seb146 wrote:

NIKV69 wrote:

johns624 wrote:

Because that's what's important...party before country or ethics.

Works both ways back when Clinton was accused nobody cared about the victims and gave Clinton the benefit of the doubt. It was party before doing "what is right"

You have a very different recollection than the rest of us. The majority feeling was "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" which happened. Since he was found innocent of sexual misconduct, you righties seem to think that makes him a sexual predator, worse than Roy Moore and Donald Trump.

Once again the Clintons get a free pass from you libs. He was a creeper just like all the other men who have power and influence and use that to take advantage of women. But that said I think a lot of women willingly went for it because of the power and money and now are jumping on the bandwagon saying "me too me too". But if this the way to drain the swamp so be it.

stratosphere wrote:

seb146 wrote:

NIKV69 wrote:

Works both ways back when Clinton was accused nobody cared about the victims and gave Clinton the benefit of the doubt. It was party before doing "what is right"

You have a very different recollection than the rest of us. The majority feeling was "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" which happened. Since he was found innocent of sexual misconduct, you righties seem to think that makes him a sexual predator, worse than Roy Moore and Donald Trump.

Once again the Clintons get a free pass from you libs. He was a creeper just like all the other men who have power and influence and use that to take advantage of women. But that said I think a lot of women willingly went for it because of the power and money and now are jumping on the bandwagon saying "me too me too". But if this the way to drain the swamp so be it.

How about we stick to current events? The Bill Clinton affairs were 20+ years ago. It has already been hashed out. That's why it looks to you like he "gets a pass." You are living in 1995 while the rest of us are in 2017.

Bill Clinton is not in office nor is he running for office. You do know that, don't you?

Trump has been accused by multiple women of sexual misconduct. Roy Moore has been accused by multiple women of sexual misconduct. Moore was even banned from a shopping mall because of it. Both say those women are lying. You righties insist that we believe all the women who have accused Franken but we have to believe the women who accuse Moore and tRump are lying. That still has not been explained to me. Why? Franken even apologized for acts he says he does not remember! He admitted to things he does not even think he did! But the women who accuse tRump and Moore are lying? Why? Explain, please.

And leave Bill Clinton out of your explanation.

seb146 wrote:

NIKV69 wrote:

johns624 wrote:

Because that's what's important...party before country or ethics.

Works both ways back when Clinton was accused nobody cared about the victims and gave Clinton the benefit of the doubt. It was party before doing "what is right"

You have a very different recollection than the rest of us. The majority feeling was "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" which happened. Since he was found innocent of sexual misconduct, you righties seem to think that makes him a sexual predator, worse than Roy Moore and Donald Trump.

So Clinton gets "innocent until proven guilty" and Trump and Moore get "credibly accused" so they should resign? Typical.

I am just glad there were some good lawyers who fought for three certain kids from Duke. The media and 24 hour news cycle are out of control.

NIKV69 wrote:

seb146 wrote:

NIKV69 wrote:

Works both ways back when Clinton was accused nobody cared about the victims and gave Clinton the benefit of the doubt. It was party before doing "what is right"

You have a very different recollection than the rest of us. The majority feeling was "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" which happened. Since he was found innocent of sexual misconduct, you righties seem to think that makes him a sexual predator, worse than Roy Moore and Donald Trump.

So Clinton gets "innocent until proven guilty" and Trump and Moore get "credibly accused" so they should resign? Typical.

You righies are OUTRAGED!!! that Franken allegedly did these things and these women MUST be heard NOW!!!!

but the women who accuse Moore and tRump are liars.

That's all I am saying.

And:

BILL
CLINTON
IS
NOT
RUNNING
OR
IN
OFFICE

LEAVE HIM OUT OF THIS

seb146 wrote:

NIKV69 wrote:

seb146 wrote:

You have a very different recollection than the rest of us. The majority feeling was "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" which happened. Since he was found innocent of sexual misconduct, you righties seem to think that makes him a sexual predator, worse than Roy Moore and Donald Trump.

So Clinton gets "innocent until proven guilty" and Trump and Moore get "credibly accused" so they should resign? Typical.

