A few years ago, in my World History class, the teacher proposed a question for the class:
"If Hitler had the Atomic Bomb first, which city would he bomb."
Now, of course most people said London. Which would have probable been a logical choice.
But the question hasn't left my mind.
A few years later, I started thinking about the question. It dawned on me that the largest effective bomber that Hitler had in the Luftwaffe was the Heinkel He111, a two engined bomber. My thoughts are, could Hitler, had he developed the atomic bomb first, had the ability to even lift it off the ground?
An answer to the question could be, could the Fokker 4-engined aircraft that was used on reconnasance (sp) missions over the Atlantic have carried it? I'm thinking not. but, I could be wrong, that's why I'm asking.
If anyone could shed any light as to whether I'm right or not, i'd appreciate it.
live forever and stay beautiful,
hole_courtney
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RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
Great question!
No, I don't think the FW 200 Condor could have carried it. The FW 200 was a patrol aircraft and not an attack aircraft; it existed only to carry radios and a few machine guns to annoy fighters. Its only purpose was to tattletale on the transatlantic convoys so the U-Boats could get into position.
But there was a four-engined bomber designed by Messerschmitt (sp?) called, I think, the Me-290 that was almost like the B-29, except it suffered from Germany's failure to obtain strategic metals. They called it the "America Bomber" but I'm not sure it could have done the job, given the fact that the genuine article B-29 needed heavy modification to get the bomb off the ground. I remember reading about how the B-29 (Bock's Car) carrying the first plutonium fission bomb (FAT MAN) nearly didn't make it off the runway at Tinian.
Any nuclear weapons developed by the Germans would have been similar to FAT MAN and not to LITTLE BOY, since the Germans had no access to uranium; only heavy isotopes of water. That is why I use the FAT MAN example rather than the more famous LITTLE BOY example.
No, I don't think the FW 200 Condor could have carried it. The FW 200 was a patrol aircraft and not an attack aircraft; it existed only to carry radios and a few machine guns to annoy fighters. Its only purpose was to tattletale on the transatlantic convoys so the U-Boats could get into position.
But there was a four-engined bomber designed by Messerschmitt (sp?) called, I think, the Me-290 that was almost like the B-29, except it suffered from Germany's failure to obtain strategic metals. They called it the "America Bomber" but I'm not sure it could have done the job, given the fact that the genuine article B-29 needed heavy modification to get the bomb off the ground. I remember reading about how the B-29 (Bock's Car) carrying the first plutonium fission bomb (FAT MAN) nearly didn't make it off the runway at Tinian.
Any nuclear weapons developed by the Germans would have been similar to FAT MAN and not to LITTLE BOY, since the Germans had no access to uranium; only heavy isotopes of water. That is why I use the FAT MAN example rather than the more famous LITTLE BOY example.
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
I believe another probable delivery device would have been a modified V-2 rocket. This was studied, but none with greater payload capabilities or the range to hit America were ever constructed.
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- chdmcmanus
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RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
The FW200 was used initially as a bomber also, however, a weak central wing spar lead to several crashes, and the acft wasn't used in this manner again. So I don't think it could have. The V-3 is a different story though, at the end of the war it was being developed more or less as a giant V-2 to bomb NY, NY. I'm willing to bet it would have had the payload to at least reach London with an H-Bomb.
Regards,
ChD
Regards,
ChD
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
Junkers was working on a Six engined bomber and Heinkel had a four engined one that drove two props on the line. Either one of those probably could have carried a bomb.
But then again one of the reasons the Allied forces made a heavy effort to bomb, "heavy water" facilities in Norway was to help "convice" The Germans that the heavy water approach was it. If we kept targeting them it was hoped that they may get the idea that we thought they where on the right track and would dump more and more effort into a dead end.
But then again one of the reasons the Allied forces made a heavy effort to bomb, "heavy water" facilities in Norway was to help "convice" The Germans that the heavy water approach was it. If we kept targeting them it was hoped that they may get the idea that we thought they where on the right track and would dump more and more effort into a dead end.
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
The history channel mentioned a jet bomber being developed by Germany towards the closing year of the war. It would have been able to reach New York.
Also, Germany had successfully launced V2 rockets from U-boats at sea before the end of the war. The first "boomers" would have belonged to Germany at the rate they were going. Imagine V2's raining down on NYC or Washington some afternoon in 1944..............
Also, Germany had successfully launced V2 rockets from U-boats at sea before the end of the war. The first "boomers" would have belonged to Germany at the rate they were going. Imagine V2's raining down on NYC or Washington some afternoon in 1944..............
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- rabenschlag
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RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
I dont know too much about it, but....
wasnt there such a thing as an Arado Ar-??, a four engined jet bomber? I vaguely remember flipping through a publication on that bird. I thought it was in service for at least a short time. Any info on that?
r.
wasnt there such a thing as an Arado Ar-??, a four engined jet bomber? I vaguely remember flipping through a publication on that bird. I thought it was in service for at least a short time. Any info on that?
r.
