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by compensateme
Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:53 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: DL outlines A350 routes
Replies: 208
Views: 54294

Re: DL outlines A350 routes

If the DTW-AMS flight that is moving to the A350 is the early flight (departs DTW at 1609 and arrives back at 1155), then only 9 frames are needed. Rotation could be DTW-NRT-DTW-PVG-DTW-AMS-DTW-ICN-ATL-ICN-DTW-PEK-DTW. That rotation allows 2+ hours for all turns except for DTW-NRT-DTW with 1 h 50 m...

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by compensateme
Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:14 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: OAG Changes 10/1/2017: UA Drops MSP-LAX
Replies: 74
Views: 10873

Re: OAG Changes 10/1/2017: UA Drops MSP-LAX

Can't understand how neither AA not UA could sustain service on MSP-LAX, especially with some of their smallest equipment. Jeremy They didn't have a problem filling planes -- they just couldn't attract enough premium traffic. Alas, it's hard to make money flying 76-seaters when your fare average is...

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:38 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Is Delta Officially Calling RDU a Hub?
Replies: 13
Views: 1734

Re: Is Delta Officially Calling RDU a Hub?

"Hub," "focus city," etc. are just marketing terms. A hub, by definition, is just a place where people make connections. Delta sells connections through IND, DFW, etc. Does that make these places hubs? Reality is, there's very little connecting traffic flowing through BOS or RDU....

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:29 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Anyone have an adult answer on how connecting traffic affects PDEW? My apologies, I thought you were being sarcastic. Airlines report the details of your tariff to the DOT -- that is, what you paid for your flight, the number of coupons in your ticket, the routing you traveled, etc. The DOT uses th...

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:37 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Not really caring whose got the bigger manhood but if a CLE-EWR-LHR routing only counts in the EWR-LHR passenger count how is either city properly measured? Much less the drive to other airport folks. Or am I mistaken on what I've read on this forum? If all the traffic on CLE-EWR-LHR comes from CLE...

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:55 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

Please try not to rewrite history. Before deregulation, Northwest was satisfied to be the dominant carrier between the USA and Asia, and had a relatively small domestic network, almost totally concentrated in the northern half of the USA. When deregulation came along, United went headlong into Asia...

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 29, 2017 6:31 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

Try to understand this: DTW and MSP are hubs because Northwest was desperate to find somewhere - anywhere - they could build a fortress hub. All the more desirable options - New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, Miami - were taken by stronger, quicker-to-get-there competitors. NW was left with Minneapoli...

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:12 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

On another topic some earlier comments on this forum driving me nuts. I'm an accountant by training, I can assure you there is no GAAP for an income statement for a hub airport, there is so much judgment that goes in to such a formulation-- anyone of us on this forum could rattle 10 ways in which j...

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by compensateme
Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:01 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Just curious why CO announced a major expansion to CLE that started to happen in 2008 (soon killed and gutted below prior ops with the great recession) when the place was loosing money since 2004 or 10.years prior to the final hub closure. Were they really planning to allocate some resources to the...

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by compensateme
Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:03 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

You've said this several times now, which caused me to think you didn't quite get what many were saying on here (including your uncalled for jab at MasseyBrown). And then I thought, perhaps you were one of the auditors in the case, as you kept referring to the very personal side of an auditor's fir...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:48 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

I will believe my direct conversations with management and document review over your conjecture and hypothesizing. Try checking SEC filings, the operation cost of business at CLE (beyond landing fees) and the performance metrics of the hub. Close it because it was smallest, fine. Compose a story to...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 27, 2017 3:15 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

I don't see your comments being any more fact-based than others'. You cite steady traffic, but you pick the sample dates; other dates would produce a different story. You cite an outside auditor who had to rely on UA assumptions and allocations; all he proved is that the numbers add up correctly. W...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:07 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Most of the people who crowed over the UA hub CLE closure were also saying that Hopkins enplanements would be severely reduced and that the airport was essentially dead. Some even said that CLE's passenger totals would be down to 4-5 million a year. They never saw WN expansion or F9/NK entering the...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:45 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Why no DTW-HNL?
Replies: 62
Views: 8410

Re: Why no DTW-HNL?

