. Nothing more. There are a few things one cannot fully comprehend until they’ve experienced it, for better or worse. Sex and long term relationships/marriages are at the top of that list. I’d find it very hard to believe that anyone who’s ever been in a relationship would ask incredulously why one ends, regardless of when. People get married for all sorts of reasons. Many noble. Many not. A lot of people forget how to be married without children because they make their children the focal point of their lives, and make the marriage second—this also has the consequence of producing completely entitled and unadjusted adults, but that’s a separate story. People change. Circumstances change. Can we revisit this thread in about five years after this OP has a few more notches in their belt?
 
seb146
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:47 am

luckyone wrote:
With all due respect the premise of this thread is, in a word, naive. Nothing more. There are a few things one cannot fully comprehend until they’ve experienced it, for better or worse. Sex and long term relationships/marriages are at the top of that list. I’d find it very hard to believe that anyone who’s ever been in a relationship would ask incredulously why one ends, regardless of when. People get married for all sorts of reasons. Many noble. Many not. A lot of people forget how to be married without children because they make their children the focal point of their lives, and make the marriage second—this also has the consequence of producing completely entitled and unadjusted adults, but that’s a separate story. People change. Circumstances change. Can we revisit this thread in about five years after this OP has a few more notches in their belt?


The OP asked a legitimate question. I get what you are saying but I get what s/he is asking. My youngest brother was 16 when our parents separated. He is 10 years younger than I am. He and I had very volatile relationships with our father. We were both relieved when they separated. We both had friends who's parents divorced and it was traumatic for them. We can each talk about our individual experiences. All we can do to help others in similar situations is listen.
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:23 pm

seb146 wrote:
The OP asked a legitimate question. I get what you are saying but I get what s/he is asking. My youngest brother was 16 when our parents separated. He is 10 years younger than I am. He and I had very volatile relationships with our father. We were both relieved when they separated. We both had friends who's parents divorced and it was traumatic for them. We can each talk about our individual experiences. All we can do to help others in similar situations is listen.

Seb, you're not making sense. It sounds like when your parents separated things improved. However, the way the OP is discussing the topic makes it seem like a split (for whatever reason) has a negative effect on the children and that splits (again, for any reason) should be frowned upon. Imagine if your parents had remained together but had not been able to work out any issues they had. Not only would they be miserable, you and your brother would have been as well.

Now, I understand the situations where a split is devastating, but I think the underlying causes would be more than reasonable. I had a classmate whose parents divorced when we were in junior year of high school. The cause? His dad was cheating on his wife. After at least 16 years of marriage, how do you reconcile that? As a logical teenager (ie a teenager capable of logical thoughts), how do you look at your dad and sweep all he's done under the rug? Had both the parents remained together, it would have likely made for an awkward household.
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MaverickM11
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:05 pm

People forget marrying for love, to one person, to remain monogamous for life--traditional marriage :sarcastic: --is a very recent concept, and perhaps not all that viable a concept. A generation ago social pressure was much stronger to stay married, no matter the abuse, philandering, etc.. However, today both men *and* woman tend to have much more independence, and less social pressure to stay in bad relationships--this just seems like the logical conclusion of that trend.
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Flighty
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:45 pm

I think the meaning of marriage has changed over time. In general these days for people in their 30s, it means "we are pretty sure we will not get divorced."

Or that they are planning on kids. Marriage is pretty much a legal arrangement based on kids, in the US. So, it has a meaning and a cultural value. In silver age, marriage seems to be "we have come to an arrangement." Whether that means money, or simple companionship, or some combination!

So, a cynical view, but still a view that marriage is very important. I'm not married, and only in rare cases have I had those feelings about anybody. A fair observer would just slap me upside the head for what I have given up over the years.
 
desertjets
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:01 pm

As a soon to be gray and somebody who is in a LTR I guess I am fully qualified to comment on this. I will echo others that you come off as incredibly naive about what relationships are and how they can change. I don't completely fault you for that, I thought I knew everything at your age too.

