So it seems Hawaiians woke early this morning to a rather scary text message:

"Ballistic missile threat inbound to Hawaii. Seek immediate shelter. This is not a drill"

That would be enough to make you choke on your breakfast!

Somehow, and I can't wait to hear the explanation, this was sent out in error. #FakeNews

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-42677604

People across the US state of Hawaii received a text on Saturday morning, warning of an impending missile strike.

The error was corrected 18 LONG minutes later. That had to be a little scary.

DDR wrote:

The error was corrected 18 LONG minutes later. That had to be a little scary.

Something tells me inbound ballistic missiles are a sufficiently abstract danger to stay calm, even if its enough to think really fast.

Best regards
Thomas

P.S. I would probably be disappointed that my funeral cocktail party won't happen in the event of nuclear war, since war is excluded from the life insurance I have for that purpose since I am 18.

NYT said it took them almost 40 minutes to cancel the warning

I think last time when North Korea test their missile and Japan release this kind of warning to the public, counting from the time North Korea fire the missile to the time Japan confirmed the missile flew pass Japan, the entire process still took less than this period of time. What was those people doing at the warning center?

I will give you one guess where Trump was during this.

c933103 wrote:

What were those people doing at the warning center?

Pot.

Call me cynical, but I think this is another ploy by the "president" to punish those Democratic states who voted against him and continue to go against him. Look at the offshore drilling. Three West Coast states objected, so tRump excluded Florida.

A reality check of the dangerous times we live in, scary stuff.

We didn't learn a f*cking thing from the Cold War, did we? And I'll bet we won't learn anything once North Korea becomes a stable place. Rinse and repeat.

Sorry, its just awful knowing that we still live in a world where we could end ourselves in nuclear warfare.

Just sad, that in these times, that the Hawaiian's running that office now have to reverse engineer "The Button" to make it Fool Proof. I wonder if there will be lawsuits over those injured by this preventable error?

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Just sad, that in these times, that the Hawaiian's running that office now have to reverse engineer "The Button" to make it Fool Proof. I wonder if there will be lawsuits over those injured by this preventable error?

Those would have injured themselves. The message doesn't say "drive to shelter without regards for your life or the life of others and generally act irresponsible ".

Otherwise the get a gun to keep you safe industry, the food industry and such would be in deep trouble
So maybe a good idea if they she and win.

Best regards
Thomas

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Just sad, that in these times, that the Hawaiian's running that office now have to reverse engineer "The Button" to make it Fool Proof. I wonder if there will be lawsuits over those injured by this preventable error?

Those would have injured themselves. The message doesn't say "drive to shelter without regards for your life or the life of others and generally act irresponsible ".

Otherwise the get a gun to keep you safe industry, the food industry and such would be in deep trouble
So maybe a good idea if they sue and win.

Best regards
Thomas

I don´t buy the story that someone pressed the wrong button. This never happened during the Cold War, even when it was at its most dangerous. But now it does?

AR385 wrote:

I don´t buy the story that someone pressed the wrong button. This never happened during the Cold War, even when it was at its most dangerous. But now it does?

Much harder to miss sirenes getting off than text messages....
It hasn't happened before isn't an argument. And this happened during a test, the messages where send by accident, the alarm was genuine in the sense of a test alert. The people doing the testing probably always get those messages, so it just took them a bit to notice.
And sirens have been tested during the cold war, in fact they still get tested every Saturday noon here, and in fact many German cities that demolished theirs are in the process of getting new ones.

Best regards
Thomas

Yes, the tests are still going on in various countries. The key here is that the "This is not a drill" part got through. For all intents and purposes, this was not a "test".

AR385 wrote:

Yes, the tests are still going on in various countries. The key here is that the "This is not a drill" part got through. For all intents and purposes, this was not a "test".

if you don't ever intend to really send them out in any other case but a real emergency, there isn't much reason to have a "this is a drill" message, or maybe there is and it is just one wrong click, to send the real message. May have been a deliberate "mistake", but may just very well be a GUI screw up. Sirenes only have on/off, no chance to screw up.

Best regards
Thomas

P.S. keep in mind that the average human being makes a mistake about every 6 minutes.

