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ILSDDM
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Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 6:55 pm

Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:46 pm

Just saw this reported on CNN, I have not heard about this treaty until today and frankly am surprised that such a treaty exists. They mention restricted airspace, does that mean airspace directly above sensitivity locations (WH, Capitol Hill, etc.) are allowed for such flights? Would be good if someone posts photos of the a/c from today's flight.

Also, as long as the a/c is "unarmed", what's stopping anyone form using a military aircraft? Imagine a Tu-160 or a B-1B buzzing Capitol Hill or the Kremlin.

http://news.google.com/news/video/pT26a ... =en&ned=us

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_on_Open_Skies

PS: anyone notice the golden-hair chicken staring down WH in the shot of the WH at the 0:10 mark in the video?
 
asuflyer05
Posts: 2065
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 8:53 am

Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:59 pm

I wonder if this is the same TU-154 that landed at Dulles yesterday.
 
Aeroplasma
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu May 14, 2015 2:22 am

Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Wed Aug 09, 2017 11:07 pm

Apparently the TU-154 has departed Newport, Rhode Island. It is currently in the air heading somewhere.
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/rf-85655/
 
xjetflyer2001
Posts: 126
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 6:20 pm

Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Wed Aug 09, 2017 11:31 pm

I would love to see this aircraft, aren't there only certain airports it's allowed to land at in the United States?
 
ThePointblank
Posts: 2906
Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:39 pm

Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Wed Aug 09, 2017 11:43 pm

ILSDDM wrote:
Just saw this reported on CNN, I have not heard about this treaty until today and frankly am surprised that such a treaty exists. They mention restricted airspace, does that mean airspace directly above sensitivity locations (WH, Capitol Hill, etc.) are allowed for such flights? Would be good if someone posts photos of the a/c from today's flight.

Also, as long as the a/c is "unarmed", what's stopping anyone form using a military aircraft? Imagine a Tu-160 or a B-1B buzzing Capitol Hill or the Kremlin.

http://news.google.com/news/video/pT26a ... =en&ned=us

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_on_Open_Skies

PS: anyone notice the golden-hair chicken staring down WH in the shot of the WH at the 0:10 mark in the video?

1. The Treaty of Open Skies permits unarmed aerial surveillance flights over the entire territory of its participants. Generally, anywhere is within limits for overflights, as long as prior notification is provided. The only way to refuse an overflight is if there is a valid safety reason.

2. The aircraft chosen for the Open Skies overflight is pre-approved and inspected prior to the flight to make sure it is in compliance with the treaty. So, no you can't use a randomly selected military aircraft, the aircraft, and the sensors it has, are specially designated and agreed upon prior to the flight. All sensor information from the aircraft must also be shared with the host country, and must also be made available to other members of the treaty at a nominal cost.

3. The flight plan must also be provided by the country making the request for an overflight to the host country at least 24 hours prior to the overflight occurring, and the host country has the right to propose changes to the flight plan.
 
rbavfan
Posts: 1936
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:53 am

Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:17 am

ThePointblank wrote:
ILSDDM wrote:
Just saw this reported on CNN, I have not heard about this treaty until today and frankly am surprised that such a treaty exists. They mention restricted airspace, does that mean airspace directly above sensitivity locations (WH, Capitol Hill, etc.) are allowed for such flights? Would be good if someone posts photos of the a/c from today's flight.

Also, as long as the a/c is "unarmed", what's stopping anyone form using a military aircraft? Imagine a Tu-160 or a B-1B buzzing Capitol Hill or the Kremlin.

http://news.google.com/news/video/pT26a ... =en&ned=us

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_on_Open_Skies

PS: anyone notice the golden-hair chicken staring down WH in the shot of the WH at the 0:10 mark in the video?

1. The Treaty of Open Skies permits unarmed aerial surveillance flights over the entire territory of its participants. Generally, anywhere is within limits for overflights, as long as prior notification is provided. The only way to refuse an overflight is if there is a valid safety reason.

2. The aircraft chosen for the Open Skies overflight is pre-approved and inspected prior to the flight to make sure it is in compliance with the treaty. So, no you can't use a randomly selected military aircraft, the aircraft, and the sensors it has, are specially designated and agreed upon prior to the flight. All sensor information from the aircraft must also be shared with the host country, and must also be made available to other members of the treaty at a nominal cost.

3. The flight plan must also be provided by the country making the request for an overflight to the host country at least 24 hours prior to the overflight occurring, and the host country has the right to propose changes to the flight plan.


This has to do with the Nuclear treaties.
It is done by the US, Russia & 32 other countries with Specific senosors to detect if new nuclear work is being done that was not agreed on.

