Never thought I'd ever get to see a statewide race in AL to be leaning towards the Democrats. This is the kind of thing I expected to see way into my adult years, when today's youth (less ideologically driven) would be open to considering candidates based on credentials and not party affiliation.

AL now leans Dem

Only three more weeks. Already an NRSC poll showed Jones beating Moore...whether the poll is made up or not is not known; it's an internal poll, but we've never been given reason to doubt them before so I will give it some legitimacy.

I wonder about voter suppression. Republicans do not like minorities or Democrats to vote, so I wonder how long the lines will be and if polling places will even be open for minorities and Democrats?

More women coming forward about his "mall trolling" proclivities... At least these seem to be in the 18+ range, though he is still missing on the "consensual" part. He's trying though. I am sure there were several that ended up be that, just not most of the half his age girls.

Tugg

Tugger wrote:

More women coming forward about his "mall trolling" proclivities... At least these seem to be in the 18+ range, though he is still missing on the "consensual" part. He's trying though. I am sure there were several that ended up be that, just not most of the half his age girls.

Tugg

Well, victim shaming is in full swing now ...... no surprise considering Moore is a vocal advocate of allowing victim shaming in court.

best regards
Thomas

MaverickM11 wrote:

Aesma wrote:

I see that the Bill Clinton defense is not an argument out of thin air, it's the official Fox/GOP rebuttal of the Roy Moore story.

Not just Roy Moore--they use that for everyone: Roy Moore, Bill O'Reilly, Roger Ailes, Donald Trump, Eric Bolling, just about any megachurch pastor, and that's just over the last few months. Can't wait to see what the Grand Ole' Pedo party rationalizes next--sex slavery?

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

You're the one throwing out unfounded allegation, why not produce the numbers for us? Or would that involve some work?

Even if you're correct, how does any of that excuse the slime ball that is Ray Moore? You can't stop yourself trying to justify his predatory sexual behaviour just because he has (R) after his name.

scbriml wrote:

You can't stop yourself trying to justify his predatory sexual behaviour just because he has (R) after his name.

I would assume that quite a few people are scared sh*tless about past sins catching up to them if victims find out that justice in one form or another can be done decades later.....

best regards
Thomas

DIRECTFLT wrote:

MaverickM11 wrote:

Aesma wrote:

I see that the Bill Clinton defense is not an argument out of thin air, it's the official Fox/GOP rebuttal of the Roy Moore story.

Not just Roy Moore--they use that for everyone: Roy Moore, Bill O'Reilly, Roger Ailes, Donald Trump, Eric Bolling, just about any megachurch pastor, and that's just over the last few months. Can't wait to see what the Grand Ole' Pedo party rationalizes next--sex slavery?

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

Yes it would be a lot of fun. But you'll never find anything out to support your little fantasy world conjecture. Gee, I'm betting conservative leaning organizations would be discovered to be involved in scandals like adultery, child abuse, and so on. It would be very illuminating. Because what we know of what has been exposed so far... there are many more Conservative/Republicans embroiled in scandal at every level of government.

And this is what happens when you get a governing philosophy that's something akin to trying to build the US Capitol building on top of a foundation made of papier-mache... it all crumbles the moment any weight is put on the system.

Got to give it to the WP... they have a sense of humor.

When Bernie in his robo-calls offered $4,000 to any person willing to make damaging remarks about Donald Trump, the response was so large that the payments threatened to bankrupt The Post and owner Jeff Bezos.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... 165311ac1c

Best regards
Thomas

tommy1808 wrote:

Got to give it to the WP... they have a sense of humor.

When Bernie in his robo-calls offered $4,000 to any person willing to make damaging remarks about Donald Trump, the response was so large that the payments threatened to bankrupt The Post and owner Jeff Bezos.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... 165311ac1c

Best regards
Thomas

That made my morning. That was a very good piece of satire. Just itching to see Hannity/Jones/Breitbart/Trump quote it as validation of their claims. It will confirm what we have long suspected: they have the mental capacity of a first grader.

