Scipio
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Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Thu Aug 06, 2015 1:07 am

Since the start of Russia's aggression, Ukraine has been working very hard on restoring its armed forces (upon independence, the second largest in Europe, but since neglected in large part because Ukraine thought somewhat naively that it did not have any enemies).

As to Ukraine's air force and air arms of other service branches, the Ukrainians have been working very hard to take mothballed aircraft out of storage, upgrade aircraft, and re-train their pilot force.

The progress is hard to monitor (state secret, plus Ukraine respecting the Minsk 1 agreement of last September prohibiting the use of air power over Donbass...) but some very partial evidence of progress has been posted online recently:

- Here is a new meaning to "being overtaken on the highway":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jye40dwDDlc

Same footage with patriotic music:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvDkcqS5gAc


- Su-25 pilots at work:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApFcZibc464


- "Master" Su-27 pilot:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFt7EVNnJv0


- Top low-pass fly-bys by Ukrainian pilots:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ8ZyBna9gY


- Ukrainian Air Force 2015

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVmIwXgJGx0


In the good news category, the Ukrainian Air Force has suffered fewer crashes than the Russian Air Force over the past two months  
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:17 pm

More low-level Su-25 flying, including among the many parked Il-76s at Melitopol Air Base.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNxk-iwUhR0

And more low-level fly-bys (with some repetitions from the similar link above):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjS5nwLoTpI

Less cheerful footage that dates from last August but was only recently released, from the cockpit of a Mi-24 that was shot down over Donbass. Both crew members perished.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NV0wdyAb00E
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:09 am

Quoting Scipio (Thread starter):
but since neglected in large part because Ukraine thought somewhat naively that it did not have any enemies

Really I think it more to do with corruption and incompetence than a lack of an enemy.

Makes interesting reading

http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB100014...4052702303949704579457591983371478

Quote:
KIEV, Ukraine—As the Kremlin began its invasion of the Ukrainian peninsula of Crimea last month, a days-old government in Kiev turned to its military to stem the tide. There was an immediate problem: No car batteries for the military vehicles.

With coffers empty, Ukraine's fledgling government appealed to the U.S. embassy for help. The embassy said it would take weeks to get assistance, so the government had to search—among its own people—to find a regional oligarch, Ihor Kolomoisky, to kick in the funds to buy them locally.

Over the years Ukraine cut its forces drastically, but spent little on those remaining under arms, with a U.S. Army report noting in 2007 that the Ukrainian armed forces "have been on a starvation diet" and that the country was 127th out of 150 countries around the world in its spending per serviceman.

Years of corruption are part of the reason for the primitive armaments, he added. "In the past four years there was basically a destruction of the army," he said. Much of the budget for new arms "was stolen by the last two ministers of defense," he said.
 
rheinwaldner
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Aug 12, 2015 9:14 am

Are they flying above the highway because that way their radar echo would not be invisible but probably be ignored by e.g. opposite fighters?

I was radar operator on the anti-aircraft system Skyguard and highways (by the moving cars) painted a line of false echoes on the screen of the search radar. There were some measurements to erase those but usually whatever moved there was considered unsuspicious...
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:26 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 2):
but since neglected in large part because Ukraine thought somewhat naively that it did not have any enemies

Really I think it more to do with corruption and incompetence than a lack of an enemy.

Principally because that second largest army in Europe was inherited from the USSR and Ukraine clearly didn't have the economy to maintain it.
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:35 pm

Quoting ptrjong (Reply 4):
Principally because that second largest army in Europe was inherited from the USSR and Ukraine clearly didn't have the economy to maintain it.

Yes. Among the reasons why the USSR collapsed is the fact that its economy could not sustain the Soviet Army Forces. With Ukraine's economy sinking in the 1990s, there was no way the country could maintain such a large military.

Moreover, it had inherited capabilities (nuclear weapons, strategic bombers, etc) that it did not need as a peaceful country without imperial ambitions.