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- rabenschlag
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RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
Well, here we go:
"The Arado Ar234 was the worlds first jet-bomber produced in series..."
source
http://www.luftfahrtmuseum.com/htmd/dth/arado.htm
"The Arado Ar234 was the worlds first jet-bomber produced in series..."
source
http://www.luftfahrtmuseum.com/htmd/dth/arado.htm
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
The Arado you are talking about was originally designed for two Junkers jet engines. But production of those where allocated to ME-262 aircraft so Arado redesigned their aircraft to take four BMW jet engines.
Sorry I dont' remember the specs or designation of the engines off the top of my head.
It might be worthy to know that the Arado was originally designed without landing gear. It took off from a dolly and then landed on a fuselage skid. Later versions where designed with a landing gear built onto the aircraft.
Sorry I dont' remember the specs or designation of the engines off the top of my head.
It might be worthy to know that the Arado was originally designed without landing gear. It took off from a dolly and then landed on a fuselage skid. Later versions where designed with a landing gear built onto the aircraft.
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- Guest
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
I don't think he would of used it on london, or at least i would not. I would have used it to destroy the russian production facilites and would have won in russia
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- USAFHummer
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RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
I have a book that dedicates about thirty pages to the Ar-134...here's what it says:
Usual payload: one 1,100 lb. bomb. (tested with 3300 lbs. payload)
...considering that our a-bomb weighed 9,000 lbs. I dont think Germany could have made it much smaller, so it didnt have the capacity to hold the bomb.
Range with payload: 970 miles
...hitting the US was out of the question with that.
Also, the Ar-234 was not that large, smaller than most fighters today:
Ar-234
Length: 41 ft.
Span: 46 ft.
Greg
Usual payload: one 1,100 lb. bomb. (tested with 3300 lbs. payload)
...considering that our a-bomb weighed 9,000 lbs. I dont think Germany could have made it much smaller, so it didnt have the capacity to hold the bomb.
Range with payload: 970 miles
...hitting the US was out of the question with that.
Also, the Ar-234 was not that large, smaller than most fighters today:
Ar-234
Length: 41 ft.
Span: 46 ft.
Greg
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- Guest
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
hi,
i once saw a picture of a bomber, also by arado, which was a delta-wing design with six jet engines, also designed to reach america. i don't think they built even a prototype, but it looks pretty much like the b-2 or so...
there were many projects for 4-6 engined bombers underway when the war ended, at least one of them should have been capable of carrying nuclear bombs.
jsb
i once saw a picture of a bomber, also by arado, which was a delta-wing design with six jet engines, also designed to reach america. i don't think they built even a prototype, but it looks pretty much like the b-2 or so...
there were many projects for 4-6 engined bombers underway when the war ended, at least one of them should have been capable of carrying nuclear bombs.
jsb
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
If Germany had gotten the atomic bomb, only one bomber in their inventory was capable of carrying such a big device: the Heinkel He 177.
The He 177 could have been an outstanding heavy bomber, but problems with engine overheating plagued the plane until 1943.
The He 177 could have been an outstanding heavy bomber, but problems with engine overheating plagued the plane until 1943.
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
Jsbothe,
That's exactly the one I was refering to.
That's exactly the one I was refering to.
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
Which city would have been the first hit depends on when the A-bomb would have entered service.
Hitler was convinced for a long time that Brittain would join him in his fight against the USSR. This would have prevented him from dropping a bomb on London as that would take out the UK leadership whom he needed to make those arrangements.
Moscow or Leningrad are more likely targets, as the war in the east was designed for extermination of the Russian peoples, not for their inclusion in the German population.
The USSR also provided more militarilly attractive targets to the Germans for areabombing.
The main targets in Brittain would have been bomberbases, not cities.
Hitler was convinced for a long time that Brittain would join him in his fight against the USSR. This would have prevented him from dropping a bomb on London as that would take out the UK leadership whom he needed to make those arrangements.
Moscow or Leningrad are more likely targets, as the war in the east was designed for extermination of the Russian peoples, not for their inclusion in the German population.
The USSR also provided more militarilly attractive targets to the Germans for areabombing.
The main targets in Brittain would have been bomberbases, not cities.
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- LOT767-300ER
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RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
I think that Hitler would of bombed Washington first if he could get through the American air defence. And what would he of used to carry it. Since the B-29 carried the Fat Boy at Hiroshima and since the Russians had some B-29s Hitler could of captured a B-29 to carry the bomb.
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- Guest
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
I have to say that London and Moscow would have topped the list. At the time, the U.S. was protected by distance and two oceans. The only way Germany would have been capable of "nuking" the U.S. would have been via submarine, and that's not a definite possibility.
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
MikeN,
As I have stated before, Germany successfully launched V2 rockets from U-boats as part of a test program towards the end of the war.
As I have stated before, Germany successfully launched V2 rockets from U-boats as part of a test program towards the end of the war.
RE: Hitler The Luftwaffe, And The A-Bomb
They did, V1s also were launched from submarines (that's where the Russians got the idea for cruisemissile subs, they seem to have captured the testbed).
Both V1 and V2 would make good platforms for launching a small/midsized nuke with their 1 ton payload.
Both V1 and V2 would make good platforms for launching a small/midsized nuke with their 1 ton payload.
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