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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:09 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 777X Testing Thread - 2019
Replies: 392
Views: 114186

Re: Boeing 777X Testing Thread - 2019

Bricktop wrote:
Revelation wrote:
I wonder if that is a FAA-approved rubber band on the gold throttle lever? :biggrin:

Maybe I will start a thread on grandfathering of rubber bands. :white:


I think this is the same rubber band I saw being used during 737-200 flight testing in 1967.

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by OldAeroGuy
Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:04 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

As for engine failure at takeoff, at least from the formal perspective, what is the probability of failure within those 3-5 critical minutes? Optimistically, I assume less than 1e-6 - although 1 in 100k hours for ETOPS180 means just about 1e-6. If you will, there are 2.5k flights daily at ATL and 2...

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by OldAeroGuy
Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:16 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

What kind of fatal error engine shutdown can cause? Shutting down wrong engine is surely one thing; and it have happened before. You probably know better than me what are precautions to avoid that. What else can be done what cannot be undone? What other actions are critical to be performed right aw...

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by OldAeroGuy
Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:58 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

Exactly why I don't really care that much for the pilot training element I want it but it's just icing on the cake for me. I don't want them facing these issues full stop. And thats exactly what aviation safety should be aiming for before we even worry about their training I fear to get MACS safe t...

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by OldAeroGuy
Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:44 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

We would have a hard time justifying a human based control having a PFD of less than 0.1. If the safety case has a low initiating event frequency, multiple layers of protection, and you end up with an acceptable residual risk then that’s fine - in other words, in the NG case, people can be a long w...

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by OldAeroGuy
Tue Jun 11, 2019 5:17 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

What is (conveniently?) missing in this comparison is the initial size of the JT8D had when the fuselage was designed compared to the LEAP 1B of today... it was 48" and the same fuselage LEAP 1B Fan/Fuselage Width: 46.7% JT8D Fan/Fuselage Width: 32,5% Still convinced that it has a neglectible ...

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by OldAeroGuy
Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:48 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

So too large for fuselage or overall layout suffered? I believe A320 fuselage is about same size and handles same size engines as MAX without extra issues. So starting statement plane with engines too big for the fuselage becomes questionable. Which doesn't bring extra credibility to the rest of it...

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by OldAeroGuy
Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:43 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

I have wondered by Boeing didn't put it in the EAD. It is in the EAD, along with a list of other symptoms. Here's a portion of the EAD along with indications that would have been present shortly after liftoff for ET302 are shown in BOLD. AOA DISAGREE is shown in italic. 737 MAX EAD 2018-23-51 lists...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 09, 2019 5:49 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

Interested wrote:

They deliberately created a defective sensor to prevent pilot overload. Same reason they didn't tell the test pilots who were writing the manual for Max about MCAS


No, Boeing did not create a defective sensor to prevent pilot overload.

Your logic path strains a rational thought process.

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:12 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

Any help the indicator could give has to be a factor in whether the pilots could have dealt better with the situation they were in Surely that's a given? Not necessarily. The ET302 crew appears to have been overloaded by the indications that were available on the flight deck. Another indication tha...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 09, 2019 1:01 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-48461110 So Chris Brady (author of 737 technical guide and pilot) is wrong saying the disagree light would be first warning something is wrong and could have helped save the plane? His view is wrong and can be discounted can it? No point calling him as a witness in...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 09, 2019 1:09 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

. . . With IAS DISAGREE and possibly ALT DISAGREE (amber alerts) visible to the flight crew if they were "familiar" with the bulletin, that would have been more than enough to alert them to an MCAS issue -- IMHO the lack of an AOA DISAGREE amber alert has always been a non-event and blown...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 09, 2019 1:05 am
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

So, 10 - 25.01, 11 - 25.02, 12 -25.03 is within spec? No, an FAA or OEM AR pilot would consider this as neutrally stable and flunk the configuration per 25.203. Or is there some minimum increase in force? No, this one of the areas in the FAR's that is subject to pilot evaluation. The airplane has t...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 8:13 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