Nonetheless, corruption has been a major factor in weakening the Ukrainian military over the years (as in Russia...), especially during the Yanukovych years. Many Ukrainians suspect that Yanukovych deliberately undermined the military, at Putin's behest, enriching himself and his clan in the process.

The Russian-language Wikipedia page on the Ukrainian Air Force has an overview table of sales of military aircraft abroad, duing 1994-2014. The totals are as follows:

An-12: 3
An-26: 2
An-72: 2
Tu-143: 50
Il-76: 4
Il-78: 4
L-29: 10
L-39: 115
Mi-8: 53
Mi-24: 144
Mi-26: 2
Mig-21: 49
Mig-23: 8
Mig-27: 10
Mig-29: 26
Su-22: 24
Su-24: 1
Su-25: 20
Su-27: 5

That adds up to 143 combat aircraft, 199 helicopters, 125 jet trainers, 12 transport aircraft, 4 tankers, and 50 drones...

In addition, quite a few transport aircraft and helicopters were sold or leased long-term to private Ukrainian companies.

At the start of Russia's aggression, the Ukrainian armed forces reportedly had just a few dozen helicopters left that were in flyable condition...
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Thu Aug 13, 2015 11:41 pm

Quoting Scipio (Reply 5):

Nonetheless, corruption has been a major factor in weakening the Ukrainian military over the years (as in Russia...),

I don't doubt that.

By the way, how did the dvision of arms upon independence take place? Is it that Ukraine simply inherited anything on its soil, except the navy in Sebastopol, but including nukes and heavy combat aircraft? Russian generals cannot have been happy with that, and even Ukranian generals should have wanted to make a more practical division.
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Fri Aug 14, 2015 7:34 am

Quoting ptrjong (Reply 6):


By the way, how did the dvision of arms upon independence take place? Is it that Ukraine simply inherited anything on its soil, except the navy in Sebastopol, but including nukes and heavy combat aircraft? Russian generals cannot have been happy with that, and even Ukranian generals should have wanted to make a more practical division.

That's pretty much how it happened in all the former Soviet Republics.
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:59 pm

Quoting ptrjong (Reply 6):
By the way, how did the dvision of arms upon independence take place? Is it that Ukraine simply inherited anything on its soil, except the navy in Sebastopol, but including nukes and heavy combat aircraft? Russian generals cannot have been happy with that, and even Ukranian generals should have wanted to make a more practical division.

Generally yes, and without exception for the Black Sea Fleet (BSF). All military assets and personnel on Ukrainian soil came formally under Ukrainian control in late-1991 or at least were claimed to be Ukrainian by the Ukrainian authorities. However, some form of joint control over strategic military assets was agreed on December 30.

For the next half year or so, Ukraine and Russia disputed control over the BSF, and most officers of the fleet preferred to declare their loyalty to Russia than Ukraine. In June 1992, the Presidents of the Russian Federation and Ukraine agreed to establish joint control over the BSF pending its partition. On May 28, 1997, the Russian Federation and Ukraine signed an agreement to partition the BSF between the Russian and Ukrainian navies, and for the Russian Navy and armed forces to continue to make use of certain facilities in Crimea until 2017.

Ukraine gave up its strategic (nuclear and related) arsenal under the 1994 Budapest Memorandum, which Russia signed but has grotesquely violated in the recent past.
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Tue Sep 08, 2015 8:04 pm

Quoting Scipio (Reply 8):
make use of certain facilities in Crimea until 2017.

Again more misinformation, the lease was extended in 2010 for an additional 25 years after 2017, so that makes is 2042.

Quoting Scipio (Reply 8):
Ukraine gave up its strategic (nuclear and related) arsenal under the 1994 Budapest Memorandum, which Russia signed but has grotesquely violated in the recent past.

A memorandum is not a treaty, as such there was no guarantee of anything, if it was a true treaty then why are the other signatories leaping to Ukraine's aid with a full military response?