You righies are OUTRAGED!!! that Franken allegedly did these things and these women MUST be heard NOW!!!!

but the women who accuse Moore and tRump are liars.

That's all I am saying.

And:

BILL
CLINTON
IS
NOT
RUNNING
OR
IN
OFFICE

LEAVE HIM OUT OF THIS

He was in office and the response to same accusations was entirely different. Bias must be exposed and called out and for the millionth time I am not a righty and not from New Zealand.

NIKV69 wrote:

seb146 wrote:

NIKV69 wrote:

So Clinton gets "innocent until proven guilty" and Trump and Moore get "credibly accused" so they should resign? Typical.

You righies are OUTRAGED!!! that Franken allegedly did these things and these women MUST be heard NOW!!!!

but the women who accuse Moore and tRump are liars.

That's all I am saying.

And:

BILL
CLINTON
IS
NOT
RUNNING
OR
IN
OFFICE

LEAVE HIM OUT OF THIS

He was in office and the response to same accusations was entirely different.

His response was NOT to call the women liars, but to deny. Not as bad at Moore or tRump.

Read that last sentence again and think about what Moore and tRump have said.

And keep in mind that

THIS THREAD IS ABOUT FRANKEN

There is a thread about all sexual assaults. Even the ones that Bill Clinton has been to court for.

Even the ones Bill Clinton has been to court for.

Keep that in mind. EVEN THE ONES BILL CLINTON HAS BEEN TO COURT FOR.

Roy Moore and Donald tRump have called their accusers liars. Let's stay in the present. The Bill Clinton years have been litigated.

We get it: you hate Bill Clinton. Move on. The rest of us have. Stop living in the past. This is 2017. Bill Clinton has NOTHING AT ALL to do with Roy Moore or Donald tRump or Al Franken. That is the past. GET. OVER. IT.

If "but Bill Clinton!!!" is your only argument, maybe you need to rethink your argument.

NIKV69 wrote:

seb146 wrote:

NIKV69 wrote:

Works both ways back when Clinton was accused nobody cared about the victims and gave Clinton the benefit of the doubt. It was party before doing "what is right"

You have a very different recollection than the rest of us. The majority feeling was "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" which happened. Since he was found innocent of sexual misconduct, you righties seem to think that makes him a sexual predator, worse than Roy Moore and Donald Trump.

So Clinton gets "innocent until proven guilty" and Trump and Moore get "credibly accused" so they should resign? Typical.

I am just glad there were some good lawyers who fought for three certain kids from Duke. The media and 24 hour news cycle are out of control.

I’ve been on this site for a very long time and remember a lot of things. Just one and two months into Barack Obama’s first term (recall he had two in spite of your repeated assertions he’d be a one-term President) you were telling us that Bush could no longer be blamed for the economic mess he left Obama because Bush was the past, it was all Obama’s failure at that point. Again, just one and two months after Bush left office. Bill Clinton has been out of office 17 years, holds no elected office, and is not running for any elected office.

So now, without saying “but what about” Bill or Hillary Clinton, or Barack Obama, explain to us why it’s correct and proper to put party over country and vote for a man who bragged about grabbing women or a man accused of pedophilia. Why in 2017, is it ok to do that?

OA412 wrote:

I’ve been on this site for a very long time and remember a lot of things. Just one and two months into Barack Obama’s first term (recall he had two in spite of your repeated assertions he’d be a one-term President) you were telling us that Bush could no longer be blamed for the economic mess he left Obama because Bush was the past, it was all Obama’s failure at that point. Again, just one and two months after Bush left office. Bill Clinton has been out of office 17 years, holds no elected office, and is not running for any elected office.

So now, without saying “but what about” Bill or Hillary Clinton, or Barack Obama, explain to us why it’s correct and proper to put party over country and vote for a man who bragged about grabbing women or a man accused of pedophilia. Why in 2017, is it ok to do that?

Obama would have been a one term president if the GOP had a decent candidate. Romney was a disaster.

I love how you ask me to explain how a sitting official or someone running for elected office accused of sexual crimes should be disqualified but can not make reference to Bill Clinton who was accused of the same crimes but was hailed as a hero and his accusers discounted. Unfortunately you can't run away from that.

As for Trump Derangement syndrome the DNC tried the smear of the sexual allegations and they didn't work. Again I would like to remind you that we live in a country that believes you are innocent until proven guilty. If you are inferring that accusations should be the end all to a political career or reputation then again I have to say I am glad three certain Duke lacrosse players had the lawyers they had. If you still believe Trump should be removed from office then contact your representative and ask why impeachment didn't work and or try again. It's over. Move on.

As for Moore I find it funny that the allegations are older than Clinton's yet you don't want me to use Clinton but Moore has to be pulled from the ballot? Doesn't work that way. The people of Alabama have say in who there Senators are. Not the media. If the GOP feels he committed acts not becoming an elected official they remove him. There is a process in place and it should be respected. The media doesn't have say since they desperately want the Senate back.

These media smears work and sometimes they don't. Gloria Allred is a favorite operative of the DNC and she was successful in bringing down Meg Whitman when she was giving Jerry Brown a run for this money in the 2010 Gubernatorial in CA. http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/meg-whit ... d=11758365

Now Gloria is all in trying to destroy Moore. Will it work? Personally I think Moore will win but that is politics.

I sure hope you are not trying to tell us we have to now use accusations as means to decide who we vote for and who we don't. In fact Nikki Haley endured a late smear when it was clear she was going to win her election

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... al/345466/

Should she have pulled out of the race?

Again in this country we are innocent until proven guilty. We are not tried in the media and we are entitled to our day in court. Just because the DNC is in total desperation mode to win any seat doesn't change this.

NIKV69 wrote:

Did you read my post? In his speech........

Read the CNN article carefully. His speech was bitter and had no contrition. IMO he wouldn't have resigned. He was pushed into it by his party trying to push out Moore..

Bet you didn't have a problem with Trump bragging women by their privates did you? But Frankens speech is "bitter"?

NIKV69 wrote:

DocLightning wrote:

salttee wrote:

Just as his resignation is necessary, the contrast is astounding.

Well put, sir.

Kind of funny but I remember when Bill Clinton was in this situation the reaction of the left was quite different. Guess you must have "Evolved"

casinterest wrote:

He should attack Trump. Trump gets to continue on to serve in a disgusting twist.

As did Clinton. You will have a chance to get rid of Trump. In 2020.

Trump is long gone before 2020; the dominoes are falling in the Russia investigation. It's only a matter of time before either Trump resigns or is carted off in handcuffs.

Smerconish @CNN last evening coined an interesting theory about this announcement, claiming this is just posturing prior to AL Senate elections, i.e., just to claim short-term moral high ground. If Moore wins Franken will not leave Senate.

Smerconish thinks Al Franken should have followed Trent Franks, who resigned immediately.

Any thoughts?

LMP737 wrote:

Bet you didn't have a problem with Trump bragging women by their privates did you? But Frankens speech is "bitter"?

One has nothing to do with the other. I don't condone sexual assault.

CaliAtenza wrote:

Trump is long gone before 2020; the dominoes are falling in the Russia investigation. It's only a matter of time before either Trump resigns or is carted off in handcuffs.

Not going to happen. I know this mantra is soothing to the never Trumpers but if there was any evidence he would have been removed from office already. At this point it will be dragged out so the media can keep reciting "Russia meddled in our election" as a way to deny Hillary was a horrible candidate.

dtw2hyd wrote:

Smerconish @CNN last evening coined an interesting theory about this announcement, claiming this is just posturing prior to AL Senate elections, i.e., just to claim short-term moral high ground. If Moore wins Franken will not leave Senate.

Smerconish thinks Al Franken should have followed Trent Franks, who resigned immediately.

Any thoughts?

This theory was floated before Smerconish. I find it interesting and it could be plausible that Franken said "in the coming weeks" as a way to rescind his resignation if Moore wins and is not removed from the Senate after an ethics hearing. Boy can you imagine? Some heavy hitters in the DNC have asked him to leave and if he fights back get the popcorn.

NIKV69 wrote:

OA412 wrote:

I’ve been on this site for a very long time and remember a lot of things. Just one and two months into Barack Obama’s first term (recall he had two in spite of your repeated assertions he’d be a one-term President) you were telling us that Bush could no longer be blamed for the economic mess he left Obama because Bush was the past, it was all Obama’s failure at that point. Again, just one and two months after Bush left office. Bill Clinton has been out of office 17 years, holds no elected office, and is not running for any elected office.

So now, without saying “but what about” Bill or Hillary Clinton, or Barack Obama, explain to us why it’s correct and proper to put party over country and vote for a man who bragged about grabbing women or a man accused of pedophilia. Why in 2017, is it ok to do that?

Obama would have been a one term president if the GOP had a decent candidate. Romney was a disaster.

I love how you ask me to explain how a sitting official or someone running for elected office accused of sexual crimes should be disqualified but can not make reference to Bill Clinton who was accused of the same crimes but was hailed as a hero and his accusers discounted. Unfortunately you can't run away from that.

*sigh*

No one but no one is "running away" from anything. Bill Clinton is not running for office. Bill Clinton's affairs have already been debated. That subject is finished. Except for you righties. The last time any of you righties cared Clinton had inappropriate sexual relations with anyone, he did it in 1998 with a consenting adult.

Again: get over it.

I sure hope you are not trying to tell us we have to now use accusations as means to decide who we vote for and who we don't. In fact Nikki Haley endured a late smear when it was clear she was going to win her election

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... al/345466/

Should she have pulled out of the race?

Again in this country we are innocent until proven guilty. We are not tried in the media and we are entitled to our day in court. Just because the DNC is in total desperation mode to win any seat doesn't change this.

HA!! What a huge load of horse hockey! That is rich coming from you! "Innocent until proven guilty"? Like Franken? I hope he does refuse to leave IF Moore is elected. I think the DNC and many Americans would support his move. Simply because, if you guys are happy and welcoming of a racist pedophile, then you all should we welcoming of Franken.

He is, as YOU POINT OUT: Innocent until proven guilty.

And, it is completely and totally appropriate to hold "Republican" candidates to their own party's high "moral" standard of one-man-one-woman and "marriage is sacred" and so forth. Why the outrage over Nikki Hailey being called out on this? She runs as a "Republican" and the "Republican" party has a certain set of rules. Like marriage is a sacred bond between one man and one woman. What's wrong with holding her to that same standard that you all demonize gays for? Or do rules not apply to everyone, only a select few?

Please view the SNL Weekend Update from 12/9, where Che and Cathy Anne weigh in on the Franken resignation vis a vis the Alabama Senate Race. I agreed with some of the points Cathy Anne was making. They kind of told the political truth, but in a comedy setting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3QzKcdpy9LU

NIKV69 wrote:

One has nothing to do with the other. I don't condone sexual assault.
.

Translation, you said nothing.

I love how people are trying to bring the Clintons into this

seb146 wrote:

I think it is absolutely disgusting that righties are screaming about how we NEED to take these accusations against Franken seriously and we MUST believe these women who accused Franken but we can not believe any of the women who accused Moore or Trump because there was no trial and that was so long ago and any other reason. If you feel we all HAVE to believe Franken's accusers, then we all HAVE to believe Trump's and Moore's accusers. Period.

One comment I heard on the radio was:

Democrats are playing Queensberry Rules while Republicans are playing street rules and demanding everyone else play Queensberry rules.

The contrast is disgusting - especially all the people in this thread who still don't seem to have a problem with Moore's actions. I don't understand all the outrage from all the righties about Franken being forced out. The bottom line is that they got rid of someone in their ranks who was accused behaviour unbefitting of his office. If the dems did force him out then that is a good thing as it shows such behaviour is not being tolerated. At the end of the day, the party is drawing a line in the stand and saying that people like him can either resign on their own or have that decision made for him.

Airstud wrote:

The person to replace the senator whom I voted for will be appointed by the governor whom I voted against.