What you're showing in this example is the rate of force decrease, d^2F/da^2. I am referring to fig. 7.2 in AC 25-7D where "acceptable" curve (vs speed) shows that exact behavior - decrease of derivative to zero at the edge. You interpret such behavior (vs AoA) as unacceptable. So where d...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 4:51 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

What you're showing in this example is the rate of force decrease, d^2F/da^2. I am referring to fig. 7.2 in AC 25-7D where "acceptable" curve (vs speed) shows that exact behavior - decrease of derivative to zero at the edge. You interpret such behavior (vs AoA) as unacceptable. So where d...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 4:10 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

The adaptive cruse control is yet again a dismal comparison. If the cruse control would accelerate on the failure off one sensor, you would have a comparison. On the failure of the cruise control, nothing hinders you to brake yourself. The car is not actively trying to kill you and your passengers....

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 4:02 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

I've seen a report a couple of weeks ago suggesting the warning light would have allowed the Ethiopian pilots to recognise and identify their problem earlier If that's true then it's end of argument about whether or not it would have helped them. Do you have a source for the suggestion? I'm curious...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 3:57 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

My apologies, but is there a specific reference for these interpretations? Our beloved 25-7 has graphs only for force vs speed, and all your examples would be acceptable if AoA is interpreted as "AoA required at given speed". Gradient as dF/dx doesn't change sign in your examples, and I d...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 3:05 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

I've seen a report a couple of weeks ago suggesting the warning light would have allowed the Ethiopian pilots to recognise and identify their problem earlier If that's true then it's end of argument about whether or not it would have helped them. Do you have a source for the suggestion? I'm curious...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 2:57 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

But how many other commercial planes would even test pilot skills in this way? How many other commercial planes would try and crash themselves? Any commercial airplane that has a runaway stab trim and the crew does not deal with it correctly. It means it has the potential to crash if you don't deal...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 2:31 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

I've seen it suggested that enlarging the h. stab would solve the problem. This isn't the case. I assume the limiting case/configuration is the stab trim at nose up limit of trim switch, and the righting moment versus AOA curve as the elevator is used to enter a stall according to the parameters of...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 08, 2019 2:22 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

The intent is to obtain enough data to determine the stall speed at an entry rate not exceeding 1.0 knot/second. I take it that means a deceleration of less than 1.0 knot/second to stall, during which the control pressure must increase. So the righting force curve went flat or up on the MAX in this...

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by OldAeroGuy
Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:00 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

Not a designer or engineer, so correct me if I am wrong.. From some of what I have read I get the impression that adjusting the stabiliser design would help resolve the problems that sparked the genesis of MCAS. Would that take months or would it be years? If an airworthiness certificate is refused...

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by OldAeroGuy
Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:47 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

What do you thing about the term "death trap"? Is it appropriate for discussions on this thread? We need some words to talk about dangerous things and we cannot ban all of them. Now that you specifically asked I could use that word to describe the condition of the plane after the first Li...

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by OldAeroGuy
Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:06 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

A simple question: Do you think Boeing set out to kill people by creating the 737 MAX? What asinine question. Of course not. That was the whole point. NObody has set out to kill anybody. It was the point I was trying to make that the word kill is totally 1000% inappropriate to be used anywhere in t...

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by OldAeroGuy
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:52 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

Then you've missed the replies that say Boeing caused the MAX to be a "Death Trap". Over the top language has been the hallmark rather the exception for this thread. Your over the top language tries to conflate two very different things. Killing people is a crime and those who kill people...

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by OldAeroGuy
Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:14 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

People still fly with airlines that have crashed planes and killed far more people than the two Max crashes . One more issue in a way you talk. I haven't seen anybody say in any of these threads that Boeing have killed anybody, but here you talk about airlines that have killed people. Not good. I g...

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by OldAeroGuy
Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:54 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: More safety issues for Boeing...
Replies: 37
Views: 5407

Re: More safety issues for Boeing...