Yes. I am aware that a human makes mistakes. I make a lot of mistakes, that is why such a delicate system has to take into consideration that fact, and protect against it. A system that allows such an easy mistake by a human, is a non-robust system, a badly designed one and one that needs to be fixed.

AR385 wrote:

A system that allows such an easy mistake by a human, is a non-robust system, a badly designed one and one that needs to be fixed.

I totally agree.

Best regards
Thomas

AR385 wrote:

Yes. I am aware that a human makes mistakes. I make a lot of mistakes, that is why such a delicate system has to take into consideration that fact, and protect against it. A system that allows such an easy mistake by a human, is a non-robust system, a badly designed one and one that needs to be fixed.

Since the current US president is lighting up the fire, this seemed like a possible tread.

AR385 wrote:

Yes. I am aware that a human makes mistakes. I make a lot of mistakes, that is why such a delicate system has to take into consideration that fact, and protect against it. A system that allows such an easy mistake by a human, is a non-robust system, a badly designed one and one that needs to be fixed.

Which explains why, on most cars, the hood release is harder to activate than the trunk release and the door lock release.

Sounds like they should require Hawaiian Gold be consumed before the end of each shift...

http://www.thecannabist.co/2016/03/16/h ... iew/49262/

seb146 wrote:

Call me cynical, but I think this is another ploy by the "president" to punish those Democratic states who voted against him and continue to go against him.

You folks really are unhinged, now. Are you not embarrassed to post this type of nonsense?

NoTime wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Call me cynical, but I think this is another ploy by the "president" to punish those Democratic states who voted against him and continue to go against him.

You folks really are unhinged, now. Are you not embarrassed to post this type of nonsense?

How is the great dictators initial response to the threat not unhinged? "Fake news?" It's like a bratty 5 year old writes his tweets.

tommy1808 wrote:

AR385 wrote:

Yes, the tests are still going on in various countries. The key here is that the "This is not a drill" part got through. For all intents and purposes, this was not a "test".

if you don't ever intend to really send them out in any other case but a real emergency, there isn't much reason to have a "this is a drill" message, or maybe there is and it is just one wrong click, to send the real message. May have been a deliberate "mistake", but may just very well be a GUI screw up. Sirenes only have on/off, no chance to screw up.

Best regards
Thomas

P.S. keep in mind that the average human being makes a mistake about every 6 minutes.

It's hard to fathom it took so long to fix this problem.

NoTime wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Call me cynical, but I think this is another ploy by the "president" to punish those Democratic states who voted against him and continue to go against him.

You folks really are unhinged, now. Are you not embarrassed to post this type of nonsense?

Nearly every day, the "president" say foolish and obnoxious and degrading downright insulting things via twitter and you have the nerve to make that statement about what I said? At least I was just throwing out a random thought and let it be know it has no basis in reality. Geez.... Your post makes it sound like you honestly believe everything anyone writes on here is gospel truth and not opinion.

AR385 wrote:

I don´t buy the story that someone pressed the wrong button. This never happened during the Cold War, even when it was at its most dangerous. But now it does?

You mean like a possible hack? Like happened in Dallas several years ago? I’m sure that such a system is totally fool proof and that could never happen

The FCC will be investigating.

On Sunday, Federal Communications Commission Chairman Ajit Pai called the false alert “absolutely unacceptable” and said a full investigation was “well underway.” At least initially, Pai seemed to cast blame on state-level officials for the error. “Based on the information we have collected so far, it appears that the government of Hawaii did not have reasonable safeguards or process controls in place to prevent the transmission of a false alert,” Pai said in a statement.

Shortly after 8 a.m. local time Saturday morning, an employee at the Hawaii Emergency Management Agency settled in at the start of his shift. Among his duties that day was to initiate an internal test of the emergency missile warning system: essentially, to practice sending an emergency alert to the public without actually sending it to the public. Around 8:05 a.m., the Hawaii emergency employee initiated the internal test, according to a timeline released by the state. From a drop-down menu on a computer program, he saw two options: “Test missile alert” and “Missile alert.” He was supposed to choose the former; as much of the world now knows, he chose the latter, an initiation of a real-life missile alert.