What could help the Democrat Jones beat Moore will be the turnout of the Black vote which is substantial in AL. That is something the DNC should be funding and pushing for, to make sure as many Black voters go to vote for Jones, helping with getting proper ID's, rides to polls, getting mail/absentee ballots. For sure any Republican and someone as much as a jerk as Moore is won't get votes from all but a few Black voters.
I am just waiting for the 'racist' shoe to drop. For sure he must have done racist acts, dropped the 'n-word' and other garbage that should be used against him.
By the way, did you know Moore was a West Point Graduate and served as an officer in the Vietnam War ? An article on Salon by a classmate of his who is an established writer points out he was a 'straight arrow' but was also so hated by his men that allegedly he slept on sandbags as so feared being 'fragged' with a grenade under his bunk. Sound like he has been a jerk all of his life.

ltbewr wrote:

What could help the Democrat Jones beat Moore will be the turnout of the Black vote which is substantial in AL. That is something the DNC should be funding and pushing for, to make sure as many Black voters go to vote for Jones, helping with getting proper ID's, rides to polls, getting mail/absentee ballots. For sure any Republican and someone as much as a jerk as Moore is won't get votes from all but a few Black voters.

Jones himself has said he doesn't want the DNC involved in any capacity. This is threading a needle: Southern (well, red state) Democrats know they need to show independence from the DNC. They want to showcase that they're coming from the masses and don't need DC help. The situation gets complicated when AL Republicans repudiated Strange and the establishment in favor of an outsider maverick. How does Jones balance being an outsider, being a Democrat, and appealing to Republican voters who may be put off by Moore but think it's a sin to vote Democrat?

Having the DNC involved will hurt him. And let's not pretend that AL is a sunshiny state where people have coexisted in harmony for centuries. Imagine the ads if the DNC set up shop to help African Americans vote. It's the right thing to do, but the fallout will be huge...racial tensions, already high, will be increased further.

Not saying the DNC shouldn't help, but if I were in Jones's position, I could understand why not even a ground operation to help African Americans across the state to register is not in his interest IF it's sponsored by the DNC in any capacity.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

I agree fully, anyone should be pulled out from whatever rock they are hiding under, no matter the religious or political affiliation etc. I am glad you are on this and care, working to discover those involved. These things are not OK to support. Especially now (in the past a lot of things were OK but we have changed as a society thankfully).

I truly look forward to what you show us.

scbriml wrote:

Even if you're correct, how does any of that excuse the slime ball that is Ray Moore? You can't stop yourself trying to justify his predatory sexual behaviour just because he has (R) after his name.

I do have to say it has been incredible to watch people work to excuse or defend him the last day. I get the first day or two as a response to the unproven allegation and it being a report by the WaPo that did not yet have independent corroboration, that is how it is normally is. But it is getting obvious that there is more here.

Off the topic of Moore but regarding the apparent echo chamber that we all prefer to live in nowadays, is the recent report of Uranium One by FoxNews Shepard Smith. Apparently many Fax watchers want Shep removed for not being critical of Clinton in his report and appearing to possibly show that the "Uranium One scandal" really isn't and actually doesn't involve her.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnsAZzsdI1U
http://video.foxnews.com/v/564642607500 ... show-clips

Actually it does relate to Moore, as I have heard a number of caller on talking head radio shows getting on the case of the hosts for when they start to give credibility to the Moore allegations. Listeners/callers are upset that the hosts are actually believing that Moore may have actually done the things the many women now coming forward say he did. So many callers, and the radio shows, are trying to excuse or figure out a way to excuse what is being said about Moore. It is amazing and appalling.

Tugg

Tugger wrote:

Actually it does relate to Moore, as I have heard a number of caller on talking head radio shows getting on the case of the hosts for when they start to give credibility to the Moore allegations. Listeners/callers are upset that the hosts are actually believing that Moore may have actually done the things the many women now coming forward say he did. So many callers, and the radio shows, are trying to excuse or figure out a way to excuse what is being said about Moore. It is amazing and appalling.