I've been with my partner for now nearly 11 years (we are not married by choice), 3 cats and 1 kid. Neither of us are the same people that we were 11 years ago. And we won't be the same people 11 years from now. People change and relationships evolve. And if the couple does not grow together that can be a reason for separation later on. Sometimes people aren't all that they seem to be. Which is something you discover over time. There is also some truth to the mid-life crisis, where one partner in the relationship wants or needs something different, personally, career wise, etc.... and if the other half of the couple can't help make it work then it is splitsville. And there is always the couple the stays together for the children (however misguided) that splits after the nest empties.
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seb146
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:20 am

einsteinboricua wrote:
seb146 wrote:
The OP asked a legitimate question. I get what you are saying but I get what s/he is asking. My youngest brother was 16 when our parents separated. He is 10 years younger than I am. He and I had very volatile relationships with our father. We were both relieved when they separated. We both had friends who's parents divorced and it was traumatic for them. We can each talk about our individual experiences. All we can do to help others in similar situations is listen.

Seb, you're not making sense. It sounds like when your parents separated things improved. However, the way the OP is discussing the topic makes it seem like a split (for whatever reason) has a negative effect on the children and that splits (again, for any reason) should be frowned upon. Imagine if your parents had remained together but had not been able to work out any issues they had. Not only would they be miserable, you and your brother would have been as well.

Now, I understand the situations where a split is devastating, but I think the underlying causes would be more than reasonable. I had a classmate whose parents divorced when we were in junior year of high school. The cause? His dad was cheating on his wife. After at least 16 years of marriage, how do you reconcile that? As a logical teenager (ie a teenager capable of logical thoughts), how do you look at your dad and sweep all he's done under the rug? Had both the parents remained together, it would have likely made for an awkward household.


My parents spoke very little for 20 years. And it got worse the next 10 years. Dad was a very secretive person, as well as an angry person. He would go "out for a walk" and come back a few hours later. No explanation and we could not ask. He would not even consider therapy or counseling. They should have separated long ago, IMO. Some couples can weather any storm, other couples are constantly in the hurricane. There are so many factors it is almost impossible to say how things will go.

Some children can not get over their parents divorce, other children roll with it. Some parents divorce just because, others divorce because they realize the huge mistake they made.
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DLFREEBIRD
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:05 am

There are always good reasons for getting a divorce.

In my day, people usually got divorce because they got married to young. I asked my kids to at least to wait until they turned 30 to marry. Mainly because who you are in your 20's is not who you will be in your 30's. With a partner you will either grown together or grow apart.

That said, it's rare for people to divorce as they get older simply because they become set in their ways and they don't like change. The exception and there is always a exception is when one partner becomes crotchety. Why put up with that?
 
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777222LR
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:53 am

I actually feel divorce in my circle of friends is much less than in that of parents. My parents got divorced in the 1980's. I felt there was a high rate of it, and seemingly people of my generation are staying with it. Of course, that could be because once your parents are divorced, they end up hanging around divorcees, and dating divorcees.

Either way, I think people need to do what makes them happy. I don't think that norms of the 1950's need to be around for the 2010s/2020s. Staying in a marriage is just as unhealthy, if not more, than being in one and it being terrible. I was honestly a MUCH happier child with the family split.
 
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CitizenJustin
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Re: Gray divorces on the rise

Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:09 am

af773atmsp wrote:
One of my friend's parents still live together, but rarely talk to each other. Since early college he's said he would be fine with them getting divorced, but they're still together for whatever reason.

I'm 24 and am shocked when I see friends on Facebook posting about getting engaged, but I'm just not used to it. When I was in high school I thought a relationship was a necessity, but now I think it would be more of an inconvenience. That could change, but that's my mindset right now.


“Inconvenience” is a good word to describe relationships for some people. I’ve been in 2 long term relationships and while they were both great, I’ve come to realize that for me, relationships are a massive inconvenience. I don’t really like having someone around 24/7 and as I’ve gotten older I’ve accepted that maybe relationships just aren’t for me. Of course this realization took a while because from day 1 we’re told that we’re not complete without a partner.

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Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos