stratosphere
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James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:52 pm

I have to say out of all the Hollywood types this guy gets it. Unlike the rest of the Hollyweird morons and freaks. I hope Trump heeds his warnings because a lot of Trumps base voted for him for these reasons. I agree with everything he has said pretty much. My take is absolutely do NOT do any kind of deal on DACA until we secure and I mean really secure the border this time (not like when Reagan gave amnesty in 86 and promised to secure the border later) . The Democrats just push this crap to build their voter base just like Woods said.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/25607/li ... sspatriot#
 
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mbmbos
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:03 pm

For what reason should we "secure the border?
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
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casinterest
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:06 pm

mbmbos wrote:
For what reason should we "secure the border?


Trump minions have no clue how to secure the border or which border, or why people cross the border in the first place. Or how people wind up in the country without immigration status, or why all those cut throat business folks hire undocumented workers on the farms or in the slaughterhouse.. They just know that their Trumpy wants a wall and they want it too.
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mbmbos
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:11 pm

casinterest wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
For what reason should we "secure the border?


Trump minions have no clue how to secure the border or which border, or why people cross the border in the first place. Or how people wind up in the country without immigration status, or why all those cut throat business folks hire undocumented workers on the farms or in the slaughterhouse.. They just know that their Trumpy wants a wall and they want it too.


Precisely. First, I would like someone to present cogent reasons for "securing the border." Those who promote anti-immigration skip the first step - why is this necessary?

We all know the real reason.
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
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Francoflier
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:32 pm

I just thought I'd post this again here.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/pow ... bd44fe3f94

This immigration 'scandal' raised by the Trump crowd always amuses me... mostly because they have no understanding of the issue whatsoever, apart from what their supreme guru tells them, and they continually fall for the old 'foreigners are to blame for everything' slogan that has been used by populists and autocrats to foster anger and divert attention for centuries.

But hey, do what he says, not what he does, right?
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jetero
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:46 pm

stratosphere wrote:
I have to say out of all the Hollywood types this guy gets it. Unlike the rest of the Hollyweird morons and freaks. I hope Trump heeds his warnings because a lot of Trumps base voted for him for these reasons. I agree with everything he has said pretty much. My take is absolutely do NOT do any kind of deal on DACA until we secure and I mean really secure the border this time (not like when Reagan gave amnesty in 86 and promised to secure the border later) . The Democrats just push this crap to build their voter base just like Woods said.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/25607/li ... sspatriot#


And Strato what're you going to do when you don't get your way? Stamp your feet, grit your teeth, and whine? Or wake up and realize that your position is not the majority one and, as Trump reminds us, "YOU CAN'T ALWAYS GET WHAT YOU WANT"? You live in a democracy, brother.
 
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Tugger
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:50 pm

jetero wrote:
And Strato what're you going to do when you don't get your way?

Well, hopefully he and others like him and actor James Woods will abandon Trump and not support or vote for him.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
 
jetero
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:57 pm

Tugger wrote:
jetero wrote:
And Strato what're you going to do when you don't get your way?

Well, hopefully he and others like him and actor James Woods will abandon Trump and not support or vote for him.

Tugg


As I said in another post, there's no learning with these guys. If things don't go their way, they think they weren't right enough and want to push only harder.

But a good outcome for the country . . . weed these extremists out of the system. Natural selection and survival of the fittest at its best.
 
NIKV69
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:54 pm

mbmbos wrote:
For what reason should we "secure the border?


I don't know why don't you ask Mexico? They don't just let anybody walk in to their country. I wonder why?

I love Woods. He walked into a poker room I was playing in recently in LAS but didn't spend much time and just talked to someone he knew. I so wanted to go shake his hand and tell him to keep up the tweets.
The Juice is loose and he is in Vegas!
 
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Lilienthal
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:19 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
For what reason should we "secure the border?


I don't know why don't you ask Mexico? They don't just let anybody walk in to their country.



Neither does the US...
 
LMP737
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:20 pm

stratosphere wrote:
I have to say out of all the Hollywood types this guy gets it. Unlike the rest of the Hollyweird morons and freaks. I hope Trump heeds his warnings because a lot of Trumps base voted for him for these reasons. I agree with everything he has said pretty much. My take is absolutely do NOT do any kind of deal on DACA until we secure and I mean really secure the border this time (not like when Reagan gave amnesty in 86 and promised to secure the border later) . The Democrats just push this crap to build their voter base just like Woods said.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/25607/li ... sspatriot#


Sigh. The only thing a wall is going to do is create a market for ladders one foot taller than the the wall. Of course this whole wall thing ignores that the number of people crossing has gone down over the past twenty years.

The only way you could have a secure southern border is to make it a mirror image of the South/North Korean border. That means walls, land mines, tunnel detection gear and troops to cover every inch of it. And even if you were to do this one must not forget that around 30-40% of illegal immigrants in the US arrived via the airports.
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 8:28 pm

LMP737 wrote:
stratosphere wrote:
I have to say out of all the Hollywood types this guy gets it. Unlike the rest of the Hollyweird morons and freaks. I hope Trump heeds his warnings because a lot of Trumps base voted for him for these reasons. I agree with everything he has said pretty much. My take is absolutely do NOT do any kind of deal on DACA until we secure and I mean really secure the border this time (not like when Reagan gave amnesty in 86 and promised to secure the border later) . The Democrats just push this crap to build their voter base just like Woods said.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/25607/li ... sspatriot#


Sigh. The only thing a wall is going to do is create a market for ladders one foot taller than the the wall. Of course this whole wall thing ignores that the number of people crossing has gone down over the past twenty years.

The only way you could have a secure southern border is to make it a mirror image of the South/North Korean border. That means walls, land mines, tunnel detection gear and troops to cover every inch of it. And even if you were to do this one must not forget that around 30-40% of illegal immigrants in the US arrived via the airports.

Here is the truth:
Go ahead and try to actually get the wall built and get Republican's in one border state in particular to support a full wall.... It won't happen. Texans are not going to give up and sell their land or have a wall divide their land. Texas does not want a wall built that is any much more than what California and Arizona have. A good barrier (fence etc.) is needed in keys areas but the vast majority of the border does not need a wall. And Republican's in those parts don't want it either. Hell will freeze (or if you like, the day guns are pried from cold dead fingers) before they will give up their land.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
 
Route66
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:02 pm

mbmbos wrote:
casinterest wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
For what reason should we "secure the border?


Trump minions have no clue how to secure the border or which border, or why people cross the border in the first place. Or how people wind up in the country without immigration status, or why all those cut throat business folks hire undocumented workers on the farms or in the slaughterhouse.. They just know that their Trumpy wants a wall and they want it too.


Precisely. First, I would like someone to present cogent reasons for "securing the border." Those who promote anti-immigration skip the first step - why is this necessary?

We all know the real reason.


Do you really?

Let's start with the lowering of wages in previously middleclass industries over the last 20 years. Start with construction please.

Then we can start looking at specific examples of the bigger picture, such as the fact that 400,000 illegals in Chicago metro are "Sanctualized" but more than 40 percent of 20-to-24-year-old black males are out of work. In los Angeles, another illegal hotbed with an estimated 1 million illegals, a black simoply cannot get a construction job that might enable him to move up, they are all taken by cheaper illegals and those who do work are under constant wage pressure.
Last edited by Route66 on Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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mbmbos
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:10 pm

Route66 wrote:

Do you really?

Let's start with the lowering of wages in previously middleclass industries over the last 20 years. Start with construction please.



And that is because of undocumented workers? Can you cite evidence they are directly related? From the metrics I have read middle class wages began their downward spiral, relative to inflation, about the time the Reagan Revolution got started. You know, the revolution that busted unions.

So if you have some actual facts that support your thesis that Mexicans took middle class construction jobs, I will be happy to look at them.
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:12 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
For what reason should we "secure the border?


I don't know why don't you ask Mexico? They don't just let anybody walk in to their country. I wonder why?

I love Woods. He walked into a poker room I was playing in recently in LAS but didn't spend much time and just talked to someone he knew. I so wanted to go shake his hand and tell him to keep up the tweets.


Wow! A powerful non-answer to my question. Snarky too.

Do you know how to actually provide a logical argument and, you know, facts?
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
Route66
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:25 pm

mbmbos wrote:
And that is because of undocumented workers? Can you cite evidence they are directly related? From the metrics I have read middle class wages began their downward spiral, relative to inflation, about the time the Reagan Revolution got started. You know, the revolution that busted unions.

So if you have some actual facts that support your thesis that Mexicans took middle class construction jobs, I will be happy to look at them.


I have seen firsthand Mexicans who contract for (literally) half the going rate, employ more illegals at half the going wage, send what they can home until Mama has a new house and then return home. Followed by the next cycle, not only killing wages but killing the trades. How many jobsites have you been on?
 
Route66
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:32 pm

mbmbos wrote:
casinterest wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
For what reason should we "secure the border?


Trump minions have no clue how to secure the border or which border, or why people cross the border in the first place. Or how people wind up in the country without immigration status, or why all those cut throat business folks hire undocumented workers on the farms or in the slaughterhouse.. They just know that their Trumpy wants a wall and they want it too.


Precisely. First, I would like someone to present cogent reasons for "securing the border." Those who promote anti-immigration skip the first step - why is this necessary?

We all know the real reason.


Are you trying to imply racism? Could be, why do you hate blacks?

Construction has offered a lot of new jobs to Angelenos over the last several decades, but those positions don’t seem to be going to black workers. There were 7,012 black workers in construction in 2014, 2,000 fewer than there were in 1980, according to census data analyzed by UCLA.

That 23% drop compares with an overall increase of 120,840 construction workers of all races during those 34 years, or 80%.

Those new jobs aren’t going to white workers, either. There were nearly 40,000 fewer white construction workers in Los Angeles in 2014 compared with 1980, a decline of about 40%.

Latinos, however, have significantly upped their representation. There were more than 185,000 Latino construction workers in Los Angeles in 2014, five times as many as there were in 1980.

Manufacturing has been slashing jobs in the county over the last three decades. The number of black and white Angelenos in manufacturing declined by the same rate — about 77% — from 1980 to 2014. Latinos also lost some ground, but their ranks shrank by only 5% over the same period.

“The way that we heard in the Rust Belt we lost middle-class manufacturing jobs, you could say the same for black workers here in L.A.,” says Saba Waheed, a researcher at the UCLA Labor Center who co-authored the study.


http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-b ... story.html
Last edited by Route66 on Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
jetero
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:33 pm

Route66 wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
And that is because of undocumented workers? Can you cite evidence they are directly related? From the metrics I have read middle class wages began their downward spiral, relative to inflation, about the time the Reagan Revolution got started. You know, the revolution that busted unions.

So if you have some actual facts that support your thesis that Mexicans took middle class construction jobs, I will be happy to look at them.


I have seen firsthand Mexicans who contract for (literally) half the going rate, employ more illegals at half the going wage, send what they can home until Mama has a new house and then return home. Followed by the next cycle, not only killing wages but killing the trades. How many jobsites have you been on?


All I have to say is I wish we could have a policy debate along these lines. I don't doubt intuitively that what you're saying is at least partially (perhaps a significant portion) responsible for the symptoms you describe. And, if we approach it from that perspective, we could (as a country) probably come up with some sort of middle ground that may or may not include a wall. As far as I'm concerned, however, I have no confidence that any of the policy that is being implemented is in the spirit that you imply and rather out of naked, bloodthirsty, "can explain to a kindergartner" (Son, look there's a big, beautiful wall! Ain't no Mexicans getting over that thing!) retribution to satisfy the Bannonites.

I also agree with MBM--the blue-collar middle class died with Reagan. We're about to do it again because very little of what is being proposed is rationally defensible as a solution to the perceived problems, you know, because rationality equals "ELITE" these days.
 
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:37 pm

Route66 wrote:
hate blacks

Why do you hate blacks? This seems off topic.

Tugg
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Route66
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:46 pm

Tugger wrote:
Route66 wrote:
hate blacks

Why do you hate blacks? This seems off topic.

Tugg


I don't know what you are saying, I happen to have a lot of empathy for the African-American situation at large. They have been sold down the river by people and politicians who want to harbor any illegal from around the world that can swim the river or overstay a visa. And somehow, their leaders, blinded by whiteness and not seeing the forest for trees, support it all.
 
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Tugger
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:00 pm

Route66 wrote:
Tugger wrote:
Route66 wrote:
hate blacks

Why do you hate blacks? This seems off topic.

Tugg


I don't know what you are saying, I happen to have a lot of empathy for the African-American situation at large. They have been sold down the river by people and politicians who want to harbor any illegal from around the world that can swim the river or overstay a visa. And somehow, their leaders, blinded by whiteness and not seeing the forest for trees, support it all.

Yes, I am just trying to make a point. Your post was implying that the other poster hated blacks, which is not supported anywhere nor implied or stated in their post. Immigration control, jobs etc. are one thing, making it appear someone is racist is another. My apologies for making the point the way I did but it is something I wish people would stop doing.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
 
NIKV69
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:12 pm

mbmbos wrote:

Wow! A powerful non-answer to my question. Snarky too.

Do you know how to actually provide a logical argument and, you know, facts?


It was a polite way to try to nicely point out how silly your question was. Also I am convinced you asked the question not for an answer but to illicit an emotional response.

Fact is we are a sovereign nation and need to have a secure border with an immigration policy. If you are inferring we should just let anyone walk in here well some would disagree with you.
The Juice is loose and he is in Vegas!
 
jetero
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:22 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
mbmbos wrote:

Wow! A powerful non-answer to my question. Snarky too.

Do you know how to actually provide a logical argument and, you know, facts?


It was a polite way to try to nicely point out how silly your question was. Also I am convinced you asked the question not for an answer but to illicit an emotional response.

Fact is we are a sovereign nation and need to have a secure border with an immigration policy. If you are inferring we should just let anyone walk in here well some would disagree with you.


Stop being illicit, MBM!!!!

Image

(Are you sure it's not "enfurring"? Thank God for (1) spell check, and (2) "sovereign" not being a homophone.)
 
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casinterest
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:22 am

Route66 wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
casinterest wrote:

Trump minions have no clue how to secure the border or which border, or why people cross the border in the first place. Or how people wind up in the country without immigration status, or why all those cut throat business folks hire undocumented workers on the farms or in the slaughterhouse.. They just know that their Trumpy wants a wall and they want it too.


Precisely. First, I would like someone to present cogent reasons for "securing the border." Those who promote anti-immigration skip the first step - why is this necessary?

We all know the real reason.


Do you really?

Let's start with the lowering of wages in previously middleclass industries over the last 20 years. Start with construction please.

Then we can start looking at specific examples of the bigger picture, such as the fact that 400,000 illegals in Chicago metro are "Sanctualized" but more than 40 percent of 20-to-24-year-old black males are out of work. In los Angeles, another illegal hotbed with an estimated 1 million illegals, a black simoply cannot get a construction job that might enable him to move up, they are all taken by cheaper illegals and those who do work are under constant wage pressure.



The middle class has been screwed by the morons that are in the Republican party that keep cheering as the leadership gives the lions share of tax breaks to the wealthy, and then incentivizes the hiring of folks with questionable work backgrounds by blaming a wall instead of the business owners that get by offering the jobs.
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MaverickM11
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:18 am

stratosphere wrote:
I have to say out of all the Hollywood types this guy gets it

Crazy old white bigot gets it--"it" being a crazy old white bigot president and administration of same

Route66 wrote:
I don't know what you are saying, I happen to have a lot of empathy for the African-American situation at large. They have been sold down the river by people and politicians who want to harbor any illegal from around the world that can swim the river or overstay a visa. And somehow, their leaders, blinded by whiteness and not seeing the forest for trees, support it all.

To imply illegals are the problem behind the black community's issues is the definition of scapegoat, and the GOP's favorite color of scapegoat: nonwhite. Multitudes of studies have shown that influxes of immigrants, legal or otherwise, have minimal impact to wages at worst in the US

jetero wrote:
Route66 wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
And that is because of undocumented workers? Can you cite evidence they are directly related? From the metrics I have read middle class wages began their downward spiral, relative to inflation, about the time the Reagan Revolution got started. You know, the revolution that busted unions.

So if you have some actual facts that support your thesis that Mexicans took middle class construction jobs, I will be happy to look at them.


I have seen firsthand Mexicans who contract for (literally) half the going rate, employ more illegals at half the going wage, send what they can home until Mama has a new house and then return home. Followed by the next cycle, not only killing wages but killing the trades. How many jobsites have you been on?


All I have to say is I wish we could have a policy debate along these lines. I don't doubt intuitively that what you're saying is at least partially (perhaps a significant portion) responsible for the symptoms you describe.