Tugg

It is almost like we live in a bizarro world. I previously believed there were at least 2 things that were considered Bi-partisanly bad.... Nazis and relationships with underaged women girls.

Tugger wrote:

I do have to say it has been incredible to watch people work to excuse or defend him the last day.

i do have the feeling that lots of Journalists are going to look very carefully into the past of each and any public figure that stands out with the sort of excuses they are making. They are in full sexual predator predation mode now, and probably will be for a while.

best regards
Thomas

tommy1808 wrote:

Got to give it to the WP... they have a sense of humor.

When Bernie in his robo-calls offered $4,000 to any person willing to make damaging remarks about Donald Trump, the response was so large that the payments threatened to bankrupt The Post and owner Jeff Bezos.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... 165311ac1c

Best regards
Thomas

The sad/scary thing about this is staunch right wing supporters will actually believe this is how Washington Post, NYT, HuffPo, AP, etc. run. This will strengthen their opinion about "fake" news organizations. The parrot of "yeah, but remember when WP bribed people?" will now be their legitimate excuse for ignoring facts. Sad.

And now Al Franken is accused of sexual assault by Leeann Tweeden: http://www.kabc.com/2017/11/16/leeann-t ... l-franken/

But I am sure there will be some who want to say it is excusable... I mean people are saying what Moore did is OK or excusable, right?

It's NOT OK folks. Stop.

Tugg

ltbewr wrote:

What could help the Democrat Jones beat Moore will be the turnout of the Black vote which is substantial in AL. That is something the DNC should be funding and pushing for, to make sure as many Black voters go to vote for Jones, helping with getting proper ID's, rides to polls, getting mail/absentee ballots. For sure any Republican and someone as much as a jerk as Moore is won't get votes from all but a few Black voters.

I am just waiting for the 'racist' shoe to drop. For sure he must have done racist acts, dropped the 'n-word' and other garbage that should be used against him.

Audio of Moore using the "N" word would be spun into DNC "Gold"....

Prospectors are likely headed to Alabama for that Gold Rush even as we type...

Tugger wrote:

And now Al Franken is accused of sexual assault by Leeann Tweeden: http://www.kabc.com/2017/11/16/leeann-t ... l-franken/

Tugg

Stuart ! ! !



Say It Ain't So ! !

Tugger wrote:

And now Al Franken is accused of sexual assault by Leeann Tweeden: http://www.kabc.com/2017/11/16/leeann-t ... l-franken/

But I am sure there will be some who want to say it is excusable... I mean people are saying what Moore did is OK or excusable, right?

It's NOT OK folks. Stop.

Tugg

The pic is objective proof, something nobody has shown in the case of Moore.

Tugger wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

I agree fully, anyone should be pulled out from whatever rock they are hiding under, no matter the religious or political affiliation etc. I am glad you are on this and care, working to discover those involved. These things are not OK to support. Especially now (in the past a lot of things were OK but we have changed as a society thankfully).

I truly look forward to what you show us.

>>Ummmm, I never said that I was going to do the Research. I just suspect there's a high rate of infidelity / philandering among certain pastor groups...<<

So many callers, and the radio shows, are trying to excuse or figure out a way to excuse what is being said about Moore. It is amazing and appalling.

Tugg

If the shoe was on the other foot, and this was Barry Obama being accused, and there were as many Liberal Radio Talk shows that their base listened to, then I'm quite sure there would be an abundance of Obama Forever supporters calling in. You can see their Blind loyalty to their first Black President on You Tube videos. They may not have a HS education, but Obama is their "Savior."

They are amazingly pathetic.

Just showing you the other side of the coin.

Hope that doesn't make too much sense..

DIRECTFLT wrote:

They are amazingly pathetic.

Just showing you the other side of the coin.

Hope that doesn't make too much sense..

Since you're on that coin, I'd say amazingly pathetic is 100% spot on.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Say It Ain't So ! !