There's no thru flights with that routing, but the early LAX-HNL will go to a 767ER in place of the domestic 767 that flew the same flight last year. DL hasn't regularly operated the 763A on LAX/HNL in quite awhile. That early flight has been a 763ER for years, used for utilization / bridging aircr...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:38 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

The point of mergers is to make more money through economies of scale (and eliminating competition), meaning, in this case closing hubs. The minute the CO-UA merger was sealed, hubs and jobs had to go. That's the point of the merger. So they clearly wanted to close CLE as geographically its redunda...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 27, 2017 3:07 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

One thing I will share is that I have personally seen the correspondence between UA and CLE when they decided to dehub CLE. The first pieces of information contained several grammatical errors and the wrong routes in which they would cut. It seemed to be very rushed and shortly after the announceme...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:41 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Why no DTW-HNL?
Replies: 62
Views: 8410

Re: Why no DTW-HNL?

Delta will have removed the 16 domestic 767s by the end of October. And 9 of the 16 747s. In the meantime they have received 10 A330CEOs and 2 A359s. Some domestic flying will go to the 25 A321s and 85 739s, but these are mostly replacing more than 70 757s that have been retired. And allowing 738s ...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:15 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

There's absolutely no truth to this, UA UA was in the process of downsizing IA in favor of CLE... UA was never "in the process" of downsizing IAD. The number of scheduled flights has been dropping, but that's a derivative of dwindling 50-seat jets (from IAD, the number of departures on 50-...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:21 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

I don't know of many people who drive to YYZ to fly to Florida as there is zero benefit. DTW captures the majority of the YQG-area originating traffic to Florida...and obviously connections to Florida are available via YYZ on AC. I'm not calling doom on PD however -- this IS a niche product and a n...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:34 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

I think the problem with National was that the airline had no credibility and no one wanted to risk taking the chance that their Florida vacation would be ruined by the flights never happening like what happened with the YYT-SFB flights. I also think it would have been a whole different story if th...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:12 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Why no DTW-HNL?
Replies: 62
Views: 8410

Re: Why no DTW-HNL?

If you didn't know already Hawaii is a very seasonal market from all the US, even the west coast.... Seasonal variances aren't nearly as strong from the West Coast. The MSP to DTW comparison is interesting, but MSP is still larger even though it dips in Summer.... MSP's is on pace to have grown nea...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:28 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

Because where DL can capture anything extra is brownie points for DL, why would someone want to cross the border just to travel to Detroit or come down to Florida? DTW is open to more people, more connections and more willingness to take the flight. There is no market DTW-MLB. NK served the market ...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:58 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

National Airlines' service from YQG-SFB was a total disaster, in spite of the free baggage allowance and free meals. Amazingly, Essex County residents thought it was more convenient to cross the border and transit through the DTW mega complex to fly directly into MCO than it was to fly nonstop from ...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 1:30 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Porter Expands Seasonal MLB Services
Replies: 38
Views: 3366

Re: Porter Expands Seasonal MLB Services

ahj2000 wrote:
DOES YQG even have preclearance? If so, this might be the first PD flight needing immigration on arrival to the us.


No. When National Airlines operated YQG-SFB a year ago or so, the flights cleared at SFB.

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 1:27 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Porter Expands Seasonal MLB Services
Replies: 38
Views: 3366

Re: Porter Expands Seasonal MLB Services

Porter's 74 seat config. is very comfortable. I'd do it in a heartbeat. Very comfortable? The seat is tight and the cabin is deafening. Porter's service is superb for short flights, but it's certainly not worth the trade off for a 3-hour flight. Plus, there's no lounge at YQG or MLB so that takes s...

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by compensateme
Tue Sep 26, 2017 1:26 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Why no DTW-HNL?
Replies: 62
Views: 8410

Re: Why no DTW-HNL?

TW operated the 757 from STL-HNL -- the eastbound flight was scheduled nonstop but the westbound flight made a stop at LAX. Many of the 757 that operated these flights are with DL today.