It's a fair debate but it's more than just Mexicans... For as long as I can remember, anything giving any kind of support or sustainability to the middle/lower class has been a job killer: unions, minimum wage, health care, job retraining, insurance of any kind, maternity leave, clean water/air, public transportation, public education, you name it. One by one they've been all blown up by mostly one side of the political spectrum and here we are: must be those messicans ruining everything :roll:
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NoTime
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:42 am

In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would we want to import more poor people?
 
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:08 am

NoTime wrote:
In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would we want to import more poor people?


Now that is a simple question to answer, and why we have an immigration problem now disavowed by the Republicans, who loved cheap labor and still do behind the scenes. Many Democrats are just as guilty on that score. The roles are clouded by politics, but both parties are guilty of exploiting workers, some overtly, some not so much. Lip service by politicians is why we have not corrected the problem over all these years
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NoTime
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:19 am

WarRI1 wrote:
NoTime wrote:
In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would we want to import more poor people?


Now that is a simple question to answer, and why we have an immigration problem now disavowed by the Republicans, who loved cheap labor and still do behind the scenes. Many Democrats are just as guilty on that score. The roles are clouded by politics, but both parties are guilty of exploiting workers, some overtly, some not so much. Lip service by politicians is why we have not corrected the problem over all these years


OK, then allow me to rephrase - In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would the citizenry want to import more poor people?
 
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WarRI1
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:20 am

WarRI1 wrote:
NoTime wrote:
In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would we want to import more poor people?


Now that is a simple question to answer, and why we have an immigration problem now disavowed by the Republicans, who loved cheap labor and still do behind the scenes. Many Democrats are just as guilty on that score. The roles are clouded by politics, but both parties are guilty of exploiting workers, some overtly, some not so much. Lip service by politicians is why we have not corrected the problem over all these years


Let me rephrase my answer, Ditto
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NoTime
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:28 am

WarRI1 wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:
NoTime wrote:
In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would we want to import more poor people?


Now that is a simple question to answer, and why we have an immigration problem now disavowed by the Republicans, who loved cheap labor and still do behind the scenes. Many Democrats are just as guilty on that score. The roles are clouded by politics, but both parties are guilty of exploiting workers, some overtly, some not so much. Lip service by politicians is why we have not corrected the problem over all these years


Let me rephrase my answer, Ditto


So, the average joe schmoe in middle America should be in favor of illegal immigration of poor people because of the cheap labor? Regardless of the burdens placed on society?
 
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WarRI1
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:45 am

NoTime wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:

Now that is a simple question to answer, and why we have an immigration problem now disavowed by the Republicans, who loved cheap labor and still do behind the scenes. Many Democrats are just as guilty on that score. The roles are clouded by politics, but both parties are guilty of exploiting workers, some overtly, some not so much. Lip service by politicians is why we have not corrected the problem over all these years


Let me rephrase my answer, Ditto


So, the average joe schmoe in middle America should be in favor of illegal immigration of poor people because of the cheap labor? Regardless of the burdens placed on society?




You will notice not one word advocating anymore illegal immigration in my answer, not one that I can see anyway. I have been stating the cause and the failure to correct the same problem that I have written about myself on here many times, no jobs, poorer citizens, exploitation of labor by wealthy folks to the detriment of US workers from both sides of the aisle. Those that do get in through this corrupted system by and large are not educated, but they can do hard work and that is the reason we are sparring on here. Exploitation of people allowed in and encouraged by our corporations, and our government and some churches. Cheap Labor!!! Low wages!!! No benefits!!! A Capitalist wet dream.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
NoTime
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:03 am

WarRI1 wrote:
NoTime wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:

Let me rephrase my answer, Ditto


So, the average joe schmoe in middle America should be in favor of illegal immigration of poor people because of the cheap labor? Regardless of the burdens placed on society?


You will notice not one word advocating anymore illegal immigration in my answer, not one that I can see anyway. I have been stating the cause and the failure to correct the same problem that I have written about myself on here many times, no jobs, poorer citizens, exploitation of labor by wealthy folks to the detriment of US workers from both sides of the aisle.


So, then you don't think the average American should be in favor of more illegal immigration? That, perhaps, they should be in favor of stopping further illegal immigration?
 
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casinterest
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:23 am

NoTime wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:
NoTime wrote:

So, the average joe schmoe in middle America should be in favor of illegal immigration of poor people because of the cheap labor? Regardless of the burdens placed on society?