Quote:
According to Stephen MacFarlane, a professor of international relations "It gives signatories justification if they take action, but it does not force anyone to act in Ukraine." In the U.S. neither the George H. W. Bush administration nor the Clinton administration was prepared to give a military commitment to Ukraine, nor did they believe the U.S. Senate would ratify an international treaty, so the memorandum was adopted in more limited terms.
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sun Sep 27, 2015 10:04 am

Ukrainian Air Force Il-76 low pass:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtCllxPFX_Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nC5uvr3AmqQ


Su-24 low pass:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZm_KqGvEDY


The Ukrainian Air Force is ready to meet the "Russkiy Mir".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN8E-e8UbXo

This requires some explaining. The Russian word "mir" has two meanings -- "world" and "peace". So, "Russkiy Mir" can be translated either as "Russian world" or "Russian peace". However, in Putin's Russia, the concept "Russkiy Mir" implies that all Rus people should be reunited under the "peaceful" reign of the Kremlin dictator.

In Russian only, unfortunately:

http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A0%...%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%80

[Edited 2015-09-27 03:12:03]
 
sovietjet
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Mon Sep 28, 2015 1:55 pm

I suppose if you judge how capable an air force is by the amount of (extreme) low level passes, then yes the Ukrainians are increasing their capabilities.

Quoting Scipio (Thread starter):
In the good news category, the Ukrainian Air Force has suffered fewer crashes than the Russian Air Force over the past two months

Makes sense since they operate only a small fraction of the amount of aircraft the RuAF does  
 
Acheron
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:07 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 11):
Makes sense since they operate only a small fraction of the amount of aircraft the RuAF does

Yeah, not particularly hard to achieve when you barely fly at all...
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Fri Oct 16, 2015 7:23 am

Poroshenko on Wednesday participated in a "test flight" of a refurbished and modernized Su-27, prior to its delivery to the Ukrainian Air Force.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXj3b2pUHeY

The aircraft was one of two Su-27s delivered to the Ukrainian Air Force on Wednesday by MigRemont in Zaporizhia.

The "test flight" is already giving rise to jokes about Poroshenko's Putin stunts...

The delivery ceremony and test flight took place in the context of the "Defender of Ukraine Day", a new public holiday in Ukraine.


Separately, the Ukrainian and Polish air forces held joint exercises ("Safe Sky 2015") over the past few days in western Ukraine.

http://en.censor.net.ua/photo_news/3...d_in_carpathian_region_photosvideo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSyDYBNo7Ic
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Thu Nov 12, 2015 11:08 pm

The low-level flying is, of course, not without risks.

Yesterday, a Ukrainian Air Force Su-25 crashed during a low-level training flight in Zaporizhia oblast. The aircraft may have hit a high-voltage power line.

http://uatoday.tv/news/su-25-fighter...ia-region-pilot-killed-531657.html
http://en.censor.net.ua/news/360195/...e_chief_military_prosecutor_matios

The pilot, a 23-year old native of Crimea, died in the crash.

http://en.censor.net.ua/photo_news/3...rom_simferopol_general_staff_photo

Pictures from the crash site:

http://en.censor.net.ua/photo_news/3...of_su25_crash_site_released_photos
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Tue Dec 01, 2015 10:12 am

An informative article on the Ukrainian Air Force's single remaining Su-24 unit, the 7th Brigade Tactical Aviation (BrTA) at Starokostiantyniv Air Base.

The article dates from late October, but seems based on a visit to Starokostiantyniv AB in May.

Lots of good pictures ...

http://aviationphotodigest.com/ukrainian-air-force/

According to the article, the Ukrainian Air Force is exploring options to modernize its Su-24s (of course, without Russian involvement).


Ukraine's 2016 budget foresees spending about USD 5 billion on defense, and Defense Minister Poltorak has announced that modernizing Ukraine's air defenses and air force will be a priority.

[Edited 2015-12-01 02:16:11]
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Dec 12, 2015 11:34 am

A historic moment for Ukraine's naval aviation.