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by compensateme
Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:36 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: DTW-MCO on NW in April 1996 - equipment?
Replies: 9
Views: 685

Re: DTW-MCO on NW in April 1996 - equipment?

DTW-MCO also saw the 747 depending on the day, but its DTW departure would have been too early for a LGW connection. So your flight was likely a DC-10-40 on flight 442. If you knew the exact day, we could even find out the reg number. Only because I know some people will ask: per the spring 1996 ti...

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by compensateme
Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:22 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: DTW-MCO on NW in April 1996 - equipment?
Replies: 9
Views: 685

Re: DTW-MCO on NW in April 1996 - equipment?

In April 1996, NW442 was scheduled to depart DTW at 7:10PM and arrive in MCO at 9:45PM. It was operated with DC-10-40 equipment. This is the flight that was timed to connect with service from LGW and one of two flights on the route operated with widebodies (the other was a morning flight) so I'm pre...

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by compensateme
Mon Sep 25, 2017 2:11 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Why no DTW-HNL?
Replies: 62
Views: 8410

Re: Why no DTW-HNL?

Numbers are both ways combined IIRC... so divide that number by two and you get ~46 PDEW. And that is Hawaii in general, not HNL specifically so if you take HNL specifically that number will be lower. Either way, DTW is last in terms of O&D to HI for DL hubs, and flying to HI is not very profit...

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by compensateme
Mon Sep 25, 2017 2:01 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Even as a CLE person I'm not a total believer in the CLE profitability as CO and then UA eroded ops with focus on their more prestigious hubs. But since at least I don't believe everything a CEO or politician say, I found these in my website research that discuss other factors than a non CLE a.nett...

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 24, 2017 7:26 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Yes, UA has more gates (14) than they need for 45-50 flights a day; but they RON a bunch of planes and use most of them for that. In addition, they recently renegotiated the Concourse C lease. They could have dropped more gates than they did. So either they wanted to preserve a cheap option to expa...

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 24, 2017 7:17 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Not saying I disagree, but could you provide some articles with CO talking about the losses of CLE? I haven't read many outside of the Bethune article above and would like to take a walk down memory lane if there are any out there. As mentioned by another poster, here's an article in which UA says ...

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 24, 2017 3:19 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

The messy UA/CO merger, Smisek, or Cleveland's economic situation aside, the Cleveland hub would not have lasted. It wasn't profitable. It made sense only when CO was a stand alone airline in need of a midwest hub and RJ's went all jet and that trend was also what helped precipitate it's downfall. ...

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by compensateme
Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:23 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

Quick thought, if Smisek wasn't at the helm, would another leadership team give CLE the chance to work as a hub? CLE does have a lot of business demand and is an important city on the map. Could critical business markets work with some upguages utilizing E-170/175 jets and less frequencies? I think...

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by compensateme
Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:09 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: UA in CLE: What's next?
Replies: 123
Views: 9325

Re: UA in CLE: What's next?

UA has the gates they do now as they built and remodeled the banjo and are on the hook for those payments as well as Concourse D. As far as gate availability goes, there is less than you would think for a dehubbed airport as AA did take a lot of the low C gates and the ULCC's use most of A concours...

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by compensateme
Sat Sep 23, 2017 8:22 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

As expected, the new flight will be operated with a 763 while the incumbent flight is downgauged to a 332. Summer 2018 vs 2017: LHR: 332 plus 3 weekly 763 (was 10x763) AMS: 332, 3x333 (3x332, 333) CDG: 763, 332 (333) FCO: 333 (unchanged) MUC: 763 (unchanged) FRA: 763 (332) GRU: 3 weekly 332 (unchang...

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by compensateme
Sat Sep 23, 2017 8:12 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has Delta ever regularly flown the 777 out of DTW?
Replies: 9
Views: 1903

Re: Has Delta ever regularly flown the 777 out of DTW?

As mentioned, at some point they've operated to every single Asian destination offered by DL from DTW (NRT, HND, PEK, PVG, ICN, HKG) as well as AMS & CDG. Additionally, they up to 2x daily re-positioning flights to ATL for several years and several times weekly to LAX for a year.