Polot wrote:
In your first post you mentioned SBs. You are aware most service bulletins are drafted in response to an AD correct? It’s basically telling you how to best rectify and meet the AD.


Usually, an Alert SB is issued first by the OEM and the FAA turns the ASB into an AD.

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 02, 2019 9:03 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has grandfathering been taken too far?
Replies: 361
Views: 13362

Re: Has grandfathering been taken too far?

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
No, it reinforces the fact that humor is lacking in the dull and overly serious.

GF


:checkmark: :checkmark:

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 02, 2019 7:45 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has grandfathering been taken too far?
Replies: 361
Views: 13362

Re: Has grandfathering been taken too far?

kalvado wrote:
with fire raging behind


Yes, a fire would add an incentive.

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 02, 2019 6:18 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has grandfathering been taken too far?
Replies: 361
Views: 13362

Re: Has grandfathering been taken too far?

Which just happens to let the 737 squeak in. No one is going to jump six feet with any safety. I'd be lucky to jump two feet. Exactly. When I was a kid, jumping from 10' wasn't a problem. Now I'm 53 and I guess I could jump the 6' without problems. But I doubt I'll be able to do that when I'm 73. W...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 02, 2019 1:58 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has grandfathering been taken too far?
Replies: 361
Views: 13362

Re: Has grandfathering been taken too far?

From my understanding you need to certify anything new. New variant of the aircraft or not. However Boeing doesn't need to certify the complete aircraft anew, if it's grandfathered. So the new wings, new engines, etc., get a full certification regime, but not the completed aircraft. That's exactly ...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun Jun 02, 2019 12:10 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has grandfathering been taken too far?
Replies: 361
Views: 13362

Re: Boeing 777-8/-9 Grandfathering Certification, 777X or 7X7?

So unlike the MAX, the X is a new aircraft, with full new model testing, no exemptions (in full or part) to the latest regulations, and no grandfathering? As has been explained many times in this thread, any new regulations apply only if the part has been changed. There may be many unchanged parts,...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 01, 2019 5:38 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has grandfathering been taken too far?
Replies: 361
Views: 13362

Re: Boeing 777-8/-9 Grandfathering Certification, 777X or 7X7?

This doesn't mean you don't have to test the changed area. The new 777X wing will be required to pass a fatigue test and a structural load test to be certified but that certification may need only pass unchanged parts of the regulations that were in force during the original certification basis. Or...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:30 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Has grandfathering been taken too far?
Replies: 361
Views: 13362

Re: Has grandfathering been taken too far?

The basic 737 frame has proven over many years to be tough and reliable. Anything that has come to light has been remedied. One thing that does strike me, though. No overwing emergency exit slides. https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/passengers-injured-in-scramble-to-flee-after-man-makes-bomb-thr...

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by OldAeroGuy
Wed May 29, 2019 2:58 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

I haven' read all the posts here so I don't know if anyone has linked this already about "Could US pilots have saved the 737 MAX8 ?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtHBz2-YpWE Thanks, but already posted. Of course, the simulation starts with the horizontal stabilizer electric motor switc...

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by OldAeroGuy
Mon May 27, 2019 9:53 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

I cant agree that complying with 671 will relieve anyone from complying with 1309.... Cheers To carry on with 7BOEING7's point about the FAA interpretation of MCAS 1.0, the single sensor failure with regard to MCAS operation was always present. Under MCAS 1.0 certification, a single AoA vane signal...

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by OldAeroGuy
Mon May 27, 2019 7:35 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

-Cannot obtain meaningful voting on the validity of the data source, it is either OP or INOP. -Cannot achieve failure rate (typ 10^-9) for critical flight control components and thus probability vs severity wrt stalling and departure from controlled flight. -Without it aircraft is still uncertifiab...

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by OldAeroGuy
Mon May 27, 2019 12:33 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

ExperimentalFTE wrote:
I personally think that with current hardware configuration functionality you mention for MCAS 2.0 is as uncertifiable as it gets.