On March 5, 2014, Ukrainian crews flew four helicopters (three Mi-14s, and one Ka27) and three fixed-wing aircraft (two An-26s and one Be-200) out of Russian-occupied Crimea to mainland Ukraine, through de-facto Russian controlled airspace and from under the nose of the Russian military. The Russian military had surrounded Saki AB, from where the Ukrainians took off, and had parts of the airbase under their control due to the fact that the base hosted Russian units even before the invasion.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKcb6sIymQw
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Dec 12, 2015 5:35 pm

Quoting Scipio (Reply 16):
Be-200

Ukraine doesn't have any BE-200's, the only foreign customer is Azerbaijan.
 
angad84
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Dec 12, 2015 8:51 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 17):
Ukraine doesn't have any BE-200's, the only foreign customer is Azerbaijan.

Probably a Be-12.

Cheers
A
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:48 am

US donations for the Ukrainian Air Force -- helmets, masks and harnesses for pilots.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qL-REQ3M5WY


Ukrainian Air Force Mig-29s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XC-3cimg89k


More low-level flying -- impressing the girls...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGc3TK6va3c

Quoting angad84 (Reply 18):
Probably a Be-12.

That's right. It's a Be-12.

Thanks for the correction.
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Fri Dec 25, 2015 11:42 pm

Мы будем летать. We will fly ...

A lot of interesting footage of Ukrainian Air Force Su-27 operations:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1i3okgvbP1g

Quoting Scipio (Reply 1):
More low-level Su-25 flying, including among the many parked Il-76s at Melitopol Air Base.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNxk-...wUhR0

A seemingly expanded version of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1i3okgvbP1g
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Dec 26, 2015 9:11 am

What exactly is the point in posting videos of planes taxing, taking off and landing, does this show anything we don't already know? Ukraine can fly a fighter woohoo the war is won.
 
tu204
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:09 am

Quoting Scipio (Reply 20):

Мы будем летать. We will fly ...

Funny thing is you can't even fly over you own territory (Donetsk and Lughansk regions)...
I do not dream about movie stars, they must dream about me for I am real and they are not. - Alexander Popov
 
Acheron
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Mon Dec 28, 2015 2:15 pm

Nvm. Wrong information.

[Edited 2015-12-28 06:47:20]
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Thu Jan 14, 2016 1:40 am

Su-27 formation low pass:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1T6Pu0mNbs

Parachutist training using a Mi-8 with (apparently) removed rear doors:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThaZKZABmxc

On the way down, the guy filming mentions that it is his fifth jump and that this completes the program...
 
WIederling
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Jan 27, 2016 8:29 am

Saw this in the news:
http://uatoday.tv/news/ukraine-s-ant...ation-group-liquidated-578864.html

IMU after all subdivision have been transfered to Ukroboronrpom
the Antonov company will now be close down.


True? Wrong?
Murphy is an optimist
 
sovietjet
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Jan 27, 2016 5:06 pm

What is going to happen with operations of the An-225??
 
WIederling
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Jan 27, 2016 5:28 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 26):
What is going to happen with operations of the An-225??

operated by Antonov Airlines a subsidiary of Ukroboronrpom
http://www.antonov.com/

As I wrote : the company name / toplevel is taken down.
( see, Oleg Konstantinovich Antonov was a Russian. How peinlich  
Murphy is an optimist
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:49 pm

Ukrainian Air Force Mig-29s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aC42UtPkur8

I'm a bit surprised that one of the pilots seems to be flying a Mig-29 dressed just in a T-shirt...

And a formation of four UkrAF Su-25's:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOAVpw8o5P0

[Edited 2016-01-29 15:04:34]
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:28 pm

Nice footage of a quartet of UkrAF Su-25's, with a tribute to the crew of the Il-76 that was shot down on approach to Luhansk Airport in June 2014:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXHvrGQfRDk
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Feb 20, 2016 4:21 pm

Antonov has started building An-148 variants for the Ukrainian Air Force.