He should have told everyone she was too ugly to assault, like your dear leader who you still support despite dozens of sexual assault accusations.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

Now you're just babbling incoherently. Well--more so than usual. I think at the end of the day, you just want an excuse to assault underage boys/girls. You have no interest in any justice--just another example to rationalize your own politicians' (perhaps your own? Would fit a pattern) atrocious behavior

seahawk wrote:

The pic is objective proof, something nobody has shown in the case of Moore.

Sure if you ignore all the evidence surrounding Moore, there's no "objective proof". Old men get banned from malls all the time because they're good christians.

desertjets wrote:

It is almost like we live in a bizarro world. I previously believed there were at least 2 things that were considered Bi-partisanly bad.... Nazis and relationships with underaged women girls.

Those are very fine people now, up to and including the president. #blessed

MaverickM11 wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

They are amazingly pathetic.

Just showing you the other side of the coin.

Hope that doesn't make too much sense..

Since you're on that coin, I'd say amazingly pathetic is 100% spot on.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Say It Ain't So ! !

He should have told everyone she was too ugly to assault, like your dear leader who you still support despite dozens of sexual assault accusations.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

Now you're just babbling incoherently. Well--more so than usual. I think at the end of the day, you just want an excuse to assault underage boys/girls. You have no interest in any justice--just another example to rationalize your own politicians' (perhaps your own? Would fit a pattern) atrocious behavior

Your presumtive attacks on my character are unfounded.

You sir, are guilty of what you accuse me of... babbling incoherently.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

MaverickM11 wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

They are amazingly pathetic.

Just showing you the other side of the coin.

Hope that doesn't make too much sense..

Since you're on that coin, I'd say amazingly pathetic is 100% spot on.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Say It Ain't So ! !

He should have told everyone she was too ugly to assault, like your dear leader who you still support despite dozens of sexual assault accusations.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

Now you're just babbling incoherently. Well--more so than usual. I think at the end of the day, you just want an excuse to assault underage boys/girls. You have no interest in any justice--just another example to rationalize your own politicians' (perhaps your own? Would fit a pattern) atrocious behavior

Your presumtive attacks on my character are unfounded.

You sir, are guilty of what you accuse me of... babbling incoherently.

You're a trump supporter. My "attacks" are 100% spot on. Anyone with a firing synapse knew you'd run so fast with your knuckles dragging behind you to excoriate--rightly I might add--Al Franken while simultaneously covering for Trump/Moore who thus far have been accused of assaulting dozens of women between the two of them, including underage girls. Amazingly pathetic doesn't do it justice.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

If the shoe was on the other foot, and this was Barry Obama being accused, and there were as many Liberal Radio Talk shows that their base listened to, then I'm quite sure there would be an abundance of Obama Forever supporters calling in. You can see their Blind loyalty to their first Black President on You Tube videos. They may not have a HS education, but Obama is their "Savior."

Yes, but the two are not unconnected. Part of the reason Obama's supporters love him is that he's a self-evidently decent human being who isn't a sleazy sex pest. You may think he's a Marxist who wants to exterminate the white race and institute Sharia law, but even you must concede that he is clearly dotes on his wife and family.

Just showing you the other side of the coin.

By positing a hypothetical situation? You're showing a side of the coin that doesn't exist. Obama hasn't been accused of any of those things.

seahawk wrote:

The pic is objective proof, something nobody has shown in the case of Moore.

It is proof, but a picture is not the only standard of proof.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... moore.html

The evidence is now too strong to be dismissed as a conspiracy.

The difference between the right and the left in this country is that the GOP doesn't know when it's time to throw its allies under the bus. The Al Franken story is barely a few hours old and already the Democrat-leaning press and some Hollywood celebs are calling for his resignation.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... ately.html
http://thehill.com/blogs/in-the-know/in ... or-franken

I wish the Republicans still had the ability to stand up for morality over politics. But then they'd have to start with Trump, so I guess that's never going to happen.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Audio of Moore using the "N" word would be spun into DNC "Gold"....