Please explain why you think that MCAS 2.0 as described is not certifiable.

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun May 26, 2019 9:44 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

I'd like to post my summary of what I think the key issues are - and to debunk some of what I see as the most common misconceptions presented: 1) Misconception & Outright Not True: Boeing hid the MCAS system, its design functions, etc from anyone. Boeing clearly and fully told both all the regu...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun May 26, 2019 9:35 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

JT043, JT610 and ET302 proved that a new "potential failure or variation of failure" was not appropriately handled by the existing procedures and training. Existing procedures and training seemed to work for JT043. It did take someone who recognized a "Runaway Stabilizer" and ad...

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by OldAeroGuy
Sun May 26, 2019 7:45 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

furthermore, MCAS 2.0 will turn itself off *by design* after activating once. So, after the "protection" is needed once, it will not be available again (not clear for how long). I think you're incorrect on how MCAS 2.0 will function. - MCAS 2.0 will activate once when both AoA vanes excee...

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by OldAeroGuy
Thu May 23, 2019 11:43 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

If China will not approve the 737 MAX for domestic operation, then why will the Chinese 737 MAX completion center be operational?

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by OldAeroGuy
Thu May 23, 2019 11:27 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

Compensation is nothing compared to Chinese never letting MAX to fly. Half of the world's population live in that area. Then I guess that the 737 MAX Chinese completion center will be shutdown. https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-set-to-deliver-first-737-jet-from-completio...

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by OldAeroGuy
Wed May 22, 2019 7:58 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 777X Testing Thread - 2019
Replies: 392
Views: 114186

Re: Boeing 777X Testing Thread - 2019

The initial 777 roll out to first flight was a little over 2 months. From Wikipedia: "On April 9, 1994, the first 777, line number WA001, was rolled out in a series of 15 ceremonies held during the day to accommodate the 100,000 invited guests.[52] The first flight took place on June 12, 1994&...

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by OldAeroGuy
Wed May 22, 2019 5:52 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 777X Testing Thread - 2019
Replies: 392
Views: 114186

Re: Boeing 777X Testing Thread - 2019

The initial 777 roll out to first flight was a little over 2 months. From Wikipedia: "On April 9, 1994, the first 777, line number WA001, was rolled out in a series of 15 ceremonies held during the day to accommodate the 100,000 invited guests.[52] The first flight took place on June 12, 1994&q...

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by OldAeroGuy
Tue May 21, 2019 3:06 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xixM_cwSLcQ
-->

PixelFlight wrote:
I still will believe both of you only when you will be able to describe in detail how is done a 737 NG/MAX runaway stabilizer training session on a simulator.


Is this the sort of thing you're looking for?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xixM_cwSLcQ

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by OldAeroGuy
Tue May 21, 2019 2:32 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

All 4 flights with similar conditions reacted in a similar way and retracted flaps. Good Airmanship? following Unreliable Airspeed NNC? or just plain wrong because they were not you? Before we go any further with this discussion, please name the 4th flight you're referring to. I have: JT 043 JT 610...

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by OldAeroGuy
Tue May 21, 2019 1:10 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

Flaps retracted because airspeed exceeded the max allowed for the flap setting? Do you know which is dominant and which recessive where there is a conflict between what the NNC demands and what the operating manual demands eg manual gives max speed allowed for 5, 10, 15 flaps but NNC specifies keep...

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by OldAeroGuy
Tue May 21, 2019 1:02 pm
Forum: Civil Aviation
Topic: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019
Replies: 3088
Views: 307152

Re: Boeing 737MAX Grounded Worldwide Q2 2019

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-05-21/boeing-max-could-stay-grounded-beyond-this-year-indonesia-says?srnd=premium-asia Despite what many fan boys may say, the world will put safety first. It is snarky comments and attitudes like this that have ruined this thread. What "fan boys&qu...

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