Meanwhile, work is ongoing to refurbish and modernize the UkrAF's Su-27s, Su-25s, Su-24s, and Mig-29s, as well as the Ukrainian armed forces' Mi-8's and Mi-24's.

http://www.unian.net/society/1269950...i-serii-an-148-i-bespilotniki.html

[Edited 2016-02-20 08:22:13]
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sun Mar 06, 2016 1:23 am

Drones have been used extensively in the Donbass war. Hence, as part of their modernization efforts, the Ukrainian Armed Forces are betting heavily on drones.

Many drones have been built and funded by volunteer organizations:

http://www.theguardian.com/technolog...ding-war-ukraines-diy-drone-makers

The US has committed to providing Ukraine with RQ-11 Raven drones (30 systems with 3 drones each):

http://www.defence24.com/262066,rq-11b-raven-drones-for-ukraine
http://lugansk-news.com/us-departmen...pply-rq-11b-raven-uav-for-ukraine/

Ukraine also restored to service Soviet-era Tu-143 drones:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSgLsUFO_JI

At least one of them was shot down or crashed over rebel territory:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0J7yP2FydU

The first mass-produced Ukrainian drone is the Athlon Avia Furia

http://uav-tech.info/news/item/65-ukraine-unveiled-mini-uav-a1-s-fury
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsvfX8AJqDk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiBKhYsUtxQ

In January of this year, Ukroboronprom delivered the first batch of Spectator UAVs to the Ukrainian armed forces.
The BpAK MP-1 Spectator was developed at the Kyiv Politechnic Institute and is produced by Ukroboronprom firm Merydian.

http://www.defence24.com/299745,ukra...ufactured-by-the-domestic-industry
http://www.defensenews.com/story/def...ry-uav-combat-insurgents/79834454/
http://en.censor.net.ua/photo_news/3...foreign_ones_nsdc_secretary_photos
http://uk.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectator_(%D0%91%D0%9F%D0%9B%D0%90)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKl0Yv_r9gY

Ukroboronprom has at least two major UAV projects going at the moment.

One is for a reconnaissance drone with light attack capabilities, being developed by a consortium led by Antonov. EIS is planned for next year:

http://en.cfts.org.ua/news/antonov_t...launch_production_of_attack_drones
http://www.ukroboronprom.com.ua/en/newsview/4/930

Antonov also recently concluded an agreement with Poland's WB Electronics for cooperation in the development of tactical UAV systems:

http://www.defence24.com/263655,wb-e...the-ukrainian-tactical-uav-systems

Separately, Ukroboronprom is developing an attack drone that will be able to carry heavier loads and be able to, for example, destroy tanks.

In Ukrainian only:

http://www.ukroboronprom.com.ua/newsview/1/934

[Edited 2016-03-05 17:55:37]
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sun Mar 06, 2016 2:11 am

NATO and the Ukrainian Air Force are working on implementing NATO's Regional Airspace Security Program (RASP) in Ukraine:

http://uawire.org/news/ukraine-and-n...regional-airspace-security-program

This is a project under NATO's C4 Trust Fund for Ukraine.

http://www.ncia.nato.int/NewsRoom/Pages/150703-NATO-C4-Trust-Fund.aspx
 
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TWA772LR
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Mar 09, 2016 2:33 am

I saw in an old book I have that Ukraine inherited TU-160s from the USSR. What's the status of those?
"It's not getting to the land of the nonrev that's the problem, it's getting back." ~~Captain Hector Barbossa
The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and don't necessarily reflect those of my employer.
 
ThePointblank
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Wed Mar 09, 2016 6:18 am

Quoting TWA772LR (Reply 33):
I saw in an old book I have that Ukraine inherited TU-160s from the USSR. What's the status of those?

Some were returned to the Russians for debt relief, while the majority were scrapped. One remains as an museum piece.
 