Bleah.

People who vote across party lines are the ones who make democracy work.

einsteinboricua wrote:

Someone needs to tell me how single-party GOP rule has benefitted Kansas or Oklahoma or Alabama or Mississippi.

In Oklahoma their government's wise and careful fiscal conservationism has resulted in four day school weeks! Such prudence!

http://newsok.com/article/5545768

zkojq wrote:

I love how people are trying to bring the Clintons into this

Right? I asked someone above to explain why, knowing all we know and understanding the mistakes of the past, it's OK to vote for accused sexual predators in 2017 and to explain it without mentioning the Clintons and that didn't happen. I still got "but Bill Clinton" sprinkled throughout the answer. Lord.

NIKV69 wrote:

Obama would have been a one term president if the GOP had a decent candidate. Romney was a disaster.

Yeah nice try.

NIKV69 wrote:

As for Trump Derangement syndrome the DNC tried the smear of the sexual allegations and they didn't work. Again I would like to remind you that we live in a country that believes you are innocent until proven guilty. If you are inferring that accusations should be the end all to a political career or reputation then again I have to say I am glad three certain Duke lacrosse players had the lawyers they had. If you still believe Trump should be removed from office then contact your representative and ask why impeachment didn't work and or try again. It's over. Move on.

Mr. Trump: Yeah, that’s her. With the gold. I better use some Tic Tacs just in case I start kissing her. You know, I’m automatically attracted to beautiful — I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything.

Mr. Bush: Whatever you want.

Mr. Trump: Grab ’em by the pussy. You can do anything.

All anyone has done is used Trump's own words, Trump's own taped admission to conclude he has no issue grabbing women without their consent. He is a self-admitted sexual predator. You voted for and continue to support a man who has admitted to grabbing women by the pussy without their consent. Crow about Clinton and his supporters all you want. After all that happened, after all that we now know, and given the mistakes of the past, you've decided it's perfectly OK to vote for some who admitted to using his power to take advantage of women. Complain about Clinton and his supporters all you want, you're no better than them.

Can’t wait for Barron to grow up. That kid is going to have a lot of rage.

OA412 wrote:

[ Complain about Clinton and his supporters all you want, you're no better than them.

Now you are beginning to understand politics!

NIKV69 wrote:

OA412 wrote:

[ Complain about Clinton and his supporters all you want, you're no better than them.

Now you are beginning to understand politics!

AIM HIGH NIKKY V!!!!!

Are you still losing sleep over the fact that Al “didn’t apologize” enough for you?

jetero wrote:

Are you still losing sleep over the fact that Al “didn’t apologize” enough for you?

Not at all I knew he wouldn't because of the kind of person he is. I am still not convinced he is resigning, the next few weeks will be fun if Moore wins!

NIK, I can only picture the amount of fun you'd have introducing Trump and Moore to your wife and newly pubescent daughter. So much grabbing, so much preying...so much winning. I'm guessing your wife is into it (party over pussy I say!). But man, watching Moore forcing your daughter's head under the dinner table during Grace..how do you abide that? Oh hell, so long as it's someone else's women I agree brother..Moore for Senate!

cledaybuck wrote:

It would be a lot easier to democrats to claim the high ground if they had done this from the beginning (make no mistake, he was forced out). Better late than never, I guess.

High ground? For decades the Democrats let Ted Kennedy get away with much worse. He got away with manslaughter with no legal or political consequences (at least in the Senate). Sure he didn't ever win the Democratic nomination for president, but he suffered no censure or loss of seniority in the Senate. That seniority allowed him to get his pick of powereful committee chairmanships. Im no fan of Roy Moore, but at least not one ever died riding in a car he drove.

flyingclrs727 wrote:

cledaybuck wrote:

It would be a lot easier to democrats to claim the high ground if they had done this from the beginning (make no mistake, he was forced out). Better late than never, I guess.

High ground? For decades the Democrats let Ted Kennedy get away with much worse. He got away with manslaughter with no legal or political consequences (at least in the Senate). Sure he didn't ever win the Democratic nomination for president, but he suffered no censure or loss of seniority in the Senate. That seniority allowed him to get his pick of powereful committee chairmanships. Im no fan of Roy Moore, but at least not one ever died riding in a car he drove.