Prospectors are likely headed to Alabama for that Gold Rush even as we type...[/quote]

Of cause, once you know someone is deplorable, it is totally legit to find out how deplorable they actually are.
Just like the republicans really wanted to know how deplorable Hillary is, digging for most her professional career, spending 100 million or so taxpayer dollars to satisfy their curiosity, and even after 20 years of nothing found, they are still not satisfied.
So, technically it should be perfectly fine for you that Roy More to have Reporters and congressional investigations shadowing him for the rest of his life.

Best regards
Thomas

zckls04 wrote:

I wish the Republicans still had the ability to stand up for morality over politics. But then they'd have to start with Trump, so I guess that's never going to happen.

Their morals died with their sense of irony or human decency:

Moore mocks McConnell’s call for an investigation into Franken
https://nypost.com/2017/11/16/moore-moc ... o-franken/

Who would have ever thought we would miss the days that Republican's beat people over the head with "morals"?

Tugg

Weird...I don’t understand why Dems are not going the Grand Old Pedo route, scream “but Dennis Hastert”, invoke Jesus and the Bible in support of assault, and go full bore on victim shaming? And why is there no full throated, unquestioning support for Franken on CNN like there would be on Fox for Moore and Trump? Bad fake news!
Democrats Embrace Ethics Committee Inquiry for Senator Franken
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... urce=atlfb

Let's open a thread about the sexual harassment stuff and keep this one focused on the senate race. There are a few things I'd like to discuss about the claims made lately and this thread is not the place.

Here's a few mins of cringeworthy pedosplainin' from Alabama's best and brightest:

http://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-can ... used-judge

The gist of their defense is "we'd rather have a child-molester than a Democrat"

bgm wrote:

Here's a few mins of cringeworthy pedosplainin' from Alabama's best and brightest:

http://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-can ... used-judge

The gist of their defense is "we'd rather have a child-molester than a Democrat"

Well of course, wouldn't you rather support someone whose values reflect yours?

Wait....

Tugg

bgm wrote:

Here's a few mins of cringeworthy pedosplainin' from Alabama's best and brightest:

http://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-can ... used-judge

The gist of their defense is "we'd rather have a child-molester than a Democrat"

What an amazing bunch of good ol' boys.

Then again, we are talking about Alabama, where apparently men can't tell if a 'girl' is 14 or 20.

That moment when even Fox News has Jones leading.

Looks like this race could be for Jones after all.

Alabama GOP still sets itself for a difficult situation:
1. If Moore retires and someone else is immediately replaced, they still have to mount a write-in as Moore's name is already printed. But let's assume that person wins. The question is: is this person an outsider or an insider? Depending on the answer is the kind of love McConnell will get in the Senate and the kind of assurance that the seat will remain red in 2020. Based on the GOP primary alone, AL was clear that it wanted an outsider.
2. If Moore remains on the ballot, they give Jones a lead by depressing GOP votes or defecting. The fact that the RNC is going berserk at the thought of Moore winning means that AL GOP voters have as much love for the national party as Berniecrats have for the DNC.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Tugger wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

I agree fully, anyone should be pulled out from whatever rock they are hiding under, no matter the religious or political affiliation etc. I am glad you are on this and care, working to discover those involved. These things are not OK to support. Especially now (in the past a lot of things were OK but we have changed as a society thankfully).

I truly look forward to what you show us.

>>Ummmm, I never said that I was going to do the Research. I just suspect there's a high rate of infidelity / philandering among certain pastor groups...<<

So many callers, and the radio shows, are trying to excuse or figure out a way to excuse what is being said about Moore. It is amazing and appalling.

Tugg

If the shoe was on the other foot, and this was Barry Obama being accused, and there were as many Liberal Radio Talk shows that their base listened to, then I'm quite sure there would be an abundance of Obama Forever supporters calling in. You can see their Blind loyalty to their first Black President on You Tube videos. They may not have a HS education, but Obama is their "Savior."

They are amazingly pathetic.

Just showing you the other side of the coin.

Hope that doesn't make too much sense..