Scipio
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Tue Mar 22, 2016 12:48 am

The Ukrainian publication "Segodnya" (Today) just published an interesting article on Ukraine's air defenses. Unfortunately, it is available in Ukrainian and Russian only.

http://ukr.segodnya.ua/ukraine/smozh...iaciya-zashchitit-nebo-699461.html

Highlights:

- On paper, according to an official publication of the Ministry of Defense, in 2013 Ukraine had 72 helicopters in service in its Army aviation, as well as 160 combat aircraft and 27 transport aircraft in the Air Force. However, in practice, many of these were not in an operational state.
- A substantial part of this inventory was lost in Crimea, and additional losses were suffered during combat operations in Donbass.
- Combat operations over Donbass were ended from late-August 2014 onward [not only due to the losses, but also as part of the Minsk peace process].
- Since then, the Ukrainian Air Force and Army aviation have been rebuilding their strength, restoring to service and upgrading aircraft. By late-August 2015, there were twice as many aircraft stationed in [near] the combat zone as a year before.
- Importantly, pilots now get proper practice in line with international standards: 90-110 hours per year. [Whereas in recent years before the conflict, they barely got any practice at all. This explains all those enthusiastic movies published on YouTube lately   ]
- The challenge is not only to get sufficient aircraft in an operational state, but also to bring them up to modern standards. Ukraine has limited experience thus far in upgrading combat aircraft without Russian assistance and parts. However, Motor Sich has developed modernization, and weaponization / weapons upgrade, programs for the Mi-2 and Mi-8.
- Ukraine does not have money to buy new aircraft, so upgrading existing ones is for now the only option. Comprehensive upgrade programs have been launched for the UkrAF's Su-27's and Mig-29's.
- The existing aircraft inventory should be able to serve until around 2030, and some of it until 2040.



Note: a substantial part of the Ukrainian weaponry that Russia seized in Crimea was returned to Ukraine during spring-2014, before Russia stopped the implementation of the return agreement using the fighting in Donbass as a pretext (fighting for which Russia was of course itself responsible). The returned weaponry reportedly included 37 of about 45 MIg-29's seized by the Russians. Some of the returned Mig-29s have since been restored to service.
 
Hywel
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Fri Mar 25, 2016 9:00 am

Meanwhile, a classic example of why you can never trust Ukraine: Link

Quote:


Croatia's military police is currently conducting a major investigation in the refurbishment of MiG-21s which were bought and refurbished in Ukraine.

According to sources close to the investigation, the investigators found that serial numbers on the chassis of the planes have been changed and that the parts which were changed do not match the ones listed in the documents raising serious suspicion that the planes could be 5 years older than their accompanying documentation claims.

Now it seems that even the 5 planes that Croatia did end up buying from Ukraine were put together using parts from all over the world and there is a suspicion that the hull is Bulgarian, wings from Algeria while the gas tanks had Russian insignia on them. Sources state that the hulls are probably from the planes Bulgaria reported to NATO as destroyed.

 
Acheron
Posts: 1851
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:14 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Mar 26, 2016 3:36 am

Quoting Hywel (Reply 36):

They just replaced some corrupt politicians and managers with others equally or even more corrupt.

Except now it's even worse because they don't have the Russian's to sell them stuff.

[Edited 2016-03-25 20:37:26]
 
tu204
Posts: 1512
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:36 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Mar 26, 2016 5:44 am

Quoting Hywel (Reply 36):
Meanwhile, a classic example of why you can never trust Ukraine: Link
Quoting Acheron (Reply 37):

Here's Scipio's que to enter the building and blame this one on Russia too!   
I do not dream about movie stars, they must dream about me for I am real and they are not. - Alexander Popov
 
Scipio
Topic Author
Posts: 883
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 4:38 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Mar 26, 2016 8:17 pm

Quoting Hywel (Reply 36):
Meanwhile, a classic example of why you can never trust Ukraine: Link

First, the article seems to be mostly about Croatian internal affairs, raising allegations of corruption toward the (circles of the) previous Croatian Minister of Defense. In your logic, this means we can never trust Croatia, right?