“In this case, the operator selected the wrong menu option,” HEMA spokesman Richard Rapoza told The Washington Post on Sunday. On Saturday, Ripoza said, the employee was asked in the computer program to confirm that he wanted to send the message.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2018/01/14/hawaii-missile-alert-how-one-employee-pushed-the-wrong-button-and-caused-a-wave-of-panic/

Just Read The comments to see what the Locals are saying about the reported cause as being an "accident."

http://www.staradvertiser.com/2018/01/1 ... eat-alert/

I can't help but have a teeny, tiny suspicion that this "incident" was actually not a mistake, but intentional, from very high levels to gauge how Hawaiian residents would actually react under the gun if they believed it wasn't a drill.

That could also explain why it took so long to send out a "correction" that it was actually a drill.

But unless the existence of such an order/motive is leaked to the press (not impossible) or uncovered by the FCC investigation (highly unlikely if such a hypothetical order came from above them), it will always officially have been "known" to be "a mistake": You can't tell people after a drill broadcasted as "not a drill" that it actually was a reaction test to "not a drill" and expect them to take "not a drill" seriously next time.

Somewhere in Hawaii and/or DC, this "event" may have been considered a success.

dmg626 wrote:

AR385 wrote:

I don´t buy the story that someone pressed the wrong button. This never happened during the Cold War, even when it was at its most dangerous. But now it does?

You mean like a possible hack? Like happened in Dallas several years ago? I’m sure that such a system is totally fool proof and that could never happen

That is one of a few possibilties that occured to me, yes, other than the simple "I pressed the wrong button." Disgruntled employee, also. Who knows? The fact it took them 40 mins. to advise it was a false alarm with the excuse of : "because we had no template" I also find sort of flimsy.

seb146 wrote:

NoTime wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Call me cynical, but I think this is another ploy by the "president" to punish those Democratic states who voted against him and continue to go against him.

You folks really are unhinged, now. Are you not embarrassed to post this type of nonsense?

Nearly every day, the "president" say foolish and obnoxious and degrading downright insulting things via twitter and you have the nerve to make that statement about what I said? At least I was just throwing out a random thought and let it be know it has no basis in reality. Geez.... Your post makes it sound like you honestly believe everything anyone writes on here is gospel truth and not opinion.

Yeah, yeah... you're no better than the people that were peddling "Obama faked Bin Laden's death" or "Obama had Breitbart killed" rumors a few years back.

I can't understand how this can happen. Something like this should bring up a confirmation window, bright red with a 10 second count down to make it so bleedingly obvious that it is real that nobody could miss it.

Given this happened, it's a good time to evaluate how people responded and proceed accordingly.

They say they're going to correct it with more training.

Correct what ??? How to read and interpret English statements???

I want to read the worker's explanation of how this happened.

I also want to know how this worker is related to his Boss.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

They say they're going to correct it with more training.

Correct what ??? How to read and interpret English statements???

I want to read the worker's explanation of how this happened.

I also want to know how this worker is related to his Boss.

You can train all you want, but if the online systems are poorly done and let this sort of thing happen without confirmations being required, then it is a bad thing.

A proper confirmation check should be needed, so you click the button or menu item and then get asked if it is correct. And if it is a real war situation, have an option where the confirmation check can be disabled.

Or otherwise, you just put test/real launch warnings in locations away from each other so one cannot be inadvertently used.

AR385 wrote:

That is one of a few possibilties that occured to me, yes, other than the simple "I pressed the wrong button." Disgruntled employee, also. Who knows? The fact it took them 40 mins. to advise it was a false alarm with the excuse of : "because we had no template" I also find sort of flimsy.

I can only quote my IT dept. for source. They indicate there was no further thought of other than generating an alarm put into the system. Sound the alarm, job done, take cover.
They had to call IT who had taken cover, convince them that it was a false alarm and wait until they arrived at work to generate a message that it was a false alarm.
There was no way for the operator who accidentally generated the alarm to cancel it nor generate any other specific message.


Okie

cpd wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

They say they're going to correct it with more training.

Correct what ??? How to read and interpret English statements???

I want to read the worker's explanation of how this happened.

I also want to know how this worker is related to his Boss.