Since "Barry" did not stalk and fondle high school girls, there really is no comparison. Come to think of it, neither did Bill Clinton. The closest "liberals" come is Anthony Wiener and look at how little support he has anymore from "liberals" so all of your arguments fall flat.

wingman wrote:

It's not just Alabama. After Hannity defended sexual abuse of minors over the past week Keurig Coffee dropped him from their ad spend. Hannity is now encouraging all sexual predators to smash their Keurigs and they're doing it on YouTube. It's incredible, outing yourself as pro sexual abuse just because Sean Hannity thinks teen sex is cool. These conservatives are off the hook.

It shows what a complete moron Hannity is. No sane business would want to start advertising on Hannity's show when they know that he might start a boycott like that if they decide to pull their ads in the future.

Other than that, I find it hilarious that people are suddenly deciding that their small appliances have political loyalties. It's one thing not to buy a product because of the political affiliations (perceived or otherwise) of its manufacturer, but to destroy the product that you already have just to "stick it to libroolz"?? Stupidity like that only comes from the hard right.

Siren wrote:

I want that scumbag on the ballot for the December 12th election. I want to see how deplorable the Alabama electorate really is.

I agree - they'll probably elect him anyway. The real problem with political correctness is that by removing racism/bigotry/sexism from the media to set a good example, we forget how many racists, sexists and bigots there actually are in society. This brings up unpleasant surprises when the bigots/racists/sexists vote en-masse for scumbags like Trump or Moore, resulting in their election. I have no doubt that Alabama has more than enough of these undesirables to get Moore elected.

Siren wrote:

What is it with this pervasive obsession with the Clintons? They're not relevant to this discussion.

They're not relevant politically speaking, period, and haven't been for over a year.

tommy1808 wrote:

Well, victim shaming is in full swing now ...... no surprise considering Moore is a vocal advocate of allowing victim shaming in court.

It's disgusting. Yet people wonder why they felt too intimidated to come forwards for so long....

BobPatterson wrote:

apodino wrote:

The fact is, no one knows for sure if these charges are true or not. No evidence either way has been presented.

When you discount the first-person testimony (evidence) of people who were directly involved, as well as the testimony of those to whom they had reported the events, then you eliminate all chance of bringing a scumbag to account.

I imagine that statutes of limitations ensure that 38-year-old crimes cannot now be prosecuted. There is only the court of public opinion to weigh in on the matter.

I'd disagree here. There are many accusations, but no statements have been taken under oath. Without a sworn statement (evidence), the accuracy of those accusations can't be tested. Those to whom the events had been reported have only hearsay, which doesn’t prove a thing.

I certainly agree with your scumbag and the weight of public opinion parts.

Caryjack wrote:

BobPatterson wrote:

apodino wrote:

The fact is, no one knows for sure if these charges are true or not. No evidence either way has been presented.

When you discount the first-person testimony (evidence) of people who were directly involved, as well as the testimony of those to whom they had reported the events, then you eliminate all chance of bringing a scumbag to account.

I imagine that statutes of limitations ensure that 38-year-old crimes cannot now be prosecuted. There is only the court of public opinion to weigh in on the matter.

I'd disagree here. There are many accusations, but no statements have been taken under oath. Without a sworn statement (evidence), the accuracy of those accusations can't be tested. Those to whom the events had been reported have only hearsay, which doesn’t prove a thing.

I certainly agree with your scumbag and the weight of public opinion parts.

Looks like that is going to change

http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/15/roy-m ... wyer-says/

Accusers want to testify under oath. Knowing they could face fines and jail time for lying to Congress, they still want to testify under oath. That is very telling.

seb146 wrote:

Caryjack wrote:

BobPatterson wrote:

Looks like that is going to change

http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/15/roy-m ... wyer-says/

Accusers want to testify under oath. Knowing they could face fines and jail time for lying to Congress, they still want to testify under oath. That is very telling.

A Senate committee hearing? What a circus that would be, certainly an over abundance of clowns! Such a spectacle would allow members to huff & puff but serve no practical purpose.