Second, the Mig-21 refurbishment contract was concluded in June 2013, i.e., in Yanukovych times. We all know very well that the Yanukovych regime was thoroughly corrupt. This is the main reason why Ukrainians revolted against this regime, and probably also why Putin supported it.

Hence, I don't think this contract can be seen as acceptable evidence of corruption by the current Ukrainian government.

Third, the management of the Ukrainian contractor, Ukrspetseksport, as well as of its parent company Ukroboronprom, has been changed since June 2013 and since Ukraine's Maidan revolution.

That there still is a lot of corruption in Ukraine is a fact. The place to discuss this, if you want to do so seriously, is in the non-aviation forum.
 
Acheron
Posts: 1851
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:14 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sun Mar 27, 2016 1:58 am

Quoting Scipio (Reply 39):

Lol. You should actually read the article instead of just whitewashing it...

Quote:
The refurbished MiG-21s were handed over to Croatian Air Force in July 2015

Well within the timeframe of the current Ukrainian government, and probably fully aware of what they were doing.

I do also find it amusing how you act like Poroshenko wasn't part of Yanukovych's government at one point or another.

[Edited 2016-03-26 19:01:53]
 
Scipio
Topic Author
Posts: 883
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 4:38 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sun Mar 27, 2016 2:41 am

Quoting Acheron (Reply 40):
Lol. You should actually read the article instead of just whitewashing it...

I read the article from the beginning to the end multiple times, and researched the case from other sources, before posting what I posted.

Did you and your (probably close) friend Hywel do any proper research before posting your anti-Ukrainian propaganda here?

Again, if you want to discuss corruption and politics in Ukraine, the proper forum for this is in the non-aviation section of a.net.

See you there?

[Edited 2016-03-26 20:11:30]
 
Scipio
Topic Author
Posts: 883
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 4:38 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Apr 09, 2016 5:47 pm

Ukrainian media recently reported that the development of the new medium-range SAM system Dnipro is in its final stages.

http://www.milnavigator.com/uk/novej...sya-na-finalnoj-stadii-razrabotki/
http://rusjev.net/2016/03/24/noveysh...sya-s-samoletami-i-bpla-agressora/
http://wartime.org.ua/24357-bagatoka...pleks-serednoyi-dalnost-dnpro.html

Dnipro is being developed by Ukroboronservice, with the involvement of various other Ukrainian companies. It is intended to be able to detect targets at distances up to 150 km and engage targets at distances up to 60 km.

Here is a two-part film about the system:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpTbUD6VpP0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjhqqBsWuF4

[Edited 2016-04-09 11:00:43]
 
Scipio
Topic Author
Posts: 883
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 4:38 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:26 pm

On a lighter note, a UkrAF Il-76 is resupplying the Danish Nord polar station in operation "Northern Falcon 2016". Makes for some nice pictures.

http://www.mil.gov.ua/en/news/2016/0...04/northern-falcon-2016-kicks-off/
http://www.mil.gov.ua/en/news/2016/0...orm-their-first-successful-flight/

http://www.mil.gov.ua/assets/images/resources/19119/38311242ca9b2b9e50c5b5a8558f06814996e498.jpg

http://www.mil.gov.ua/assets/images/resources/19119/cacbc4e2df8f7bdcec4051b72fbee967cb9dd920.jpg

http://www.mil.gov.ua/assets/images/resources/19119/e53817167ba63eef354eedca5cea8990fb4095e6.jpg

http://www.mil.gov.ua/assets/images/resources/19119/5fc58b6458e77a2d2c29baa7be48fc12ff61942e.jpg
 
Scipio
Topic Author
Posts: 883
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RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:09 pm

A promo film about the Ukrainian National Guard's aviation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFaJ823xKrA

And another promo film about the Ukrainian Air Force:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGetVrZlgac
 
Scipio
Topic Author
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Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 4:38 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:19 am

I cannot vow for the authenticity of this, but on the internet a memorandum has appeared about the return of Ukrainian aircraft seized by Russia in Crimea.