What you also neglected to say was each countries aircraft have representatives from the other country on board during all flights to make sure no unapproved equipment is being used for spying per treaty.
 
rbavfan
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:20 am

xjetflyer2001 wrote:
I would love to see this aircraft, aren't there only certain airports it's allowed to land at in the United States?


It's allowed to fly over the entire country per treaty.
 
MO11
Posts: 312
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:26 am

Aeroplasma wrote:
Apparently the TU-154 has departed Newport, Rhode Island. It is currently in the air heading somewhere.
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/rf-85655/


Newport has a 3000 ft. runway - that must have been something to see.
 
xjetflyer2001
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:28 am

rbavfan wrote:
xjetflyer2001 wrote:
I would love to see this aircraft, aren't there only certain airports it's allowed to land at in the United States?


It's allowed to fly over the entire country per treaty.


Yes, but I thought I read somewhere that though it can fly over anywhere, it is only allowed to land at either certain airports or certain states.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:34 am

I would hope it goes to JFK.
 
CapitalAvGeek
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2017 12:45 am

Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:52 am

According to this article, the plane can only land at certain airports in the United Sates.

"In the United States, Russian Aerospace Force aircraft participating in Open Skies must enter the country through Dulles International Airport on the East Coast and Travis Air Force Base on the West Coast. They may operate from Travis AFB, Dulles, Elemendorf Air Force Base in Alaska, and Lincoln Municipal Airport in Nebraska. They may refuel at air bases and airports in Hawaii, Wisconsin, Montana, Arizona, and Tennessee. Likewise, American planes operating over Belarus and Russia operate under similar restrictions."

http://www.popularmechanics.com/militar ... us-canada/
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 2:47 am

We were watching the flight (OSY331F) from about 9:30 this morning, and saw it fly by us three times at about 4000ft. I got a couple of pretty terrible pictures, but they aren't worth uploading. It flew in and out of FFO to Pax River, Dahlgren, P-56 (DC), P-40 (Camp David), Langley, ADW, etc. It made about two winding orbits around the DC/VA/MD area between 3700-6000ft. Needless to say it made for an interesting day. I'm not sure what exactly they hope to gain from a photography mission like this, so I'm wondering if it's more for political reasons.
 
xjetflyer2001
Posts: 126
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 6:20 pm

Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:37 am

CapitalAvGeek wrote:
According to this article, the plane can only land at certain airports in the United Sates.

"In the United States, Russian Aerospace Force aircraft participating in Open Skies must enter the country through Dulles International Airport on the East Coast and Travis Air Force Base on the West Coast. They may operate from Travis AFB, Dulles, Elemendorf Air Force Base in Alaska, and Lincoln Municipal Airport in Nebraska. They may refuel at air bases and airports in Hawaii, Wisconsin, Montana, Arizona, and Tennessee. Likewise, American planes operating over Belarus and Russia operate under similar restrictions."

http://www.popularmechanics.com/militar ... us-canada/


Thanks for the info, I thought I saw that somewhere. Sure wish it could land in Colorado.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 6:57 am

rbavfan wrote:
This has to do with the Nuclear treaties.
It is done by the US, Russia & 32 other countries with Specific senosors to detect if new nuclear work is being done that was not agreed on.

What you also neglected to say was each countries aircraft have representatives from the other country on board during all flights to make sure no unapproved equipment is being used for spying per treaty.


and it is an important tool to get any serious arms treaty in place, since agreeing on reductions usually isn´t the problem, verification is.

best regards
Thomas
NIKV69 wrote:
The race is over. Moore has over 50% of the vote with just about half the votes in. Jones can't overcome that. McConnell has 10am meeting tomorrow so they can get this guy removed. At least the seat stays Republican. That is the important thing.
:D
 
Noshow
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:53 am

During US overflights there are US officers on board AFAIK.
 
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Ty134A
Posts: 441
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:19 am

Noshow wrote:
During US overflights there are US officers on board AFAIK.


i would think that there are a hell of a lot of officers wanting to fly on this bird... russia should sell some seats on ebay for the fun of it ;-)
flown on: TU3,TU5,T20,IL8,IL6,ILW,IL9,I14,YK4,YK2,AN2,AN4,A26,A28,A38,A40,A81,SU9,L4T,L11,D1C,M11,M80,M87,
AB4,AB6,318,313,342,343,345,346,712,703,722,732,735,741,742,743,74L,744,752,753,763,772,J31,F50,F70,100,ATP,
142,143,AR8,AR1,SF3,S20,D38...,738,320
 
Noshow
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Re: Russian "Treaty on Open Skies" flight over DC today

Fri Aug 11, 2017 9:03 am

I know in Germany a russian open skies flight went right over a certain german military installation at the very moment they had an internal parade going on down there to take pictures. They must have known precisely in advance when that parade was planned.

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