Fines and jail time for lying to Congress? Those people lie to themselves. That would require an FBI investigation, grand jury indictment, a go-ahead from a federal prosecutor, jury trial and a conviction. None of that is going to happen.

Even a simple deposition would be all but worthless. I doubt the accuser would be questioned by opposing lawyers. As Bob points out above, there is no case so it couldn't go to trial. This will all be over and done with when the election occurs.

I'm more interested in Al Franken's situation. Just last summer he was held up as a presidential hopeful but now has problems of his own. Could he be rehabilitated for a presidential run?[quote]

DIRECTFLT wrote:

MaverickM11 wrote:

Aesma wrote:

I see that the Bill Clinton defense is not an argument out of thin air, it's the official Fox/GOP rebuttal of the Roy Moore story.

Not just Roy Moore--they use that for everyone: Roy Moore, Bill O'Reilly, Roger Ailes, Donald Trump, Eric Bolling, just about any megachurch pastor, and that's just over the last few months. Can't wait to see what the Grand Ole' Pedo party rationalizes next--sex slavery?

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

You definitely have a few screws loose. Perhaps it's time to get some professional help?

Caryjack wrote:

As Bob points out above, there is no case so it couldn't go to trial.

It's easy to get the quotes/attributions messed up.

The words quoted were not mine (not that it really matters a whole lot).

bgm wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

You definitely have a few screws loose.

What statement(s) indicates loose screws?

Or are your comments to be taken as sarcasm?

Caryjack wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Caryjack wrote:

A Senate committee hearing? What a circus that would be, certainly an over abundance of clowns! Such a spectacle would allow members to huff & puff but serve no practical purpose.

Fines and jail time for lying to Congress? Those people lie to themselves. That would require an FBI investigation, grand jury indictment, a go-ahead from a federal prosecutor, jury trial and a conviction. None of that is going to happen.

Even a simple deposition would be all but worthless. I doubt the accuser would be questioned by opposing lawyers. As Bob points out above, there is no case so it couldn't go to trial. This will all be over and done with when the election occurs.

I'm more interested in Al Franken's situation. Just last summer he was held up as a presidential hopeful but now has problems of his own. Could he be rehabilitated for a presidential run?

So, what you are saying, is to just ignore Roy Moore and Donald Trump but go after Al Franken because Al Franken had talked about running for president? Or something?

BTW, what happened to tRump suing the women who accused him of sexual assault? He said there would be lawsuits brought against them after the election.

BobPatterson wrote:

bgm wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

Oh please, don't stop with just the Mega-Pastors....

Wouldn't it be fun to see a list and political affiliation of EVERY pastor/priest/rabbi, of ANY sized church/synagogue, ANYWHERE in the US, in the last few years, that has been discovered to have been involved in scandal, like adultery, or child sexual abuse, for example.

Gee, I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list, than Republican or Independent affiliations.

Yeah... That would be Fun !

You definitely have a few screws loose.

What statement(s) indicates loose screws?

Or are your comments to be taken as sarcasm?

Well, would you take what he is stating as someone who operates on a basis of rational and sound logic?

bgm wrote:

BobPatterson wrote:

bgm wrote:

You definitely have a few screws loose.

What statement(s) indicates loose screws?

Or are your comments to be taken as sarcasm?

Well, would you take what he is stating as someone who operates on a basis of rational and sound logic?

I think his statement: "I'm betting there's a LOT more Democratically affiliated that will fill up that list" is not too far off the mark. Republican affiliates might still come out ahead.

The problem of "immorality" in the sense of sexual "misconduct" is very, very widely found in American society. I doubt that clergy of any faith differ greatly from the population as a whole. I suspect that pastors/counselors actually have more opportunities to become sexually involved with persons seeking their help than do members of their congregations.

I also think there is a general attitude that clergy tend to fall on the liberal side of the political divide (in the USA). I'm not sure that is really the case.

BobPatterson wrote:

Caryjack wrote:

As Bob points out above, there is no case so it couldn't go to trial.

It's easy to get the quotes/attributions messed up.

The words quoted were not mine (not that it really matters a whole lot).