You will notice not one word advocating anymore illegal immigration in my answer, not one that I can see anyway. I have been stating the cause and the failure to correct the same problem that I have written about myself on here many times, no jobs, poorer citizens, exploitation of labor by wealthy folks to the detriment of US workers from both sides of the aisle.


So, then you don't think the average American should be in favor of more illegal immigration? That, perhaps, they should be in favor of stopping further illegal immigration?


And is a wall the best way to do that?

Ask the Trojans how that worked out.
Ask the Chinese how that worked out.
Ask the Russians how that worked out in Berlin.

A wall requires Maintenance, upkeep, staffing, surveillance, and at many points along the border it is just flat out not worth it. Especially when better enforcement of hiring and payrolls would do just as good a job.
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WarRI1
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:48 am

I think the wall is a waste of money and time. As has been said they will build a taller ladder. There is a Federal Law called E-verify that had a chance of taking away some of the incentive to illegally immigration, no work, no money, no incentive. We had a partial program once which was done away with by a kooky Governor we had earlier. Executive Order, sound familiar? No one will now touch it with a ten foot pole here. I do not like law breakers myself, but we reward them in this instance, someone has to fill the slumlords pockets and do the menial work. Crazy!!!
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MaverickM11
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:09 am

NoTime wrote:
In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would we want to import more poor people?

Are you just trolling people thinking the GOP and this administration cares about poor people? Or are you using it as a convenient excuse to crack down on any kind of immigration, legal or otherwise?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
jetero
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:02 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
NoTime wrote:
In a country that is already challenged with dealing with the poverty of its native citizens, why would we want to import more poor people?

Are you just trolling people thinking the GOP and this administration cares about poor people? Or are you using it as a convenient excuse to crack down on any kind of immigration, legal or otherwise?


“Yes please”

—NoTime
 
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:07 am

If you give someone an opportunity, more than likely he/she will take it.

Rather than building a wall that the illegals could circumvent as is always the case, why not put an effort in closing the opportunity instead by going after businesses who employ illegals and go after them hard. Punish them to the max to deter other businesses from even thinking about employing illegals. Once the illegals realize that they won't be able to make any money by staying illegally in America, they will leave.

It's that simple, and neither Jimmy Wood nor Donald Trump nor any of the other wall advocates get it.
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MaverickM11
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:59 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
If you give someone an opportunity, more than likely he/she will take it.

Rather than building a wall that the illegals could circumvent as is always the case, why not put an effort in closing the opportunity instead by going after businesses who employ illegals and go after them hard. Punish them to the max to deter other businesses from even thinking about employing illegals. Once the illegals realize that they won't be able to make any money by staying illegally in America, they will leave.

It's that simple, and neither Jimmy Wood nor Donald Trump nor any of the other wall advocates get it.

Going after businesses for doing illegal things is an undue burden and a jaaaaaaahb killer. Much easier to go after the dirt poor colored folk...
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jetero
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:02 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
If you give someone an opportunity, more than likely he/she will take it.

Rather than building a wall that the illegals could circumvent as is always the case, why not put an effort in closing the opportunity instead by going after businesses who employ illegals and go after them hard. Punish them to the max to deter other businesses from even thinking about employing illegals. Once the illegals realize that they won't be able to make any money by staying illegally in America, they will leave.

It's that simple, and neither Jimmy Wood nor Donald Trump nor any of the other wall advocates get it.


In re this (im)migration paranoia, maybe it’d be a good idea from a policy perspective if the federal government just paid for people to leave No End, West Virginia and Hopeless, Alabama to places with jobs. (While giving a holy middle finger to their governors and all elected officials for not making their states adaptable.)

But that won’t work ... it’s an “elitist” solution.
 
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mbmbos
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:17 pm

Route66 wrote:
Are you trying to imply racism? Could be, why do you hate blacks?

Construction has offered a lot of new jobs to Angelenos over the last several decades, but those positions don’t seem to be going to black workers. There were 7,012 black workers in construction in 2014, 2,000 fewer than there were in 1980, according to census data analyzed by UCLA.

That 23% drop compares with an overall increase of 120,840 construction workers of all races during those 34 years, or 80%.

Those new jobs aren’t going to white workers, either. There were nearly 40,000 fewer white construction workers in Los Angeles in 2014 compared with 1980, a decline of about 40%.