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:12 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/unu ... ources-say

Appearently the soap dispensers at Midfield are being replaced because some um, bodily fluid was found in them...
-->

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/unu ... ources-say

Appearently the soap dispensers at Midfield are being replaced because some um, bodily fluid was found in them...

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by compensateme
Thu Sep 21, 2017 2:53 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

DTW is getting a 3rd CDG flight next summer, the most accurate flight times will be added on Saturday when the schedule change is released It's in the press release. DL0096 03:50PM DTW CDG 06:00AM+1 NEW DL0098 06:05PM DTW CDG 08:05AM+1 333 AF0377 08:45PM DTW CDG 10:40AM+1 777 DL0099 10:20AM CDG DTW...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:25 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

DL's SNA service has been leaving Detroit, ever since it started with no more than 15 seats open, for September travel out west, I'd say that is pretty good, but as for it making a profit, there's no way to figure that out, you can only hope it's making money, because the flight's are leaving full....

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:12 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Why didn't DL keep main services from MEM?
Replies: 16
Views: 2883

Re: Why didn't DL keep main services from MEM?

In its final years as an NW hub, MEM drew fewer than 2M local enplaments whereas both DTW & MSP topped 9M. MEM was a relic of years past when it was the de facto capital of the Deep South. Southern/Republic/Northwest remained the dominate airline in the region for years - for example, NW began o...

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by compensateme
Fri Sep 15, 2017 2:03 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

Airlines grow - often exponentially - in growing markets. Airlines stagnate in stagnant markets. Austin in a great example of the first statement; Detroit is a great example of the second. Really? CLT has the least amount of local traffic of any major hub, yet it's developing into the second-larges...

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by compensateme
Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:14 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

Between 2010 and 2016, Atlanta Metropolitan Area grew 9.5% Between 2010 and 2016, Minneapolis Metropolitan Area grew 6.0% Between 2010 and 2016, Detroit Metropolitan Area grew 0.0% That is quite a contrast, too. http://www.startribune.com/twin-cities-population-growth-lags-other-major-u-s-cities/41...

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by compensateme
Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:43 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

Based on what? Are people literally pulling things out of thin air at this point? There's no backup or support for anything anyone's saying in this thread. Jeremy There's plenty of backup and support for what I've written within this thread, so your comments aren't true. Nonetheless, the lion's sha...

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by compensateme
Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:11 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW
Replies: 15
Views: 4318

Re: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW

I very strongly doubt the temporary relocation of Spirit's HQ to Detroit was "planned quickly" apart from minor details. When you're running a large public company, it is absolutely critical to have a business continuity plan in place to deal with potential threats from natural or man-mad...

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:49 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW
Replies: 15
Views: 4318

Re: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW

I see th delusion in Michigan is alive and well. Spirit is based in Miramar, a far north Miami suburb that is quite affordable. :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: I remember when we had this conversation a couple years ago or so, and you insisted NK was just seeking tax breaks. Coming from the guy who insists...

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:04 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW
Replies: 15
Views: 4318

Re: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW

One can complain about the so-called high cost of living in Florida, but compared to a lot of Metro areas, it's pennies. Also, Florida has no state income tax. The combination of no state income tax plus comparatively low cost of living and high quality of life is why so many people from the Northe...

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:25 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW
Replies: 15
Views: 4318

Re: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW

Things change if the powers that be in Michigan get out there and offer a good tax package maybe they can win them back to Michigan where the headquarters originally was. From the suggestions you offered uo it would seem that they don't want to relocated to a cold weather location. NK moved out of ...

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:58 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5
Replies: 1385
Views: 98192

Re: Detroit Air Service Discussion Part 5

DL uploaded their Sunday after Thanksgiving upgauges this weekend. DTW gets a 330 to SFO and a pair of 764 to MCO but it doesn't look like any 744 flights are planned (anywhere).

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by compensateme
Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:52 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW
Replies: 15
Views: 4318

Re: Spirit Temporarily Moves HQ Back to DTW

They won't stay there since they don't own their temporary headquarters. They only rent the place. NK "only" rents their space in Florida as well - they don't lease it. The high costs of living in Southern Florida have prompted NK to private consider moving its HQ in the recent past, but ...

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