Ted Kennedy has been dead for over eight years now. I don't think he has much influence on the Democratic Party anymore.

Uh oh Joe Manchin said he thinks Franken should get a hearing before he resigns. Chris Cillizza summed it up but we all knew he only resigned because the Dems thought Moore would win and wanted ammo to get him removed. This is going to get good! The junior Senator from NY must not be liking this!

I hope he stays in office. The accusations against him are for buffonery, they're not sexual in nature and they're certainly not equivalent to child molesting. The guy was a comedian for cripes sake!

Sarah Silverman knows him personally, and raves about him. That's good enough for me.

salttee wrote:

I hope he stays in office. The accusations against him are for buffonery, they're not sexual in nature and they're certainly not equivalent to child molesting. The guy was a comedian for cripes sake!

Sarah Silverman knows him personally, and raves about him. That's good enough for me.

I hope he stays too. Just seeing egg on all those female Senstors faces would make it worth it. Plus they lose the high ground on sexual harassment just think of that pic of him grabbing boobs posted everywhere!

NIKV69 wrote:

I hope he stays too. Just seeing egg on all those female Senstors faces would make it worth it. Plus they lose the high ground on sexual harassment just think of that pic of him grabbing boobs posted everywhere!

Actually, I hope he stays and is given due process through the Ethics committee. I sympathize with women who have stepped forward, but due process is a guaranteed right of all Americans. As such, let Franken stand before a committee who will recommend action (if any).

They may lose the high ground on sexual harassment, but when the GOP allowed a p*$$y grabber to lead their party, they really have no leg to stand on either. Plus, it allows Democrats to claim they're a party of due process and law.

salttee wrote:

I hope he stays in office. The accusations against him are for buffonery, they're not sexual in nature and they're certainly not equivalent to child molesting. The guy was a comedian for cripes sake!

Sarah Silverman knows him personally, and raves about him. That's good enough for me.

Another buffoon just what we need to stay in congress. He might as well stay I mean he fits right in with the rest of the democratic buffoons. Although this is not just limited to one party I am afraid.

einsteinboricua wrote:

Actually, I hope he stays and is given due process through the Ethics committee. I sympathize with women who have stepped forward, but due process is a guaranteed right of all Americans. As such, let Franken stand before a committee who will recommend action (if any).

They may lose the high ground on sexual harassment, but when the GOP allowed a p*$$y grabber to lead their party, they really have no leg to stand on either. Plus, it allows Democrats to claim they're a party of due process and law.

There are a couple of caveats here. One, the women Senators were not denying him his due process they were pressuring him to resign not just because of his deeds but because a certain person was assumed coming to the senate. Which brings us to the second caveat, Moore.

Moore didn't materialize and which is why we have Manchin and others crying foul. Also because they fear the seat could be in play.

I feel Franken is going to fight back and not resign. He was considering it before and now he has people backing him. Look for a real ugly situation next few weeks.

How colossal of a loser can the guy be.... honestly?

A proud hypocrite, accused sexual assault perpetrator, fake "feminist?" A rich guy who pretends to help the poor? A guy who said he would resign for his misconduct, then never did?

When will the Democrats clean house? His replacement has been named. His entire party has disowned him, both in Washington, and in Minnesota. Only the New York media set are protecting him at this point. Consider their qualifications for doing so.

stratosphere wrote:

salttee wrote:

I hope he stays in office. The accusations against him are for buffonery, they're not sexual in nature and they're certainly not equivalent to child molesting. The guy was a comedian for cripes sake!

Sarah Silverman knows him personally, and raves about him. That's good enough for me.

Another buffoon just what we need to stay in congress. He might as well stay I mean he fits right in with the rest of the democratic buffoons. Although this is not just limited to one party I am afraid.

I must say that was big of you to include both parties, and let us not forget the Chief Buffoon who deny's, deny's and deny's. As I saw written on here tRump himself.