Latinos, however, have significantly upped their representation. There were more than 185,000 Latino construction workers in Los Angeles in 2014, five times as many as there were in 1980.

Manufacturing has been slashing jobs in the county over the last three decades. The number of black and white Angelenos in manufacturing declined by the same rate — about 77% — from 1980 to 2014. Latinos also lost some ground, but their ranks shrank by only 5% over the same period.

“The way that we heard in the Rust Belt we lost middle-class manufacturing jobs, you could say the same for black workers here in L.A.,” says Saba Waheed, a researcher at the UCLA Labor Center who co-authored the study.


http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-b ... story.html


1. Why did you suggest that I "hate blacks?" I find that offensive.

2. "Latinos, however, have significantly upped their representation." The majority of Latinos are American citizens. The majority of Latinos in this country have been here for generations. That you equate Latinos with undocumented workers reveals a whole lot about your thinking.
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LMP737
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:51 am

Route66 wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
casinterest wrote:

Trump minions have no clue how to secure the border or which border, or why people cross the border in the first place. Or how people wind up in the country without immigration status, or why all those cut throat business folks hire undocumented workers on the farms or in the slaughterhouse.. They just know that their Trumpy wants a wall and they want it too.


Precisely. First, I would like someone to present cogent reasons for "securing the border." Those who promote anti-immigration skip the first step - why is this necessary?

We all know the real reason.


Are you trying to imply racism? Could be, why do you hate blacks?

Construction has offered a lot of new jobs to Angelenos over the last several decades, but those positions don’t seem to be going to black workers. There were 7,012 black workers in construction in 2014, 2,000 fewer than there were in 1980, according to census data analyzed by UCLA.

That 23% drop compares with an overall increase of 120,840 construction workers of all races during those 34 years, or 80%.

Those new jobs aren’t going to white workers, either. There were nearly 40,000 fewer white construction workers in Los Angeles in 2014 compared with 1980, a decline of about 40%.

Latinos, however, have significantly upped their representation. There were more than 185,000 Latino construction workers in Los Angeles in 2014, five times as many as there were in 1980.

Manufacturing has been slashing jobs in the county over the last three decades. The number of black and white Angelenos in manufacturing declined by the same rate — about 77% — from 1980 to 2014. Latinos also lost some ground, but their ranks shrank by only 5% over the same period.

“The way that we heard in the Rust Belt we lost middle-class manufacturing jobs, you could say the same for black workers here in L.A.,” says Saba Waheed, a researcher at the UCLA Labor Center who co-authored the study.


http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-b ... story.html


What exactly is you point? That illegal immigrants are the reason less black and white Angelenos are in manufacturing? Good luck proving that.

Since this is an aviation sight let me point out that McDonnell Douglas was one of the biggest private employers in the Los Angeles area at one time. Now Boeing only employees a handful of people compared to the glory days of years past. That has nothing to do with immigrants and everything to do with bad management decisions at MD.
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tommy1808
Posts: 7569
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Re: James Woods issues warning to Trump

Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:28 am

NoTime wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:
NoTime wrote:

So, the average joe schmoe in middle America should be in favor of illegal immigration of poor people because of the cheap labor? Regardless of the burdens placed on society?


You will notice not one word advocating anymore illegal immigration in my answer, not one that I can see anyway. I have been stating the cause and the failure to correct the same problem that I have written about myself on here many times, no jobs, poorer citizens, exploitation of labor by wealthy folks to the detriment of US workers from both sides of the aisle.


So, then you don't think the average American should be in favor of more illegal immigration? That, perhaps, they should be in favor of stopping further illegal immigration?


And that is easy to solve. Company gets caught hiring illegals, toss the CEO in jail, company does so in any structural way, expropriate the whole company and sell it off to the highest bidder. All illegals getting caught or ratting out their employer won't be punished, but have the right to get full pay retrospectively for as long as they worked for the criminal. Full cooperation with law enforcement could earn them the right to stay to work legally.
That way illegals have lots of motivation to rat out their boss, and bosses would have zero incentive to keep hiring illegals.

Illegal immigration would be as good as over within month and the government would make lots of money from it.

But of course that won't fly, because a populist move towards immigrants is easier und doesn't have the bribe.... donations drying up.
Rounding up immigrants and sending them back is so liked by the same lot, because that is the whip to keep those illegal workers wages down, and society even pays for the whipping.

Best regards
Thomas
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