It says that, at the time of the Russian invasion, Ukraine's armed forces had 84 aircraft and 42 helicopters in Crimea.

In the course of the invasion Ukraine managed to transfer 4 aircraft and 6 helicopters to its mainland.

I posted this before, but this is footage of how four helicopters and three fixed-wing aircraft were evacuated from surrounded Saki AB to mainland Ukraine:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKcb6sIymQw

As a result, 80 aircraft and 36 helicopters were left in Russian-occupied Crimea.

Russia agreed to return these aircraft to Ukraine, but later suspended the agreement on the pretext that Ukraine was fighting in Donbass, in a war that Russia itself created...

Before the suspension of the agreement, according to the memo, Russia returned to Ukraine 59 aircraft and 23 helicopters, as follows:

- 48 Mig-29s
- 4 Mig-29UBs
- 1 Be-12
- 3 Su-25s
- 1 An-2
- 1 Yak-38
- 1 L-39M1

- 4 Ka-29s
- 7 Ka-27s
- 6 Mi-8Ts
- 2 Mi-8PPAs
- 1 Mi-8SMV
- 1 Mi-8MTYu
- 1 Mi-8PS
- 1 Mi-14

The note proposes to write off 6 aircraft - 5 Be-12s and 1 An-26.

That leaves to be returned, 15 aircraft and 13 helicopters, as follows:

- 7 Mig-29s
- 2 Mig-29UBs
- 2 Be-12s
- 3 L-39M1s
- 1 An-72

- 5 Mi-8Ts
- 2 Mi-8MTs
- 3 Mi-8MTVs
- 2 Mi-9s
- 1 Mi-24
 
sovietjet
Posts: 2585
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2003 12:32 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Tue Apr 26, 2016 2:07 pm

Given that most of these aircraft were not in airworthy condition, it makes little sense to want them back. On the other hand Russia should just send them back for the same reason. Ukraine has hundreds and hundreds of aircraft and helicopters sitting around not being used anyway. If they really wanted to use a Mi-8, just fix up one of the huge number of airframes rotting away now.
 
tu204
Posts: 1512
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:36 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Tue Apr 26, 2016 3:06 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 46):
Given that most of these aircraft were not in airworthy condition, it makes little sense to want them back. On the other hand Russia should just send them back for the same reason. Ukraine has hundreds and hundreds of aircraft and helicopters sitting around not being used anyway. If they really wanted to use a Mi-8, just fix up one of the huge number of airframes rotting away now.

Agree with you, we should give them their scrap metal back. Of course there is a risk that Ukraine will use whatever is sent back to them in their Civil War, which is the reason the transfers from Crimea stopped in the first place, but Ukraine hasn't used aviation for over a year in their conflict.

In my opinion APC's, tanks, artillery should not be handed over until the Civil War ends, but no risk in returning what is on that above mentioned list.
I do not dream about movie stars, they must dream about me for I am real and they are not. - Alexander Popov
 
User avatar
fallap
Posts: 841
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:36 am

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Sat Apr 30, 2016 8:51 pm

What is the current status of the maintenance facilities of The Ukrainian Air Force? Ground equipment, supply of parts, quality of training, influx of new technicians, overall morale of the personal?

Them fancy jets need a lot of ground personal in order to keep them flying, as we all know
Grease monkey buried head to toe inside an F-16M
 
fvtu134
Posts: 141
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 1:11 pm

RE: Ukrainian Air Power / Prowess

Mon May 02, 2016 9:21 am

Actually the L-39m1 are modernized L-39's.. not that they would matter much in a warfighting capability, but still. I also read somewhere that Belbek air base housed some upgraded Mig-29's.. but i do not recall where i read it.. it's a while back.

Let's hope that cool heads prevail and this war can come to an end.. what people forget is that many families had Russian/ukrainian mix that resulted from the soviet era... and many of those families are now torn apart by the differing "facts" on both sides of the fence..
In the end everybody loses.

FvTu134
who decided that a Horizon should be HORIZONtal???

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