You can train all you want, but if the online systems are poorly done and let this sort of thing happen without confirmations being required, then it is a bad thing.

A proper confirmation check should be needed, so you click the button or menu item and then get asked if it is correct. And if it is a real war situation, have an option where the confirmation check can be disabled.

Or otherwise, you just put test/real launch warnings in locations away from each other so one cannot be inadvertently used.

"A proper confirmation check should be needed, so you click the button or menu item and then get asked if it is correct."

But, but, but....That's what already happened Saturday.... The operator got the 2nd question, and still hit "Yes"....

I was in a Del Taco about to bite into my burger when I saw it on my phone! Talk about a freak out. Took me a couple of minutes to find on twitter it was a false alarm.

As for whether this was an honest mistake or not why would any button be pushed if nothing was happening?

DIRECTFLT wrote:

But, but, but....That's what already happened Saturday.... The operator got the 2nd question, and still hit "Yes"....

Unfortunately, it's a common human failing to not read the confirmation message, especially if it's a process that you're familiar with and have used many times before.

I've run this test many times before...
1 - Select "Test Warning" from the drop-down menu.
2 - Click "Yes" or "Ok" on the confirmation dialog.

On this occasion, the user accidentally selected the live warning, but still confirmed (simply because he was expecting to have to confirm it).

What needs to happen with systems like this is that the live warning confirmation dialog needs to be significantly different to the test one. Visually and probably with an audible alarm as well. A second confirmation for the live message would be another good idea.

Whats the point? What is the plan to "seek shelter?" Many of the residents had no idea what to do, and unles the State has been building bomb shelters, I say again...whats the point?

scbriml wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

But, but, but....That's what already happened Saturday.... The operator got the 2nd question, and still hit "Yes"....

Unfortunately, it's a common human failing to not read the confirmation message, especially if it's a process that you're familiar with and have used many times before.

I've run this test many times before...
1 - Select "Test Warning" from the drop-down menu.
2 - Click "Yes" or "Ok" on the confirmation dialog.

On this occasion, the user accidentally selected the live warning, but still confirmed (simply because he was expecting to have to confirm it).

What needs to happen with systems like this is that the live warning confirmation dialog needs to be significantly different to the test one. Visually and probably with an audible alarm as well. A second confirmation for the live message would be another good idea.

I AGREE

The Live Warning option confirmation needs to be in FLASHING RED.

NoTime wrote:

seb146 wrote:

NoTime wrote:

You folks really are unhinged, now. Are you not embarrassed to post this type of nonsense?

Nearly every day, the "president" say foolish and obnoxious and degrading downright insulting things via twitter and you have the nerve to make that statement about what I said? At least I was just throwing out a random thought and let it be know it has no basis in reality. Geez.... Your post makes it sound like you honestly believe everything anyone writes on here is gospel truth and not opinion.

Yeah, yeah... you're no better than the people that were peddling "Obama faked Bin Laden's death" or "Obama had Breitbart killed" rumors a few years back.

The difference is: I only think there is a .00001% chance it is true, especially considering this administration. If it were any other administration, I would not even think about it. The Obama haters actually believe the tripe they write with all their mind and soul.

af773atmsp wrote:

We didn't learn a f*cking thing from the Cold War, did we? And I'll bet we won't learn anything once North Korea becomes a stable place. Rinse and repeat.

Sorry, its just awful knowing that we still live in a world where we could end ourselves in nuclear warfare.

I don't think it's a fair comparison to compare NK to a former superpower like Russia, who the public believed, mostly incorrectly that their weapon sophistication bested ours, or at least kept in parity with our tech and resources for strategic arsenals.

We won economically by forcing them to spend into the ground, while NK starves their country doing the same thing after producing just a tiny percent of what Russia's armarment consisted of.

It's in China's interest to have a barrier between the west and its borders, I can't see how the South or the US could afford or otherwise take care of millions and millions of starved refugees. They have three enemies, the US, China, and internal threats such as starvation. It's a chess game to curtail those threats, what's easier, confrontation or just throwing a few scraps of aid to keep the status quo.

Nobody knows the effectiveness or not of the missile defense capabilities of the US military... but I hope it never comes to a real life scenerio to find out.