Yup....I got it all balled up with cutting & pasting and all. I haven't had much luck (or fun) posting since a.net received its new & improved makeover a while back.

I was referring to your post at the top of page 3 of this thread concerning the statute of limitations making our only recourse public shaming. So no actual trail with testimony and evidence.

seb146 wrote:

Caryjack wrote:

seb146 wrote:

A Senate committee hearing? What a circus that would be, certainly an over abundance of clowns! Such a spectacle would allow members to huff & puff but serve no practical purpose.

Fines and jail time for lying to Congress? Those people lie to themselves. That would require an FBI investigation, grand jury indictment, a go-ahead from a federal prosecutor, jury trial and a conviction. None of that is going to happen.

Even a simple deposition would be all but worthless. I doubt the accuser would be questioned by opposing lawyers. As Bob points out above, there is no case so it couldn't go to trial. This will all be over and done with when the election occurs.

I'm more interested in Al Franken's situation. Just last summer he was held up as a presidential hopeful but now has problems of his own. Could he be rehabilitated for a presidential run?

There is no legal action that can be taken against Roy Moore because any crimes he has so far been accused of have timed out, and it is too close to the ellection to prosecute him. Public shamming is the only option.

Any complaints against Trump that came out before he was ellected are worthless. The public saw them and voted. Trump will bring no lawsuits because he was not harmed (he won the election).

I'd not heard Al Franken voice presidental asperations, but others have been talking about him. If not much more comes out against Frankin, the DNC should be able to dress him up for a serious presidental bid (they've had decades of experience). Who else would they run, Hillary Cilnton, Joe Biden? Just something to watch.

I love the Governor of Alabama who is a women by the way saying that she would vote for Moore, the Mall Creep because it was more important to elect a Republican to the Senate and I have no doubt that she also meant more than making a moral stand. Another woman said these women are claiming this man did this to them because they or we hate Christians. I guess I am not included on the Christian list as a Roman Catholic. I sure believe the accusers and was not aware my thoughts were based on religious hatred. I never knew!!!!

Caryjack wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Caryjack wrote:

A Senate committee hearing? What a circus that would be, certainly an over abundance of clowns! Such a spectacle would allow members to huff & puff but serve no practical purpose.

Fines and jail time for lying to Congress? Those people lie to themselves. That would require an FBI investigation, grand jury indictment, a go-ahead from a federal prosecutor, jury trial and a conviction. None of that is going to happen.

Even a simple deposition would be all but worthless. I doubt the accuser would be questioned by opposing lawyers. As Bob points out above, there is no case so it couldn't go to trial. This will all be over and done with when the election occurs.

I'm more interested in Al Franken's situation. Just last summer he was held up as a presidential hopeful but now has problems of his own. Could he be rehabilitated for a presidential run?

There is no legal action that can be taken against Roy Moore because any crimes he has so far been accused of have timed out, and it is too close to the ellection to prosecute him. Public shamming is the only option.

Any complaints against Trump that came out before he was ellected are worthless. The public saw them and voted. Trump will bring no lawsuits because he was not harmed (he won the election).

I'd not heard Al Franken voice presidental asperations, but others have been talking about him. If not much more comes out against Frankin, the DNC should be able to dress him up for a serious presidental bid (they've had decades of experience). Who else would they run, Hillary Cilnton, Joe Biden? Just something to watch.

I had not heard that Al Franken was going to run, either. As far as Trump suing, he put no limits. He simply said that he would sue all of the women who accused him because they are all liars.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... bcf22c06ea

So? Where are the lawsuits?

WarRI1 wrote:

I love the Governor of Alabama who is a women by the way saying that she would vote for Moore, the Mall Creep because it was more important to elect a Republican to the Senate and I have no doubt that she also meant more than making a moral stand. Another woman said these women are claiming this man did this to them because they or we hate Christians. I guess I am not included on the Christian list as a Roman Catholic. I sure believe the accusers and was not aware my thoughts were based on religious hatred. I never knew!!!!

Party before country. God before country. Typical Republican reaction.