FUBAR

The Hawaii employee who sent out a false alarm earlier this month warning of an incoming missile attack said he misheard a message played during a drill and believed a ballistic missile was actually heading for the state, according to a federal investigation.

This contradicts the explanations previously offered by Hawaii officials, who have said the Jan. 13 alert was sent because the employee hit the wrong button on a drop-down menu.
Surprise....Surprise....Surprise ! ! !

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... -fcc-says/

DIRECTFLT wrote:

FUBAR

The Hawaii employee who sent out a false alarm earlier this month warning of an incoming missile attack said he misheard a message played during a drill and believed a ballistic missile was actually heading for the state, according to a federal investigation.

This contradicts the explanations previously offered by Hawaii officials, who have said the Jan. 13 alert was sent because the employee hit the wrong button on a drop-down menu.
Surprise....Surprise....Surprise ! ! !

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... -fcc-says/

What a massive cover-up by a Blue State government! I bet Andy McCabe was involved!

jetero wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

FUBAR

The Hawaii employee who sent out a false alarm earlier this month warning of an incoming missile attack said he misheard a message played during a drill and believed a ballistic missile was actually heading for the state, according to a federal investigation.

This contradicts the explanations previously offered by Hawaii officials, who have said the Jan. 13 alert was sent because the employee hit the wrong button on a drop-down menu.
Surprise....Surprise....Surprise ! ! !

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... -fcc-says/

What a massive cover-up by a Blue State government! I bet Andy McCabe was involved!

No....just incompetency.... The cover-ups are happening in DC. Right Andrew ???

DIRECTFLT wrote:

jetero wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

FUBAR

The Hawaii employee who sent out a false alarm earlier this month warning of an incoming missile attack said he misheard a message played during a drill and believed a ballistic missile was actually heading for the state, according to a federal investigation.

This contradicts the explanations previously offered by Hawaii officials, who have said the Jan. 13 alert was sent because the employee hit the wrong button on a drop-down menu.
Surprise....Surprise....Surprise ! ! !

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... -fcc-says/

What a massive cover-up by a Blue State government! I bet Andy McCabe was involved!

No....just incompetency.... The cover-ups are happening in DC. Right Andrew ???

If it's just incompetency than what's the "Surprise . . . Surprise . . . Surprise ! ! !" Two different flavors of the same.

You guys are funny. And this is a perfect example why investigation need to be done first, without constant public declarations. Things change as an investigation moves forward, what was thought at issue first may turn out to not be later.

But everybody wants instant information and results ad anyone not being forthcoming risk things being labeled "cover up".

Terrorists may have won now that we have a chunk of "law and order" types no longer trusting those very agencies.

Tugg

Tugger wrote:

You guys are funny. And this is a perfect example why investigation need to be done first, without constant public declarations. Things change as an investigation moves forward, what was thought at issue first may turn out to not be later.

But everybody wants instant information and results ad anyone not being forthcoming risk things being labeled "cover up".

Terrorists may have won now that we have a chunk of "law and order" types no longer trusting those very agencies.

Tugg

DF says Blue Lives Don't Matter

(What a pun!)

The emergency worker responsible for sending a false missile alert to over 1 million people has been fired from the Hawaii Emergency Management Agency, officials announced Tuesday. The employee “has been a source of concern for the same [State Warning Point] staff for over 10 years,” according to a report released Tuesday. The report was written by Brig. Gen. Bruce E. Oliveira, who conducted an investigation into the matter on behalf of the agency.

When asked why the worker hadn’t been terminated earlier given his performance issues, Maj. Gen. Joe Logan, director of the Hawaii Emergency Management Agency, said the worker’s supervisor felt he had taken “appropriate action” by counseling and mentoring him.

It gets better....

Maj. Gen. Vern Miyagi resigned Tuesday from his position as administrator of the agency, Logan said during the press conference. “Maj. Gen. Miyagi ― a respected military lead, an honorable man ― has taken full responsibility for the incident of January 13 and the actions of all his employees,” Logan said.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/ha ... 29f08b667d

I thought so. It sounded too far fetched for it to have been a simple "mistake".